RV Trailer Tires

[JRTJH]

WHOA guys !!!!

Take a look at the "Vantra specs" before jumping on installing them on your trailer which currently has "other brand ST tires"... Hankook has "derated the load capacity" on the Vantra line and they may not support the weight required for your trailer. The numbers in red are the "standard load ratings" used by other manufacturers. As you can see, the Vantra tire line is "significantly derated" assuming they are using the standard maximum pressure ratings. Something ain't quite right with their load ratings.

Here's what the Hankook sites has:
SIZE PLY LOAD SPEED
ST205/75R14 08 101/1819 N 2040
ST215/75R14 08 103/1929 N 2200
ST205/75R15 08 102/1874 N 2150
ST225/75R15 10 112/2469 N 2830

The above information was obtained from the Hankook website. https://www.hankooktire.com/us/speci...iler-st01.html

On the Tire Rack website, the load capacity is the same as other brands... https://www.tirerack.com/tires/Spec....Vantra+Trailer

So, it may be an error in data input on one of the sites or it may be "growing pains with a new product"... At any rate, verify the tire markings on the actual tires to make sure they can carry the load you're expecting them to carry before installing them on a trailer only to find out they are "overloaded" for the application.....

IMHO, if the manufacturer's website is providing incorrect information about their "new product" it doesn't bode well for the product or the manufacturer.... YMMV

[jasin1]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

Glad to see another major tire manufacturer jump into the RV tire marketplace. Four of those Vanta Trailer in ST225/75R15 appear to be about $100 less than Goodyear Endurance. Time will tell if Hanook is making a reliable trailer tire.

They make a good truck tire..Im using hankook dynapro atm tires on my 2004 ram 1500 Hemi …second set on the truck…I like em

I think I will wait on the trailer tires till they prove reliable

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by jasin1

They make a good truck tire..Im using hankook dynapro atm tires on my 2004 ram 1500 Hemi …second set on the truck…I like em

I think I will wait on the trailer tires till they prove reliable

A lot of folks bought Goodyear Marathon ST tires years ago based on their experience with Goodyear tires on their trucks and cars. That trust evaporated rather quickly.

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

WHOA guys !!!!

Take a look at the "Vantra specs" before jumping on installing them on your trailer which currently has "other brand ST tires"... Hankook has "derated the load capacity" on the Vantra line and they may not support the weight required for your trailer. The numbers in red are the "standard load ratings" used by other manufacturers. As you can see, the Vantra tire line is "significantly derated" assuming they are using the standard maximum pressure ratings. Something ain't quite right with their load ratings.

Here's what the Hankook sites has:
SIZE PLY LOAD SPEED
ST205/75R14 08 101/1819 N 2040
ST215/75R14 08 103/1929 N 2200
ST205/75R15 08 102/1874 N 2150
ST225/75R15 10 112/2469 N 2830

The above information was obtained from the Hankook website. https://www.hankooktire.com/us/speci...iler-st01.html

On the Tire Rack website, the load capacity is the same as other brands... https://www.tirerack.com/tires/Spec....Vantra+Trailer

So, it may be an error in data input on one of the sites or it may be "growing pains with a new product"... At any rate, verify the tire markings on the actual tires to make sure they can carry the load you're expecting them to carry before installing them on a trailer only to find out they are "overloaded" for the application.....

IMHO, if the manufacturer's website is providing incorrect information about their "new product" it doesn't bode well for the product or the manufacturer.... YMMV

NHTSA has always allowed tire manufacturers to set different load capacity ratings for same designated sized tires. There is a caviat in the FMVSS standards that says tires having the same designated size at a specific load range will defalt to the lowest load rating unless the vehicle manufacturer provides documentation for the higher load.

In the past, Keystone actually set lower vehicle certified GAWRs to somewhere around 6850# to accomidate the GY Marathons that, at LRE have a maximum load capacity of 3420#.

There are three distince load capacities for the ST235/80R16 LRE; 3420#, 3500# and 3520#. Kenda is one with a 3500# rating.

You may have noticed I have warned users here about using the Endurance (3420# tire) when replacing OE 3520# tires.

[JRTJH]

My point, was aimed more at the discrepancies between what Hankook has on their website and what Tire Rack has on their for the same tires. There is, apparently some "confusion" between the specification charts. My concern was that people not "rush to buy a Hankook 225 75R15 LRE tire expecting the "standard inflation of 80 PSI to support 2830 pounds of weight.... If (take your pick on which chart is correct) Hankook's chart is correct, then "upgrading to those tires will actually give you a lower max weight rating than the 8 ply/65 PSI tires in the same size from other manufacturers.

In many past posts, "you've said chart specs matter, pay attention to them"... I'm "suggesting" that this time it also matters.... YMMV

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

My point, was aimed more at the discrepancies between what Hankook has on their website and what Tire Rack has on their for the same tires. There is, apparently some "confusion" between the specification charts. My concern was that people not "rush to buy a Hankook 225 75R15 LRE tire expecting the "standard inflation of 80 PSI to support 2830 pounds of weight.... If (take your pick on which chart is correct) Hankook's chart is correct, then "upgrading to those tires will actually give you a lower max weight rating than the 8 ply/65 PSI tires in the same size from other manufacturers.

In many past posts, "you've said chart specs matter, pay attention to them"... I'm "suggesting" that this time it also matters.... YMMV

If the tire rack is going to retail them it's their responsibility to use the parameters set by the tire manufacturer. The tire manufacturer clearly has the authority to set the tires load capacities within the bounds allowed by HHTSA, which are approved by the TRA.

Just a note: The load index numbering system is not the offical tire load capacity system for ST/LT tires, the Load Range lettering system is.

I'm pretty sure the confusion begain when president Trump forced the China - and other ST manufacturers - to provide speed ratings for ST tires. The official display of a tire's speed letter is a tag on the end of a load index (124/121L). The optional method is to display the speed rating on the tire sidewall, 75 MPH.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

If the tire rack is going to retail them it's their responsibility to use the parameters set by the tire manufacturer. The tire manufacturer clearly has the authority to set the tires load capacities within the bounds allowed by HHTSA, which are approved by the TRA.

Just a note: The load index numbering system is not the offical tire load capacity system for ST/LT tires, the Load Range lettering system is.

I'm pretty sure the confusion begain when president Trump forced the China - and other ST manufacturers - to provide speed ratings for ST tires. The official display of a tire's speed letter is a tag on the end of a load index (124/121L). The optional method is to display the speed rating on the tire sidewall, 75 MPH.

BOTTOM LINE: If the Hankook website is correct and the 225 75R15 LRE tires are actually rated at 2469 max load, that's 1444 pounds less (for a set of 4 tires on a tandem trailer) than the equivalent tire from "virtually any other ST tire brand in the same size.

My point was NOT to discuss HHTSA or TRA approvals, rather to identify an apparent "shortcoming in the tire rating or an error in the tire chart. Either way, it's NOT about what the regulations require, it's about what I see when looking at the Hankook tire specifications. I don't much care who has what authority to do which in any tire situation. I just care what they tell me about the product and in this case, it's not the same as other manufacturers are saying about their tires in the same sizes.... Use the information from Hankook or ignore it, up to you, not me....

[CWtheMan]

On the vantra advertising page it gives a load index of 112 with a speed rating "N". They also describe the tire as a 10 ply meaning rating because there is no other kind. A 10 ply tire is a LRE.

IMO the following link is correctly displayed.

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires...omCompare1=yes

[JRTJH]

Cal,

The HANKOOK website says this:
ST225/75R15 10 112 N

The TIRE RACK website says this:
ST225/75R15 117/112N E 2,830 lbs 80 psi

The two websites do NOT match with the same information.

It doesn't really matter which one is "right" and which one is "not right or incomplete"... Once a buyer puts them on his trailer and pays his money, it becomes his problem when a tire is overloaded and HE (the buyer) has a blowout and injures or kills someone on the highway when he loses control of his rig....

MY GOAL IN POSTING WAS TO IDENTIFY TWO DIFFERENT SETS OF SPECIFICATIONS THAT DON'T MATCH. Nothing more.

It's up to the buyer to make sure he's getting what he thinks he's getting. In this situation, I'd urge that a buyer verify what is actually molded on the tire to verify just what the hell is being put on his trailer. It might not be (actually it WILL NOT be) both sets of specifications. One is not correct. WHICH ONE IS UP TO THE BUYER TO CONFIRM.....

[CWtheMan]

A reference: FMVSS 571.109 S4.2.1 General. Each tire shall conform to each of the following: (c) Its load rating shall be that specified in a submission made by an individual manufacturer, pursuant to S4.4.1(a), or in one of the publications described in S4.4.1(b) for its size designation, type and each appropriate inflation pressure. If the maximum load rating for a particular tire size is shown in more than one of the publications described in S4.4.1(b), each tire of that size designation shall have a maximum load rating that is not less than the published maximum load rating, or if there are differing maximum load ratings for the same tire size designation, not less than the lowest published maximum load rating.

[CWtheMan]

It looks like someone here wants an example/excuse for a vertically stored, spare tire explosion. I’ve never been able to find a professional explanation for the phenomenon. However, it happens, and it’s not isolated to any tire brand but seems to be a common occurrence with ST trailer tires stored in a vertical position and having a nonporous cover.

A layman’s point of view about a spare tire explosion stored in a vertical position and covered with a nonporous cover. Tire aging has to be a factor. Do they age faster when stored in a heated environment? If the normal tire life is 3-5 years what is the tire life when always covered and heated?

ST trailer tires require higher operational inflation pressures. Do those higher inflation pressures need to be exercised? Were told we should change the positioning of the tires on the ground when stored. How about the spare? The vast majority of trailer tires are serviced with pressurized air. Does it contain water? How much? Where will it settle? Is it possible it will turn into steam? Will the steam try to exit at the top? We know tires allow a smallish amount of permeation. Could it permeate out the top rather than from the sidewalls?

There is a reason for the phenomenon; some day it will be explained.

[Ken / Claudia]

Steam is a good thought. When we or a poster talks about heat it's normally the outside air temps. Never about the large surface a few inch's away that in my testing can be 140-150f range. I have read more than once about windows on a building or house reflecting enough heat from the sun that vinyl window frames and siding nearby on another house or building is melted.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by Ken / Claudia

Steam is a good thought. When we or a poster talks about heat it's normally the outside air temps. Never about the large surface a few inch's away that in my testing can be 140-150f range. I have read more than once about windows on a building or house reflecting enough heat from the sun that vinyl window frames and siding nearby on another house or building is melted.

Yep, Sit on black leather seats in a convertible with the top down on a hot, sunny day in Arizona (or even Michigan), while wearing shorts and no shirt and you'll have a perfect example of what goes on "with a spare tire covered with a black cover, sitting in the sun on the back of a trailer." Heck, even white seats are "hotter than hell" in that kind of situation.....

Mounting a spare, "in the sun, baking all day, every day" might be "convenient to access it" but it sure isn't "beneficial to the tire under that cover".....

[flybouy]

Steam inside a tire? Boiling point of water is 212° F, 100 C. The higher the pressure the higher the boiling point temp. I'm not that interested in that theory to do the math but considering most ICE run the coolant at around 15 psi I can imagine at 60, 80, or more the boiling point would be above what could be generated by the sun. Maybe someone else cojld prove my theory incorrect.

[gascott]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

It looks like someone here wants an example/excuse for a vertically stored, spare tire explosion. I’ve never been able to find a professional explanation for the phenomenon. However, it happens, and it’s not isolated to any tire brand but seems to be a common occurrence with ST trailer tires stored in a vertical position and having a nonporous cover.

A layman’s point of view about a spare tire explosion stored in a vertical position and covered with a nonporous cover. Tire aging has to be a factor. Do they age faster when stored in a heated environment? If the normal tire life is 3-5 years what is the tire life when always covered and heated?

ST trailer tires require higher operational inflation pressures. Do those higher inflation pressures need to be exercised? Were told we should change the positioning of the tires on the ground when stored. How about the spare? The vast majority of trailer tires are serviced with pressurized air. Does it contain water? How much? Where will it settle? Is it possible it will turn into steam? Will the steam try to exit at the top? We know tires allow a smallish amount of permeation. Could it permeate out the top rather than from the sidewalls?

There is a reason for the phenomenon; some day it will be explained.

Should I cover my tires with wheel covers to keep them protected from the sun or will covering them degrade the tires?

[CWtheMan]

Here’s a question to ponder. I’ve not asked an individual tire builder for an answer, nor can I find any individual ST tire builders with an explanation in any of their PDF files.

We normally refer to ST tires as age-out tires. With the introduction of steel cased tires having a regrooving ability, is that referral still a hard fast truth?

Some ST tire manufacturers have increased their warranty limits up to 6 years or more for the steel cased regroovable tires, with no mention of an age out factor.

Below (in part) is the formal definition for regroovable tires with no mention as to life expectancy.

*****

§ 569.3 Definitions.

(a) Statutory definitions. All terms used in this part that are defined in section 102 of the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act of 1966 (15 U.S.C. 1391) are used as defined in the Act.
(b) Motor Vehicle Safety Standard definitions. Unless otherwise indicated, all terms used in this part that are defined in the Motor Vehicle Safety Standards, part 571, of this subchapter (hereinafter “The Standards”), are used as defined therein without regard to the applicability of a standard in which a definition is contained.
(c) Regroovable tire means a tire, either original tread or retread, designed and constructed with sufficient tread material to permit renewal of the tread pattern or the generation of a new tread pattern in a manner which conforms to this part.
(d) Regrooved tire means a tire, either original tread or retread, on which the tread pattern has been renewed or a new tread has been produced by cutting into the tread of a worn tire to a depth equal to or deeper than the molded original groove depth.

*****

Why would a consumer want a regroovable tire with a short life expectancy?

[Badbart56]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

[/COLOR][/B]

Why would a consumer want a regroovable tire with a short life expectancy?

I know of some friends who use the ST tires commercially on heavy dump trailers and they actually wear out the tread in a fairly short time. Cheaper to regroove them than buy new? That I don't know.

[CWtheMan]

Crappy, synonyms:

substandard · below standard · below par · bad · deficient · defective · faulty · imperfect · inferior · mediocre · abject · appalling · abysmal · atrocious · awful · terrible·

************************************

Because of standardization, all tires of the same designated size and load range (LT & ST) are considered equal. The overseer of their standardization is the Tire and Rim Association (for the USA). Brands are never mentioned. Even the U.S. Tire manufacturers Association omits brand names from their maintenance documents. All foreign made tires entering the USA for road service must have the DOT logo on their sidewalls. That means the builder has certified them (not all) and they were tested by the manufacturer or a 3rd party. All are subject to NHTSA supervised testing when necessary. All tire shipments into the USA must pass a U.S. Customs inspection. The vast majority of “off shore” tire manufacturers operate with the same ISO certifications as USA manufacturers.

I was an active duty naval aircraft mechanic for 31 years and then worked another 10 years for them when Eastern Airlines folded. With military machinery and disposables, like many other machinery materials, from other manufacturing sources, “crap” is something that must be exposed as “crap”. There are experts at each major tire manufacturer’s plant that can identify the cause of a tire failure from forensic analysis, even when there isn’t much of the tire left to analyze.

As long as there is a verified accounting of RV trailer tires (57%) being under inflated/overloaded “crap” must be ruled out. No one in the industry is going to jump on a bandwagon about “crap” unless it can be accounted for.

My mother called her first car Matilda, it was her middle name and she hated it. That didn’t make her car a bad car, she just didn’t like it. If something went wrong with that car it was always because she didn’t like the whole package.

FMVSS 571.120 Paragraph; S5.3.1 Tires. The size and the recommended cold inflation pressure for those tires such that the sum of the load ratings of the tires on each axle is appropriate for the GAWR.

For RV trailer axles the tires must provide a load capacity – via inflation – that will support the vehicle certified GAWRs. RVIA has mandated a 10% load capacity reserve for all of their members (98%).

That basic GAWR load capacity for RV trailer axles is different for automotive vehicles. They are required to have a percentage of load capacity reserves above certified GAWRs, or at GAWR when the GAWR is providing the load capacity reserves.

[gearhead]

Originally Posted by CWtheMan

Here’s a question to ponder. I’ve not asked an individual tire builder for an answer, nor can I find any individual ST tire builders with an explanation in any of their PDF files.

We normally refer to ST tires as age-out tires. With the introduction of steel cased tires having a regrooving ability, is that referral still a hard fast truth?

Some ST tire manufacturers have increased their warranty limits up to 6 years or more for the steel cased regroovable tires, with no mention of an age out factor.

Below (in part) is the formal definition for regroovable tires with no mention as to life expectancy.

*****

§ 569.3 Definitions.

(a) Statutory definitions. All terms used in this part that are defined in section 102 of the National Traffic and Motor Vehicle Safety Act of 1966 (15 U.S.C. 1391) are used as defined in the Act.
(b) Motor Vehicle Safety Standard definitions. Unless otherwise indicated, all terms used in this part that are defined in the Motor Vehicle Safety Standards, part 571, of this subchapter (hereinafter “The Standards”), are used as defined therein without regard to the applicability of a standard in which a definition is contained.
(c) Regroovable tire means a tire, either original tread or retread, designed and constructed with sufficient tread material to permit renewal of the tread pattern or the generation of a new tread pattern in a manner which conforms to this part.
(d) Regrooved tire means a tire, either original tread or retread, on which the tread pattern has been renewed or a new tread has been produced by cutting into the tread of a worn tire to a depth equal to or deeper than the molded original groove depth.

*****

Why would a consumer want a regroovable tire with a short life expectancy?

I may be connecting the dots too easily....I believe Sailuns and Hercules 17.5" steel cased tires are regroovable. Are you drawing a conclusion that they are also short lived?

[CWtheMan]

Originally Posted by gearhead

I may be connecting the dots too easily....I believe Sailuns and Hercules 17.5" steel cased tires are regroovable. Are you drawing a conclusion that they are also short lived?

No! Sailun has gone to a 6-year warranty for the steel cased ST tires. Do you think it's safe to say, they have raised the bar?