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Old 12-16-2020, 04:46 PM   #21
aboyz
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Originally Posted by flybouy View Post
abozs I'm glad you're reconsidering your decision. In an earlier statement you said you wanted dual axles for "safety concerns" but it appeared to me that you weren't concerned with the safety of the truck being overloaded. I thought your mind was set.

Anyway, I think there's several price factors. The market (as in overall economy), the local market, demand for the product, the product itself (like cars, there's a larger profit margin in the luxury segment then the economy models), your credit rating if financing etc. I don't think anyone can "reasonably" say what you should pay. As with any negotiation go in offering less than you are willing to spend and commit to walking away if they are unwilling to come down to the most that you are willing to spend.
What would you say is a fair price just to start at? say the MSRP is $21,000. If I can get it down to $15,000 that is a great price right? and $16,000 will be a good price and $17,000 will be a ok price? is that how you would see it?

I just wanted to know the range of this so when I'm dealing with the dealer I am well prepare for battle. I won't be finanacing it I"ll just pay it off.

Thank you again.
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Old 12-16-2020, 04:48 PM   #22
aboyz
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Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
I don't know about that mark down but doubt it. I bought mine in March just as all the "pandemic" was breaking out. I got a little over 30% off MSRP which was very consistent on the same trailer over 3 states. With an msrp of 21k I don't know, but doubt, if they have that much fluff they can/will take off.
If not, what is a reasonable offer price for this trailer that is MSRP $21K? Fair price is $16K+ tax and registration fee? I provide my brake controller and equalizer e4 sway bar?

I was told I needed to purchase from them the sway bar or else they will not install it for me. They are charing me $650 for the equalizer e4 with labor. Seem fair?
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Old 12-17-2020, 06:35 AM   #23
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Memories: In 1986 I purchased a new Chevy S-10 (2 door) long bed. I put a cap on the bed and we used it for camping several times with a tent. We slept in the truck and put all our junk in the tent.

Anyway, I was in the Army, and I rented a pop-up camper from the post AAFES for a week. I was stationed at Fort Belvoir, Virginia (Alexandria, Virginia, near Washington D.C.) and we traveled to Fort Story, (Norfolk) that had a military campground. Now, it's called First Landing State Park.

We traveled from there back to the mountains, followed the Blue Ridge Parkway North and then cut back over to Washington D.C.

The bumper had a hole in it for a hitch ball, and that's how I towed the trailer.

When the trip was over, the bumper was bent down and all twisted up from towing the pop-up. I eventually got a new bumper put on. It was my first lesson on towing any RV.

It's just a memory now. But dang! That was a fun trip. My baby boy, who is now 35 years old was not even 1 year old yet. We'd been married just a year! Very exciting times back then. Good memory. Chevy S-10??? I haven't thought about that truck in a long time!

Edit: I found the photo. Yes, that's me! 35 years ago when I still had hair (not bald), I was still THIN, and I still had all my original body parts! (1986 - Fort Belvoir, Virginia. For anyone who has memory of the Fort during this time period, that is Lewis Heights (inadequate) housing in the back ground. Wow! What memories!

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Old 12-17-2020, 08:30 AM   #24
flybouy
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Originally Posted by aboyz View Post
What would you say is a fair price just to start at? say the MSRP is $21,000. If I can get it down to $15,000 that is a great price right? and $16,000 will be a good price and $17,000 will be a ok price? is that how you would see it?

I just wanted to know the range of this so when I'm dealing with the dealer I am well prepare for battle. I won't be finanacing it I"ll just pay it off.

Thank you again.
I really couldn't begin to guess to be honest. I'm not familiar with the local market there and what they are getting for that type unit. I don't think a $6K reduction on a $21K trailer is likely but all they can do is say no. The most important thing to do in my experiences is:

1. DON'T get in a hurry! Rushing to buy ANYTHING because you just gotta have it is a guarantee to get gouged. Salesman can "smell" that anticipation.

2. DON'T get snarky or insult the salesman. Make a "low ball" offer so there's room for a counter and negotiations but don't get ridiculous as that will alienate and put them on the defensive. Make it clear up front that you're not trying to steal it but you're not "giving"your money away either. Knowledge is power so what you are doing is good. Research what the local market is doing. The salesman will typically try to "befriend" you so he/she can manipulate you. Be cordial but remember their job is to get as m,uch money from you as possible.

3. DON'T tell them it's a cash deal out of the gate. They make money off of financing sales thru banks and other institutions. If they know that they won't get their "cut" from financing then they'll get that from you in the price.

4. DO make them put the numbers to paper. I always tell them to draw up a "sale" with everything included. I don't care where the numbers go as I'm spending my money ONE time and that's the number beside TOTAL. Don't accept any BS about advertising fees, or "prep" fees, opr fabric or paint treatments, etc.

5. DO prepare to walk away from the deal if the numbers don't work. After trading numbers and hitting an impasse I'll tell the salesman that "here's my final number, it's all in, everything included and if this isn't acceptable then we won't have a deal. If the salesman want's to "talk to the manager" I'll tell them fine, but if you're not back in 10 min don't bother, I won't be here. They will try to "wear you down" to mentally exhaust you and ghet you to submit. More than once I've told a salesman that the the car, truck, camper, whatever is "depreciating as we speak" so if the process is delayed I'll reduce my offer. My time is valuable to.

I've walked away from deals in the past. I've had a salesman call me back a half hour later and agree to my offer and I've had them call me and try to renegotiate. The important thing is to be steadfast on your high limit and DON'T exceed it. DON'T let the "shiny stuff" blind you into a bad decision. DO let the salesman know that they don't have to "sell" the trailer as you've made up your mind on what you want (this will also stop them from trying to "upsell" you to a more expensive unit). Let then know the only thing they have to do is get the price right.

These are some of the things that I have found useful over the years in making purchases and negotiating contracts for goods and services when I was working. I hope this helps and I wish you luck in your venture.
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Old 12-17-2020, 11:24 AM   #25
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I looked at rvtrader before I bought my current TT but the problem is that prices are all over the place.
I do kinda wonder just what dealers actually pay.

https://www.rvtrader.com/Keystone-Bu...1700BH%7C60606
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Old 12-17-2020, 02:00 PM   #26
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My advice is to decide what you currently think is important in a camper. Then go buy a used one and camp in it for a season or two and then you will really know what is important. Start saving for a real truck to open your options weight-wise. New campers WILL have issues and used campers, if you are careful, will have some, if not most of these issues sorted out. Main thing to look for in a used camper is water intrusion.
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Old 12-20-2020, 03:56 PM   #27
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I'm planning to purchase the passport 239ML. I got a couple of questions.

1. The dealer says the MSRP is listed at $31,000. What price range should I get average OTD price? is a 20% off OTD price good deal? or just OK deal?
2. I'm in the Riverside, CA and one dealer gave me OTD price $31,200 and another dealer in arizona gave me a price for $26,500 OTD. Arizona drive is 380miles. Is it worth the time to drive up there and get it? or find some other dealer local and get it down to around $27,500 OTD?
3. What place to go to to do some travel trailer pricing and comparison?
4. Will my tacoma truck good enough to to wthis.

thank you..
The 239ML has been discontinued, it is replaced with 219BH. Keystone website MSRP on this trailer is 24K , or so it was. The replacement is priced at 25k . There is a delivery charge, as these towed at a rate of something like 1$/Mile. So I believe , it would be fair to say that if you can get this out the door for 24K (+ tax) you can sleep well. Unless you live a block away from assembly plant in Indiana.
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Old 12-22-2020, 12:57 AM   #28
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The 239ML has been discontinued, it is replaced with 219BH. Keystone website MSRP on this trailer is 24K , or so it was. The replacement is priced at 25k . There is a delivery charge, as these towed at a rate of something like 1$/Mile. So I believe , it would be fair to say that if you can get this out the door for 24K (+ tax) you can sleep well. Unless you live a block away from assembly plant in Indiana.
Thank you!! this is excellent. now i know what i can ask for.. hahhaah

after some more research, can my tacoma carrie a
KEY SPECIFICATIONS
Length 26'11"
Width 96"
Exterior Height 9'10"
Interior Height 6'8"
ADDITIONAL SPECS
Dry Weight 3,899
Hitch Weight 500
Net Carrying Capacity 3,601

? thoughts. is this too heavy for my tacoma? or just right
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Old 12-22-2020, 04:57 AM   #29
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7500 pound trailer with about 950 pounds of tongue weight. Please post itinerary when traveling so that we can avoid you.
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Old 12-22-2020, 06:36 AM   #30
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Originally Posted by aboyz View Post
Thank you!! this is excellent. now i know what i can ask for.. hahhaah

after some more research, can my tacoma carrie a
KEY SPECIFICATIONS
Length 26'11"
Width 96"
Exterior Height 9'10"
Interior Height 6'8"
ADDITIONAL SPECS
Dry Weight 3,899
Hitch Weight 500
Net Carrying Capacity 3,601

? thoughts. is this too heavy for my tacoma? or just right
Check those numbers again or post the year, make & model of the trailer. I'm not aware of any travel trailer that's capable of carrying close to it's empty weight. A 27' trailer weighing 3,899 with a gvw of 7,500 lbs. I'd suspect that empty weight is off. But if the gvw is correct then when loaded your looking at 975 lb tongue weight then add about 120 for wdh and your slapping on nearly 1,100 lbs on the truck's back.
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Old 12-22-2020, 08:13 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by aboyz View Post
Thank you!! this is excellent. now i know what i can ask for.. hahhaah

after some more research, can my tacoma carrie a
KEY SPECIFICATIONS
Length 26'11"
Width 96"
Exterior Height 9'10"
Interior Height 6'8"
ADDITIONAL SPECS
Dry Weight 3,899
Hitch Weight 500
Net Carrying Capacity 3,601

? thoughts. is this too heavy for my tacoma? or just right
Simple answer...........NOPE!
That much rv would be about the limit for the Tundra!
Toyota makes great trucks for the DYI handyman to make lumber runs or haul their lawnmower & even hook up a trailer for their skidoos or snowmobiles, but neither of them are not nor never were designed to carry large heavy loads such as RVs, regardless of the ridiculous commercials or advertising.
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Old 12-24-2020, 08:33 AM   #32
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I'm planning to purchase the passport 239ML. I got a couple of questions.

1. The dealer says the MSRP is listed at $31,000. What price range should I get average OTD price? is a 20% off OTD price good deal? or just OK deal?
2. I'm in the Riverside, CA and one dealer gave me OTD price $31,200 and another dealer in arizona gave me a price for $26,500 OTD. Arizona drive is 380miles. Is it worth the time to drive up there and get it? or find some other dealer local and get it down to around $27,500 OTD?
3. What place to go to to do some travel trailer pricing and comparison?
4. Will my tacoma truck good enough to to wthis.

I got a tacoma TRD sport 4x4 2020. Attached is the GVWR 5600lb and also pasenger weight of 900lb.
I'm getting this trailer. passport SL 239ml
shipping weight = 4,430 lb.
carrying capacity = 2,000 lb.
hitch = 436 lb.
tire size = ST205/75R15D

Family weight = 400lbs
food = 100lbs
bike = 50 lbs
blanket/pillow = 50lbs
pots/pan/etc 50lbs
misc = 100lbs


I will be getting the brake controller P3 and also weight distrubition Equalizer E2 and a backup wireless camera.

I think I should be able to handle this pretty nicely right? I live in California, Riverside, and just camping around this area within a 100miles radius.
Should be good? please advise if i'm missing anything.

thank you..
Discount the price by 37%.
That truck is nowhere near enough.
For a TT minimum is 3/4T, for a 5er 1T diesel, maybe dually.
Best is to go 1T dually. The truck will last forever and will pull anything you might buy in the future.
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Old 12-24-2020, 08:58 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by aboyz View Post
.............I'm planning to purchase the passport 239ML. I got a couple of questions.

1. The dealer says the MSRP is listed at $31,000. What price range should I get average OTD price? is a 20% off OTD price good deal? or just OK deal?
2. I'm in the Riverside, CA and one dealer gave me OTD price $31,200 and another dealer in arizona gave me a price for $26,500 OTD. Arizona drive is 380miles. Is it worth the time to drive up there and get it? or find some other dealer local and get it down to around $27,500 OTD?
3. What place to go to to do some travel trailer pricing and comparison?
Buying a trailer 380 miles from home is a big risk in the event you discover warranty work or need some repairs. A friend of mine in northern California drove to Arkansas to purchase a trailer at a lower cost than he could purchase locally and when he discovered warranty issues the local dealers would not take care of them since they only service their trailer customers. Plus that may be a long way to pull a trailer for your first trip towing a trailer.
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Old 12-24-2020, 10:01 AM   #34
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Buying a trailer 380 miles from home is a big risk in the event you discover warranty work or need some repairs. A friend of mine in northern California drove to Arkansas to purchase a trailer at a lower cost than he could purchase locally and when he discovered warranty issues the local dealers would not take care of them since they only service their trailer customers. Plus that may be a long way to pull a trailer for your first trip towing a trailer.
RVs are not like automobiles, rv dealers are not obligated to do warranty work on RVs they did not sell.
Also if planning to tow that rv with that truck 380 miles back is going to be a VERY VERY long trip, especially if there's wind or lots of truck traffic, I'd give it a 10 on the pucker factor scale.
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Old 12-24-2020, 12:25 PM   #35
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Based on my experience of buying my Keystone Hideout 30RLDS at the Greater Cleveland RV Show. MSRP $30,000 selling price $19,999. Add ons less than $1,000.plus tax.
At the RV Show in January the dealers take orders. The TT arrived in April. The same unit on the dealers lot inventory usually sells for more.
If you look at the RVTrader website you will see what dealers through out the US are selling the make and model you are interested in buying. At the 30 K price point you may see a range of pricing on identical units.
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Old 12-24-2020, 12:55 PM   #36
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First off welcome. Traveling Texans and flyboy are spot on, used to be that there was a ton of leeway on the price. Now that RVs are selling like crazy you might have a more difficult time negotaiting. That said, getting a better price non locally will benefit you as long as you don't need much maintenance, as stated - dealerships will give preference to their customers first. I've heard ( but not experienced ) of RVs being tied up all season. There's a ton of experience and knowledge on this site and I've benefited so much from the advice offered. Good luck to you and have a safe and fun experience.
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Old 12-24-2020, 06:23 PM   #37
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aboyz,
We've got a Passport 2210RBWE. It weighs about 400 pounds more and 100 pounds more tongue weight than your trailer.

The dealer hitched it to our 2012 Tacoma and said it was a perfect match.
Our Tacoma had the bigger 4.0 motor with tow package and had no problem with power.
We actually made several long trips with it before I had to admit the trailer was pushing us too much on downhill curves.
I was really disappointed. The Tacoma looked great towing our trailer. The trailer even had the same blue stripes that the Tacoma was.
We traded the Tacoma in on a 1500 Silverado.
I wouldn't say we get to the top of the ridge faster, but the rig feels more secure.
Also, our Tacoma was the crew cab long bed. I'm certain that's why it towed as well as it did. I sure wouldn't have even tried it with a standard cab or short bed. Tow vehicle wheelbase length is important.
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Old 12-26-2020, 12:06 AM   #38
NCAL_YEE
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239ML purchased ~8mo ago

Hi, I bought the exact travel trailer you mentioned.
My tow vehicle is a 2001 ford sport trac with 4.0l V6.
I was also very worried since i'm pretty much at the limit and make sure to pack as little as possible.
I purchased a Eazlift R6 WD hitch with sway control.
When I took it out the first time on the freeway it was very smooth and yes I could feel the weight but it pulled it okay. Maybe this is better since it keeps you from going to fast.
Anyway the trailer pulls with no sway on the short trips so far. Of course when you when you get hit with wind gusts you will fill it and a little scary but under control.
I will eventually get a bigger more capable tow vehicle but want to make sure I like h=this before spending too much money.
I think Keystone builds fairly good quality trailers so far no issues.
Only thing I had issues with was the dealer not grounding the battery to the frame, which I did and fixed my issues.
I paid about 31K out the door no haggling in N CA since the dealer said he could sell these at this price any day.
I also heard that there nay be some used deals around since people who bought like myself may have a change of heart or got too scared after there first trip.
Anyway good luch and Merry Xmas,
IYEE
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Old 08-10-2021, 04:28 PM   #39
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Hi. I am looking to get a 1700BH. any update on your sales experience? We’re you able to haggle and how much off MSRP? Any help is appreciated. I do not see any in California for sale.
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Old 08-10-2021, 04:33 PM   #40
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Hi. I am looking to get a 1700BH. any update on your sales experience? We’re you able to haggle and how much off MSRP? Any help is appreciated. I do not see any in California for sale.
I negotiated a 37.81% discount and probably could have done better.
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