I thot I would add observations...caught my eye with 'weight police' Being an ex trucker from long ago in a family of current truckers and retired truckers with a brother who is a cop...that has meaning to us! lol
Preface:
Back in the day when I bought my first new truck (Ford, 1990) all of this info was published, literally, on paper the 'Ford Towing Guide' and the 'Chevrolet Guide to Towing'. All these questions and more were in there and I did look online based what was written above. Its in there, but its not as intuitive WHY they put in the charts what they do. Back in the day, if you cared and was willing to sit with the truck/commercial mgr for a few hours, could play games with the PEP (ford) or RPO (GM) and equip to taste. *magical* things would happen when you did. Even after the sale.
Back then there were 2 things: the publish weights, and the ones you could get. All the trucks, including the half ton had an option to box delete, had overload add, front end differences, plus optional equipment in which ford or GM would send you ANOTHER sticker so you could reg it different.
This brings me to: Police? Whose? Now the disclaimers: (ymmv, batteries not included, simulated picture, professional driver, closed course etc etc) I am going to speak for PA for no other reason than I live in PA, tow in PA, license in PA and am a licensed vehicle inspector in pa... Check your state....
John Q Law, aka JQL aka 'the cops' only worry about 2 stickers - if at all. Civilian enforcement is spotty at best. If they have reason so look, PA has a weight sticker on trucks (but not SUVS!) that has the PA registered weight class. Its way different than the 4 tier above...it goes up from 1 to *something* that grosses 80K, If JQL sees a class 2 with a 5th wheel or a slide in or a 35ft box, he is gonna question it.
The other set of numbers is in the door jamb - the GAWR. This is the one that indicates what the axles can do, HERE and are oft lower than the actual axle capability. To approach the axle max rating, you likely are looking at total different spring packs, mounting, perhaps not even on that frame.
So where are we? Customers, over the last 30 years want these damn things to look like cars, act like cars, pamper like a car, and ride like cars so we start getting 'max' numbers from the OEM that dont always line up with what we want to do. The GVWR and payload numbers walk hand in hand. A change in equipment, increases lite weight, and within the confines of GVWR payload drops.
In the F350 V F450 DRW example, if we scroll thru fords online 'Ford Towing Guide' equivalent, we find, that for 2 trucks that look alike, are sized sorta alike, have the same powertrain - the F450 is *significantly* heavier at the curb. It does not take much metal added to a frame in terms of thickness or bracing, to get there fast.
We assume Ford engineers and GM engineers base these on sound engineering principles, and product test, or voodoo and witchcraft...which ever is better.
But they came up with a payload, in pretty much every case, that is far less than the weight afforded by summing GAWRR and GAWRF. They want it to ride fine, and they dont know the dumb things people will do to load it. There are blurbs in the owners manual to cover their butts, but reality is, I can climb into a cab and surround me in the front seat with DU slugs and not exceed the GVWR, but do exceed the GAWRF and cause a failure...
So let me pepper this with some real world 'frinstances' (stored on the shelf next to 'round tuits')
As an inspector in PA with the required shop stuff and hammers etc, I am asked to do more than annually make sure someones brakes are thick enuf, tires deep enuf and ball joints tight enuf. As someone supposedly versed in mechanicals and springs and suspensions etc, anoher person in PA wishing to change regs would grab up a few PA DMV forms, the 1005 and the 41 and come visit. I did more trailers than trucks, and they were cargo trailers (boxed or flat) and never a coach.
So here is how it works:
Frinstance 1: 1981 F100. I have restored a number of vehicles for no reason that I wanted to. I did 6 trucks and the last, my swan song, was a 1981 F100 strip job I literally found behind a business, and paid almost nothing. It had no options (no air, no auto, no PB, no PW, no PS, no PL, no carpet, no slider...you get the point.) It had a I6, an SROD tranny, an open 9" rear and get this: a 4700lb GVWR. The truck curbed at 3700, a true half ton, but alas, part of that half ton payload was ME. If you stood in the bed and wiggled, it was like being in an old S10 short bed...not very heavy duty. long stories short, I happened to have an 89 F150 on the property I was parting out. It had a locking 8.8 in 3.55 and was GVWR 5450. So I grafted the rear end, springs and axle and all to the F100. Now it behaved like a real-er truck so I grabbed an MV1005 and signed, and being the mechanic I filled in the MV41 doing due dilliengce...yes the springs are the proper rating, yes the GAWR is higher, yes the tires are proper load carrying, sent is all in with a new title application as I was changing the titled weight, not just reg. couple weeks later....got it and when I sold the truck later, the new owner was for all intents and purposes buying a heavy half, it was still close to 3700 light (closer to 3850 after mods, but with 5450 top, 1600lb rating instead of 1000.)
Frisntance 2: I would get a lot of trailer inspections (up to 10000lbs, in PA you can only inspect what you are licensed to drive so therefore I can inspect vehicles up to 26000lbs, trailers 10K and motorcycles. I gave up my big truck ratings when I moved out of state to start my post graduation job) Lets take 1, a guy buys a 12ish ft box trailer, titled and registered at 2995lbs, the max before you require trailer brakes and therefore: annuals. Wanting to take advantage of the springs and axle capability, but be safe, he added electric brakes to the trailer. given that he had 3500lb springs and a dexter 3500lb axle, he came to me with the 1005 and 41 forms. I looked, yep, has brakes and they worked when I tested them. The tires were proper load rating, the springs were proper capacity, I filled in the form and gave him his first sticker. The pink copy of his new application for title served as temp reg and off he went
Frinstance 3: dealer changes. I got my first new on the planet truck in 1990, an F150 I ordered. I had a specific boat I wanted to tow...so we sat down to order, the 5.0, AOD, 3L55 axle would let me weigh 6250lbs, but tow 7600. than, as now, the haul weights and tow weights ARE also dictated by drivetrain (auto or stick) MOSTLY, axle ratio next, then engine. 4x4 deducts as 4x4 equipment was both sprung (xfer case) and unsprung (front axle) . the truck mgr pointed out that if I order snow plow prep PEP, and the utility body PEP, I would get heavier front coils, and contact overloads in the back. This would cause ford to give me a 7000GVWR sticker, instead of the 6250 one. The GAWR was still < 3800 rear(8.8) and 3700lbs front (D44IFS) axle maxes so I still could have found a way to get to 7500GVWR. I declined, as the ford options were a LOT, and instead installed my own contact overloads and applied after the fact.
Looking at the current Ford charts here:
https://media.ford.com/content/dam/f...Tech-Specs.pdf
We find there really isnt a tranny difference. Only the F250HD gets a lesser tranny so that COULD be the 9kGVW example
If you scroll, you find that they do state the F350DRW will have the highest payload and it appears the reason why is the difference in curb, as all are held in max config to 14KGVW. I suspect there are things NOT in that document that state the 450 can go over 14K in some configuration, prolly a hotshot setup. IF you box delete - not that big of a deal, 2 beef eating guys can lift an 8ft bed off the frame (assuming you unbolt it first) - thats only in the 300ish lb range. When we look at GAWR, those huge corporate axles are insane.
Frinstance 4: My tow vehicle is a square Suburban. Unlike most 3/4 ton buses made then with a 7500GVWR, this was a 8600GVW with commercial emissions and the full floater. My axle max load is 8600lbs....meaning I could technically wheelie the whole loaded truck on it and not fail it...assuming I updated the springs. but the GAWR says 5600. meaning on THIS truck, this frame etc, that corporate 14 bolt can do 3000 less than its 'bearings fail' rating. I bet on a hotshot chassis cab, its higher...thicker frame, thicker leaf pack etc.
Biggest issue I find reading all these tables....they are allowing trailers way way to large or heavy for civilians....
In my state once the trailer tops 10K (not hard to do today) you can apply for a non-commercial 'CDL' that lets you drive it after a driving test and of course, fee paid. Others are likely similar. Dont skip doing that, if you do the pinch is pretty painful.
In my state the class C car and truck license is also 26Klbs. Todays Class A motorhomes can exceed that in a hurry AS WELL.
So to sum up and make a long story, longer, if you are concerned about the weight of fido on the payload...who cares. Stay within GVWR and failing that, just apply for an update to stay under GAWR. If the REAL weight police cant get you on the former, they will try on the latter. as long as your paperwork is updated to cover you for the reality of what you are doing, the door stickers are ignored.
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