Super Solar Flex

[McRod]

Originally Posted by GHen

Some else might do better math than me, but here is my guess.
This is a special AC and is only 1075 watts, I think most AC’s are around 1500 watts. 1075 watts is about 9 amps at 120 volts, I think that’s about 90 amps at 12 volts. The system has 510 usable amps so you would only have about 5 hours of AC use and the batteries would be close to dead. That does not account for the possible 1000 watts of solar recharging while using the ac. The solar will probably average around 50 amps at 12 volts if they have full sun, so that would cut your battery usage in half, or allow you to use the AC for up to 10 hours, if you had full sun.

Ok solar guys, am I close to correct?

Its not a special AC. It's simply a soft start capacitor on the AC. Takes less than 30 mins to install for your average DIYer.

Go to this link to read about soft starts for AC. Easy start.

[GHen]

Originally Posted by McRod

Its not a special AC. It's simply a soft start capacitor on the AC. Takes less than 30 mins to install for your average DIYer.

Go to this link to read about soft starts for AC. Easy start.

This is referring to the new AC that are an option on the Montana’s. it include an energy efficient A/c that only draws 10 amps and includes a soft start standard. It’s a “Coleman Mach powersaver”

A standard Coleman Mach AC draws 15 amps even if you add the aftermarket soft start as your suggesting. The savings of the 5 amp in normal cool mode make it easier to power with only a 1000 watts of solar.

[GHen]

(The super solar flex system also has 510 amps of lithium to power the ac through an inverter)

[Fishsizzle]

I’m not sure what battery models, but Dragonfly only lists a few and the biggest is 100 ah. It’s $1090

So for 2 batteries to have 510 from Dragon fly must be an insane amount of money

[GHen]

Originally Posted by Fishsizzle

I’m not sure what battery models, but Dragonfly only lists a few and the biggest is 100 ah. It’s $1090

So for 2 batteries to have 510 from Dragon fly must be an insane amount of money

Your right, the batteries in the package are not listed on the dragonfly website.
Here is a quote I found, the ones in the package are 250ah.


Dragonfly Energy introduces its new LiFePO4 battery – the GC3, which is being featured on a Keystone RV towable for Open House Week. The GC3 is Dragonfly’s new 250AH battery and is being presented in collaboration with RV manufacturer Keystone

[Fishsizzle]

Originally Posted by GHen

Your right, the batteries in the package are not listed on the dragonfly website.
Here is a quote I found, the ones in the package are 250ah.


Dragonfly Energy introduces its new LiFePO4 battery – the GC3, which is being featured on a Keystone RV towable for Open House Week. The GC3 is Dragonfly’s new 250AH battery and is being presented in collaboration with RV manufacturer Keystone

So you have to imagine this battery set up is $4-5k

[SR71 Jet Mech]

I’m using 4x 6 v 230ah

[McRod]

Originally Posted by GHen

This is referring to the new AC that are an option on the Montana’s. it include an energy efficient A/c that only draws 10 amps and includes a soft start standard. It’s a “Coleman Mach powersaver”

A standard Coleman Mach AC draws 15 amps even if you add the aftermarket soft start as your suggesting. The savings of the 5 amp in normal cool mode make it easier to power with only a 1000 watts of solar.

Yeah, I read it. It's marketing hype for a soft start capacitor. Add a soft start and you can call it a new fandangled congugalamajig.

The standard AC draws that amperage as it cycles on and off. By adding a soft start that cycling power consumption is reduced by ~67%. Its not a different AC unit. It's the same AC unit with a soft start capacitor. Been around for years now. The RV industry is seeing what people are doing to their RVs and adding them as new options with their marketing spin on it. They didn't reinvent an AC unit.

[McRod]

Originally Posted by GHen

(The super solar flex system also has 510 amps of lithium to power the ac through an inverter)

Yes, that's a big portion of the added cost. Just my opinion, but the value is not there yet. Lithium is going to continue to change due to demand in EVs. Buying into it now is like buying into laser discs...if you can remember those.

[Fishsizzle]

Originally Posted by McRod

Yes, that's a big portion of the added cost. Just my opinion, but the value is not there yet. Lithium is going to continue to change due to demand in EVs. Buying into it now is like buying into laser discs...if you can remember those.

Yes, laser disc. Flip it over half way through the movie.

Before all this I was researching batteries from China. It’s where all these “parts” come from. Battle Born and Dragon fly buy all the components from China and “assemble” them in the states.

You could get the whole battery at half the price direct. Not sure I’ll get them anytime soon.

[Fishsizzle]

Originally Posted by SR71 Jet Mech

I’m using 4x 6 v 230ah

I don’t have solar, but I Run 4x6v as Well and have 2x6v for the res fridge, for 6 total batteries. They are Heavy!

[McRod]

Originally Posted by GHen

Your right, the batteries in the package are not listed on the dragonfly website.
Here is a quote I found, the ones in the package are 250ah.


Dragonfly Energy introduces its new LiFePO4 battery – the GC3, which is being featured on a Keystone RV towable for Open House Week. The GC3 is Dragonfly’s new 250AH battery and is being presented in collaboration with RV manufacturer Keystone

The won't be available until late 2020 according to website. I would expect the cost to be just north of $2k per battery @255 AH.

Renogy sells their 12v 170AH LifePo for $1349. So far that seems to be the best deal/AH on the market.

[Fishsizzle]

Originally Posted by McRod

The won't be available until late 2020 according to website. I would expect the cost to be just north of $2k per battery @255 AH.

Renogy sells their 12v 170AH LifePo for $1349. So far that seems to be the best deal/AH on the market.

That’s not a bad price given the life span of lithium

Here’s what’s on the backside of the pacific, goto “Alibaba Express” online and enter 250ah Lithium and shop away.

[McRod]

Originally Posted by Fishsizzle

I don’t have solar, but I Run 4x6v as Well and have 2x6v for the res fridge, for 6 total batteries. They are Heavy!

Yes, they are 67lbs ea. I have 8 of them! They run my entire rig on a normal day. I have 2 fridges, microwave, coffee maker, instant pot, toaster, 2 x TV's, heater, and lots of ancillary stuff (lights, water pump, fans,etc).

What kills me with their marketing hype is the lifecycle comparison. They say SLA batteries only last 300 cycles. Mine are getting close to 1200 cycles and I am fully expecting another 300-500 cycles out of them. They've been in my rig since 2016. That's a huge difference in cost/value comparison. It makes you question the other side of the comparison for LifePo being 3000 cycles - is that overhyped?

[McRod]

Originally Posted by Fishsizzle

That’s not a bad price given the life span of lithium

Here’s what’s on the backside of the pacific, goto “Alibaba Express” online and enter 250ah Lithium and shop away.

Yep, there out there. Here is a 250AH for $999 on Amazon. Doesn't have the polish, but for 1/2 the price....

Link

[McRod]

Originally Posted by Fishsizzle

Yes, laser disc. Flip it over half way through the movie...

That was the first laser disc players...later players you didn't need to flip them. The discs cost about $40 each. Within a decade they got replaced by DVDs at half the cost and a quarter of the size.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by McRod

Yep, there out there. Here is a 250AH for $999 on Amazon. Doesn't have the polish, but for 1/2 the price....

Link

The battery at your link has a 23% "one star rating". That's nearly 25% of the buyers are not satisfied with their "thousand dollar battery". It may be a "expectation of more for that much money" or it may be "a CHEAP Chinese assembled battery that's inferior"...

I'm not suggesting any reason for the 23% "one star", just pointing out that a LOT of people are not satisfied with that product, for some reason.

[GHen]

It’s interesting to watch the YouTube videos taking the lithium batteries apart. Lots of different construction out there. Some have just one temperature sensor, some have 4. Some with light wiring, some with solid copper straps between cells. And they all have a different types of controller circuit boards inside also.
Lithium Seems like overkill for weekend warriors, but for full timers, week plus boondockers and maybe even hunters out in the woods for a week, maybe. A generator for occasional use seems like more sense for me. I’ll stick with my 6 volt setup.

[McRod]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

The battery at your link has a 23% "one star rating". That's nearly 25% of the buyers are not satisfied with their "thousand dollar battery". It may be a "expectation of more for that much money" or it may be "a CHEAP Chinese assembled battery that's inferior"...

I'm not suggesting any reason for the 23% "one star", just pointing out that a LOT of people are not satisfied with that product, for some reason.

Yeah, as I read most of them that gave it one star is because it is rated @255 AH and they are getting 225ish AH. Claim it's over rated. Still good value comparatively speaking. BTW, I wasn't promoting that battery, it was the first one that turned up in my search using the terms suggested above.

That being said, I think if I were to go lithium, this is where I would start. My 8 x 6v 225 golf cart batteries cost $1,100. + Tax and self watering system. That gave me about 450 usable amp hours new. I would say now after 4 years I am close to 80% usable capacity (350ish AH). You can buy the 500AH lithium for $1,850 at the link I provided (expect it to perform in the 450AH range). That's much better value and less risk. I just can't see spending $5k for batteries.

[McRod]

Just for reference for Solid Lead Acid (SLA) batteries, to date I have charged almost 3.5 Megawatt hours into my SLA batteries. That's over a 44 month period. During that time, specifically, at start, I was still using campgrounds electric, so average is going to be a lot lower. Also, when I workcamped last year at Amazon, electricity was provided. My system is only 1000w solar.

Compared to a home that's not much at all. Average full size home uses 914kwh per month! (Source EIA.gov).

Pays to be green!