New to the forum/towing questions

depshrink · 11-19-2010, 12:44 PM

Hello folks,

I am new to the forum. After months of looking for my first TT, my wife and I have settled on a Keystone Laredo 293 RK, which we hope to purchase at the RV show in Pittsburgh Pa in January. Like many new RV'rs, I have struggled with the question, "What can my truck tow?" I have a 2010 GMC Sierra 1500 "All Terrain", with a towing capacity of 9500 pounds. So, at first, I was using the 9500 pounds as my guideline, only to find out I shouldnt be using that figure. Advice from others have ranged from TT's weighing from 3000 pounds to 9500 pounds. I've seen formulas that use the trucks GVR and the RV's GVR and the trucks GCWR. My problem centers around accepting that you should use the GVR as the primary measure of weight. Why would you assume that I will fill my truck with all the weight it can legally carry, and that I will fill the RV with all the weight it can carry. What really brought this home to me was seeing a number of RV's that had the same dry weight, say, 5000 pounds. One, perhaps, had a carrying capacity of 1500 pounds. Thats a GVR of 6500 pounds. A weight I would find acceptable. But, the other RV had a carrying capacity of 4000 pounds. That would give you a GVR of 9500 pounds. A weight I would find unacceptable. But, whose to say that I have to put 4000 pounds of stuff in that RV? If I put 1500 pounds in it, it would weigh the same as the first one. So, by shopping by GVRs and not dry weight, I am automatically eliminating a number of RV's that, would, actually, work well for me. The frustrations of a first time RV shopper!

(Moderator's Note: This post has been moved to "Towing and Tow Vehicles" since it deals mainly with tow vehicles and towing capacity.)

MightyMike · 11-20-2010, 01:12 AM

depshrink, I think you're on the right track. I never figure the max. tow weight when I'm buying an Rv, simply because I know how I am going to use it. That's the key-you have to know what you are going to do and have some basic weight information. you can find many posts on different sites where weight rating is a huge issue. I never found it to be that complicated. First thing I would do is weigh your truck with full load of fuel and you and the wife and any kids in it. If you already have your hitch, put that on too. Find you GCWR and you GRAW. Combined weight is everything you are going down the road with, axle weight is the limit you can carry on the rear tires. Also have to check what your tires are rated for. So take your GCWR minus what the truck weighed, and that's what you can tow- that means trailer and all your "stuff". I usually add 1000 pounds for all the things we take along, and it's usually a pretty close guess. Now you need to figure out if you are going to do a lot of dry camping or will you always go where you have hook ups. If you don't need to carry water, that's good as it contributes heavily to your carried weight-each gallon weighs about 8 pounds. All we ever carry is enough to use the potty on the way to or from camping, and always dump my tanks before I leave for home. Also keep in mind when a mfg. quotes a dry weight, they are not including full propane tanks or battery.

Flyguy · 11-20-2010, 04:58 AM

I have to agree with MightyMike, I have been looking at the same TTer and BTW isn't it a beauty! I have the empty weight as per the Keystone Laredo website as: 6560#s and I know that when we travel we load approx. 1100#s into our Passport which brings us to a towing weight of approx. 5600#s. So if you load the same way that would bring you to approx. 7600#s of towing weight and like Mike says, add the loaded weight of your TV to this to see how close you come to the GCVW rating of your TV. Of more concern to me is the stated tongue weight rating (hitch) of 645#s, will your rear suspension and hitch handle this? What is the RAWR (Rear axle weight rating) posted on the drivers side door jamb? And will the tires that you have cover that rating? All things considered you will probably be ok but I would monitor my weights and know what the limits are. I can't say enough about that 293RK, it's all the trailer that I dream of. And BTW they have a new fiberglass front cap that makes the trailer look really nice and encloses the LP tanks too! If you buy one you might want to get one with the new front cap (looks like their 5ver version), if the dealer has one that has the old flat curved front then he knows that people will want the new front cap if they get wind of it. Get a better price if it dosen't have the new front cap. Here's a URL for you to look at the new front cap: http://www.rvtraderonline.com/find/l...293RK-97618248 And BTW do a through PDI with the dealer and get him to fix all that's on the punch list (faults) before you hand over the check. Here's where you can find the PDI form, download it and print it out and take it with you and tell the dealer that this is the list you want to go by: http://eaa1358.com/Passport/Pre-Deli...0Checklist.pdf This won't sovle all the problems but it will go a long way to making you a "Happy Camper".

Jim W · 11-20-2010, 05:52 AM

Hi, I have not pull a TT in a long long time, but I have referred to this site for my towing needs and requirements. This site maybe able to answer your questions. You may have seen this web site or not. If not then I hope this helps you.
Jim.
http://changingears.com/rv-sec-tow-vehicle-sizing.shtml

depshrink · 11-20-2010, 05:34 PM

I'm going to have to crunch some more numbers to examine whether my rear axles can handle the weight. I know that the hitch is rated at 600 pounds, but is increased to 1100 pounds by using a WD hitch (which I plan to do). I noticed that the TT I looked at didn't have the new front cap. I will have to make sure mine has it. Kinda reminds me of the Keystone Premier I saw recently on tv. I also, have resigned myself to the fact that I will probably be upgrading my tow vehicle in a few years to something that I dont have to worry about towing weight so much. This truck is only a few months old, so I will keep it for awhile. Thanks to everyone for their input.

Flyguy · 11-21-2010, 06:11 AM

Depshrink, what engine, transmission, and rear axle does your 1500 have? Do you have the tow package?

depshrink · 11-21-2010, 08:00 AM

I have the 5.3 L V-8, 6 speed automatic transmission, 3.42 axle ratio, and it came with the heavy duty tow package. My rated towing capacity is 9500 pounds.

Flyguy · 11-21-2010, 08:38 AM

That sounds good! My Tundra has about all the same ratings in every category except that the maximum tow rating is 10,400#s but very close to yours and I would not worry about towing that trailer either with your TV or my Tundra. From your previous post it sounds like you have already ordered the trailer, when did the dealer say it would be delivered?

depshrink · 11-21-2010, 12:16 PM

Haven't ordered it yet. I plan (hope) to get a good deal at the big RV show in Pittsburgh, Pa. in January. With any luck, I will take possession of it in early spring. I must admit that I am still wrestling with the weight issue. If I can find an identical set up with a 1000 pounds less weight, I would be a happy fella. This one is sooooo nice, though......

Flyguy · 11-21-2010, 02:28 PM

It is one of the nicest floorplans and TTer that I've seen in a long time, I would love to have one of these but I'm content with what I already have and it's paid for! Be careful at the RV show, very often dealers will bring units that they haven't been able to sell all year and have had trouble with and don't be rushed into buying on the spot. If you put a deposit on one be sure to let the dealer know that you reserve the right to inspect it on his lot and be satisfied with it and have all faults fixed BEFORE you hand him the check and don't worry about your TV not being able to pull it, it will although you might have to be patient with it on hills but it will do until you get into position for a new TV. Also when you do go for a new TV be sure to look at getting a 3/4 ton diesel. These will give you at least 600ft-lbs of torque at between 1500 and 1900 rpm and will pull any TT you can think of. I love my Tundra but it dosen't give that kind of torque. Good luck to you!

GMcKenzie · 11-24-2010, 06:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by depshrink

If I can find an identical set up with a 1000 pounds less weight, I would be a happy fella. This one is sooooo nice, though......

I've got a Cougar 30 RKS, but it looks to be close to the same weight, although a bit lighter on the hitch. The extra foot must be behind the wheels.

Beachnut · 12-31-2010, 09:06 AM

depshrink

We just bought a 2010 Keystone Outback 230RS with a dry weight of "5241 #'s", add to that the 40 gallon's of water it will carry and your at 6000#'s, then add all the camping stuff, full twin 8 Ibs propane tanks, batts and your probably at around 6700 - 7000 Ibs. Hook it all up to my 2005 Chevy Silverado with the 5.3 V-8 and it is a whole lot of work for that 5.3 liter motor to pull around!!!! I live in Central Coastal CA, so to go anywhere, I am going over mountans. Climbing those mtns. I am down in 2nd gear, reving 3200 to 4000 RPM to maintain 55 to 60 MPH, and it will stay in 2nd for the whole long climb! The truck does the job, but it sure is working HARD to tow that trailer. I know you have a 2010, but I asked the dealer how the newer models can say they can haul so much more weight than my truck, while still having the 5.3 motor and he said "Its all about the towing capacity wars between truck company's. Yes the truck CAN do it, but it sure wont last long if you haul around that much weight with it very often"! So be careful about how much trailer weight you end up buying, with that 5.3 liter motor! (For us old timers, that only like a 327 motor!)

Also, the 1/2 ton truck that I have needs air bags to stiffen up the back as the truck and trailer will set up this "bounce" where you go over a bump, and you get this rise and fall effect at the hitch for a while as it "settles" down. So as others advised me on this forum, a 3/4 ton truck IS better suited for towing these large heavy trailers! (But others complain about how hard the HD 3/4 ton trucks ride ALL the time, and wish they had beefed up a 1/2 ton with air bags and such so as to have the nice smooth ride of the 1/2 ton when NOT towing).

Lastly.......

As another wise forum adviser suggested to me on this forum, go to Holman RV Wholesalers and get a price quote, and have that in your hand before dealing with ANY dealer. I saved thousands of dollars by having a printed quote in hand with full shipping / transportation fees all the way to CA from Holman in Ohio, when I went to my local California keystone dealer and said I was just looking to see what I was going to order an buy form Holman RV. They ended up near matching the Holman extremly low price, and I was able to buy local. The site is:

http://www.holmanrv.com/

We have owned our RV since 11/10/10 and have already made 3 trips and spent over a month camping in it! They are GREAT RV's! Hold up well in pouring rain, and 20 degree temp's!

Best of luck with your hard decision...

Beachnut

Ruffus · 12-31-2010, 10:59 AM

Maybe your trying to go to fast up these grades. I've pulled trailers up Questa grade North of San Luis Obispo CA for years

and 45 MPH pulls fine and doesn't work the engine to hard. If people want to go faster then let them go around you, jsut my 2 cents worth.

Paul Clancy · 01-02-2011, 07:59 AM

Towing in the 9000lb range with a half ton 5.3 would be frustrating for me on every level. Considering mountain towing is a must do in my region I had to go hd diesel or stay home. It's fine to go slow uphill but it usually sets up a dangerous situation as drivers try to pass. I have towed 6000lbs with a half ton 5.7 and was so stressed by it and felt so on the edge of grenading motor/trans or having an accident I took the hit and bought a diesel hd truck. Now towing 10,000lbs I am very relaxed and enjoy the whole experience.

Flyguy · 01-03-2011, 06:04 AM

There's something else to consider here, COST! Is having a TV with 650 ft-lbs of torque at 1600 rpm great as opposed to 400 ft-lbs at 3600 rpm! Of course it is! Can everyone afford to own the Biltmore estate in NC? If they could they would and also own a 3/4 ton Diesel TV. But for all of us PO-Folks who still want to tow a TT with our gas TV's we have to consider just what we can and cannot do. And there's nothing wrong with that. Wasn't it Clint Eastwood who once said in one of his movies that "a man has to know his limitations"? This is nothing new and has always been that way. What you select as a TT to tow with your gasser is a careful consideration and that's all this member is asking. I know where he is coming from because I had to make the same decision and it has worked out fine for me. JMHO You can also add to this that I tow with the holding tanks empty to save weight (just six gallons in the fresh tank and a charge in the potty so we can use it on the road if we have to).

depshrink · 01-11-2011, 05:34 PM

Well, went to the Pittsburgh RV show on Sunday. I expected to find a number of rv's that would fill the bill, so to speak, but, only found one to conpete with the Laredo. It's a Kodiak 281RLGS, weighing about 5000 pounds empty. Thing is, it really isn't much competition. Even though the weight is a better match for my half ton truck, I couldn't make the compromise. I ended up deciding on the Laredo 293 RK. It's has all the features I could possibly want (except for being a mite heavy). Wish me luck! I am buying it now and will pick it up in the spring.

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