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10-29-2020, 11:57 AM
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#1
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Junior Member
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: Gainesville
Posts: 7
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Older vs Newer quality
My wife and I are looking at buying a preowned keystone fifth wheel toy hauler, probably a Fuzion or Raptor. I had my eye on a 2014 Fuzion but
my wife thinks the build quality is crap and feels that an older model, 2009 or so is made better and uses better materials. I on the other hand fear a rig that old has a whole lot of equipment (AC, fridge, pumps, brakes, etc) that is just that much older and worn out. Thoughts?
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10-29-2020, 04:44 PM
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#2
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Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Tucson
Posts: 822
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I lean your direction. Last year, we traded our 2008 Raptor 3712TS for a new 2018 Raptor 353TS. Build quality? I'd guess they were about the same. But the roof was 10 years newer, the appliances all newer with better features, brakes, bearings, seals, slides, etc. From a practical standpoint, I have always considered the life of a typical RV to be about 20 years - that's just my guess (based on the roof) and I can not support that with facts or figures. We were age 65+ and looking for something that would take us to age 75 or so - our final rig. So we made the trade and have REALLY enjoyed the newer rig.
My opinion: find a rig with the features & size you want, then get the newest one possible. Your doing the right thing by asking others on the forum. A "walk-through" review of "build quality" is likely not going to give you much factual information. JMHO
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10-29-2020, 05:01 PM
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#3
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Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Germantown, TN
Posts: 6,333
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I like what Lewis said. A 2009 is just asking for you to practice every one of your repair skills you possess. Which one of you will be doing the repairs, you or Momma? That alone might help in the decision of newer or older. I don't want to spend my lazy years fixing anything but a greyhound or a cold beer.
__________________
Jim in Memphis, Wife of 51 years is Brenda
2019 F450 6.7 Powerstroke
2018 Mobile Suites 40RSSA
2021 40' Jayco Eagle
2001 Road king w/matching Harley sidecar
2021 Yamaha X2 Wolverine 1000
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10-29-2020, 05:01 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Monroeville
Posts: 1,550
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With the year models you are talking about (2009 vs 2014) there is not really going to be a difference in build quality. The concerns about the stuff being older and more worn out is more of a concern wit those ages. If you were talking about a 2000 model vs a 2014 model, maybe. But at those ages, the concern is the older model is more likely to have more serious issues. That said, it still all depends on how they were each taken care of. That is more important than the absolute age.
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2014 Bullet Premier 29bh in Charocal
2019 Ram 2500 HD 4x4, CC, 6.4L
2011 Passport 2510RB (Sold)
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10-29-2020, 05:02 PM
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#5
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Site Team
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,997
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Build quality is about the same, maybe a bit "less quality" in newer rigs, but the offset is improved equipment, improved technology, improved materials, improved building techniques.
Many trailers from about 1990 to current have used luan paneling, even on the outside where it absorbs water and quickly deteriorates. Current technology is to replace luan with adzel in areas where water damage is probable. Many of the newer trailers have transitioned away from luan in the wheelwells and "sandwich flooring systems".
Older trailers (even in 2014 era) had incandescent lighting. Current models are almost all using LED lighting both inside and outside the trailer.
Leveling systems were "unheard of" just a few years ago and are now "standard equipment" on all luxury trailers and either a "no option option" or "mandatory option" on mid-range trailers. Even many entry level trailers offer leveling systems as standard equipment....
Then there's the 30 amp/50 amp shore power system. Even entry level trailers are now coming with 50 amp power systems either standard or as an option. The use of 30 amp systems is fast becoming extinct.
As "fashion" changes, furnishings such as rockers changed to recliners which changed to theater seating which changed to power recline/massage/heat seating....
Some of the above is "gimmicks" intended to create a desire for a new trailer, but if you're shopping for a used trailer, consider the available improvements that you might find desirable as well as some that you may find "invaluable" given the improvements they offer.
To me, it's not about whether the trim is attached as well as in years past (build quality) as it is about the availability of improved materials and techniques that actually come together to make a trailer that will last longer with fewer problems from the environment that trailers are used in, every day of their life.
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John
2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
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10-30-2020, 07:51 AM
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#6
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Las Cruces
Posts: 4,665
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Things I have noticed in the sales business getting to see many RVs from different eras is that many people look at interior materials and assume build quality. Many things on newer RVs are built with lighter materials and weights have reduced drastically over the years. The lighter materials may have a “cheaper feel”, but that doesn’t necessarily mean the build quality is lower. One thing I can really point to is doors. The bedroom doors on my 2013 Alpine feel much more solid and sound more solid when they close than the new units. Just because I have a “better door” that weighs more doesn’t mean my RV is built better than a new one. In fact, I’m confident the lighter weight materials used now for the doors will have no difference in the performance of the RV over the long run. The appliances are the things that will eventually nickel and dime you to death and cause you constant headache.
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Brent
2013 Alpine 3500RE
2019 Silverado 2500HD Duramax
U.S. Air Force Retired (25 yrs)
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10-30-2020, 08:06 AM
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#7
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,468
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I will speak up for the OLD camper crowd. I have a 2002 and will tell you the roof needed replacement as well as quite a few exterior small plastic bits; stove vent, compartment door keepers, etc. but NOTHING major other than the roof. I had the roof replaced with a lifetime warranty roof from RV-Armor on the insurance companiy's dime. On the inside, all changes have been making the trailer features to my liking. The water pump, heater, refrigerator and other major stuff are great. I replaced the original Dometic 13.5K btu a/c with a 15k and nothing wrong with the old. I sold it QUICKLY (on CL if I recall right) to greatly mitigate the cost of the new. I think I was about $150 or so out of pocket. The swap really wasn't needed as the old one worked fine but was looking for more cool in the cabin. The original mattress was crap so it went before taking the camper home but I think you might face this on a brand new camper. I have not had major work on anything inside the camper. Drawers and woodwork still look fine. Did they make them better in 2002 or did I get lucky? Not sure. I had a Forest River Wildwood toy hauler prior and its quality was similar except the microwave died and I had to replace an axle (probably undersized for the gross weight of the trailer); it was a 2011 model camper. Had a 2012 Sunnybrook bumper pull prior and its quality may have been a shade better as far as fit and finish.
If I were to give any advice, regardless of trailer age, look carefully carefully carefully for signs of water intrusion on the inside and look CAREFULLY at the roof to assess its condition and the condition of roof maintenance.
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wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
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10-30-2020, 08:07 AM
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#8
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Site Team
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,758
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Personally I would have 2 very serious considerations before evaluating the year or quality.
First - does it work with your tow vehichle? Do your homework. Nothing says a bad time like a trailer swaying or lying on it's side.
Second - does the layout work? It's no fun if you end up detesting the camper because "you hit your head getting out of bed", or "your knees are in your chin when you set on the toilet" or "you can't fit a week end's worth of food in the cabinets".
A screw pulled out of a hinge or a shelf that's got the staples pulled out are easy fixes. Having a toilet too close to the sink, or a ceiling that's too l;ow isn't an easy fix.
JMHO
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Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
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10-30-2020, 12:52 PM
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#9
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Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Las Cruces
Posts: 4,665
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My biggest concern with old, and mines quickly becoming that, I’ve had old before and had to replace a refrigerator. Bought a used 2003 5th wheel in 2013, used it once without issues, went to Afghanistan for a year, had a bug tripped planned with the family when I got home. Started getting everything ready to go and the fridge went out. Trying to save the vacation paid extra for shipping on a new one, luckily the local shop squeezed me in and got it replaced. Cost me $2500. I could have saved the labor cost if I had time to do it myself, but you always find this stuff when you’re ready to go, not when you’re planning a trip for next month.
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Brent
2013 Alpine 3500RE
2019 Silverado 2500HD Duramax
U.S. Air Force Retired (25 yrs)
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10-30-2020, 03:53 PM
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#10
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Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Wickenburg
Posts: 3,314
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My own opinion is that a 20-years ago, RV quality was far superior to what it is today. But the quality a 20-year-old unit still has today is no better than comparable, plus a lot of parks won't let you in.
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2019 Cougar 26RBSWE
2019 Ford F-250
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10-30-2020, 04:29 PM
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#11
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Site Team
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: W. Texas
Posts: 17,695
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Older vs newer? I would never buy a 10+ year old RV thinking I was getting a better deal. The appliances are on their last legs (these are not res appliances from 1960), the wear an tear on the interior, the deterioration of the roof, ACs, furnace etc. - not no but heck no.
Construction MIGHT have been a little better 10 years ago but I doubt it. Although some of the newer "gadgets" in an RV are useless IMO they have made great strides in most of the appliances you use. Suspensions, finishes, conveniences - you name it. Having owned a 2014 I would never think that a 2009 model in the same price category would be better today. JMO/YMMV
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Danny and Susan, wife of 56 years
2019 Ram 3500 Laramie CC SWB SB 6.4 4x4 4.10
2020 Montana High Country 331RL
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11-12-2020, 09:27 AM
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#12
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Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2020
Location: Buford
Posts: 9
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Keystone Raptor Toy Hauler
We have a 2010 Raptor we bought used a couple of years ago for about half of its original retail price. It had been stored mostly outside and the graphics are in bad shape. The tailgate had some moisture intrusion resulting in a 6" x12" rotten area and is in need of reinforcing at the hinge area. We had 3 of the 4 aluminum wheels fail (cracked spokes) on a long trip Atlanta to Texas. Discovered the problem before the wheels came off on the interstate. Scary! Otherwise we have been happy with it and plan to keep it a little longer. Inspect wheels and tailgate of any Raptor you are looking at!
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11-12-2020, 09:58 AM
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#13
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Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2016
Location: San Francisco Bay Area, CA
Posts: 15
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I have been looking at new 5s. we have a TT and are thinking about a 5th. But I wonder what effect covid had/has on the quality of 2020 and 2021 builds.
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11-12-2020, 07:36 PM
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#14
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Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: Peru
Posts: 133
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Some other issues that came up for us was getting a loan on a vehicle that's over ten years and then some resorts don't allow older RVs.
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11-12-2020, 09:17 PM
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#15
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Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Picacho, Az
Posts: 6,809
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alelka
I have been looking at new 5s. we have a TT and are thinking about a 5th. But I wonder what effect covid had/has on the quality of 2020 and 2021 builds.
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Not sure the quality has suffered any more than before Covid, but I believe the quantity has.
Just a bit of advice if upgrading to a 5er, if you currently have a 2 ton truck you'll need to upgrade that as well. Regardless of what any dealer may tell you or what they may call the 5th wheel, there very few very small 5th wheels that a 1/2 truck is capable of carrying due to limited payload.
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Full-timed 10+ years
Sold '13 Redwood FB
Traded '13 GMC Denali DRW D/A
Replacement undetermined
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