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Old 04-22-2021, 04:29 PM   #61
mjsibe
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Tow Vehicle.

Gmc or Chevy express 3500. Passenger van.
Will do just great.
Plenty of room for the kids.
Good payload rating & 9600 tow rating.
My 2014 6.0 pulls a 2014 Passport 31rk
Gvw 7400 lbs
Payload on yellow sticker is 3342 lbs.
Don't know the new 2021 van s specs with the 6.6
But should be similar.
An alternative to cramped pickup truck.
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Old 04-23-2021, 05:09 AM   #62
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Blah, Blah, Blah. I feel like I am reading a novel on some of these comments. I really love my Diesel, especially when going down a steep hill and can use the diesel brake to slow me down. As far as I know gas trucks don't have this ability. Enough said.
I get it. I love diesel too. But some people have different needs. DW and I are in our early 60's. And we plan on being part-timers, never planning to buy any rig that weighs more than 16k lbs.
I want one last truck to take us through 10 to 20 years of traveling. Probably about 200k miles and well past extended warranty time periods. The most reliable diesels out there are the older ones with mechanical pumps, no def, egr etc. The very same ones my wife despises.
I won't bad mouth anyone's diesel, I like them. If I was towing heavier than I'm going to, I would buy one. But since I am not, I am planning on a F-350 with the 7.3l gas engine.
Oh, and 4:30 gears . It fits my needs.
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Old 04-23-2021, 05:24 AM   #63
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I feel guilt (or rather dread) that the 95% of the time the Diesel is in Dily Driver mode is setting us up for costly DPF maintenance at some time in the future...and would LOVE to have gas for that 95% of the time....but the Diesel just flat tows so much better than the 5.3 V8’s we had in the Avalanche and Tahoes...it was massive over-compensation for that experience, but one I’d do again.

With me working from home, my wife’ll be taking my gas-commuter more often so that we can reserve the Diesel for the things we bought it for...but still...
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Old 04-23-2021, 05:40 AM   #64
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I feel guilt (or rather dread) that the 95% of the time the Diesel is in Dily Driver mode is setting us up for costly DPF maintenance at some time in the future...and would LOVE to have gas for that 95% of the time....but the Diesel just flat tows so much better than the 5.3 V8’s we had in the Avalanche and Tahoes...it was massive over-compensation for that experience, but one I’d do again.

With me working from home, my wife’ll be taking my gas-commuter more often so that we can reserve the Diesel for the things we bought it for...but still...
Yup! It's designed to tow hot and heavy. I pray you never have any troubles with it! Happy camping.
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Old 04-23-2021, 05:41 AM   #65
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I feel guilt (or rather dread) that the 95% of the time the Diesel is in Dily Driver mode is setting us up for costly DPF maintenance at some time in the future...and would LOVE to have gas for that 95% of the time....but the Diesel just flat tows so much better than the 5.3 V8’s we had in the Avalanche and Tahoes...it was massive over-compensation for that experience, but one I’d do again.

With me working from home, my wife’ll be taking my gas-commuter more often so that we can reserve the Diesel for the things we bought it for...but still...
I drive my '15 every day 7 miles to work and 7 miles home and have had zero trouble with the DPF but we do use it for nearly all travel because I absolutely hate my wife's car... so it gets a good run on the highway on the weekends even if we're not camping..
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Old 04-23-2021, 05:44 AM   #66
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Yup! It's designed to tow hot and heavy. I pray you never have any troubles with it! Happy camping.
It’s a solvable problem, and I file it under ‘Diesel is better, but more expensive’ along with lineitems for DEF, Fuel Filter, Severe Duty fluid swaps*, and more expensive oil changes.

Having dealt with Johnny Law while owning an emissions illegal vehicle, I have no desire to do it again.

* - Gas towing would warrant severe duty cycle service as well, but then my observation breaks down.
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Old 04-23-2021, 06:13 AM   #67
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This debate has gone on for as long as there have been deisel and gas trucks. Buy what you want, it's your money. Every time I see these debates I read the same arguments by the same camps. Much false info about the reliability, maintenance, etc. of one or the other.

As I see it the deisel crowd will defend diesels and the gas crowd the gassers. But here's my honest observation and assessment:
Deisel owners tend to have bought and used a gasser for years before buying a deisel. Typically they don't go back to a gasser for doing the same job. So they are speaking from real world experiences, not "driving a deisel once", not "driving a deisel work truck" but real world, side by side comparisons of actually OWNING and USING both over a number of years for towing similar loads, both in weight, wind resistance, center of gravity, etc.
Gasser owners typically have never owned or driven a deisel. Those that have usually driven or used a deisel that was owned by someone else (usually their employer) and their experience is jaded by the "fleet vehichle" that they drove.

I see a lot of similarities with the 1/2 ton vs 3/4 ton or larger crowds and all those arguments. And before someone get's their panties in a wad and finds that one guy that has owned a deisel and went back to a gasser to tow their 43' 25K camper and swear it does "just fine". Sure, if that's what they want to believe more power to them. All I'm saying is when reading these anecdotal reflections consider who's talking, their experience, and are they comparing apples to apples.

JMHO YMMV
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Old 04-23-2021, 06:22 AM   #68
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To your point, Flybouy, the gasser’s I’d towed with were all half-ton (or less)...to be completely scientific, I’d have to buy another 3/4 ton gasser and I just don’t have the seed funding for the research.
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Old 04-23-2021, 06:38 AM   #69
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To your point, Flybouy, the gasser’s I’d towed with were all half-ton (or less)...to be completely scientific, I’d have to buy another 3/4 ton gasser and I just don’t have the seed funding for the research.
I think you missed my point. The last line "All I'm saying is when reading these anecdotal reflections consider who's talking, their experience, and are they comparing apples to apples." is my opinion on vetting the information when researching your search, no where did I say you should go buy one of each to conduct you're own research.
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Old 04-23-2021, 07:51 AM   #70
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Well in some cases it really has nothing to do with anecdotes or experience; you don't need any to try to fit a dually in my garage....it won't....and I won't leave a vehicle parked out under the pecan trees in the orchard where we built our house because I don't want to wash it every other day or have it painted every 3-4 years after the black sap destroys the paint. First guy that puts a full sized, CC dually in my garage I will buy one on the spot....but it can't/won't happen. Hence, you buy the trailer to fit the truck not vice versa.
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Old 04-23-2021, 08:17 AM   #71
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I like what you said, Flybouy. Too many members try to argue that theirs is best: Tow vehicle, tires, hitch, diesel vs gas, etc. i would prefer to have members say what works for them and go from there, not all of this “mine is best” crapola.
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Old 04-23-2021, 08:20 AM   #72
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I think you missed my point. The last line "All I'm saying is when reading these anecdotal reflections consider who's talking, their experience, and are they comparing apples to apples." is my opinion on vetting the information when researching your search, no where did I say you should go buy one of each to conduct you're own research.
If I offended, I apologize, that wasn’t my intent. I can’t comment on a 3/4 ton gasser because I’d had enough of ‘not having enough’ and went Diesel.
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Old 04-23-2021, 08:32 AM   #73
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To "second Marshall's point" I towed with gas trucks from the 70's to the early 90's. Always has "less than 30' trailers" and never longed for anything else...

Then in 92 we bought a 35' Holiday Rambler travel trailer and the "gas half ton" was simply outclassed. I bought a diesel and never looked back... After we "got out of towing" with a motorhome, I sold the diesel truck and bought a small Ranger to "haul stuff"... I was "totally happy with that gas truck"...

Then we retired and moved up north, bought a small 26' fifth wheel and a gas half ton. NO, we weren't overloaded... It was OK, but.... I longed for the "diesel capabilities" that I previously had. I thought if I buy a bigger gas truck, it'll compensate. A F250 with a 6.2 didn't match what I knew a diesel would give me. I sold that truck and bought the current truck and now, once again, have what I want (not what I might need, but what I want) in the way of performance while towing....

There's two considerations the way I look at it... One is "what's the bare minimum I need" and the other side is "what do I want"....

Each owner needs to know what they need AND what they want... Just because I "WANT" a diesel doesn't mean you should or even that you "NEED" one....

I'll end with: Until you've actually hitched your current trailer to a modern diesel and compared it to a gas truck towing the same trailer, you don't have the "apples to apples" experience.... If you have done that "diesel/gas comparison with the same trailer" then make your decision based on YOUR wants and needs..... Until that comparison it's impossible to put all the "wants and needs" into the right category on the +/- list..... And, don't compare a 1999 diesel with a 2020 diesel they are as different as night and day.
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Old 04-23-2021, 08:32 AM   #74
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I get it. I love diesel too. But some people have different needs. DW and I are in our early 60's. And we plan on being part-timers, never planning to buy any rig that weighs more than 16k lbs.
I want one last truck to take us through 10 to 20 years of traveling. Probably about 200k miles and well past extended warranty time periods. The most reliable diesels out there are the older ones with mechanical pumps, no def, egr etc. The very same ones my wife despises.
I won't bad mouth anyone's diesel, I like them. If I was towing heavier than I'm going to, I would buy one. But since I am not, I am planning on a F-350 with the 7.3l gas engine.
Oh, and 4:30 gears . It fits my needs.
I would strongly disagree with your statement that older ones are the most reliable. I'd bet any of the big 3 newer diesels are much stronger, more powerful & much better equipped than those 10-15 years ago when most were built to be work trucks. Nowadays they can be as well equipped as most any model of luxury car on the market. They don't clatter & rattle while running, they don't stink, they don't belch black smoke with every press of the go pedal, get good fuel mileage & ride fairly decent.
I'm also one of those guys Marshall described! I've towed heavy rvs with gassers & diesels, didn't notice much difference in normal maintenance costs, fuel mileage was better with the diesel especially in hilly areas, that diesel easily chugs uphill with ease while that gasser is screaming trying to keep up speed & if towing any rv of any significant weight or length will never do so with a gasser again.
We used a diesels as a daily driver, short distances & towing, for 15+ years & never any issues with 2 different diesel trucks. In Europe the majority of vehicles, cars & trucks, are diesels.
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Old 04-24-2021, 06:08 AM   #75
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If I offended, I apologize, that wasn’t my intent. I can’t comment on a 3/4 ton gasser because I’d had enough of ‘not having enough’ and went Diesel.
No offense taken. I just thought you didn't understand what I was trying to convey.
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Old 04-24-2021, 07:30 AM   #76
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I would strongly disagree with your statement that older ones are the most reliable. I'd bet any of the big 3 newer diesels are much stronger, more powerful & much better equipped than those 10-15 years ago when most were built to be work trucks. Nowadays they can be as well equipped as most any model of luxury car on the market. They don't clatter & rattle while running, they don't stink, they don't belch black smoke with every press of the go pedal, get good fuel mileage & ride fairly decent.
I'm also one of those guys Marshall described! I've towed heavy rvs with gassers & diesels, didn't notice much difference in normal maintenance costs, fuel mileage was better with the diesel especially in hilly areas, that diesel easily chugs uphill with ease while that gasser is screaming trying to keep up speed & if towing any rv of any significant weight or length will never do so with a gasser again.
We used a diesels as a daily driver, short distances & towing, for 15+ years & never any issues with 2 different diesel trucks. In Europe the majority of vehicles, cars & trucks, are diesels.
I bought my first diesel in 1984 I ordered a F250HD 4x4 with the 6.9L IH and 4 speed manual. Man I was in hog heaven.. and I toyed with driving diesels from Ford and IH over the next few years until '94 when the new style Dodge Ram cam out with the Cummins and... boy was I hooked...

I was towing 10K to 15K equipment trailers all over the country running a crew making Ammonium polyphosphate with a portable pipe reactor and that truck was the best towing truck I'd owned. For the next four years I averaged 100K miles and a new truck every year.. In August of '98 I retired and changed careers again. I sold the diesel and started a vehicle spiral from the Durango to F150, back to an F250 diesel and finally back to the F350 dually.

All that was said to provide my Bona fides.... There is absolutely and I mean absolutely no comparison between the diesel pickups of yesterday and today... Not in longevity, not in power, not in load carrying, and not in fuel mileage.... Today's diesel pickups win every category, hands down.... well except for the Ram Bullwinkle Mirrors... that is just wrong
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Old 04-24-2021, 08:00 AM   #77
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QUOTE;
well except for the Ram Bullwinkle Mirrors... that is just wrong ;QUOTE

Especially while not towing anything. I think they could take out pedestrians on the curb with those things.
Sorry Ram guys, but if not towing fold'em up!
I took a contract job mowing pipeline right of ways, they furnished the Kubota w/ the brush hog towed w/ a F350 SRW Ford 4x4 w/ the V10, that thing would pass everything on the highway except a gas station, if you saw a station you better stop & fill up as you may not make it to the next one. At 60-65 mph that thing got, on the flats, about 6 mpg, less if there were any hills, w/ a 26 gallon tank I spent a good bit of everyday looking for a gas station. They had a F350 dually but didn't want me to use it cause diesel cost about .40 more per gallon, DUH!
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Old 04-24-2021, 09:08 AM   #78
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QUOTE;
well except for the Ram Bullwinkle Mirrors... that is just wrong ;QUOTE

Especially while not towing anything. I think they could take out pedestrians on the curb with those things.
Sorry Ram guys, but if not towing fold'em up!

Took the 5er to get the RAM TPMS installed. Forgot to move mirrors. Stopped a block from home and fixed that. Got back home and unhooked but was late to get kids from school and had not had lunch.

Almost took out the MickeyD drive through! Needless to say before a bite of burger the mirrors where back in.
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Old 04-24-2021, 09:27 AM   #79
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Gas

Modern Gas engines are nothing like engines from just a few years ago. Current gas engines in HD trucks have a lot more torque, more hp and better MPG.

Diesel owners are like vegetarians.... they really need to let you know it.

You know, at the campground, lots of diesel owners will drive by and make extra noise when going by a gas truck.
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Old 04-24-2021, 09:47 AM   #80
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I ain't good as I once was but I'm as good once as I ever was! The "when I was a young pup stories" are starting to roll. Diesel envy is evident. The trucks from the good ol' days ain't squat compared to the Def burners. How many times will this topic need to be hammered into the ground? Do you diesel owners really drive by puny 1/2 ton gas trucks and "make extra noise"? The shame. Do ya'll think it is time we got back to discussing Trailer King tires yet?
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