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Old 11-12-2019, 03:41 PM   #1
terrymullett
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Cougar Climate Guard - camping at +8 F

We are keeping our new Cougar open and lived in as far into the season as we can - better to find at least some weaknesses now while there's still a salary coming in to fix them rather than wait until after I retire :-). Last night in Spring Hill Kansas we got down to 8 degrees and found the weakest link in our Climate Guard.

I was sure it would be the water line between the fresh tank and the pump, but nope.

At around 15 degrees outside temp we lost hot water in the galley island. A few hours later at around 10 degrees, the cold was out too. But all night and the next morning, with a low at 8 degrees that lasted for several hours, the water (hot and cold) stayed on in the bathroom. We could flush, shower, brush our teeth, and pull a pitcher of water to put in the Keurig.

Now I suspect a lot of you more experienced RV owners already know what the problem was, but we're newbies and it took a little while for it to dawn on us. Actually, it dawned on DW; I was still stumped when she started talking about the low point drains.

Although there is a big ugly blob of insulating foam where the drain tubes come out, still about 6 inches of each is exposed, including the end valves. Around mid afternoon, while the outside temp was still in the low 20s, she came up the idea that this was our problem. We had one of those red 250 watt incandescent heat bulbs in the barn we used years ago when we had goats and they always had their babies in there on the coldest day of the year. I dug that thing up and put it in a conical aluminum shop light, mounted it about a foot from the exposed tubes. Around 10 minutes later the cold water started flowing in the island, and a couple of minutes after that the hot flowed.

I'm pretty impressed that the main line from the tank didn't freeze up. Maybe a few degrees cooler and it would have. As I look down into the hole where the tank line comes up, and the hot and cold go down to the low point and to the island, I see coroplast where I wish I saw insulation. Still, we have no skirts, and the wind out of the north had been stiff and steady at 20 mph for more than a day, so we expected something might freeze up.

Next job is to figure out how to strengthen that weak point. We'd rather it not freeze to start with. Anybody have an effective low cost hack for this?
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Old 11-12-2019, 04:13 PM   #2
bobbecky
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When we are in a cold area, besides using the furnace to keep the living space as well as the area above the coroplast warm, I have a small electric heater that has a fan the I place in the pass through aimed at the convenience center where the low point drains are also located. Even with the slam door closed, there is enough of a gap for heat to keep all of the plumbing in that area warm. We try to not stay in those cold areas anymore, but this has worked well for us, and we’ve been in single digit temps too.
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Old 11-12-2019, 06:53 PM   #3
JRTJH
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If the cold and hot water pipes are freezing at the low point drains, it probably is the ice forming in the exposed part of the PEX and then "creeping up into the main line"...

You might consider using one of those foam "faucet covers" to put over the low point drains. Just use some "sticky back Velcro", tape the hooks to the coroplast and the loops to the faucet cover and "slip it into place"...

While it may not protect your low point drains from freezing, it should keep them isolated from the cold, hopefully with some residual heat from above the coroplast they should stay warm enough not to freeze.

You can get a foam faucet cover from any big box store or hardware store for about $3.
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Old 11-12-2019, 06:55 PM   #4
travelin texans
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Don't expect to find spun insulation above the coroplast!! There's a sheet of the foil bubble stuff which along with possibly a 2" furnace duct blowing in the space is the extent of your "Climate Guard". So all in all you did really well in those extreme temps.
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Old 11-13-2019, 07:16 AM   #5
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My first shot would be just slip some foam pipe insulation over the exposed low point drains. Maybe use a couple cable ties to secure them. Possibly stuff some fiberglass insulation in the bottom open ends.
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Old 11-13-2019, 09:10 AM   #6
terrymullett
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Thanks gearhead, that's what I will try next.
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Old 11-13-2019, 09:16 AM   #7
terrymullett
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Thanks Danny. Yeah, there's a 2" duct too. I have picked up from forum posts that things like Polar Package, Climate Guard, etc. are marketing and require a grain of salt... looking for the real world limitations and ways to get around them.
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Old 11-13-2019, 09:23 AM   #8
flybouy
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terrymullett View Post
Thanks Danny. Yeah, there's a 2" duct too. I have picked up from forum posts that things like Polar Package, Climate Guard, etc. are marketing and require a grain of salt... looking for the real world limitations and ways to get around them.
Yup, those terms came out of the marketing dictionary right below 1/2 ton towable, car like ride, new and improved, and the check is in the mail!
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