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Old 10-20-2020, 08:25 AM   #1
jlonginav
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Possible Design Defect - Contacts at Keystone

All, My RV repair shop believes the have found the root cause behind my kitchen slide getting out of alignment. It has happened 3 times in the two 2.5 years I have owned the rig.

They have discovered that there is not enough room at the top of the slide for it to run in and out without binding. It is also rolling up and beginning to tear the TPO roof material on the roof of the slide. My extended warranty company will not cover as they claim it is a manufacturing defect. I am now about 1.5 year out of the warranty period. Any suggestion on who I should contact at Keystone?
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Old 10-20-2020, 09:11 AM   #2
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Your dealer is the best conduit to initiate a defect claim with Keystone. Also, they can (I'd try the GM or Sales Manager) get you the name and contact information for the Keystone sales/marketing person for that region. I've used this method ending with a positive outcome. You will need a dealer claim confirming the problem, might cost an hours worth of diagnostic time, but you'll need it for documentation. Our regional guy got with the right folks at Keystone to have our repairs approved when they were originally denied. Note we were still under warranty when this occurred, but your problem started under warranty and most respectable dealers will warranty their repairs for a year too.
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Old 10-20-2020, 10:46 AM   #3
nellie1289
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All, My RV repair shop believes the have found the root cause behind my kitchen slide getting out of alignment. It has happened 3 times in the two 2.5 years I have owned the rig.

They have discovered that there is not enough room at the top of the slide for it to run in and out without binding. It is also rolling up and beginning to tear the TPO roof material on the roof of the slide. My extended warranty company will not cover as they claim it is a manufacturing defect. I am now about 1.5 year out of the warranty period. Any suggestion on who I should contact at Keystone?
im feeling your pain here, but question is isn't this exactly why you have an extended warranty for items such as this? i assume you have the slide coverage through ez care or someone equivalent. How would they know its a manufacturing defect without someone telling them. Either way, keystone, or the RV warranty people, will be paying your claim. IF the extended warranty people are legitimately putting manufuactirng defect in writing send that to keystone.
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Old 10-20-2020, 12:40 PM   #4
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It seem that you have a lot of leg work in front of you. Your RV repair guy has come up with his "root cause". Has that been verified by anyone else? That would appear to be where the extended warranty folks are getting the manufacturer's defect claim. In 2018 did Keystone have the 3 year structural warranty? It would be close. If so, a too small cutout for a slide would be a structural issue to me. Has anyone contacted them?

To me the repair tech's conclusion needs to be verified. Then I would go after Keystone. If it's not then it's extended warranty. Keystone would want to inspect it themselves I'm sure. If they do I would insist on being there along with a certified tech. In the end, however it is resolved, you are going to be a very busy person pushing and arranging all this. I wish you well.
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Old 10-20-2020, 05:17 PM   #5
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I thought about this more and think really it’s your dealers job to either get keystone on the hook or your extended warranty. This is why you bought both.
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Old 10-20-2020, 05:54 PM   #6
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I thought about this more and think really it’s your dealers job to either get keystone on the hook or your extended warranty. This is why you bought both.

If/when you choose to do that you abdicate your responsibility (IMO) to get an acceptable solution to someone else. The owner should (must IMO) be involved when their interests are at stake. When a dealer just wants you to "go away", not be involved....what do you do? Say "OK"?
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Old 10-20-2020, 06:16 PM   #7
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If/when you choose to do that you abdicate your responsibility (IMO) to get an acceptable solution to someone else. The owner should (must IMO) be involved when their interests are at stake. When a dealer just wants you to "go away", not be involved....what do you do? Say "OK"?
That was a theoretical comment.
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Old 10-21-2020, 05:34 AM   #8
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I have to ask. Was there any documentation and warranty claim filed when it first happened? What was the “repair” the first and second time?

From what I have learned over the years is the factory will pay the FIRST time while under warranty, and it’s on the dealership after that. JMO, but I’m betting the extended warranty is going to defer to Keystone and if any labor was paid to the dealer, then the OP has a steep uphill battle ahead.

Again, this is just my opinion, based on years of experience in the industry
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Old 10-21-2020, 07:58 AM   #9
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I have to ask. Was there any documentation and warranty claim filed when it first happened? What was the “repair” the first and second time?

From what I have learned over the years is the factory will pay the FIRST time while under warranty, and it’s on the dealership after that. JMO, but I’m betting the extended warranty is going to defer to Keystone and if any labor was paid to the dealer, then the OP has a steep uphill battle ahead.

Again, this is just my opinion, based on years of experience in the industry


The highlighted above can have significant impact on how things go after a warranty repair is done. In our case with this new trailer the first time the slides were deployed the rollers began to chew up the darco. Having gone thru years, and thousands of dollars, watching darco deteriorate, it was the first thing I checked on this trailer....and sure enough, right out of the gate. I insisted on a substantial repair - not a bandaid. it took some effort and string pulling but Keystone agreed to a "good will" repair; replace the undersides of the slides with a solid bottom, not darco. This was a good sized chore. As we worked through it I sat in the RV with the tech doing the fabricating, the service advisor and the service manager. Since this was not Keystone's choice of solutions and more or less a "one off" kind of repair, as we discussed some of the challenges and solutions the tech told the service manager "I guess you know we bought this trailer from now on". That obviously was a comment that references what Chuck said. The service manager said he knew - and he knows that I know that too, but I try to be a fair guy.

In the scenario above IF the dealer does something and it fails it should be on them to re lick their repair. If they don't want to do what's right the finger pointing will begin leaving the customer holding the bag or neck deep in an argument.....I always prefer the latter.
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Old 10-21-2020, 08:46 AM   #10
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I swear I'll never buy a trailer with a slide... (haha, ya say that now...)

JLoginav - I had a bad refrigerator once, new trailer, CW was able to rapidly duplicate the failure of poor cooling I had complained about. They said it was a bad door. Jayco agreed to a warranty repair. CW put their best fridge tech on it. A month later the trailer was repaired and I took it back (stupidly not testing it beforehand) and it still had the same problem after I turned it on. They never fixed the issue. I took that up with Jayco, they then declined the repair charges CW was claiming. CW never tested their repairs after installing a new door, they just assumed it would be better. I dove in deep and figured out the problems (multi-issue) and got it working. My lesson was verify, verify, verify before you pull that rig off the dealer's property after the repairs are made. Thanks for your post, you're doing everyone some good by warning others to inspect more before delivery.

Danny - Your one-off repair sounds like it ought to be part of a "Change Order" within the Keystone manufacturing floor. A partial redesign of sorts. The designers/engineers and manufacturing heads need to have a long discussion right next to a unit with a slide in the out position and see for themselves. I've been involved in manufacturing for 30 years now, and unfortunately some badly needed COs never happened, but we are not the designer(s) or OEM, we're the contracted manufacturer so it's not our say in the end. We can only advise on design flaws or problems. Never the less, it's stories like yours and JLoginav here that caution me so.
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Old 10-21-2020, 08:58 AM   #11
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Agree with Chuckster. You can't expect the manufacturer to pay for a second repair if the first repair was not done correctly. If I paid anyone to make a repair and it isn't completed successfully then I'm not going to pay for it again. Now this is of course with the understanding that the repair failure was within a reasonable time frame.


In my thinking (no comments please) I think it would be easier to hold the dealer's feet to the fire. The dealer has more at stake with reputation and you are there, face to face to express your dissatisfaction.
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Old 10-21-2020, 01:52 PM   #12
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From reading the OP, it seems the repairs done twice before were slide adjustments/alignments. Only now does the repair facility think the root of the problem is the structural defect.

I don't believe the previous jobs were an attempt to repair the structural defect.

Perhaps the OP can comment if I'm reading that wrong.
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Old 10-21-2020, 02:19 PM   #13
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From reading the OP, it seems the repairs done twice before were slide adjustments/alignments. Only now does the repair facility think the root of the problem is the structural defect.

I don't believe the previous jobs were an attempt to repair the structural defect.

Perhaps the OP can comment if I'm reading that wrong.
In my opinion that still goes back on the dealer. Shame on them for mis-diagnosing the cause of the issue ....TWICE. I can completely understand the original diagnosis and plan of action changing once it gets torn into. Sometimes the cause can't be found until you start "tearing into it" but a structural or mechanical issue shouldn't be a great mystery. I can understand an electrical or electronic issue that's intermittent. They can be very challenging when it works sometimes and not others.

It's easy to "Monday quarterback" but it sounds to me like the service dept dropped the ball and need to make it right. JMHO
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Old 10-22-2020, 12:38 PM   #14
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Update

All, I reached out to Keystone via the website and they contacted me within about 4 hours. They have records of the first time I complained about the slide being jerky when deployed. That helped because they have a record of complaint within the first year. They have declined a full warranty repair but they have asked for a estimate and other work orders from the two other repairs. They will then look at sharing the repair cost. My tech is going to flood them with data, pictures and videos. I will keep you updated once I hear what percentage they plan to cover
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Old 10-22-2020, 12:39 PM   #15
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@ MarkEHanson This is a correct summary
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Old 10-23-2020, 09:30 AM   #16
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Update 2

Just got the pictures from my service tech. I have attached one showing how the rubbing of the side wall seal along the top of the slide is slowing destroying the roof. I am going after a warranty repair based on the 3 year structural warranty
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Old 10-23-2020, 12:15 PM   #17
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Just got the pictures from my service tech. I have attached one showing how the rubbing of the side wall seal along the top of the slide is slowing destroying the roof. I am going after a warranty repair based on the 3 year structural warranty
Im positive they are going to cover this. I had similar issues on a roof. When I talked to keystone I told them I have already bought two trailers from you and will buy many more if I am taken care of for something clearly not operator error. They covered my claim. Low and behold I am about to buy my third keystone product next week. Therefore completing a promise nobody in corporate offices will ever care about but makes me feel good.
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Old 10-23-2020, 12:27 PM   #18
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Im positive they are going to cover this. I had similar issues on a roof. When I talked to keystone I told them I have already bought two trailers from you and will buy many more if I am taken care of for something clearly not operator error. They covered my claim. Low and behold I am about to buy my third keystone product next week. Therefore completing a promise nobody in corporate offices will ever care about but makes me feel good.


Yep, I'm in the same boat; and I did as well (buy another). And as far as the highlighted part, I figure in the end the most important part is how you feel about it and yourself. Good luck with the new trailer.
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Old 10-28-2020, 08:00 AM   #19
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Update 3

Even with all the documentation provided Keystone has denied the claim. They state "After our approval to adjust the slideout in April, 2018, we have no record of any issues being reported until you provided the documentation that shows work was completed in February, 2020 and again in April ,2020. Had there been an issue with the wall opening for the slideout, it would have presented itself much sooner.
With the information we have received thus far, there is no indication that there is a problem with the structural integrity of the wall"

So back to the extended warranty contract (CampersEdge). Worst case scenario is I pay for the repairs and take both Keystone and CampersEdge to arbitration. I'm going to do a separate post about the issue in case others have seen it on their 2018.
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Old 11-26-2020, 03:24 PM   #20
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We just started having a problem with our slide out. It is the slide with the kitchen table is sticking, and starts to come in lifting the floor of the slide up (8 inches higher than the floor). We stop it and back it up and it drops suddenly. I have an appointment to take it in to have an RV repair shop to hopefully find the problem and get it fixed along with the toilet that is leaking. Our 5th wheel is 13 months old.
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