H2 as a fuel and the Beatles

[gearhead]

An interesting read, for me anyway...
https://rbnenergy.com/help-making-se...-hydrogen-buzz

[notanlines]

I swear, I thought we were discussing tires and load capacity for awhile!😋 And then we read about the Beatles and it improved appreciatively.

[Badbart56]

I remember reading articles about this twenty years or so back. Never got off the ground. They couldn't build an adequate fuel tank for vehicles and had issues producing enough IIRC. So what has changed so that this will work now?

[LHaven]

Lot of weasel wording goes on about what is a "fuel" or an "energy source." Anything where you have to put X+ϵ energy in to have X energy available later is merely a battery. The "green hydrogen" in that article fits that description. It may let you transport stored energy more effectively, but it doesn't create energy. The transformation process actually loses energy.

A true energy source is mined -- pre-existing, stored somewhere in nature, extracted, and exploited. Some, like nuclear and (they say) petroleum are non-renewable, some like solar and wood are renewable. The mining (acquisition) process is what introduces the net gain into the world's complement of available energy.

Inasmuch as any "waste" hydrogen may be an existing byproduct of one of these processes (e.g., petroleum mining), it is an energy source, but apparently just not a major one. Now, the day we can scoop up tankers of LH2 from the Jovian atmosphere, hydrogen might come into its own as a major energy source.

[gearhead]

Originally Posted by notanlines

I swear, I thought we were discussing tires and load capacity for awhile!😋 And then we read about the Beatles and it improved appreciatively.

LOL I needed a break!

[gearhead]

H2 is fairly common in the process streams in refineries and chemical plants, particularly Olefins plants. In the Olefins plant in our complex we saturated petroleum liquids with H2, removed the sulfur, then ran it through a debenzenizer and came out with a high octane gasoline blend. H2 was pretty much everywhere.
Sounds like there could be some future in enriching ethane with H2 as a fuel for power generation.
The RBN daily blog is usually good reading. Rusty Brenner is a sometimes guest of Cramer on CNBC. They usually title their blogs as a song title and that is sometimes better reading than the blog itself.
Me, my son, my son in law and a lot of my neighbors are employed in energy. I try to keep up. I miss it.

[gearhead]

Originally Posted by LHaven

Lot of weasel wording goes on about what is a "fuel" or an "energy source." Anything where you have to put X+ϵ energy in to have X energy available later is merely a battery. The "green hydrogen" in that article fits that description. It may let you transport stored energy more effectively, but it doesn't create energy. The transformation process actually loses energy.

A true energy source is mined -- pre-existing, stored somewhere in nature, extracted, and exploited. Some, like nuclear and (they say) petroleum are non-renewable, some like solar and wood are renewable. The mining (acquisition) process is what introduces the net gain into the world's complement of available energy.

Inasmuch as any "waste" hydrogen may be an existing byproduct of one of these processes (e.g., petroleum mining), it is an energy source, but apparently just not a major one. Now, the day we can scoop up tankers of LH2 from the Jovian atmosphere, hydrogen might come into its own as a major energy source.

The big battery and look how they are charging it...
https://www.rigzone.com/news/equinor...64048-article/

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by LHaven

Lot of weasel wording goes on about what is a "fuel" or an "energy source." Anything where you have to put X+ϵ energy in to have X energy available later is merely a battery. The "green hydrogen" in that article fits that description. It may let you transport stored energy more effectively, but it doesn't create energy. The transformation process actually loses energy.

A true energy source is mined -- pre-existing, stored somewhere in nature, extracted, and exploited. Some, like nuclear and (they say) petroleum are non-renewable, some like solar and wood are renewable. The mining (acquisition) process is what introduces the net gain into the world's complement of available energy.

Inasmuch as any "waste" hydrogen may be an existing byproduct of one of these processes (e.g., petroleum mining), it is an energy source, but apparently just not a major one. Now, the day we can scoop up tankers of LH2 from the Jovian atmosphere, hydrogen might come into its own as a major energy source.

I always laugh when I here solar energy referred to as "renewable". Does that mean when the sun finally goes dark they figured out a way to relight it? How long would you have to hold that pilot light in?

[LHaven]

Originally Posted by flybouy

I always laugh when I here solar energy referred to as "renewable". Does that mean when the sun finally goes dark they figured out a way to relight it? How long would you have to hold that pilot light in?

It's renewable like Doritos.
"Use all you want today -- tomorrow, we'll make more!"

[LHaven]

Originally Posted by gearhead

The big battery and look how they are charging it...
https://www.rigzone.com/news/equinor...64048-article/

So they're creating another wind farm, which is already a failed promise, and turning the energy into hydrogen instead of electricity.

Talk about hitching your wagon to an boulder.

[gearhead]

Originally Posted by LHaven

So they're creating another wind farm, which is already a failed promise, and turning the energy into hydrogen instead of electricity.

Talk about hitching your wagon to an boulder.

They will create the H2 by charging brine from wind turbine electricity, then using the H2 to fuel power plants. These folks are supposed to be smarter than me. Apparently I'm so dumb I don't see it.