question about towing weights

[hitchikerman]

So lets see if I have this right... to find out one of the ways to find out if you can tow a particular rv is take the pin weight of lets say a fifthwheel and add if to the payload capacity

[chuckster57]

That’s a good place to start. You want to use 23% of the GVWR of the trailer, not the unladen weight. Pin weight is for an empty trailer.

[jsb5717]

Yes, as Chuckster said, use 23% of the 5th wheel GVWR (15% for travel trailer) to calc pin weight. But don't add it to the payload...subtract if FROM the payload rating of your truck. Also subtract hitch, people, and other gear. Payload rating minus total load will tell you if your truck is up to it.

[wiredgeorge]

Example... my old Cougar is a 5th wheel. Let's say the gross weight is 10,100; that is the camper fully loaded to the max. Multiply 10,100 x .23 and the estimated pin weight is 2323 lbs. Add my large personage, my wife, the hitch, two chihuahuas and we have about 600 lbs give or take. Add the 600 lbs to the 2323 and that is the actual payload or 2923 lbs. The amount the truck is carrying.

Now, visit your door frame. The payload placard is yellow/white and says: "The combined weight of occupants and cargo should never exceed" and a number in KG and LBS. Mine is right at 4000 lbs so I am safely carrying the payload when on the road.

If your estimated payload is close to the actual payload of your truck, go to a weigh station and get it weighed or buy a more capable tow vehicle.

[NH_Bulldog]

As another example particular to a 5th Wheel; we are currently shopping and found a unit that meets all of our current and future needs. It has a GVWR of 11,500 lbs. (this is the 5th wheel). 23% of that is 2,645 lbs. and to that add about 850 lbs. for 5th wheel hitch, all occupants, cargo, and aftermarket accessories added to the truck since we bought it and that brings us to 3,495 lbs, which is right at my yellow sticker cargo capacity with ZERO safety margin. Since I like to have a minimum 10% safety margin, we will either need a new truck (not happening since this one is barely a year old) or find a different model 5th wheel with a lower weight.

Ironically, those figures I quoted are on a "Cougar Half Ton Towable" model behind my 3/4 Ton truck........

[Canonman]

Like George, our Cougar has a Gross Weight Rating of 10,290.
Our Ram 2500 has a documented (sticker on the door)payload rating of 2160.
On our way to Grand Teton for 4 days of dry camping, we stopped and weighed our outfit.
The Ram, full of fuel, hitch installed and all the usual camping stuff we carry, but without the Cougar rear axle weight was 3260#. With the Cougar added the rear axle weight was 5180# so the actual pin weight was 1920#.
Long story , short. The only way you'll know the actual real world numbers is to go to the scales loaded to camp and get your weights. Like Rob, we are right at the limits for our Ram 2500. Knowing that, a Ram 3500 would give us a 1,000# cushion. Maybe a little more since my wallet would be significantly lighter

[travelin texans]

Congratulations! For doing your own due diligence before buying either.
Far too many take the salesperson advice & compare rv dry weight to the max tow rating of a truck, which are absolutely the wrong Numb3rs to calculate with.

[daveinaz]

Kudos to you for actually running the numbers. It is both amusing and frustrating how they market 5th wheels as being towable for an F150 or 1500.

We recently sold our Montana that had a gross weight of 14,900. One guy called me up asking if his Ram 1500 could tow it because it had a "hemi" in it. I told him that while his motor might be able to pull it, there was no way his truck chassis could handle it -- he'd need a one ton to safely pull it -- and preferable a dually IMO.

I've lost count of how many fivers I've seen being pulled by not enough truck. Scary.

[Greg1780]

The salesman,
We purchased a 21 Keystone Montana Model 3813MS 41’ and a 21 Ram 6.7 Diesel new, but due to COVID we purchased the truck first. ••••WRONG•••••.
My truck pulls the 5th Wheel great except if I had to make a panic stop.
UPDATE: Ordered a 23 Ram high output 6.7 / Dually/ 8’ bed and made to tow. So, by listening to the RV Dealer are lucky to be alive today, or we could have had that catastrophe blow out. Either way when it come in the roads that I’m traveling will be a little bit safer.

Anyone that needs a Great/CLEAN/ Ram 2500/ 6.7 Diesel/ 16k 5th wheel it’s for sale NOW

[dutchmensport]

Here's the easiest answer: Know the max payload capacity of the truck when it is completely empty. ANYTHING you put on the truck, anything that has weight, is subtracted from that amount. When you subtract everything and if you are still above zero remaining, you are good. If below zero (negative), you are bad. You have to shed something. It just that simple. It doesn't matter if its a bumper pull or a fifth wheel, or a truck slide in camper. That's what you have to do to figure it out.

[JRTJH]

Just remember that EVERYTHING you install on or put in your truck is part of the payload. Those running boards, the compressor for the air bags, the air horn, the tools under the rear seat, the change in the ashtray, the maps in the glove compartment, even the fuzzy dice on the mirror all "take up payload" and are a part of your "maximum cargo and passengers".....

[Todd727]

There are some okay answers here.

I will say, forget about the silly yellow sticker.

Get a weight of your truck, full of fuel, whoever is going to be riding with you when you go camping and loaded with what you will be carrying in the truck when you are going to be hitched up to the camper.

If you go across a CAT scale, you should get a weight for the Steer Axle, Drive Axle and a Gross Weight, which is just simple math adding the axle weights.

While we are talking about this, get the CAT Scale app for you phone and set it up. Makes weighing simple and you never have to talk to anyone or go inside to get your slip.

Now, based on those numbers, you now know what you can add to the truck by comparing the above numbers and the white sticker that has FAWR, RAWR, GVWR and GCWR.

Don't exceed any single number and you will be fine.

This method works whether you are driving a pick-up or a semi to pull your 5th wheel. As an aside, semi's don't have a GCWR (or a stupid yellow sticker). Your axle ratings and Federal Bridge Law becomes your guidance, and you can always get overweight permits.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by Todd727

There are some okay answers here.

I will say, forget about the silly yellow sticker.

Get a weight of your truck, full of fuel, whoever is going to be riding with you when you go camping and loaded with what you will be carrying in the truck when you are going to be hitched up to the camper.

If you go across a CAT scale, you should get a weight for the Steer Axle, Drive Axle and a Gross Weight, which is just simple math adding the axle weights.

While we are talking about this, get the CAT Scale app for you phone and set it up. Makes weighing simple and you never have to talk to anyone or go inside to get your slip.

Now, based on those numbers, you now know what you can add to the truck by comparing the above numbers and the white sticker that has FAWR, RAWR, GVWR and GCWR.

Don't exceed any single number and you will be fine.

This method works whether you are driving a pick-up or a semi to pull your 5th wheel. As an aside, semi's don't have a GCWR (or a stupid yellow sticker). Your axle ratings and Federal Bridge Law becomes your guidance, and you can always get overweight permits.

The problem with your process is that you have to have the vehicle to do that...and then actually do it. Most folks try to assess the limitations of a potential new vehicle by available numbers and not a scale since they don't have the truck...that's where the yellow sticker comes in. Without it a potential buyer has absolutely NO clue as to what they are looking at or its abilities so you really can't just forget about it.

[rhagfo]

Originally Posted by sourdough

The problem with your process is that you have to have the vehicle to do that...and then actually do it. Most folks try to assess the limitations of a potential new vehicle by available numbers and not a scale since they don't have the truck...that's where the yellow sticker comes in. Without it a potential buyer has absolutely NO clue as to what they are looking at or its abilities so you really can't just forget about it.

What Todd727 is forgetting about, is new TV shoppers. It is a great comparison too, BUT people also need to be aware of how much other weight they carry with them. We would barely be within numbers with our 2,800# pin one 4,200# payload because of what we carry in the truck.