Tires Pricing - Page 3

ctbruce · 02-01-2018, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wbdvt

Tires arrived today and have a date code of 0317. They are also stamped Made in China.

That would be expected, Carlisle comes from China.

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rhagfo · 02-01-2018, 04:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wbdvt

Tires arrived today and have a date code of 0317. They are also stamped Made in China.

0317???
Those tires are already a year old.

Tinner12002 · 02-02-2018, 03:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Tinner,

Do you have any information to support the "1st/2nd run tire" theory? Is there anything that you've encountered to suggest that WalMart is trying to "dupe the public" or "unload a bunch of maypops"? Have you heard from or read articles to suggest that WalMart sells inferior ST tires to the public?

Or is your suspicion based solely on the sales price? If it is, then are the 2017 trucks Ford, GM and RAM are offering huge discounts on also 2nd run products? Are the 30% off appliances at Lowe's also 2nd run? How about (as Bolo4u indicated) most of the items sold on Amazon?

If you've got any data to support your theory, please give us all a "heads-up"....

Back in the day, we used to shop at the Levi's Over-run store in the Discount Mall just east of Memphis, TN. Everything in that store was marked "irregular" or "rejected" (probably by inspector #5) and the size tag was cut halfway through to show it was an "irregular item".....

All of the Carlisle tires I've seen at WalMart have identical markings, identical part numbers, identical molds and identical tags. How is it that the warehouse (or the tire plant for that matter) can keep them separated? Or is it possible that Firestone Tire Center (or some other "full price outlet") might be getting the 2nd's from the wrong pile while WalMart is getting the 1st's that were picked out of the warehouse by mistake???

Are there any markings on any of the Carlisle tires you suspect as 2nd's that you're aware of?

Or is this "just a suspicion I have, because they're so cheap to buy" ??????

Inquiring minds want to know what you know that the rest of us don't (yet)... Please give us that inside scoop on how WalMart is pulling off this "greatest heist on the public" ......

No I don't have any info to back that statement up. I was just expressing my opinion as to why I won't buy tires at Walmart. I have read that they have different part #s than the same tires you'll purchase elsewhere. Are the companies making the tires special for Walmart, who knows but I just choose not to purchase tires there. Everyone can poke fun if you want about my comment of the tires possibly being 2nds but that is just my thinking, doesn't mean anyone has to agree. That's whats nice about forums is that everyone is entitled to there opinion and hopefully without getting bashed for expressing it.

My only other comment on this thread is why, pray tell me why, someone would want to purchase tires somewhere to save money, only to have to take them somewhere else to pay money to have them mounted and balanced?? Someone enlighten me.

rhagfo · 02-02-2018, 04:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctbruce

That would be expected, Carlisle comes from China.

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and already one year old! 0317!

ctbruce · 02-02-2018, 04:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tinner12002

No I don't have any info to back that statement up. I was just expressing my opinion as to why I won't buy tires at Walmart. I have read that they have different part #s than the same tires you'll purchase elsewhere. Are the companies making the tires special for Walmart, who knows but I just choose not to purchase tires there. Everyone can poke fun if you want about my comment of the tires possibly being 2nds but that is just my thinking, doesn't mean anyone has to agree. That's whats nice about forums is that everyone is entitled to there opinion and hopefully without getting bashed for expressing it.

My only other comment on this thread is why, pray tell me why, someone would want to purchase tires somewhere to save money, only to have to take them somewhere else to pay money to have them mounted and balanced?? Someone enlighten me.

All told, I saved $150 over what Discount Tire quoted me. I asked them to price match and they wouldnt. In my mind, $150 is not chump change. DT mountend the tires so I spread the wealth around a little. Even had lunch at Pizza Ranch while they were taking care care of my tires. I'd count that a win-win-win.

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ctbruce · 02-02-2018, 04:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rhagfo

and already one year old! 0317!

There are 2 threads going on this and it gets harder to keep it all together.

I would not have accepted those and walked away. It has not been answered yet if they cane from the warehouse that way or if they were a set in stock from WM already that they were stuck with and trying to move. You always have the right to ask for fresher tires if they are available.

A call can be made to the warehouse to ask what they got in stock or put in an order for newest available.

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Tinner12002 · 02-02-2018, 05:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctbruce

All told, I saved $150 over what Discount Tire quoted me. I asked them to price match and they wouldnt. In my mind, $150 is not chump change. DT mountend the tires so I spread the wealth around a little. Even had lunch at Pizza Ranch while they were taking care care of my tires. I'd count that a win-win-win.

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That's unusual because my DT has priced matched a couple times for me. They may not match walmarts price but they will attempt to compete. I like them partially because I can take any car or truck there for a tire repair and they fix it for free, no questions asked.
Just courious, how much of that $150 did you give to DT to mount and bal those tires??

ctbruce · 02-02-2018, 06:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tinner12002

That's unusual because my DT has priced matched a couple times for me. They may not match walmarts price but they will attempt to compete. I like them partially because I can take any car or truck there for a tire repair and they fix it for free, no questions asked.
Just courious, how much of that $150 did you give to DT to mount and bal those tires??

That was my net savings. Put the whole thing in my pocket. The guy at DT just wouldn't budge but this was almost a year ago just at the start of the price war. They may have softened up a bit now. I liked them and will use them again. They did right by me on what they did. I get it that it's business. That's why I cherry picked the best deal for me. YMMV.

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**JRTJH** · 02-02-2018, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tinner12002

No I don't have any info to back that statement up.... I have read that they have different part #s than the same tires you'll purchase elsewhere. ...

My only other comment on this thread is why, pray tell me why, someone would want to purchase tires somewhere to save money, only to have to take them somewhere else to pay money to have them mounted and balanced?? Someone enlighten me.

I cut out parts of your post so it's easier to address your comments.

I have never heard or seen any proof that WalMart sells inferior Carlisle tires. The part number on the tires that I've seen is exactly the same as those at Discount Tire and Mekhoff Tire (the local tire store). DT is nearly 100 miles away and has no "local presence" here. Towing the trailer to DT would take a significant savings to equal the purchase price. Mekhoff Tire quoted $159 per tire and $20 to mount/balance. That's $636 for the tires, $80 to mount/balance for a total of $716 before sales tax and disposal fees.

Buying them at WalMart and taking the trailer to Mekhoff for mount balance costs $67 per tire and $20 per tire to mount/balance. That's $268 for tires and $80 to mount/balance for a total of $348. For me, that's a savings of $368. The savings (368) is more than the cost of the tires + mounting (348).

My thinking, unless you're "rolling in extra cash" saving more than half the price is a substantial reason to buy the tires one place and go somewhere else to get them mounted......

Other's may not consider $368 a savings, but as Chip said, "It ain't chump change"......

Tinner12002 · 02-02-2018, 08:37 AM

I'm sure some situations warrant doing that, purchasing at wallyworld and taking rv somewhere else to have the work done. That savings JRTJH mentioned would be hard to pass on. For me as long as a tire shop will match or come close to matching wallys price then that's where I'm shopping. In todays economy its hard to imagine a dealer not wanting business bad enough to at least try and match someones prices in order to get their business but obviously it happens. So I've been enlightened! Lol! This topic has probably been beaten enough...lol!

Andymil · 02-02-2018, 09:33 AM

Got my Goodyears from DT yesterday. Date codes 2617, 2917, and two were 3117. Made in U.S.A. $500 after rebates. I'm happy with that.

Is it really that big a deal if the tire was made a year ago? Do fresh ones taste better?

**JRTJH** · 02-02-2018, 10:24 AM

Andymil,

If you're satisfied, that's what matters....

To answer your question about the importance of manufacturing date. If you agree to the concept that ST tires "degrade" about 10% per year, then you lose about 10% of your tire capacity annually. If you've got sufficient reserve capacity to carry the load on your axles, then the mfg date doesn't matter much. But, on the other hand, if you have a 30% reserve and degrade 10% per year, if the tires are already 10% "gone" you can only use them 2 years before you are "at weight capacity".

In my situation, my axles weigh 7700 pounds, that's 1925 pounds per tire. My tires are rated at 2830 per tire (a 905 pound reserve). That's a 47% reserve. So, for me, a one year old tire isn't a big deal. On the other hand, for someone who has 2300 pounds on each wheel with the same tires, they only have about a 18% reserve. Losing 10% of their reserve is a significant deciding factor...

So, if you subscribe to the concept that tires degrade as they age, buying year old tires can make a difference in some situations and not matter much in other situations....

TheGriz · 02-02-2018, 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Andymil,

If you agree to the concept that ST tires "degrade" about 10% per year, then you lose about 10% of your tire capacity annually.

Yeesh...I'm trying hard to understand all the factors and nuances on tires. Please help me. Is that 10% loss in tire capacity the same if they are sitting in a warehouse not exposed to WX versus the tires on one's RV exposed to WX particularly UV rays??? And wouldn't tire covers used properly play into the "loss" factor?

Mike

**JRTJH** · 02-02-2018, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGriz

Yeesh...I'm trying hard to understand all the factors and nuances on tires. Please help me. Is that 10% loss in tire capacity the same if they are sitting in a warehouse not exposed to WX versus the tires on one's RV exposed to WX particularly UV rays??? And wouldn't tire covers used properly play into the "loss" factor?

Mike

I suppose that's a question that we all could argue (pro/con) until the tires dry rot on the wheels. The "generally accepted date to start" has been the date of manufacture. If you think about it, the date of manufacture is also the date we use on condoms to establish the "use by date"... (and they are in a sealed packet until use) Something to be said about comparing "rubber to rubber" when it comes to when they're too old to use...... YMMV

ADDED: Thinking beyond the DOM and warehouse storage, we have no way of knowing how the tires were stored in the warehouse. Ozone (produced by electric transformers/motors) degrades rubber products as does humidity and temperature. So, even tires that are stored with covers and on wooden slats might be subject to "degrading forces" when in the warehouse, in the conex container on the ship during transportation and in the store awaiting pickup. How would anyone "quantify" how much (if any) of that environment affects the tire? The only "reasonable way" to measure it would be from a "known starting point" and the DOM is the only commonly accepted point to start measuring since tires in different conex boxes, different warehouses and different states aren't all "controlled identically" when in storage....

When considering the 10%, I have never heard or seen any breakdown of how that was determined, it may include 3% during storage and 14% after installation to average 10% from DOM or it may have some other convoluted formula to get to the bottom line. The point, I think, is that a tire in Michigan won't suffer the same UV degradation as a tire in south Texas, so the 10% isn't a "hard and fast rule" but a "generally accepted concept that a 5 year old tire isn't as strong as a new tire and that needs to be considered in the decision of when to replace tires that "don't look worn out"......

**sourdough** · 02-02-2018, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andymil

Got my Goodyears from DT yesterday. Date codes 2617, 2917, and two were 3117. Made in U.S.A. $500 after rebates. I'm happy with that.

Is it really that big a deal if the tire was made a year ago? Do fresh ones taste better?

Actually they do I think. The older they get they need a little more salt........

IRV2 · 02-02-2018, 03:54 PM

I ended up getting 5 of the Goodyear Endurance E/10 at Americas Tire(DT). The cost was 827.00 with the replacement plan and they price matched Tire Rack + shipping. The oldest tire is 3117, two were 3317 and the other two 4117. I saved about 35 dollars with the price match and had lunch.

wbdvt · 02-03-2018, 08:07 AM

I understand the concern on the tire date being a year old but a year old in a warehouse is a lot different than being mounted and sitting on a vehicle outside.

How many out there check the tire date when they purchase a new vehicle or camper? If the tires are a year old (possibly more depending on how long the vehicle/camper has been in the lot), do you ask the dealer to put fresher tires on? I can imagine the reply that "yes we can and here is the additional cost to do that." Do you walk away or accept that tires are a year old?

I am unsure where the 10% loss of life figure came from and could not find a definitive answer with a Google search. Gut feel would be less in a warehouse versus mounted and outside exposed to sun, temperature changes, weight of vehicle on tire, etc.

**JRTJH** · 02-03-2018, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wbdvt

...
I am unsure where the 10% loss of life figure came from and could not find a definitive answer with a Google search. Gut feel would be less in a warehouse versus mounted and outside exposed to sun, temperature changes, weight of vehicle on tire, etc.

Here's just one of many references that give a definitive answer to tire aging and provides a "quick way to calculate that aging"

http://www.trailerlife.com/tech/diy/...-a-tire-guide/

Read the part titled "Tire Lifespan" in this TL article. It's one of a number of available sources. Carlisle Tire company recently revised their ST Tire FAQ section and deleted the part referencing tire age factors, but they still recommend replacing tires at about 5 years of service, even if they show no wear, so what would one draw from that except that tires degrade with age?

In the TL article, they state, "Carlisle Tire estimates that one-third of a tire’s strength is gone in approximately 3 years." When you do the math, if 33% of the strength is "gone" in 3 years, that equates to 11% per year (or an easier calculation would be 10% per year)...

Like you, I wouldn't "refuse to buy" tires that were 12 months old (depending on alternative selections) but I also wouldn't pay "double the price" for newer tires just because of the date of manufacture. I guess it boils down to "comfortable pricing vs economy vs availability" To each his own in how to factor that decision.

wbdvt · 02-03-2018, 12:48 PM

Well I could not find the FAQ section on the Carlisle website but I think the key in the TL article and your posting is the term "in service". I would not consider sitting in a warehouse in service.

**sourdough** · 02-03-2018, 05:17 PM

Was just in DT yesterday having some tires rotated/balanced and looking at their little signs/placards etc. DT recommends any tire be replaced at 6 years from DOM. Will not touch them after 10.

All rubber starts degrading the minute it encounters the elements. Other things; driving, curbs, debris etc. can/will accelerate that degradation. I don't know about you but I've had rubber inner tubes for bicycles sitting in my garage new that I forgot about completely shred when pulled. So no, being on the ground and in service has absolutely nothing to do with rubber aging.

ST (or LT) tires sitting in the elements, under a trailer, in the sun......well, 3 years and out they go....if they don't go first!

All that simply because you can't be too careful with those that you love. Heck, I replace my TV tires at no more than 50k which is usually 3 years or less.

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