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Old 09-19-2020, 02:42 AM   #1
HideoutSpadz
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Towing Advice

Hi....Newbie Tower here

I have a 2019 1500 V6 with 3:55 ratio. My tow capacity is 7490 and my GCWR is 12,900.....dealership advised that it is actually 13,900 but manufacturers always give a 1,000lbs buffer????

Also on paper, my payload is 2100 to which my calculations look like this:
Tongue weight -780
Occupants -500
Interior Crap (2 car seats & odds) -100
Gear -300/400 MAX
———total 1780


Here’s my situation/question:
I recently bought a travel trailer (Hideout 272BH) that weighs 6100....add an additional 200/300 pounds for bedding and some stuff we keep in storage bays). I have a weight distribution hitch/sway bar setup.
When towing with my family and gear I estimate that my total weight (fuelled truck/trailer/people/gear) is around 12,200ish which gives me at least 700lbs in GCVW space BUT when towing in relatively flat (small-medium hills) My engine sits at b/n 3200/3500 RPMS in tow/haul mode.

Additionally, in tow/haul mode it has a hell of a time switching gears in 3rd/4th.

should I be concerned?
Was I advised incorrectly by both RV & Dodge dealerships on capability?
Is this a lemon?
Do I need a 5.7/V8 Hemi?

any help/guidance is greatly appreciated.
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Old 09-19-2020, 03:20 AM   #2
notanlines
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First things first. Your truck dealer flat-out lied to you. There is no 1000 pound cusion to towing capacity nor any other capacity. And your RV salesman handed you a pretty good line of baloney also. Your RV does not weigh 6100. Actual weight is between 7000 and 7800 pounds. After you add battery, propane, sheets, blankets, food, beer, and hundreds of pounds of 'stuff' to pacify those two little one's of yours the 6100 pounds factory isn't even close. Let's move your tongue weight to about a thousand pounds and go from there.

We have a member from Texas that will join this conversation as soon as he gets out of bed. He is going to ask you to post pertinent information about your TV and your RV in the signature line. It helps us all make a better determination about how to advise you. There, I beat him to it.

Welcome to the forum, by the way. There is a lot to be gleaned from this site.
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Old 09-19-2020, 04:20 AM   #3
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You say your payload is 2100lbs. Is that brochure or actual from the yellow and white sticker inside the door? The sticker is for YOUR truck. That is the one that matters. My guess is you are around 1500lbs. If the trailer is loaded like Jim guessed and the hitch weight is around 1,000 and the hitch weighs another 100 you can see how you are prolly over weight. In my opinion that is a lot to ask of a V-6 even if you come in just under weight.
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Old 09-19-2020, 04:39 AM   #4
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HideoutSpadz, You are dragging a loaded 7500 lb camper (6100 is how it rolled off factory floor EMPTY). The camper has a tongue weight right under 1000 lbs (figured at 13 percent of the gross trailer weight) and add the weight of your passengers and what you called truck cab interior crap about 600 lbs. Add your hitch and other things you are hauling and guessing your payload at this point is nudging up towards 2000 lbs.


In your door frame is a placard that has your truck's actual payload capacity and exceeding it puts you, your family and other motorists in danger. It also stresses your truck which likely was never designed with the payload you are asking of it. In addition, the engine/transmission combo in your truck are not intended for towing anything. Here is a payload placard... what is you ACTUAL payload?
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Old 09-19-2020, 05:34 AM   #5
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My first question is are you prepared to hear the truth? So many new posters start out asking, then when a dozen or so experienced “been there done that” thyme folks tell you the bad news they argue or disappear. Secondly, what are you prepared to do about it? If you are unable or unwilling to “change the equation” ( the equation presently is a truck incapable of the load) then you are wasting your time.

Bottom line .. your truck is grossly overloaded. The cure ... buy a capable truck or a smaller trailer. No amount of air bags, “we travel light” or “we don’t go far” will change the equation. It’s a simple math equation, load capacity of truck must be equal to or greater than load the truck carrying.

I know it’s devastating news but that’s the reality of the situation.
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Old 09-19-2020, 06:22 AM   #6
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I completely agree with previous responses.

OP: You asked "if you should be concerned?" YES! Your truck is dangerously overloaded.

You asked: "Was I advised incorrectly by both RV & Dodge dealerships on capability?" Yes, you were advised incorrectly by both the RV and Dodge dealer. They were/are focused ONLY on separating you from your money - making the sale. Now, they have your money and you have an unusable camping rig.

You asked: "Is this a lemon? Do I need a 5.7/V8 Hemi?" No and not necessarily. Your truck may not be a lemon provided it is used within the intended design limitations of the manufacturer. Clearly, however, you are asking way too much of the vehicle in pulling your trailer. You will likely need more truck or less trailer, don't just go buy something with a bigger motor (it's a HEMI!) based on advertising. That would be a repeat of previous mistakes.

Don't feel like we are picking on you! Many of us have been in the same boat. The only skin we have in this is wanting to help you be successful. So, keep an open mind - ask lots of questions on this forum. And DON"T just go buy something based on advertisements you see on TV or read about on the internet!
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Old 09-19-2020, 06:38 AM   #7
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If you don't want to "hear the bad news from forum members" then "prove it to yourself" and go to the nearest CAT scale.

There's one 50km from Binbrook at the Flying J Travel Plaza, Hwy 401 & Exit 268 AYR, ON.

Hitch up, listen to your V-6 "whine" to that location, drive onto the scales and see "exactly where you are in the weight department.

I'd suspect you're either "at the very top or over the top in combined weight, likely over the rear axle weight capacity on your truck and over the payload for your truck.

While "uncomfortable for your wallet," that's not the issue... The issue is that you're very likely "damaging/destroying your vehicle drive train" while putting your family and others on the highway in an unsafe situation by towing significantly over your truck's weight/performance limitations.

The cost, $12, is likely the most "revealing and worthwhile investment" you could make for your future RV'ing experience.
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Old 09-19-2020, 08:03 AM   #8
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Welcome to the forum and congrats on the new trailer! Now to your concerns...and you have every right to be concerned.

Here is the link to your trailer;

https://www.keystonerv.com/travel-tr...ravel-trailer/

Note that the trailer is not 6100lbs, or even close to it. It is right at 7700lbs. gvw. Since it isn't scaled just figure 13% (avg. tongue weight) for tongue weight and you have approx. 1000lbs. sitting on the back receiver.

Before anything else completely throw out and forget 1) anything about max tow numbers, 2) anything a truck salesman told you , 3) anything an RV salesman told you (and by the way they lied to you) or 4) anything you read in a brochure or generalized statement about truck weights. Everyone of those things/people have only one goal - sell you something and get you on the road. Not a one of them is concerned about your safety or wellbeing. The ONLY numbers that are pertinent to your truck are inside the driver door on the gray and little yellow stickers. That is about YOUR truck and not some dreamland sales truck/gimmick. There is no "cushion" anywhere in those numbers.

That 1/2 ton with a V6 and 7400 lb. max tow (which will be exceeded) was never meant to be a tow truck...by any means. That 2100 payload is incorrect too. Look at the stickers on the door. One poster said it might be as low as 1500lbs. I would say it is more likely to be in the 1200 lb. range.

The V6 struggling? Absolutely. Hills making it spin, trying to blow its guts out? No doubt. Doesn't want to come out of 3rd when towing? It can't - it doesn't have the power to do anything but try to throw a rod out the side. What will happen is that the tranny will self destruct in no time. It is a light duty unit that would be taxed by a 8' utility trailer with a riding mower on it.

Bottom line is your truck is grossly overweight and not up to the task that trailer presents. It is a dangerous combo that puts not only you and your family at risk but everyone on the highway with you. Do yourself, your family and others a favor and post those numbers then weigh the truck/trailer. Load it as if you were actually going to stay in it for a couple of weeks - not with a couple of wash cloths. Load the truck as well; hitch, tools, family, "stuff" for the kids etc.

My remarks aren't trying to "get onto you" or anything like that - I've been there myself. Just trying to point out some very serious issues that you need to address right away before taking off on a trip. Lots of good folks here with tons of experience that only wish for your wellbeing and fun, safe trips. Not a soul here has any other motivation other than that. Post back with those stickers and any questions or concerns you may have, our only goal is to help you. Oh, BTW I'm from TX.
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Old 09-19-2020, 08:29 AM   #9
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Would like to see the payload numbers. Being as it's a V6, I think they may be higher than some are suggesting.

But other than that, I agree with the general sentiment that you have too much trailer for your truck.
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Old 09-19-2020, 08:46 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by GMcKenzie View Post
Would like to see the payload numbers. Being as it's a V6, I think they may be higher than some are suggesting.

But other than that, I agree with the general sentiment that you have too much trailer for your truck.

I figure the 1500 estimate is going to be close for the door. I base my thought on 1200 because I've driven one of those V6s....
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Old 09-19-2020, 08:51 AM   #11
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If by some chance you're able to trade for a capable truck don't go to the 3/4 ton 2500, go to the 3500 for much greater payload. The ride, price, nor mileage will be much different than the 2500 but now you're ready for the next rv upgrade.
BTW Welcome!
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Old 09-19-2020, 04:46 PM   #12
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Hi All

Thank you all for the tough love and hard knocks truth.

My first concern is my family’s safety. Second is the safety of others on the road. 3 is the truck....as expensive on an issue it could be!

So I have decided to not make any trailer changes and HAVE decided to change my truck.

I have an opportunity to get a 5.7 litre V8 Hemi Ram 1500 for a minimum increase in payments. The alternative is an F150 XTR as that will also be a minimal increase but am concerned about the turbo blowing out as I’ve heard issues about the engine not lasting.

I will Definitely be looking at all the stickers to determine the correct action.

If you have thoughts on the Ram 5.7l V8 versus the F150, please chime in.

Unfortunately the 250 or 2500 are not an option for me at this time.

Thanks again!
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Old 09-19-2020, 05:10 PM   #13
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Watch the payload sticker close. You may be over for all the 150/1500 class trucks.
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Old 09-19-2020, 05:25 PM   #14
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If the F150 turbo you are considering is the 3.5 Ecoboost V6 twin turbo....it is a towing beast. I haven't towed with the V8 Ram but have had the Ecoboost, it will easily pull that trailer. I would have little/no concern over any 'turbo issues'.

In either case - your main issue seems to be payload. With a more realistic tongue weight of 1000 lbs, plus 500 for passengers plus 100 for hitch plus 400 for gear that equals 2000 lbs. Unless you can trim down that last figure (400/gear) you are going to be hard pressed to find a half-ton that will meet these requirements, unless you special order an F150 Heavy Duty Payload Package (HDPP). The problem is that you do not have much of a chance of finding one of these 'unicorns' on the lot. The Nissan Titan XD is sort of an equivalent to the HDPP, and more readily obtainable. Pretty sure the payload on the XD will be 2K and up.

Unless you get a mostly stripped down F150, with a short cab configuration you will really have a hard time finding 2K plus payload. My modestly equipped XLT F150 with Max Tow package, 4x4, Super Crew had a sticker payload of 1873 pounds. I don't have any first hand experience, but based on my forum reading, I think Ram generally has even less payload than Ford in the 1/2 ton segment.

Moving some of the truck gear to the trailer is also an option to lessen your payload.
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Old 09-19-2020, 07:03 PM   #15
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Originally Posted by HideoutSpadz View Post
Hi All

Thank you all for the tough love and hard knocks truth.

My first concern is my family’s safety. Second is the safety of others on the road. 3 is the truck....as expensive on an issue it could be!

So I have decided to not make any trailer changes and HAVE decided to change my truck.

I have an opportunity to get a 5.7 litre V8 Hemi Ram 1500 for a minimum increase in payments. The alternative is an F150 XTR as that will also be a minimal increase but am concerned about the turbo blowing out as I’ve heard issues about the engine not lasting.

I will Definitely be looking at all the stickers to determine the correct action.

If you have thoughts on the Ram 5.7l V8 versus the F150, please chime in.

Unfortunately the 250 or 2500 are not an option for me at this time.

Thanks again!


Here's the deal to me. A non boosted 5.7L V8 is just that. The 3.5 L is a 213 cubic inch, think about that, 213 cubic inch (tiny motor) that has been "supercharged", inflated, given puffed ability by....2 very expensive turbos....very expensive. When they fail, and they have quite often, if you're one of the unlucky ones you can look at a 8k repair bill - trying to make a tiny V6 into a regular V8. I like guts and the ability to do what you do without all the mega dollar add ons.

Had a Ford turbo engine SVO. Great when it worked...or not. When it decided to gut out (and I wasn't a hot rodder) it was a fortune to repair. I would never consider a Ford gas turbo again. Get an engine that was built for the job up front. JMO/YMMV
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Old 09-19-2020, 07:27 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
Here's the deal to me. A non boosted 5.7L V8 is just that. The 3.5 L is a 213 cubic inch, think about that, 213 cubic inch (tiny motor) that has been "supercharged", inflated, given puffed ability by....2 very expensive turbos....very expensive. When they fail, and they have quite often, if you're one of the unlucky ones you can look at a 8k repair bill - trying to make a tiny V6 into a regular V8. I like guts and the ability to do what you do without all the mega dollar add ons.

Had a Ford turbo engine SVO. Great when it worked...or not. When it decided to gut out (and I wasn't a hot rodder) it was a fortune to repair. I would never consider a Ford gas turbo again. Get an engine that was built for the job up front. JMO/YMMV
To each his own. not sure what year turbo you are referring to but generally speaking the 2015+ 3.5 EB is by and large considered an excellent towing engine. But then again, I’m a Ford guy.
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Old 09-19-2020, 07:35 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
Welcome to the forum and congrats on the new trailer! Now to your concerns...and you have every right to be concerned.

Here is the link to your trailer;

https://www.keystonerv.com/travel-tr...ravel-trailer/

Note that the trailer is not 6100lbs, or even close to it. It is right at 7700lbs. gvw. Since it isn't scaled just figure 13% (avg. tongue weight) for tongue weight and you have approx. 1000lbs. sitting on the back receiver.

Before anything else completely throw out and forget 1) anything about max tow numbers, 2) anything a truck salesman told you , 3) anything an RV salesman told you (and by the way they lied to you) or 4) anything you read in a brochure or generalized statement about truck weights. Everyone of those things/people have only one goal - sell you something and get you on the road. Not a one of them is concerned about your safety or wellbeing. The ONLY numbers that are pertinent to your truck are inside the driver door on the gray and little yellow stickers. That is about YOUR truck and not some dreamland sales truck/gimmick. There is no "cushion" anywhere in those numbers.

That 1/2 ton with a V6 and 7400 lb. max tow (which will be exceeded) was never meant to be a tow truck...by any means. That 2100 payload is incorrect too. Look at the stickers on the door. One poster said it might be as low as 1500lbs. I would say it is more likely to be in the 1200 lb. range.

The V6 struggling? Absolutely. Hills making it spin, trying to blow its guts out? No doubt. Doesn't want to come out of 3rd when towing? It can't - it doesn't have the power to do anything but try to throw a rod out the side. What will happen is that the tranny will self destruct in no time. It is a light duty unit that would be taxed by a 8' utility trailer with a riding mower on it.

Bottom line is your truck is grossly overweight and not up to the task that trailer presents. It is a dangerous combo that puts not only you and your family at risk but everyone on the highway with you. Do yourself, your family and others a favor and post those numbers then weigh the truck/trailer. Load it as if you were actually going to stay in it for a couple of weeks - not with a couple of wash cloths. Load the truck as well; hitch, tools, family, "stuff" for the kids etc.

My remarks aren't trying to "get onto you" or anything like that - I've been there myself. Just trying to point out some very serious issues that you need to address right away before taking off on a trip. Lots of good folks here with tons of experience that only wish for your wellbeing and fun, safe trips. Not a soul here has any other motivation other than that. Post back with those stickers and any questions or concerns you may have, our only goal is to help you. Oh, BTW I'm from TX.

Thanks sourdough for the insight. Yes I’m starting to realize everyone was more interested in the sale rather than the right solution or proper advice!

I think I’m going to be checking out the Ram 1500 5.7L V8.

With its tow capacity, I should be able to mitigate using up all my payload capacity and just load the trailer Of everything & not put our packings in the truck. We don’t pack heavy at all and mostly do weekend trips. I guesstimate that what I currently have in my trailer would weight about 400 pounds, add an additional 300 pounds of gear (again we don’t pack much) and that would put me at (dry+trailer gear+personal gear+propane tanks) approx 7000. Now even if I’m off by 1000 pounds, I’m still at only 8000 and with the Hemi, I can tow, according to the papers, just over 11000 which gives me plenary of space.

Also, with a payload of about 1800lbs, with tongue/hitch/people/some stuff, I should be ok.

Unless of course I’ve neglected a factor and am off the mark still?????
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Old 09-19-2020, 07:50 PM   #18
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To each his own. not sure what year turbo you are referring to but generally speaking the 2015+ 3.5 EB is by and large considered an excellent towing engine. But then again, I’m a Ford guy.

I was a Ford guy for 37 years. They lost their way in any number of things important to me. A tiny V6 pumped up to act like a real "big engine" doesn't work for me. As you said JMO.
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Old 09-19-2020, 08:02 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by HideoutSpadz View Post
Thanks sourdough for the insight. Yes I’m starting to realize everyone was more interested in the sale rather than the right solution or proper advice!

I think I’m going to be checking out the Ram 1500 5.7L V8.

With its tow capacity, I should be able to mitigate using up all my payload capacity and just load the trailer Of everything & not put our packings in the truck. We don’t pack heavy at all and mostly do weekend trips. I guesstimate that what I currently have in my trailer would weight about 400 pounds, add an additional 300 pounds of gear (again we don’t pack much) and that would put me at (dry+trailer gear+personal gear+propane tanks) approx 7000. Now even if I’m off by 1000 pounds, I’m still at only 8000 and with the Hemi, I can tow, according to the papers, just over 11000 which gives me plenary of space.

Also, with a payload of about 1800lbs, with tongue/hitch/people/some stuff, I should be ok.

Unless of course I’ve neglected a factor and am off the mark still?????


In the last post I noted that I used Ford trucks for decades. I quit for any number of reasons. If you go with the Ram note;

DO NOT look at the published "max tow weights" for Ram or any other manufacturer; they will get you in trouble really fast. Look only at the placards inside the driver door. I never buy a truck for towing without looking at it first or having someone send me a picture of it.

The 5.7 Ram is a great truck; owned a few. When looking at one watch the rear axle ratio. 3.73 minimum. I've had all of them. The 3.92 is the best overall probably for the weight you are talking about but 3.73 will work considering the new 8 speed trannys.

If you maxed out on gvw, which you should avoid greatly, the 5.7 and an acceptable axle ratio will be a great fit and not have 8k of add ons to the engine to make it feel like a V8...JMO
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Old 09-20-2020, 05:16 AM   #20
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HideoutSpadz, While a certain brand of truck may be the favorite for you and others, the point is, you are contemplating buying yet another 1/2 ton. The V8 will likely be more capable as far as pulling power but the payload issue still looms. Since you seem to have your eye on a very specific 1/2 ton, what does the number on the payload sticker on that truck say? Going from a bad choice of tow vehicles to a less bad choice may not be the way to go... just my opinion, of course. Payload????
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