What to do, what to do ???

mskeyspirate · 05-08-2022, 08:50 AM

Ok..I'll try to make this as brief and to the point as I can, so hang with me for a minute for this journey. We own a 2015 Passport Ultra lite, bought new by us. It's stored inside all winter, every winter, waxed twice a year, so well taken care of. Anyway i took it to the regular dealer for service 3 days after removing it from storage. I ask them to check the roof for any potential leaks/damage, repair it if any, and put on my new antenna. I get it home...no antenna !Oh it was put on, but no coax to be found. I called them, they made it right. So last weekend we take it out for the first trip of the year, in the rain, and observe water coming through the air conditioner vent in the ceiling. I call the dealer who says that the air conditioner must have "dropped down" during transport by hitting a bump, but they this time will send a guy out to look at it. Once again I think OK, they're going to make it right. Then we notice not one, but 3 more leaks in the bedroom area. I have yet to let the dealer know about the new found leaks. Now realize that because we have a "no walk" roof I take it to the dealer and my words were "check the roof for any "POTENTIAL" issues and seal it. How much tolerance/patience should I have ? Should I trust them again to fix things. Remember that I paid good money to them the first time this year. Please give me your thoughts. I don't want to be a jerk, but this poor service should not be my headache. Maybe looking to sell very soon !!!

**sourdough** · 05-08-2022, 10:29 AM

Over what kind of time frame did all this transpire? If it all happened within a matter of a couple/few weeks that's one thing and is recent that's one thing, if it all happened over a span of months that's another.

Personally I would have a sit down with the SM and the tech that did the work. They may or may not let the tech sit in but you need to know exactly what they did, when and why. If the trailer has not been subjected to rain for a few years then no telling where those leaks came from. If you have inspected that roof frequently, it's been in the rain and it never leaked that's a different situation.

I always inspected my sealant and repaired it but I did have the dealership (used to) clean and seal it once a year (it stays in a barn when not in use). They have covered the sides with cleaner and sealant requiring me to wash and wax the entire trailer, cracked a bathroom skylight, bent my roof ladder etc. If I take it in and put it in their hands something will come back broken. They've always taken care of it but it happens EVERY TIME.

If they in fact caused the damage and you can prove it, or at least reasonably, they should be repairing the damage. I don't know what they would do to cause so many leaks and they will have to tell you - or maybe they didn't and there is some roof issue they had nothing to do with.

As far as the poor service; it IS your headache because you took it to them. If you sell the trailer and continue to use this same dealer, and they did in fact damage the roof, expect more of the same if you continue to use them.

wiredgeorge · 05-08-2022, 11:24 AM

I don't believe there is sealant around the A/C but a gasket seal is place beneath when the A/C is installed and the lower assembly and A/C above are held tight using four very long screws. I can't see how the A/C could drop for any reason. Had the trailer been previously in a heavy rain and NOT leaked? You mentioned leaks in the bedroom area. There are a limited number of roof penetrations where a leak may have occurred but I would suspect the antenna that wasn't connected to any wiring. Installing a rooftop antenna requires sealing it fully with self leveling Dicor. I would get up on a ladder myself and have a look as that would be my suspicion. Did your camper ever have an antenna mounted? Is there a plate near your television area with a booster light on it? I have never seen a modern camper with no antenna or booster/power set up.

mskeyspirate · 05-08-2022, 07:42 PM

The time frame for all of this is about 3 weeks. Came out of storage April 13, went to the dealer on the 16th for the antenna and roof inspection. When they "fixed the antenna I'm sure it had to come back off of the roof to route the coax. My guess is that they walk on the roof, and may have broken the seal on the outside edges of the camper roof. They've told me that they walk on them, but they no where to walk so no problem. They are sending someone out to check things out, and I hate to have them touch it, but I did pay good money to them initially for their work. And I understand what was said about the air conditioner, and I know it's connected by bolts, but how then all of the sudden does that kind of leak happen ? I just want them to do the work that they were paid to do, and be done with them. Coming on tuesday to check things out again. I'll let you know the outcome.

jasin1 · 05-09-2022, 02:54 AM

since they immediately mentioned the air conditioner…i wonder if when you took it back the second time, because you couldn’t find the coax wire, if they removed the ac unit to look between the roof and ceiling for the wire…maybe they didn’t replace the ac seal with a new one when they were finished or didn’t compress it properly…i’m thinking they didn’t want to remove the antenna and have to reseal it and thought the cable was in between the roof and ceiling

**sourdough** · 05-09-2022, 05:42 AM

jasin has a good point. The very well may have done that trying to find the coax. Another thing that would worry me is the "we know where to walk" comment on a non walkable roof. The guy that was working at Burger King last week who was walking/working on your roof won't know anything about the construction of the roof or "where to walk". I suspect they in fact did wander all over the roof and flexed it in all kinds of ways and places creating some sealing issues that you have now found.

**JRTJH** · 05-09-2022, 06:51 AM

If it were my trailer, I'd be concerned with how the second air conditioner was installed....

If I remember correctly, the 2015 Passports were not available with 50 amp service, and were not "engineered/constructed" with roof joist reinforcement to support the weight of the air conditioner. That may explain their comment, "the air conditioner must have "dropped down" during transport by hitting a bump"...

While the power requirement for a second air conditioner is not an "impossible to solve problem" it does take some thought to provide power to two A/C units on a 30 amp trailer.... That said, on trailers that are "equipped for an optional air conditioner" every one that I've seen has reinforced roof structure around the roof vent opening as well as the ROMEX and possibly the thermostat wiring to the specific vent opening.

If your Passport has 50 amp shore power, wiring for the second unit available at the roof vent and was properly braced to support the extra weight, then you should not have had a "dropped A/C from hitting a bump"...

If there was no wiring, I'd suspect that Keystone also didn't reinforce the roof to support the extra weight, and the dealer's comment may reflect his concern for that same issue.....

As for leaks in other areas, if they were "walking on a non-walkable roof" that's the same, IMO, as any other "forbidden maintenance shortcut".... Non-walkable means exactly that, it doesn't mean, "except for our guys who can take shortcuts"....

mskeyspirate · 05-10-2022, 07:54 AM

Feel like I have to check in and report. The dealership sent a tech out today to remedy the roof issues. The seal around the air conditioner was good, but he torqued the air conditioner down to insure a good seal. The other spots, he said that he saw nothing obvious but did caulk the area around the other leaks. Also did the refrigerator vent on the roof. So....I have to say that I have no real complaints about the dealership. They were quick to remedy the issue, had a great attitude and were very apologetic about the whole thing. See....there are some dealers worth going to.

wiredgeorge · 05-10-2022, 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JRTJH

If it were my trailer, I'd be concerned with how the second air conditioner was installed....

If I remember correctly, the 2015 Passports were not available with 50 amp service, and were not "engineered/constructed" with roof joist reinforcement to support the weight of the air conditioner. That may explain their comment, "the air conditioner must have "dropped down" during transport by hitting a bump"...

While the power requirement for a second air conditioner is not an "impossible to solve problem" it does take some thought to provide power to two A/C units on a 30 amp trailer.... That said, on trailers that are "equipped for an optional air conditioner" every one that I've seen has reinforced roof structure around the roof vent opening as well as the ROMEX and possibly the thermostat wiring to the specific vent opening.

If your Passport has 50 amp shore power, wiring for the second unit available at the roof vent and was properly braced to support the extra weight, then you should not have had a "dropped A/C from hitting a bump"...

If there was no wiring, I'd suspect that Keystone also didn't reinforce the roof to support the extra weight, and the dealer's comment may reflect his concern for that same issue.....

As for leaks in other areas, if they were "walking on a non-walkable roof" that's the same, IMO, as any other "forbidden maintenance shortcut".... Non-walkable means exactly that, it doesn't mean, "except for our guys who can take shortcuts"....

John, Did the OP ever mention a 2nd A/C install? I didn't see that... he said water was coming through his A/C vent. I am not sure whether this Passport has a ducted or non ducted A/C on the roof. I am also pretty sure it will leak again if the tech merely tightened the nuts on the four skinny screws and didn't replace the A/C seal but guess time will tell. The OP mentioned leaking in the bedroom in multiple places and the cause was never pinpointed. I hope his camper isn't leaking again.

**JRTJH** · 05-10-2022, 08:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

John, Did the OP ever mention a 2nd A/C install? I didn't see that... he said water was coming through his A/C vent. I am not sure whether this Passport has a ducted or non ducted A/C on the roof. I am also pretty sure it will leak again if the tech merely tightened the nuts on the four skinny screws and didn't replace the A/C seal but guess time will tell. The OP mentioned leaking in the bedroom in multiple places and the cause was never pinpointed. I hope his camper isn't leaking again.

You're right, George. I'm not sure what took me down that "second A/C installation road".... Rereading the OP's first comment, it doesn't suggest this is a problem with an "add on A/C unit" but with the OEM installed A/C unit. That vent opening is "supposed to be structurally braced" for the unit's weight. That would make the "dropped down" (IMO) a very remote possibility. With my "new realization" that this is the OEM A/C leaking, I'd be even more concerned that the dealer's techs "walking on the roof where only they know the spots" is even more suspect.

Looking back through his previous posts, he had the front FILON sheet/front cap replaced a few years ago because of a leaking "roof/front cap seal"... So this isn't a "new, never seen before roof problem on this trailer".... That doesn't excuse any technician's walking on the roof, nor does it make any of the current leaks "inconsequential"... Rather, IMO, it increases the reasons for the OP to be suspicious of what was done to his trailer and demands a critical look at how the previous leaks and the current leaks may be "all from the same sources"....

wegone · 05-15-2022, 07:51 AM

Sheit happens..... that's a fact, often times with no explanation but a best guess scenario.

As a plumber of 50 plus years, I know leaks.
No one can tell when a seal is about to go, that is why we have maintenance, to hopefully avoid damage from a leak, etc.

If I had a nickel for every time I was blamed for a leak after working on a problem elsewhere in the system, I'd be a rich man

Water is a amazing element, just look at the Grand Canyon and what it can do.

It sounds like you have the right attitude, and the dealer/service folk are trying, keep up a good line of communications, after all, they want it fixed too.

Also, toys take money to keep, that is a fact also, we need to weigh the value vs. need ourselves, and just like all the different rigs to choose from, so is our own outcome to owning a trailer, or not.

I tried to keep that thought front and center recently in dealing with a big issue of my new trailer.

Good luck.

GordKey22 · 05-15-2022, 08:40 AM

The roof on mine is "walkable".

I don't

hawghauler · 06-17-2022, 02:54 PM

I use half sheets of 3/8 ply on non walkable roofs to spread the load allowing me to perform maintenance

You may also like: