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Old 09-27-2020, 05:32 AM   #1
TsnTexas
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First 5th Wheel

Although we still like to think of ourselves as "campers" we're looking to upgrade from a pull behind to our first 5th Wheel. Keeping it small so we can still get into some of the National Forest Campgrounds in Colorado and such, we're strongly considering a new Cougar 24RDS (it's just the two of us). Having never owned a Keystone I'm wondering about overall quality of the build of the Cougars and how they stack up to other brands. I expect there might be small issues as you get will all new units which have just rolled off the line, but mainly interested in overall quality compared to others. It's an investment and any input is appreciated.
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Old 09-27-2020, 08:26 AM   #2
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Speaking from past experiences I would take the advice of others on here and buy a good used one. We almost did with our Alpine, bought used, instead of a new one. Wished now we would have bought used. A lot of the kinks would have been worked out, saved a ton of money in the process also. We looked at the cougars along with montanas, alpines, you name it. Just a matter as how much you want to spend. Good luck
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Old 09-27-2020, 09:13 AM   #3
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I believe the 24RDS is new this model year, so not likely to find one used.
I've looked at this model and like the general layout and the fact that it is under 30' overall length. That said, I prefer a floor plan that allows access to the bathroom, bedroom and kitchen without having to extend the slides.
I would say that the Cougar is as good as you can get quality wise in the $30k price range. All manufacturers have QC issues; mostly these are related to manufacturing shortcuts and processes that sacrifice exacting fit and finish to faster assembly line production.
This makes choosing the dealer that offers the best post sale support supremely important. I'd make sure you have the service commitment from both he service manager and the general manager before signing the contract.
If anybody at the dealership hesitates to stand behind their service I'd shop elsewhere.
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Old 09-27-2020, 09:22 AM   #4
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The 24RDS is a Cougar 1/2 ton. The regular Cougar is a different trailer (construction/build) so be aware - the 1/2 ton cuts a lot of "nicer" touches out to make it light (1/2 ton towable,,,which it isn't). As far as quality a Cougar of either kind is as good or better than any other comparable model from other manufacturers. As we all know they all seem to come off the line with some sort of issue but that is the nature of the beast no matter who makes it.

As a new model I doubt you find a used one with the kinks worked out. Some like to buy the used ones and have good luck. I never have and only buy the new so I know every screw etc. that has been touched. It's just a matter of personal preference.
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Old 09-27-2020, 09:34 AM   #5
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I really like the floorplan but would agree to buy used because I like someone else eating the depreciation and making all the fixes needed rather than take on a new camper with the huge payments but I am kind of in the minority here. That "half ton towable" isn't. It will be 10K lbs and pin weight will be between 2000 and 2300 lbs and if you don't have at least a capable 3/4 ton tow vehicle, you may be overloaded and not loving life. I own a similar size 2002 Cougar 5th wheel and your floor plan is a bit better than ours BUT we have a rear kitchen and tons of counter space and a good sized pantry. The TV placement in yours is better than ours and I have had to modify the TV holder so it articulates and turns about 45 degrees so we can see it from our LazyBoy love seat recliner. With your layout, you should be gold. Last tip...
you really need 50A service with a 2nd A/C in Texas. One A/C will leave your cabin in the mid-80s during triple digits if camping in the sun.
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Old 09-27-2020, 10:29 AM   #6
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This was our fourth season with our Cougar and we have had no major issues. A few trim pieces have loosened up wiring has come loose from an interior light. rough (roads all over here in Alaska) Minor things I fixed on my own I have abused my tongue jack though as well as my stabilizer jacks with that said I have to give kudos to Camping World in Arlington WA where we purchased it. I had no chance to do a PDI. It was in production when we bought it. They then shipped it to me after they went through it with a fine tooth comb with their own PDI.
I look at Cougars as a mid range in the Keystone line. Ours is a 1/2 ton but nicely equiped for our needs There are some upgrades I plan to do as time and money allow but I think every trailer made can benefit from something being upgreaded
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Old 09-27-2020, 11:09 AM   #7
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As a couple have already briefly mentioned a 1/2 pickup, regardless of brand or gimmicky sales name, isn't enough truck for most 5th wheels.
Look at the yellow/white tag on the drivers door post of YOUR truck, there it says "occupants & cargo must not exceed XXXX lbs". That is the payload for THAT truck which includes everybody/everything in/on that truck that did not come from the factory plus the weight of the hitch & the pin weight of the particular rv you chose. To determine the pin weight use 20-25% (22% should about average) of the GVWR of YOUR particular RV found on a manufacturer tag on the drivers side front corner of the RV.
The dry weight, dry pin weight of the rv means nothing to you nor does the max tow weight rating of your truck, these are the numbers the salesman will keep repeating. The tag mentioned & the white tag with axle weights are the numbers you're concerned with. Brochures, advertising, nor ANYTHING ANY salesman tells you about weights mean nothing about YOUR truck or the rv your looking at.
If in doubt post a picture of those tags from your truck on here & there's several that will help explain what you need to know prior to buying a 30'+ 5th wheel that you may not have enough truck for.
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Old 09-27-2020, 11:18 AM   #8
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Do yourself a favor & post the numbers from the tags on the drivers door post of your truck here before buying a 30'+ 5th wheel. As others briefly mentioned, "1/2 ton towable" is a sales gimmick that most 1/2 pickups aren't rated for hauling due to payload.
There are numerous post recently of newbies buying much more rv than they have truck for due to false or lack of information from salesmen. Salesman have one agenda.......sell something!
Don't be one of them!
Ask here 1st!
It may not be what you want to hear, but it will be honest from others with experience.
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Old 09-27-2020, 11:28 AM   #9
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Well, I should have posted my vehicle information. It's a Chevy 2500 with the 6.6 Diesel engine. (It's listed in my profile, but doesn't show up in my posts). I've read with great interest all of your responses and thank you! I do hope they keep coming, very informative.

By the way the listed specs on the 24RDS are:

Length - 28' 6"

Dry Wt. - 7355
Hitch Wt. - 1370
Carrying Wt. - 2645
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Old 09-27-2020, 11:33 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TsnTexas View Post
Well, I should have posted my vehicle information. It's a Chevy 2500 with the Diesel engine. (It's listed in my profile, but doesn't show up in my posts). I've read with great interest all of your responses and thank you! I do hope they keep coming, very informative.

By the way the listed specs on the 24RDS are:

Length - 28' 6"

Dry Wt. - 7355
Hitch Wt. - 1370
Carrying Wt. - 2645

Thanks for the truck info. Here is the link to the Keystone site with specs on the 24rds.

https://www.keystonerv.com/fifth-whe...s-fifth-wheel/

Edit: That 1370 for hitch weight will be incorrect. That is the weight for a dry trailer. Figure 20% of gvw (10k x .20 = 2000lbs.) for the pin weight to get a ballpark figure without benefit of scale weights. Then look at/post the numbers from the door pillar stickers on your truck (occupant load/gawr front/rear). That information is critical to determining where you stand weight wise. Remember that the load on your truck from a 5th wheel is much different than a bumper pull - 12-15% of gvw for bumper pull, 20-25% of gvw for a 5th wheel.
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Old 09-27-2020, 02:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TsnTexas View Post
Well, I should have posted my vehicle information. It's a Chevy 2500 with the 6.6 Diesel engine. (It's listed in my profile, but doesn't show up in my posts). I've read with great interest all of your responses and thank you! I do hope they keep coming, very informative.

By the way the listed specs on the 24RDS are:

Length - 28' 6"

Dry Wt. - 7355
Hitch Wt. - 1370
Carrying Wt. - 2645

Danny pointed you in the right direction. The truck you have is more than capable of dragging the fiver down the road. The concern is the amount of weight the Chevy can handle. Payload is its name. You have 2000 lbs of pin weight as a good estimate based on the specs for the gross weight of the trailer. Add hitch, what is in the cab (passengers and stuff) and you are looking at perhaps 2600 lbs of load. Your actual and real payload figure is in the door frame on a white/yellow sticker. If the payload of you 3/4 ton is rated more than the 2600 lbs, you are likely good but I have seen quite a few diesel 4x4 crew cab 3/4 tons with far less. Anyway, good luck!
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Old 09-27-2020, 02:35 PM   #12
TsnTexas
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Thanks for the tip, according to the Trailering Info sticker I'm well within the limits with this camper with lots of room to spare. It's good advice to be sure of your axles' capacities.
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Old 09-27-2020, 02:54 PM   #13
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By the way I would be open to buying a lightly used camper, but as we found this is a new model for 2021. Having said that and since we don't have any experience with Cougars, we wanted to make sure folks weren't finding that they had major problems with them. As someone said, salesmen need to sell units. In fact I found one dealer video in which it was claimed that a heated 24rds is good down to 0 degrees with no problems. Personally I'd be sweating bullets at that temp!
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Old 09-27-2020, 03:01 PM   #14
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Originally Posted by TsnTexas View Post
By the way I would be open to buying a lightly used camper, but as we found this is a new model for 2021. Having said that and since we don't have any experience with Cougars, we wanted to make sure folks weren't finding that they had major problems with them. As someone said, salesmen need to sell units. In fact I found one dealer video in which it was claimed that a heated 24rds is good down to 0 degrees with no problems. Personally I'd be sweating bullets at that temp!

Marketing brochures and videos are a trip to fantasy land. Your Cougar will not be a pleasant home at zero degrees F. You get much below freezing and you will burn through the on-board propane in a day or two so rely on ceramic electric heaters. The charts for towing are marketing. The charts for trailer features are marketing. The term Arctic on a trailer is about as accurate as half ton towable. The floorplan you chose is nice so just go for it and enjoy camping. Last tip, it appears the tires on new Cougars are supplied by the lowest bidder and many folks remove them immediately for name brand tires. Search for China Bombs here on this site.
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Old 09-27-2020, 03:14 PM   #15
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The payload number for my Ram is 2160. I'm guessing your Chevy's is similar. Ready to go camping I'm just over 1700# pin weight. It doesn't leave much wiggle room but it has not been a problem towing or more importantly stopping our outfit. We had the unfortunate experience of running up on a crash with everyone sliding to a panic stop. Our outfit stopped in plenty of time and in a straight line no problem other than rearranging some of the items in the Cougar's kitchen.
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Old 09-27-2020, 03:26 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by TsnTexas View Post
Thanks for the tip, according to the Trailering Info sticker I'm well within the limits with this camper with lots of room to spare. It's good advice to be sure of your axles' capacities.


I'm not sure what a trailering info sticker is but you might look at those door placards that were pointed out. I owned a 2500 gas truck with a 3100 lb. payload- pretty high for a 3/4. Diesels generally didn't get above 2500 payload. Looking at roughly 25-2600 lbs. in the truck I don't see how you have "lots of room to spare". Posting that sticker might help us all understand.
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Old 09-28-2020, 07:45 AM   #17
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TsnTexas, we still need to see a picture of the yellow sticker on your door jam. THEN we can determine the towing and carrying capabilities of your truck.
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Old 09-28-2020, 08:47 AM   #18
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I see you are from Austin. We bought our Alpine in Georgetown, right out of Austin from Crestview RV. They also have a huge dealership in Buda. If you buy your cougar from these people please do a thorough PDI before paying for it. We were very upset with the B.S. these salesmen, office workers, techs and everyone associated with their dealership. Wished we would have went elsewhere and looked but we didn't. Just trying to steer you in the right direction.
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Old 09-28-2020, 12:15 PM   #19
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Cougar 28sgs

We bought a 2018 Cougar 28sgs and love it. There have been minor issues, but overall we love it. We looked at lots of models, but the open floor plan is what sold the wife. Just the two of us (and 2 LARGE dogs). We have put on around 12k since we bought it and the only issue was the fridge dying (which the dealer replaced).
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Old 09-29-2020, 05:55 AM   #20
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While we looked for over a year at campers and finally decided on the cougar 29 rks 5th wheel. Haven’t had it long but so far no issues. States 1/2 ton towable but at 8800 pounds dry I don’t know about that. We have a 3/4 ton f250 and have no problem pulling it. Don’t even know it’s behind us. But of course I am not one of those who try and drive 70 mph while pulling a camper. I’m the guy in the right lane who everyone is passing. 55-60 is my max I will go. Besides part of camping is to enjoy life so slow and easy is me.
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