2012 Copper Canyon Brake Problem

[JohnnyA]

Purchased a new unit last September and starting experiencing brake problems (overheating/sticking) on our first short trip. It was about 300 miles. Camping World replaced all the brake shoes under warranty, which was good. The next trip in November (300 miles), the same problem started occuring. Took it in and they adjusted the controller setting and thought it should be good. Next trip was December, same problem. I isolated it down to the left front brake drum being extremely hot. In fact when I took it in in January, the grease had melted and ran down into the shoes. Camping World has been trying very hard to fix the problem with no results. AL-KO said that the temperature on the drums was within specs. The temp was measured at 166 degrees with very little braking action. The drum behind was 77 degrees. All this after a 40 mile run at high speeds. Anybody have any suggestions as to who I should contact next to try and resolve the problem. Have owned the unit for 20 weeks and in the shop for 7.

[Johnnyfry]

Clearly you have a serious safety problem which needs immediate attention.
It appears that the hot drum is dragging. When it heats up 2 things happen: the brake shoes fade and the electromagnet heats up increasing its resistance so you get even less braking action.

You need an expert brake shop instead of CW. Hopefully there is a shop near you that specializes in brakes. It sounds like the return springs are not installed correctly or are weak, but you do need an expert.

John

[rjsurfer]

Has anyone checked the grease seal? if it's working properly NO grease should leak past it and contaminate the linings. Their really cheap and easy to install I would change them out.

Been down that road, and the crappy linings that are used today are useless once their contaminated, no amount of brake cleaner will get them right again.

When you check the temps are you keeping an eye out for the hub temperature? with those digital IR temp gauges you can tell whether the heat is coming from the hub or from were the linings are contacting the drum. Your bearings could be adjusted too tight causing the overheating.

Ron W.

[JohnnyA]

They did replace the seal when they found the grease down in the brakes. The drum temperature on the very outer edges was at 166 degrees on the suspect wheel. The inner temperature around the hub ran around 120 - 130. I don't remember the exact numbers. Definitely need someone who is a brake expert, but having to go through warranty system right now. AL-KO doesn't want to give up any free parts yet for warranty service. I looked on the AL-KO site and it appears there might be bearings on the inside of the assembly and on the outside. Does anyone know this for sure?

[JRTJH]

There should be (No, unless AlCo builds an axle unique from all others) There are two wheel bearing/race assemblies. One on the inside of the hub and one on the outside of the hub. The inner bearing has a grease seal, the outer is open, has the retaining nut/cotter pin and a cap to cover the hub/axle assembly.

Here is a picture of what your hub "generally" looks like. Disregard the filler plug, nylon washer and durahub as your axle has a cap with a zerk fitting to grease your bearings and a hub with brakes. What I wanted to illustrate is the bearing/race/oil seal setup within the hub. Yours is essentially like this illustration.

If the outer surface of your hub (more distant from the axle center) is getting hotter than the part closest to the axle center, then it's probably not the bearings, the brake shoes and brake drum are in that area and if they are dragging or not releasing properly, that's probably what is causing the heat buildup. If the bearings were too tight or not lubricated/turning freely, then the center part of the axle would be getting hotter than the outside edge of the hub.

I'm suprised that any basic mechanic couldn't fix it on the first attempt. It's not that complex or sophisticated, travel trailers have used the electric drum brake system for years now.

[JRTJH]

For some reason the picture didn't post: Here it is

[SteveC7010]

The full Al-Ko manual for the 2K-7K axle/hub/brake systems is here:

http://www.al-kousa.com/pdf/ALKO_2kto7k_OM.pdf

The 8k-16K manual is here:

http://www.al-kousa.com/pdf/ALKO_8kto16k_OM.pdf

The pictures and drawings in the manuals should be helpful in understanding these components and their maintenance.

FWIW, the basic hub and drum brake assemblies in most of our trailers are virtually unchanged over the last 40+ years or longer. My '76 Prowler's brakes and hubs were identical to our '11 Cougar.

[rjsurfer]

Originally Posted by JohnnyA

They did replace the seal when they found the grease down in the brakes. The drum temperature on the very outer edges was at 166 degrees on the suspect wheel. The inner temperature around the hub ran around 120 - 130. I don't remember the exact numbers. Definitely need someone who is a brake expert, but having to go through warranty system right now. AL-KO doesn't want to give up any free parts yet for warranty service. I looked on the AL-KO site and it appears there might be bearings on the inside of the assembly and on the outside. Does anyone know this for sure?

With those temp readings it's certainly not the bearings, go to be a brake issue.

If you have some way of reading DC current you might want to see if that wheel is drawing more current than the other three. If it's the same it has to be an issue with the brake mechanism, something sticking or dragging.

As others have said these brakes haven't changed in over 50 years, when I took my 5th wheel drums off I thought I was looking at the brakes from my 1955 Plymouth, except for the magnet assembly.

Ron W.

[JohnnyA]

Thanks for the inputs. I have to go out and see the service guys again today or tomorrow. Will bring all this up to them. I assumed the brakes also with the high heat. It also creates quite a bit of drag on the truck and gas mileage goes way down. Another symptom is that when cool and stopped at a light the truck will start moving the trailer forward gradually if your foot isn't on the brake. After a run and the drum is hot, you actually have to give it a good bit of gas just to get it to go forward, as if something is stuck. Anyway, pretty soon someone will have to do something or start I need to elevate the problem. Thanks!

[JohnnyA]

Thanks for the hub breakdown also. I will ask them if they checked both sets of bearings.

[cliff1323]

I have had braking issues in the past. There is a trailer rental place in my home town with a shop. These places USAULLY have mechanics that understand all concepts of towing a trailer. They may even be able to work with warranty.