Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Keystone RV Forums > Keystone Tech Forums > Repairs & Maintenance
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 10-23-2020, 08:01 AM   #21
Javi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
On my trailer, I can pull the white PEX down about 6" or so. That gives just enough room to change things out. It's an "exercise in frustration" to be sure...

IMHO, for what it's worth, that $29 plastic anti-siphon device is the plumbing system's "weakest link"... I've known more people who flood their trailer using the black tank flush system (with that device leaking under the sink) than any other "plumbing malfunction"....

No matter what you do, even just "replacing it with a "direct section of PEX" will help assure you don't have "gallons of unexpected water under the bathroom sink".... I changed out mine in our Springdale the same weekend my DW did the "alarmed scream" letting the entire campground know that I'd just dumped about 20 gallons of water into our bathroom vanity.....

NEVER AGAIN !!!!!
Been there. That's why one of the very first things I do when we bring a new trailer home is replace that piece of junk with a PEX connection and just use a vacuum breaker on the water hose. Problem solved before it was a problem.
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 08:42 AM   #22
Folkie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Cherry Hill
Posts: 191
John,

Yup, if it can be done it will probably happen to me too, but I will likely be the one screaming and it won't be language suitable for a family campground.

You have given me an idea that I might even be able to temporarily pull the PEX lines down a little under the shower to give me some room to work. Now I can start to assemble the necessary hardware. Not sure if I'll have time to get this done before we put the camper in storage, but it is definitely on the must do list before the next trip.

Thanks for your insights.
Phil
__________________
2020 Cougar 22RBS
Folkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 08:49 AM   #23
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,837
You're very welcome. After you get your mods done, be sure to post photos and a "how I did it" commentary. It's sure to be a "hot topic" for future RV owners and your experiences will definitely help others....
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 10:14 AM   #24
Sarge2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Richmond
Posts: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
I simply blow air through the black tank flush system, then remove the anti-siphon valve, shake all the water out of it and lay it on a paper towel under the vanity. In the spring, I'll reinstall it and go from there. I replaced the "cheap plastic flood maker" with a brass anti-siphon valve from the lawn irrigation section of Lowe's.

If you blow air through the system, you'll effectively remove the water/freeze damage potential, so no need for any antifreeze for the black tank flush plumbing. When you remove the anti-siphon valve, all the water remaining in the line will "flow down to the nozzle in the black tank and to the hose connection on the side of the trailer.
JRTJH, I have not seen an anti siphon valve under my bathroom vanity. Although mine is more of a maze of lines and not organized like the pic above. Do you always have an anti siphon valve? The water connection for the flush is on the side of the trailer above the black tank. I wasn't aware that it fed to anywhere but the black tank... maybe you can help me out with this as I'm now wondering what else other than blowing out the black tank flush line I might have forgotten to do... Thanks
Sarge2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 10:18 AM   #25
Sarge2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Richmond
Posts: 625
I see the lines for the outdoor shower, for the vanity and the lines T'd over to the bathtub/shower... I don't see that small anti siphon valve anywhere in the lines...
Sarge2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 10:28 AM   #26
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,837
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarge2 View Post
I see the lines for the outdoor shower, for the vanity and the lines T'd over to the bathtub/shower... I don't see that small anti siphon valve anywhere in the lines...
You should have 4 water lines under the vanity. One is probably blue and goes to the cold water faucet connection. One is probably red and goes to the hot water faucet connection. The other two are probably the anti-siphon valve plumbing. The actual valve will probably be "tucked way up under the sink, near or behind the faucet connections, so unless you lay on your back, crawl part way into the vanity and look up, you'll "never see the valve"...
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 10:33 AM   #27
Sarge2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Richmond
Posts: 625
Thank you for the info... I will "attempt" to do that but I'm not sure my body will fit into the small door of that corner vanity... even laying on my side I didn't fit into it... I will get a mirror and check that out... Thanks again...
Sarge2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 12:36 PM   #28
flybouy
Site Team
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarge2 View Post
Thank you for the info... I will "attempt" to do that but I'm not sure my body will fit into the small door of that corner vanity... even laying on my side I didn't fit into it... I will get a mirror and check that out... Thanks again...
Easiest thing to do is stick your phone back there and take a picture.
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
flybouy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 02:21 PM   #29
Sarge2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Richmond
Posts: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by flybouy View Post
Easiest thing to do is stick your phone back there and take a picture.
Sounds like a plan... Thanks
Sarge2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 02:34 PM   #30
flybouy
Site Team
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarge2 View Post
Sounds like a plan... Thanks
And you don't have to wait for the film to develop. Now I'm showing my age!
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
flybouy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 02:36 PM   #31
Sarge2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Richmond
Posts: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by flybouy View Post
And you don't have to wait for the film to develop. Now I'm showing my age!
Lord knows I sure know what it's like to have film developed...lol... I got a brownie camera for Christmas one year...
Sarge2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 09:30 AM   #32
Brantlaker
Senior Member
 
Brantlaker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Brant Lake,NY
Posts: 321
The last 2 RV's I kept plowing them out causing a mess my now 5 year old I took it out and installed a Foot Valve it only allows water to flow in one direction so there's no back flow into the hose.
__________________
Gary & Gail
Alfa Gold 3905SH
2016 F350 DWD 4X4 6.7,3.73 Rear



2012 Cougar 318SAB
2015 F350 SWD 4X4 3.55 Rear
Brantlaker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 11:02 AM   #33
Sarge2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Richmond
Posts: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRTJH View Post
You should have 4 water lines under the vanity. One is probably blue and goes to the cold water faucet connection. One is probably red and goes to the hot water faucet connection. The other two are probably the anti-siphon valve plumbing. The actual valve will probably be "tucked way up under the sink, near or behind the faucet connections, so unless you lay on your back, crawl part way into the vanity and look up, you'll "never see the valve"...
Found the valve... directly behind the sink... my next question is why is there a lines for the black tank flush even there? The black tank connection is on the outside of the trailer not connected to any water source in the trailer... so how do they connect and why?
Sarge2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 11:11 AM   #34
Folkie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Cherry Hill
Posts: 191
My guess is it is just an easy place to run the lines for the vacuum breaker which has to be installed above the black tank.
__________________
2020 Cougar 22RBS
Folkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 12:04 PM   #35
Folkie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Cherry Hill
Posts: 191
So I ended up following Javi's advice and cut the bugger out, just replacing it with a piece of PEX.

I had planned on replacing it with a quality Watts brass vacuum breaker, but after I got it I realized that while it might not blow apart like the plastic one it can still leak if the float doesn't seat correctly. Since we store valuable stuff under the sink (toilet paper) I decided it wasn't worth the risk. I also determined based on how I use the tank flush that it was extremely unlikely that I would ever have a situation where there would be a chance of back siphoning the black tank.

If that assessment is incorrect my choice would be to install a check valve instead. I marked the tubing so if I later decide to install a check valve or the Watts I can orient it in the correct direction. I will still use a vacuum breaker on the hose to protect it and the water supply.

For anyone considering a similar mod, it helps to have 3 hands when operating the PEX pinch clamp tool. Not that there would be room to get a 3rd one in the cramped area. I had one fitting that slipped out of the PEX a little when I crimped it so I had to redo that side.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20201026_200343.jpg
Views:	114
Size:	152.4 KB
ID:	30572   Click image for larger version

Name:	20201026_224122.jpg
Views:	104
Size:	130.0 KB
ID:	30573  
__________________
2020 Cougar 22RBS
Folkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 01:03 PM   #36
Sarge2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2019
Location: Richmond
Posts: 625
Quote:
Originally Posted by Folkie View Post
My guess is it is just an easy place to run the lines for the vacuum breaker which has to be installed above the black tank.
Well I suppose that makes sense....
Sarge2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 01:14 PM   #37
flybouy
Site Team
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,714
Behind the sink in the bathroom is the "easy access" install. I've read where some models have them in the wall of the shower.
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
flybouy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 01:15 PM   #38
dutchmensport
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,665
I pump the pink through the black tank flush line. Made the mistake of not doing it the first year with a camper that had the flush system. Come Spring, I learned.... plastic doesn't have a chance against ice.... and one flooded bathroom.
__________________
2019 Montana High Country 375FL
2014 Chevy Duramax HD 6.6 - 3500 Diesel Dully Long bed Crew Cab
dutchmensport is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 04:54 PM   #39
Javi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by Folkie View Post
So I ended up following Javi's advice and cut the bugger out, just replacing it with a piece of PEX.

I had planned on replacing it with a quality Watts brass vacuum breaker, but after I got it I realized that while it might not blow apart like the plastic one it can still leak if the float doesn't seat correctly. Since we store valuable stuff under the sink (toilet paper) I decided it wasn't worth the risk. I also determined based on how I use the tank flush that it was extremely unlikely that I would ever have a situation where there would be a chance of back siphoning the black tank.

If that assessment is incorrect my choice would be to install a check valve instead. I marked the tubing so if I later decide to install a check valve or the Watts I can orient it in the correct direction. I will still use a vacuum breaker on the hose to protect it and the water supply.

For anyone considering a similar mod, it helps to have 3 hands when operating the PEX pinch clamp tool. Not that there would be room to get a 3rd one in the cramped area. I had one fitting that slipped out of the PEX a little when I crimped it so I had to redo that side.
Yep.... I made up the elbows first and then bent one line out to where I could get ahold of it and then did the contournist thing on the last one.
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 05:08 PM   #40
Folkie
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Cherry Hill
Posts: 191
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javi View Post
Yep.... I made up the elbows first and then bent one line out to where I could get ahold of it and then did the contournist thing on the last one.
Great minds think alike Tried the same. Did the hard to reach one first, but then the easier to reach one still managed to slip out due to tension from the first side.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	20201026_194619.jpg
Views:	91
Size:	262.3 KB
ID:	30575  
__________________
2020 Cougar 22RBS
Folkie is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
sink

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates in any way. Keystone RV® is a registered trademark of the Keystone RV Company.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:48 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.