More Furnace woes

Wileec · 09-29-2020, 05:37 AM

I have read multiple threads about the furnace fan running for 30-45 seconds and stopping. No ignition sounds at all. This is what I get but not all the time, only when I need it. It seems to work ok when it is warm out and I am testing.

I took my 2020 Bullet to the dealer a couple of weeks before the factory warranty expired in Aug. and guess what it worked. They told me that they could not fix something that worked. The next time we went out we needed the heat and nope no ignition. I have a quick weekend trip planned this weekend and we will see what happens.

How can I deal with an intermittent problem especially now that I no longer have the Keystone warranty? The dealer was useless back in August and Keystone was no better when I contacted them. From what I have read this is not an uncommon issue with new campers from Keystone.

**JRTJH** · 09-29-2020, 06:33 AM

I'd suspect that there's a "condition that isn't being met" when the dealership checks your furnace. There's likely a 12 VDC issue (my guess) in that when you're using the furnace, it's not connected to shore power and when the dealership checks it, the first thing they do is plug it in before even going inside the trailer. That would make it a "battery issue" .... Or, you're always plugged in and they don't plug it in and the problem is not the battery, rather it's the converter....

I'd try to make a "step by step comparison" of exactly how the trailer is being used when the problem occurs... Power status, temperature, thermostat setting (temp and function) and see if there's a "common link" that would explain the failures.

Wileec · 09-29-2020, 06:52 AM

Nope. that was my thought as well because it was on shore power when I got it to work at home. But on further testing it was on battery every time.

Stove and all gas appliances run for at least 5 minutes as well.

The only difference I am seeing is that when I have had troubles it has been at altitude. camping at or above 8000 feet. Testing is working at 5000.

**flybouy** · 09-29-2020, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wileec

Nope. that was my thought as well because it was on shore power when I got it to work at home. But on further testing it was on battery every time.

Stove and all gas appliances run for at least 5 minutes as well.

The only difference I am seeing is that when I have had troubles it has been at altitude. camping at or above 8000 feet. Testing is working at 5000.

"And now we know the rest of the story".... I'm guessing the dealership is below 8,000' asl as well. I think it's an altitude problem. There is less oxygen at altitude and therefore less btu output. The flame detector I would guess is not "seeing" the flame at that altitude.

Wileec · 09-29-2020, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flybouy

"And now we know the rest of the story".... I'm guessing the dealership is below 8,000' asl as well. I think it's an altitude problem. There is less oxygen at altitude and therefore less btu output. The flame detector I would guess is not "seeing" the flame at that altitude.

This is likely however not helpful. I have a brand new camper that does not work.

**flybouy** · 09-29-2020, 09:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wileec

This is likely however not helpful. I have a brand new camper that does not work.

Did you tell the dealer when you took it in that it was an issue at altitude?

jim1 · 09-29-2020, 09:34 AM

Had the same issue and same response from my dealer. A wasted trip to the dealer. I dug into it myself and found that the sail switch had construction debris on it, I cleaned it up and it has worked since ( knock on wood) I also had them order me a back up switch at their cost and my waste of time and travel. Then they told me there has been some problems with the new furnaces. Good Luck!

Bill Martocchio · 09-29-2020, 09:51 AM

I just had the same problem with my furnace. The dealer took the furnace out and found a loose wire on the sail switch.

Wileec · 09-29-2020, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by flybouy

Did you tell the dealer when you took it in that it was an issue at altitude?

I did not understand that that was the difference at the time. Still not sure it is. I have had a number of campers and NEVER had a problem with the heater in the mountains.

At this point no Keystone warranty any more.

**flybouy** · 09-29-2020, 10:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wileec

I did not understand that that was the difference at the time. Still not sure it is. I have had a number of campers and NEVER had a problem with the heater in the mountains.

At this point no Keystone warranty any more.

Not defending the dealer but an intermittent issue is always difficult to diagnose as everything will show good if it's running. The reason I asked about informing the dealer is every morsel of info may help. Shame it's a moot point as you unfortunately didn't make the correlation until after the warranty expired.

Doesn't the furnace have a 2 year warranty? If it does, I'd obviously pursue that and I'd also call the mfg and explain what's going on. They may offer a suggestion where to look. The sail switch was a common issue with construction debris blocking it but it sounds like your issue is related to the altitude as the altitude should not have an effect on the sail.

How handy/comfortable are you with a multimeter and working on gas lines?

Wileec · 09-29-2020, 11:47 AM

Doing the work does not bother me at all. What bothers me is that based on all of the stuff I have read here there has been a bunch of problems related to construction crap blocking the sail and the dealer should have known this and looked at it when I reported an intermittent problem. The symptoms line up close enough to warrant a look. But no they could not be bothered to help a customer with a problem.

travelin texans · 09-29-2020, 01:03 PM

As Marshall suggested contact the furnace manufacturer, it should be covered.

Wileec · 09-29-2020, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travelin texans

As Marshall suggested contact the furnace manufacturer, it should be covered.

That makes sense. I am just frustrated with the dealer and Keystone and need to vent. I thank you for listening and helping, maybe to identify the issue.

**sourdough** · 09-29-2020, 01:06 PM

Sounds like the dealer could have done more but anymore many just want you in and out. If the problem you brought it in for isn't there or apparent they just move it right on out. That's unfortunate but reality in a lot of situations anymore.

That said, the sail switch should be (I hope) pretty easy. I don't know what furnace you have but here is a quick little video that may prove helpful. Good luck.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-g3_Y7MqChE

Wileec · 09-29-2020, 01:12 PM

Thank you for that. My furnace has no external door it is all under the refrigerator and only has the vent visible from outside. Doing work will be a chore. I hope I am able to verify this weekend if it works at lower elevation. We will see.

**sourdough** · 09-29-2020, 01:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wileec

Thank you for that. My furnace has no external door it is all under the refrigerator and only has the vent visible from outside. Doing work will be a chore. I hope I am able to verify this weekend if it works at lower elevation. We will see.

Yep, that is a horse of a different color so to speak.

Northofu1 · 09-29-2020, 06:26 PM

It could very well be the sail switch and if not a loose wire, it could be the randomness of debris in your duct work affecting the switch and after driving off it loosens and clears. Until you actually disassemble it to check it, it may continue.
New units are known to have debris in ducts, water tanks, and wherever else the installers have their hands on. I'm surprised no one (that I have heard of) has found a half a ham sandwich dropped somewhere hard to get into.
Good luck

Wileec · 09-30-2020, 04:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Northofu1

It could very well be the sail switch and if not a loose wire, it could be the randomness of debris in your duct work affecting the switch and after driving off it loosens and clears. Until you actually disassemble it to check it, it may continue.
New units are known to have debris in ducts, water tanks, and wherever else the installers have their hands on. I'm surprised no one (that I have heard of) has found a half a ham sandwich dropped somewhere hard to get into.
Good luck

Exactly. It is things like this that are the reason for a warranty. But if dealers and manufacturers are unwilling to look for these under warranty it does not good.

B-O-B'03 · 09-30-2020, 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wileec

Thank you for that. My furnace has no external door it is all under the refrigerator and only has the vent visible from outside. Doing work will be a chore. I hope I am able to verify this weekend if it works at lower elevation. We will see.

I had to remove my furnace, from the same location, to replace the control board.

When you put it back in, you will need to remove the exhaust piping, from the outside wall, to get it re-established into the furnace.

It is not a big job, just a couple of screws, gas line and all of the duct work need removing.

Let me know if you have any questions.

-Brian

Wileec · 09-30-2020, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B-O-B'03

I had to remove my furnace, from the same location, to replace the control board.

When you put it back in, you will need to remove the exhaust piping, from the outside wall, to get it re-established into the furnace.

It is not a big job, just a couple of screws, gas line and all of the duct work need removing.

Let me know if you have any questions.

-Brian

Brian,

Thanks. I am upset because part of why I bought a new camper was so that things could get fixed for me or so they would not need fixin. If I wanted to do lots of work I would have bought a well used one for a lot less money.

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