Solar question

[BeemerJoe]

2016 Fuzion 422 Chrome. Solar prep. Anyone install solar panels on their toy hauler. I'm mostly concerned about keeping my residential fridge up and running without having to run my generator 24/7. I'll be dry camping in Key West for a few weeks, and would rather not run the generator constantly. I've done a test with my 2 new group 7 marine batteries ( I know, not the best, but brand new) and found that they last a total of 2 hours before being down to 45%. Running a 1000 watt inverter, and just the fridge. I know that at night, I would be fine, as long as I don't open the fridge, but just would like additional charge during the day.
Anyone here have experience with this.. Not looking to break the bank.. just the minimum I can get away with. Thanks again to everyone.

[Skillet173]

Check out this thread. I’m in same boat and found a lot of useful info here.https://www.keystoneforums.com/forum...ad.php?t=48453
https://www.keystoneforums.com/forum...ad.php?t=48453

[Essvar]

Originally Posted by BeemerJoe

2016 Fuzion 422 Chrome. Solar prep. Anyone install solar panels on their toy hauler. I'm mostly concerned about keeping my residential fridge up and running without having to run my generator 24/7. I'll be dry camping in Key West for a few weeks, and would rather not run the generator constantly. I've done a test with my 2 new group 7 marine batteries ( I know, not the best, but brand new) and found that they last a total of 2 hours before being down to 45%. Running a 1000 watt inverter, and just the fridge. I know that at night, I would be fine, as long as I don't open the fridge, but just would like additional charge during the day.
Anyone here have experience with this.. Not looking to break the bank.. just the minimum I can get away with. Thanks again to everyone.

Bare minimum? Skip the rooftop, get a suitcase panel with a built in charge controller and connect it directly to the batteries.

[BeemerJoe]

The portable was exactly what my first choice was. Just don't know what size will suffice. Any info on that? The specs are confusing when looking at them. They are much cheaper that's for sure, and I've seen a lot of people using them.. My other thought was perhaps just Buying a small 2000 generator to run my battery charger. But that seems redundant since I do have a 5500 on board, which is very quiet, and uses only ½ gallon per hours.

[Essvar]

Originally Posted by BeemerJoe

The portable was exactly what my first choice was. Just don't know what size will suffice. Any info on that? The specs are confusing when looking at them. They are much cheaper that's for sure, and I've seen a lot of people using them.. My other thought was perhaps just Buying a small 2000 generator to run my battery charger. But that seems redundant since I do have a 5500 on board, which is very quiet, and uses only ½ gallon per hours.

Ok let’s do some math. Your fridge should be pulling 3-4amps. 100w = roughly 8amps. But a 100w panel typically maxes out at 80% so… 100w panel might barely be enough to keep up with only the fridge and not all of the other parasitic loads. 200w panel would be minimum in my experience. I also carry a backup generator because it’s quieter than the onboard and I can hide it
Also, as you’ve learned your current battery storage capacity is going to limit your ability to function without a pretty constant incoming power source.

[snoobler]

Originally Posted by Essvar

Bare minimum? Skip the rooftop, get a suitcase panel with a built in charge controller and connect it directly to the batteries.

And watch your battery drain.

A typical residential sized fridge uses 2-2.5kWh/day. In great sun, that's 500-600W of panels assuming no rooftop shading and NO other power use. 600W/12V = 50A = the size of solar charge controller you need.

A high efficiency 24" wide 10-11 cu-ft fridge replacing the typical 7.6cu-ft RV absorbtion fridge uses a little over 1kWh/day.

If it's wintertime, and you're in the Northern hemisphere, you'll be lucky to produce 30-40% of what you get in the summer, thus the 500-600W of solar is probably reasonable even for the smaller fridge and double that for the large fridge.

[Essvar]

Originally Posted by snoobler

And watch your battery drain.

A typical residential sized fridge uses 2-2.5kWh/day. In great sun, that's 500-600W of panels assuming no rooftop shading and NO other power use. 600W/12V = 50A = the size of solar charge controller you need.

A high efficiency 24" wide 10-11 cu-ft fridge replacing the typical 7.6cu-ft RV absorbtion fridge uses a little over 1kWh/day.

If it's wintertime, and you're in the Northern hemisphere, you'll be lucky to produce 30-40% of what you get in the summer, thus the 500-600W of solar is probably reasonable even for the smaller fridge and double that for the large fridge.

I’ve been told these RV “residential” fridges are pulling 3-4 amps. That’s where I got that from, he can probably look at the load on his 1000w inverter and know exactly what that fridge is pulling?

Your right though, my duel fuel fridge pulls 500-600w so I run it on propane when I’m boondocking and only run the outdoor mini fridge off the inverter which pulls 60w only when the compressor kicks on.

[snoobler]

Originally Posted by Essvar

I’ve been told these RV “residential” fridges are pulling 3-4 amps. That’s where I got that from, he can probably look at the load on his 1000w inverter and know exactly what that fridge is pulling?

Your right though, my duel fuel fridge pulls 500-600w so I run it on propane when I’m boondocking and only run the outdoor mini fridge off the inverter which pulls 60w only when the compressor kicks on.

The 3-4 amps may be correct, but what you don't know is how often they cycle. You'd need something like a kill-a-watt meter to measure the kWh used over time. Given how many fridges I've researched, I'm confident in my estimates.

Yep. Absorption fridges are HORRIBLE on AC. They consume 5-6X the energy that a compressor fridge uses. Basically, it takes 5X more energy to MAKE heat than it does to MOVE it.

We have the double-door fridge in our Montana. Oddly enough on AC it only uses ~400-450W where single fridges tend to use 300-325W. I have a single in the AmericanStar next door. Both are on smart Wi-fi plugs, so I can see what they use daily (and turn them on/off remotely).

I have 3000W of solar, and I power the double fridge during solar hours where the array can power it... typically about 10 hours, and it cycles on and off throughout the day running about 16 out of 24 hours per day in mild weather on setting 1. I can see the spikes when it turns on in my solar power system's logging data. One time I left it on overnight, and it used 8kWh in 24 hours. It is by far the hungriest thing I power on a daily basis.

I run it on propane overnight. When everything goes smoothly, the wifi plug turns on and off in accordance with the times I program, and then propane takes over when I remember to leave it in Auto mode.

[Skillet173]

I looked at the Energy guide on the Haier 16 cuft that's in my rig. I'm hoping it's accurate as it states it uses 3a start up, 2.3a running, and 448 kWh/year. That's kind of what I'm basing my needs on.

Guess I should fire it up and get the numbers from the EMS for entire trailer over 24-48 hours before looking at solar!

Frikkin solar

[Essvar]

Originally Posted by Skillet173

I looked at the Energy guide on the Haier 16 cuft that's in my rig. I'm hoping it's accurate as it states it uses 3a start up, 2.3a running, and 448 kWh/year. That's kind of what I'm basing my needs on.

Guess I should fire it up and get the numbers from the EMS for entire trailer over 24-48 hours before looking at solar!

Frikkin solar

Get ready…. You are going to be blown away by how much parasitic load there is in these new Fuzions.

[Skillet173]

With the one circuit for fridge and main TV shut off I am showing 27watts, and .1a draw on one leg and .4a on the other plugged in to 50a service in barn. I didn't think that was all that bad?

[snoobler]

Originally Posted by Skillet173

I looked at the Energy guide on the Haier 16 cuft that's in my rig. I'm hoping it's accurate as it states it uses 3a start up, 2.3a running, and 448 kWh/year. That's kind of what I'm basing my needs on.

Guess I should fire it up and get the numbers from the EMS for entire trailer over 24-48 hours before looking at solar!

Frikkin solar

448kWh/year

448/365 = 1.2kWh/day (I was a little off at 1kWh, but that's based on a particular Energy Star unit I was looking at)

Flat panels on an RV roof in winter? 600W if you want to ensure that you can power the fridge consistently.

From:

http://www.solarelectricityhandbook....rradiance.html

Picking OKC, OK in the middle of the country, the attached pic shows you your DAILY solar hours. This doesn't mean you get 2.75 hours of sun. It means you get the equivalent of 2.75 hours of FULL PANEL POWER (high noon charging) from solar exposure from dawn to dusk, e.g., In November, if you have a 100W panel on your roof, you will get:

100W * 2.75h = 275Wh

if you need 1200Wh/day, in Nov, you'll need:

1200Wh/2.75h = 436W.

You'll need more in Dec/Jan.

You also need to account for losses. Assume 15% converting sunlight to AC power...

436/.85 = 513W - round up to 600W.

If you're farther North, you'll need more. South? You'll need less. The site also factors in weather influences on solar collection.

If you can determine you daily kWh needs, that tool basically yields your solar needed.

[BeemerJoe]

The hell with it lol. I'm going to go with a small 2000 watt generator and extended run kit.. Realy the most economical as far as that goes. Even if I go with the Honda 2200 and extended run kit, it would only come out to about 1300. If I go with the Predator, it's even cheaper, except hard to find an extended run kit for that.. Giving up on the Solar. Thanks every one.

[snoobler]

Originally Posted by Skillet173

With the one circuit for fridge and main TV shut off I am showing 27watts, and .1a draw on one leg and .4a on the other plugged in to 50a service in barn. I didn't think that was all that bad?

The problem is that's not with the fridge running... it's just pulling enough power to run the electronics. They cycle on and off as needed.

[snoobler]

Originally Posted by BeemerJoe

The hell with it lol. I'm going to go with a small 2000 watt generator and extended run kit.. Realy the most economical as far as that goes. Even if I go with the Honda 2200 and extended run kit, it would only come out to about 1300. If I go with the Predator, it's even cheaper, except hard to find an extended run kit for that.. Giving up on the Solar. Thanks every one.

Run the numbers. If we're just talking about a fridge, you're going to get an expensive generator to power a ~300W peak load that's only on some of the time. If you plan to run far more than that, then sure, generators are hard to beat and are the cheaper option for at least a few years... depending on fuel prices.

[Skillet173]

Originally Posted by BeemerJoe

The hell with it lol. I'm going to go with a small 2000 watt generator and extended run kit.. Realy the most economical as far as that goes. Even if I go with the Honda 2200 and extended run kit, it would only come out to about 1300. If I go with the Predator, it's even cheaper, except hard to find an extended run kit for that.. Giving up on the Solar. Thanks every one.

I hear ya. The only thing I have on my side is that I currently have no truck to tow with so I've got time. Once MX season starts up in spring I'll be worrying about bikes and my son and not trailer!

[Skillet173]

Originally Posted by snoobler

The problem is that's not with the fridge running... it's just pulling enough power to run the electronics. They cycle on and off as needed.

I know. I'll have to get some new numbers with fridge running over a 48 hour period.
Owned this trailer for 3 weeks now (bought it to put in barn for winter) and am just researching a bunch of stuff for it.

I do appreciate the wealth of knowledge and assistance on this forum!!

Thank you all!

[bbells]

First, marine batteries are not deep cycle or not very high in ah. It would be best to replace them with 2 12v or 4 6v golf cart batteries at about 200ah each. It takes about 300 watts on the roof to keep your stuff charged. Flat on the roof that is 40% less output, so, 280w x 5hrs = about 1400wh going into your batteries on a sunny day. Last I heard the 12v fridge uses 45w per hour. 45x24= 1080 watts per day. I would use more panels than that myself. I like output tone 2x use.