Tow vehicle issues

Mike1056 · 10-24-2022, 12:08 PM

So I have a 2021 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins. I am pulling a 2020 Keystone Cougar 366 thats 11,800lbs. The truck has 13,000 miles on it now. I have towed the trailer three times now. The first trip everything went well pulled nice
truck was tight, I did have to add air bags to help the suspension a bit. But the second and third trip out I am noticing when the weight transfer like letting off gas and starting I am feeling what feels like slop in the drive shaft or maybe a universal joint clunk. When not towing it is quite and tight. Anyone else get the same thing?

wiredgeorge · 10-24-2022, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike1056

So I have a 2021 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins. I am pulling a 2020 Keystone Cougar 366 thats 11,800lbs. The truck has 13,000 miles on it now. I have towed the trailer three times now. The first trip everything went well pulled nice
truck was tight, I did have to add air bags to help the suspension a bit. But the second and third trip out I am noticing when the weight transfer like letting off gas and starting I am feeling what feels like slop in the drive shaft or maybe a universal joint clunk. When not towing it is quite and tight. Anyone else get the same thing?

Your issues may have to do with the 3/4 ton truck likely having a payload of less than 2500 lbs. Your camper's gross weight is 14,000 lbs and the normal estimated pin weight is 23 percent of the 5th wheel gross weight or 3220 lbs. Add hitch, passenger and other stuff in the truck and your pin weight is likely 4000 lbs. Your payload is on a yellow/white placard in the driver door frame. What is your actual payload? Suggest a one ton truck may be your answer but I am sure others will chime in.

Also suggest you put together a signature as is now required on this site. Year, make and model of camper and same for your tow vehicle.
https://www.keystoneforums.com/forum...ad.php?t=52977

travelin texans · 10-24-2022, 02:02 PM

As George stated the 1st issue is too much rv, not enough truck.
Yes! The truck is rated to "tow" XXXXXlbs & will "tow" it all day long, but it's only rated to safely "carry" whatever that yellow/white payload tag states on the drivers door which typically doesn't equal the same weight.
Secondly the clunking may be from your 5th wheel hitch, depending on brand, not your truck u joints.

jsb5717 · 10-24-2022, 02:23 PM

I agree that you're overloaded. The published trailer weight is empty weight from the factory and is a phantom number...you'll never see it in the real world. When figuring trailer weight use either GVWR as an estimator or actual weight from a weigh station with the trailer loaded. 23% of that weight is the number to use for your pin weight. With people, hitch, and additional gear in the truck I think you'll find that you're quite overloaded.

However, I'd start with the hitch for the clunking. What hitch are you using?

Essvar · 10-24-2022, 03:29 PM

I agree with everyone on looking at your hitch first. The truck is too new for the common culprits. U-Joints, Carrier Bearing and lastly the dreaded 68RFE transmission.

**sourdough** · 10-24-2022, 03:58 PM

You need to identify the clanking as either drivetrain or the hitch. It should be easy to tell where it's coming from. If it's only happening when you start and stop, and only with the trailer attached, I'd be thinking hitch slop because worn/bad/loose U joints, bearings etc. don't "get tighter" just because you pull the trailer off.

I've owned quite a few Rams over the years and they all have a bit of a "clunk" if engaging from P to D, P to R, D to R etc. If you have slop in the drivetrain while driving under load then it may very well be from being overloaded as that trailer is a 14k gvw trailer. Even if you were running at 13k (the 11,800 was dry weight which won't mean anything) the pin @ 23% would be right at 3000lbs. which will be more than your payload without adding anything else.

Pull the trailer off and do stop and go driving, accelerate, decelerate, shift from P to D etc. Does it make noise? Put the trailer on and determine what it does when you do whatever. You should be able to easily tell if it's the hitch. If you have the sliding back window open it and listen to it.

**JRTJH** · 10-24-2022, 04:03 PM

When I read your problem, even before looking at weights, my first inclination was that you're having some problems with "pin clunk" caused by your fifth wheel hitch and pin. As you start/stop/downshift or hit a bump or swell in the road, your pin will "clunk against the sides of the hitch "pin well" (the space where the pin rides under the hitch plate). In many hitches, there's just enough "slop" to set up a clunking/chucking that can be very annoying.

With only 12 or 13K miles on your truck, I doubt it's a driveline problem with the truck. I'd look very closely at the hitch and how it secures the pin in the hitch head. I think you'll find your problem "in the bed" not "under the bed"...

Let us know what you find...

Ribtip · 10-24-2022, 06:47 PM

Op is this a long bed with dual drive shaft

mikec557 · 10-24-2022, 07:03 PM

Does a RAM Truck have a tow/haul button like Chev/GMC? If it does, use it all the time you're towing. Also, if it does, try towing the 5th wheel with it on, and then with it off, and see if you feel a difference... If you don't have one, disregard this post. :-)

rhagfo · 10-24-2022, 09:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikec557

Does a RAM Truck have a tow/haul button like Chev/GMC? If it does, use it all the time you're towing. Also, if it does, try towing the 5th wheel with it on, and then with it off, and see if you feel a difference... If you don't have one, disregard this post. :-)

Ram has T/H also Cummins has a two setting EB.
Clunk is likely the hitch, if you have the factory prep, make sure the pucks lock in snug, other than that a lot of 5er for a 10k GVWR TV.
You need to be weight aware, the -1,280 is your dry weight. You likely weigh about 13,000# with a pin of about 2,860#. Time for a trip to the scales to see where you stand on rear axl, tires, and GVWR.

Mike1056 · 10-25-2022, 03:54 AM

Thanks for all the great comments. I will check to weight loads again but I think I am ok. I believe the truck towing weight for the Limited is somewhat reduced. It is over 17,000. So I am close but I dont think over loaded.
I have a B&W Companion slider hitch. So now im wonder if the slop is in that slider.

**chuckster57** · 10-25-2022, 04:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike1056

Thanks for all the great comments. I will check to weight loads again but I think I am ok. I believe the truck towing weight for the Limited is somewhat reduced. It is over 17,000. So I am close but I dont think over loaded.
I have a B&W Companion slider hitch. So now im wonder if the slop is in that slider.

“Tow” rating is a marketing gimmick. What everyone is saying is the weight you are carrying in the truck is in question.

wiredgeorge · 10-25-2022, 04:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike1056

Thanks for all the great comments. I will check to weight loads again but I think I am ok. I believe the truck towing weight for the Limited is somewhat reduced. It is over 17,000. So I am close but I dont think over loaded.
I have a B&W Companion slider hitch. So now im wonder if the slop is in that slider.

As already suggested, look at the payload for your truck on the yellow/white placard in your door frame. You are very likely well over payload. While the clunking may be the hitch you are also in an overloaded condition and safety is also a prime issue.

rhagfo · 10-25-2022, 04:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike1056

Thanks for all the great comments. I will check to weight loads again but I think I am ok. I believe the truck towing weight for the Limited is somewhat reduced. It is over 17,000. So I am close but I don't think over loaded.
I have a B&W Companion slider hitch. So now I am wonder if the slop is in that slider.

First of all I forgot this in my previous post.

Well unfortunately you are only looking at the least important weight rating. The other weight ratings are Gross Vehicle Weight Rating (GVWR), Gross Axle Weight Rating (GVWR), and as it left the factory floor Payload.

Your Ram 2500 will still have a GVWR of 10,000# this is the maximum weight the truck can have on it's four wheels.

Not sure the number of people you carry in the truck, but that is a heavy hitch. The slider also tells me you have a short bed, which will ride rougher than a long bed would.

So here is my read on your situation, I have been in your boat, towing our current 5er with a 2001 Ram 2500.

You will be over GVWR, likely close to rear GAWR, and not mentioned before check your tires for their max weight rating.

If the air bags were to correct a squatted situation with the rear of the truck, that should have been your first clue you needed a bigger truck, the 2500 has coil springs, the 3500 has leaf springs.

There are two stickers on the drivers door post or the door, one list the GVWR, and the GAWRs, the other "Yellow" sticker list the maximum payload as the truck left the factory floor, that is no longer valid, only a trip to the scales will tell you what you still have available.

GAWR, is the maximum an axle can carry, this is important for your rear axle, as it carries the most weight from your hitch and 5th wheel pin.

ChuckS · 10-25-2022, 05:24 AM

I assume you are using a nice lube plate on the pin of the fifth wheel.. If not that will help quite a bit..

Also learn to easy into the gas pedal when starting out from a stop and the same when getting ready to brake ( unless of course its an emergency )

I rather doubt you have issues with the truck drivetrain at this point...

**chuckster57** · 10-25-2022, 06:39 AM

If he has an auto slider, I don’t think a lube plate fits with the capture plate.

RollaMo · 10-25-2022, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chuckster57

If he has an auto slider, I don’t think a lube plate fits with the capture plate.

Are you sure?

Looking at the B&W Companion "Slider" the actual head looks to be the same as the regular companion.
I am using the regular companion with a lube plate.

**flybouy** · 10-25-2022, 07:46 AM

Do yourself and fellow highway travelers a favor and visit a scale. First.load up the truck and trailer as you would to go camping. So that means all passengers, pets, ice chests, food, firewood, and that big stack of cash in your wallet.

Cat scales are located at most truck stops. You don't have to go to Cat but I'd urge you to visit their website www.catscales.com and look around. They have easy to follow instructions on how to weight. They also offer a nice app that let's you get weighed without going inside.

notanlines · 10-25-2022, 08:26 AM

What Chuckster said about the lube plate. Usually it will slide on, but it is very tight. It is a common source of the dreaded 'high hitching' according to Demco.

Camp CA · 10-25-2022, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike1056

So I have a 2021 Dodge Ram 2500 Cummins. I am pulling a 2020 Keystone Cougar 366 thats 11,800lbs.......... When not towing it is quite and tight. Anyone else get the same thing?

Yes with my F250 short bed SRW diesel towing my 38 ft, 14,000 lb GVWR trailer (same as yours). Issue went away once I replaced it with a crew cab, long bed DRW diesel.

You may also like: