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Old 08-05-2022, 06:41 AM   #1
RVGator
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Hi-Spec Tires and G load rating Suggestions

We recently returned from a 62 day 6730 mile summer trip. I will detail a trip report in a differing forum, but we had an amazing time.

The one downside was I blew 3 of my 5(including spare) Hi-Spec tires during that trip. And when I say blew I mean they went off like a bomb. The first one, driver side front, went about midway into the trip up in Maine. It, of course ruined the underside belly tape and skirting around it. It also blew the snap pad off of my leveling jack which flew into a passing truck damaging his headlight and grille.

The 2nd tire (driver side rear) went just outside of Nashville and completely destroyed the remainder of the skirting and underbelly tape along with blowing off the other snap pad, which I was able to recover from the middle of the road. The fender trim also blew off and is ruined.

The 3rd tire happened after our trip when I was bringing the camper to the dealer for warranty/repair/recall work. This one was passenger side and damaged the underbelly tape, lost the snap pad in 6 lanes of traffic in Orlando, and damaged the skirting.

So in 2 months I have significant damage that I will bear the cost of for some really poor tires. I absolutely have 0 confidence left in the remaining 2 hi-spec tires and it won’t leave the dealer without a new set.

The dealer (General RV) says Keystone won’t help out with the tires. They are willing to give me RoadX tires at their cost. Their “cost”, however, is higher than what I can get online but maybe I can get them to mount and balance them for me. I am going to reach out to Keystone personally as this shouldn’t happen with a 5th wheel that is less than a year old.

I have(had, these were blown apart as well)TPMS in all the tires, pressure always checked prior to leaving and temp monitored along the way. No warning or indications prior to explosions.

Long story short I recommend taking a hard look at getting differing tires than the factory Hi-Spec’s if you have the STw235/80R16G size and rating.

On another note finding quality tires when you are in desperate need is challenging and I ended up with 2 differing tire replacements from local tire shops where I had the issues. One being a Trailer King tire and one being a Navitrac. These are both low end tires at the $200 mark. I will say that visually both of these tires look much more “commercial” and robust than the Hi-Spec tire which looks like a normal road tire.

I am looking for inputs for a quality G rated tire. The RoadX tires are made in Canada and General RV puts them in their “best” category. I have never heard of them. These forums suggest Sailun tires, which are made in China, are great tires and people have had a lot of luck with them. I had Goodyear Endurance on my previous trailer and I liked them but they don’t make them in a G load rating. Any other suggestions are welcome.

Rob
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Old 08-05-2022, 06:55 AM   #2
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Tires

Quote:
Originally Posted by RVGator View Post
We recently returned from a 62 day 6730 mile summer trip. I will detail a trip report in a differing forum, but we had an amazing time.

The one downside was I blew 3 of my 5(including spare) Hi-Spec tires during that trip. And when I say blew I mean they went off like a bomb. The first one, driver side front, went about midway into the trip up in Maine. It, of course ruined the underside belly tape and skirting around it. It also blew the snap pad off of my leveling jack which flew into a passing truck damaging his headlight and grille.

The 2nd tire (driver side rear) went just outside of Nashville and completely destroyed the remainder of the skirting and underbelly tape along with blowing off the other snap pad, which I was able to recover from the middle of the road. The fender trim also blew off and is ruined.

The 3rd tire happened after our trip when I was bringing the camper to the dealer for warranty/repair/recall work. This one was passenger side and damaged the underbelly tape, lost the snap pad in 6 lanes of traffic in Orlando, and damaged the skirting.

So in 2 months I have significant damage that I will bear the cost of for some really poor tires. I absolutely have 0 confidence left in the remaining 2 hi-spec tires and it won’t leave the dealer without a new set.

The dealer (General RV) says Keystone won’t help out with the tires. They are willing to give me RoadX tires at their cost. Their “cost”, however, is higher than what I can get online but maybe I can get them to mount and balance them for me. I am going to reach out to Keystone personally as this shouldn’t happen with a 5th wheel that is less than a year old.

I have(had, these were blown apart as well)TPMS in all the tires, pressure always checked prior to leaving and temp monitored along the way. No warning or indications prior to explosions.

Long story short I recommend taking a hard look at getting differing tires than the factory Hi-Spec’s if you have the STw235/80R16G size and rating.

On another note finding quality tires when you are in desperate need is challenging and I ended up with 2 differing tire replacements from local tire shops where I had the issues. One being a Trailer King tire and one being a Navitrac. These are both low end tires at the $200 mark. I will say that visually both of these tires look much more “commercial” and robust than the Hi-Spec tire which looks like a normal road tire.

I am looking for inputs for a quality G rated tire. The RoadX tires are made in Canada and General RV puts them in their “best” category. I have never heard of them. These forums suggest Sailun tires, which are made in China, are great tires and people have had a lot of luck with them. I had Goodyear Endurance on my previous trailer and I liked them but they don’t make them in a G load rating. Any other suggestions are welcome.

Rob
I replaced all of my HiSpec bombs with Carlisle CSL16 14 ply tires 2 weeks ago to reduce the chance of trailer damage. Around $230 plus mount and road hazard, 5 tires was about $1,660
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Old 08-05-2022, 07:12 AM   #3
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Without knowing the cause for the first tire failure, it's hard to make any recommendations. When inflated to the trailer manufacturers recommendation on the certification label your tires provided adequate load capacity in accordance with the RVIA 10% reserve requirements. So that leaves three possible causes; under inflation, over loading or foreign object tire damages.

IMO, all failures after the first one may have been caused by the instant overloading of the tire fore or aft of the failed tire. With a heavy trailer having 7000# axles even the tires on the other side of the trailer may have suffered from the instant failure at highway speed.

Remember, internal tire damages are cumulative, meaning the overloading could cause the tire to suffer some load carrying abilities. Therefore, it will degrade rapidly because it's overloaded.

There are at least a dozen ST tire manufacturers that build tires the same size and load capacity as your OE tires, all offshore.

The RV industry recommends changing all tires on the same side as the failure because they suffered the shock of instant overloading.
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Old 08-05-2022, 07:59 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by CWtheMan View Post
Without knowing the cause for the first tire failure, it's hard to make any recommendations. When inflated to the trailer manufacturers recommendation on the certification label your tires provided adequate load capacity in accordance with the RVIA 10% reserve requirements. So that leaves three possible causes; under inflation, over loading or foreign object tire damages.

IMO, all failures after the first one may have been caused by the instant overloading of the tire fore or aft of the failed tire. With a heavy trailer having 7000# axles even the tires on the other side of the trailer may have suffered from the instant failure at highway speed.

Remember, internal tire damages are cumulative, meaning the overloading could cause the tire to suffer some load carrying abilities. Therefore, it will degrade rapidly because it's overloaded.

There are at least a dozen ST tire manufacturers that build tires the same size and load capacity as your OE tires, all offshore.

The RV industry recommends changing all tires on the same side as the failure because they suffered the shock of instant overloading.
The 4th possibly is cheap a## Chinese tires, aka China Bombs!
Regardless of what the RVIA specs may be for the recommended load carrying capability there are just some brands of tires, HiSpec, TKs & couple others, that aren't adequate to be put on a covered wagon. I can't believe every blow out on those few brands are all due to those 3 cases of abuse by the rv owner you've quoted, too much of coincidence that those brands blow up.
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Old 08-05-2022, 08:28 AM   #5
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Hi-Spec tires have been the subject of quite a few threads and all were blow out threads. You might want to search and take a look at these and what brands were suggested.
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Old 08-05-2022, 08:56 AM   #6
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I use Sailun S637 LRG tires on mine. Had them pull the OE Raniers off before I picked it up. There is a big difference in them when you pick them up side by side. Many tires are made in China....some are bona fide "bombs" IMO and others not. Some are made in Thailand as well. The difference in the Chinese made tires is who owns the factory and who provides oversight on the manufacturing and quality processes. Those left to the Chinese end up being the "bombs" as best I can tell and those companies with direct oversight (on site) of those processes produce tires that actually comply with their specs. Trailer King, Tow Max, Hi Spec, Ranier...avoid those.

Some would suggest that the only way a tire fails is due to owner abuse or foreign objects. That simply isn't the case in my experience. The original research I did on failures of one tire brand drove them all back to the same factory so there seems to be much more to it than the two factors listed above.
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Old 08-05-2022, 09:55 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by travelin texans View Post
The 4th possibly is cheap a## Chinese tires, aka China Bombs!
Regardless of what the RVIA specs may be for the recommended load carrying capability there are just some brands of tires, HiSpec, TKs & couple others, that aren't adequate to be put on a covered wagon. I can't believe every blow out on those few brands are all due to those 3 cases of abuse by the rv owner you've quoted, too much of coincidence that those brands blow up.
Junk tires normally get recalled right off the shelfs. ST tire recalls are almost nonexistent. However, Sailun - a favorite - is just recovering from one.

If an owner is not going to take the time to look into the cause of their tire failures, what's their comments worth? Just another unfounded complaint from the "band wagon"?

The meat of my comment was the fact that opposing tires on multi axle trailers are severely overloaded when one of them fails, especially more so when traveling at highway speed.

Foot note: The DOT logo on all highway tries is supported by mandatory inspections, normally done by a 3rd party. The common cause for all tire tread separations can be determined by a skilled tire forensic expert. Without proof of a factory defect the other possibilities are clearly identifiable. Overloading, under inflated or both.
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Old 08-05-2022, 09:56 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by sourdough View Post
I use Sailun S637 LRG tires on mine. Had them pull the OE Raniers off before I picked it up. There is a big difference in them when you pick them up side by side. Many tires are made in China....some are bona fide "bombs" IMO and others not. Some are made in Thailand as well. The difference in the Chinese made tires is who owns the factory and who provides oversight on the manufacturing and quality processes. Those left to the Chinese end up being the "bombs" as best I can tell and those companies with direct oversight (on site) of those processes produce tires that actually comply with their specs. Trailer King, Tow Max, Hi Spec, Ranier...avoid those.

Some would suggest that the only way a tire fails is due to owner abuse or foreign objects. That simply isn't the case in my experience. The original research I did on failures of one tire brand drove them all back to the same factory so there seems to be much more to it than the two factors listed above.
Has the OEM Ranier tire ever been the subject of blow out discussion? Hi-Spec I am sure about. TK I am sure about. What other brands does Keystone put on campers?
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Old 08-05-2022, 10:06 AM   #9
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I use Sailun S637 LRG tires on mine. Had them pull the OE Raniers off before I picked it up. There is a big difference in them when you pick them up side by side. Many tires are made in China....some are bona fide "bombs" IMO and others not. Some are made in Thailand as well. The difference in the Chinese made tires is who owns the factory and who provides oversight on the manufacturing and quality processes. Those left to the Chinese end up being the "bombs" as best I can tell and those companies with direct oversight (on site) of those processes produce tires that actually comply with their specs. Trailer King, Tow Max, Hi Spec, Ranier...avoid those.

Some would suggest that the only way a tire fails is due to owner abuse or foreign objects. That simply isn't the case in my experience. The original research I did on failures of one tire brand drove them all back to the same factory so there seems to be much more to it than the two factors listed above.
You know you can track your tires back to the OEM provider who can track them back to the tire building plant.

https://www.tredittire.com/tires/
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Old 08-05-2022, 10:08 AM   #10
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Has the OEM Ranier tire ever been the subject of blow out discussion? Hi-Spec I am sure about. TK I am sure about. What other brands does Keystone put on campers?

IIRC there have been a few comments on this forum about Ranier failures and I've read of them on other forums. I think Hi Specs are relatively new as OE tires so figure we'll get to read more about them going forward. I guess they were a cheaper alternative to the cheap Trailer Kings. As far as all the various tires they put on I don't have a list and I look at all brands of trailers so they kind of run together. For Keystone I have seen lots of TKs, Tow Max in the past, Ranier, now Hi Spec, I believe I saw the Sailuns on a Montana? - I've seen Carlisle on something but don't remember if it was Keystone,...and I'm sure others can chime in with what they've seen.
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Old 08-05-2022, 10:22 AM   #11
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Has the OEM Ranier tire ever been the subject of blow out discussion? Hi-Spec I am sure about. TK I am sure about. What other brands does Keystone put on campers?
On page #18 of the 2023 Keystone owner's manual, you'll find a listing of Keystone OEM wheel and tire providers. When you click on one of the addresses you will find a full line-up of their tires and wheels.

https://keystone-rv-dealer-app.cdn.p...l_2023_web.pdf
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Old 08-05-2022, 12:00 PM   #12
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On the note about looking into the cause of failures…that’s a tough one for owners. If the tires were inflated properly, 5th wheel under gross vehicle weight, you would rule those out. So that leaves either something sharp in the road(which you could imagine is a possibility for at least 1 failure) but the other option is subpar manufacturing and or product. Pre inspection shows normal tire with minimal wear, post inspection of the tire shows it exploded outward. And you can bet after each explosion I checked each tire inch by inch because nobody wants to go through a blowout in the highway. Aside from being a forensic tire expert I’m not sure there is much more to ascertain.
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Old 08-05-2022, 02:14 PM   #13
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Hmmmmm, just imagine you're 1/2 the country away from home and BAM! your tire disintegrates on a busy highway. THOUSANDS of vehichles rushing past at 70+ mph. Now let me put on a yellow safety vest and collect the remnants of the tire that blew apart a mile back.. Then collect all those pieces and google "forensic tire expert near me" so I can find out WHY it blew apart. Oh, that's right, box it up and send it back to China where it was made and ask them WHY. Good luck k with that.

The REASONABLE person will get it replaced and continue on. They'll chock it up to the non-scientific conclusion that they were the victim of Chines junk tires and move on. I for one would agree with that common sense conclusion.

If it "looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like like a duck then it must be a duck" I don't need DNA forensic evidence to tell me I just shot and ate a duck. JMHO, YMMV
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Old 08-05-2022, 02:42 PM   #14
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Hmmmmm, just imagine you're 1/2 the country away from home and BAM! your tire disintegrates on a busy highway. THOUSANDS of vehichles rushing past at 70+ mph. Now let me put on a yellow safety vest and collect the remnants of the tire that blew apart a mile back.. Then collect all those pieces and google "forensic tire expert near me" so I can find out WHY it blew apart. Oh, that's right, box it up and send it back to China where it was made and ask them WHY. Good luck k with that.

The REASONABLE person will get it replaced and continue on. They'll chock it up to the non-scientific conclusion that they were the victim of Chines junk tires and move on. I for one would agree with that common sense conclusion.

If it "looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like like a duck then it must be a duck" I don't need DNA forensic evidence to tell me I just shot and ate a duck. JMHO, YMMV
I agree!
And if it's one of those brands that are constantly being mentioned on EVERY rv forum as known China Bombs, ie TKs, HiSpec, Ranier & GY Marathons from the past, I'm sure not going to put another set on thinking "oh I must have hit something on the road or I was overloaded & under inflated!", I'm buying any other brand but one of those.
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Old 08-05-2022, 02:56 PM   #15
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Hmmmmm, just imagine you're 1/2 the country away from home and BAM! your tire disintegrates on a busy highway. THOUSANDS of vehichles rushing past at 70+ mph. Now let me put on a yellow safety vest and collect the remnants of the tire that blew apart a mile back.. Then collect all those pieces and google "forensic tire expert near me" so I can find out WHY it blew apart. Oh, that's right, box it up and send it back to China where it was made and ask them WHY. Good luck k with that.

The REASONABLE person will get it replaced and continue on. They'll chock it up to the non-scientific conclusion that they were the victim of Chines junk tires and move on. I for one would agree with that common sense conclusion.

If it "looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like like a duck then it must be a duck" I don't need DNA forensic evidence to tell me I just shot and ate a duck. JMHO, YMMV

After having the flat earlier this year on my truck I can certainly vouch for your comments. I was off the road (interstate) as far as I could pull the truck/trailer and vehicles of every kind were blowing past me at 80mph non stop. The longest stretch of "no car" was maybe 2 seconds. The wind was blowing and those vehicles and trucks would literally blow you around passing no more than 3' away. I had, and have, no interest in trying to collect any kind of evidence for tire failure in any way. I wanted OUT.

With tires I watch tire pressures constantly, visually inspect them and keep them from hitting things or abusing them. When a tire blows I don't need or care to know what caused it - it's gone. For me one failed tire equals a set so that's just what it is. I try to learn from others and study up on things like tires. It's funny, I haven't had a failure on a tire that I thought was a good brand; always the "suspicious" brands and virtually all were OE (trailer and truck). And yes, I know a duck when I see one and I've had to eat a few. After that I find something else....
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Old 08-05-2022, 04:21 PM   #16
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I’ve been there recently! Hi spec are low junk! I’m looking to upgrade to sailun 637’s.
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Old 08-05-2022, 08:09 PM   #17
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I’ve been there recently! Hi spec are low junk! I’m looking to upgrade to sailun 637’s.
You have must hit something really big or be extremely overloaded to do that much damage.
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Old 08-06-2022, 02:27 AM   #18
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I am a member of the "Hi_Spec " tire that blew up for no reason club see here https://www.keystoneforums.com/forum...ad.php?t=50721. I put the Saliun S637s on because I had had great service out of them on our previous 5ver. I got them from Mavis Tire at a great price thanks to Danny for recommending Mavis to me.
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Old 08-06-2022, 12:24 PM   #19
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Without knowing the cause for the first tire failure, it's hard to make any recommendations. When inflated to the trailer manufacturers recommendation on the certification label your tires provided adequate load capacity in accordance with the RVIA 10% reserve requirements. So that leaves three possible causes; under inflation, over loading or foreign object tire damages.

IMO, all failures after the first one may have been caused by the instant overloading of the tire fore or aft of the failed tire. With a heavy trailer having 7000# axles even the tires on the other side of the trailer may have suffered from the instant failure at highway speed.

Remember, internal tire damages are cumulative, meaning the overloading could cause the tire to suffer some load carrying abilities. Therefore, it will degrade rapidly because it's overloaded.

There are at least a dozen ST tire manufacturers that build tires the same size and load capacity as your OE tires, all offshore.

The RV industry recommends changing all tires on the same side as the failure because they suffered the shock of instant overloading.
I'm confused, not something new for me but hear me out. In this post you basically state that the initial tire failure was owner caused. The first paragraph plainly states that the tires meet the 10% reserve so that ONLY LEAVES 3 owner caused possabilities. And then, subsequent failures were caused by overloading from the first tire failure. Logically then all tire failures were caused by the owner.

In other posts, all I see are complaints why folks don't have their tire failures inspected by a "forensic tire expert". Logically If it's my fualt why do this? Is this for the tire companies edification so they can compile data for a tire confrence? This just seems illogical to me.
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Old 08-06-2022, 12:36 PM   #20
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The Hi Spec tire used on any large fifth wheel is just a blowout waiting to happen.. it ranks right up there with Towmax and Trailer King..

And the really bad thing is in most cases it’s carrying at least 20 psi or more compared to the E rated Blowmax kings at (80 psi versus 110 psi) for the Hispec.

I have seen well over a dozen Hispec blowouts in the last 6 months.. All Alpines .. it’s a trash tire that should never have been installed by Keystone

For some reason the Alpine line seems to want to always use off the wall tire brands while the Montana line used GoodYear G614 and then switched to Sailun S637 series.l bitch quality tires

The Alpine and Montana are both the top “Luxury Lline” units from Keystone..same weight and size class.. Same drop frame.l same 7K axles..
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