Towing Toy hauler questions.

[flybouy]

Here’s how it works, trucks have a rating based on frame, spring rates, brake size, steering components, etc. That rating is based on a single cab, bare bones model. That’s the MAXIMUM capacity for that line, 1,500 or 2,500, etc.

Now as they stretch it to a quad cab, add the extra seat, doors, windows, etc. the weight of all that comes OFF the max number. Add leather, carpet, power windows, power seats, power mirrors, 4 wheel drive components or ANYTHING ELSE it comes off that original max number.

So, if you want all the “glitter and gee whiz gizmos” and want to haul more weight than you have to go up another size. You can’t have your cake and eat it to.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by Talleyman66

With a tow behind trailer, do I still go by the max capacity of 1609 or is there a different formula for towing with the receiver hitch? If I use a weight distribution hitch, how does that effect the tongue weight of trailer? I have attached a pic of the other sticker from my vehicle. How can i use that information for determining how much I can tow? Thank you again guys for all the information you are providing.

As has been stated the mega cab, along with the diesel, really cut back on your carrying capacity because both add lots of weight to the truck which then deducts from whatever that payload would have been resulting in the 1609 you have left.

Bumper pull vs 5th wheel uses the same payload on the truck. The benefit of a bumper pull is a lighter load on the truck; approx. 12-13% of trailer gvw for the tongue weight vs approx. 20% (or a little more) for the pin weight of a 5th wheel. Example: a 10,000 lb. gvw bumper pull would put a tongue weight of approx. 12-1300lbs. on your truck (coming off your 1609 payload); a 5th wheel pin would place approx. 2000lbs + pin weight on the truck. To each you have to add the weight of the type of hitch you place in/on the truck. A bumper pull wdh w/sway control will run approx. 125lbs. A 5th wheel hitch can run from 45 - 400lbs. depending on what you select - all of those come off the payload as well. Remember that in addition the trailer and hitch the weights of all the family, pets, tools, jacks, blocks, ice chests etc. etc. - ANYTHING placed in the truck comes off the payload as well.

As far as using the info on that sticker here is a link to a chart that provides some generic information;

https://www.ramtrucks.com/content/da...Ram%202500.pdf

Your info is on page 4. Remember that this is a "generic" chart; your specific numbers are on that sticker and actual axle weights for "your" truck would have to come from a scale but they get you in the ballpark.

[B-O-B'03]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

Talleyman66, That payload you cited doesn't seem like much for a 3/4 ton truck. Where did you get this number from. Actual payload number can be seen on the yellow sticker in the door frame and says something like, "the combined weight of occupants and cargo" and lists payload in both KG and LBS. The payload you mentioned sounds like a half ton.

I was thinking the same thing, our F150 Platinum SCREW has a 1400 pound payload, scientists are puzzled.

-Brian

[Kebees42]

With the diesel you lose about a thousand lbs of payload. I have a 2020 ram 2500 with gas and payload is 3070. With the diesel you need a one ton to make up for the weight of the drive train.

[LewisB]

Originally Posted by Talleyman66

I was hoping I was wrong about all the info I was gathering. Is there any way I can make my vehicle have more load capacity? (Grasping for straws) Changing springs, adding air bags etc....... Thanks

I don't think anyone has mentioned legality issue, so I'll throw that into the discussion. The stickers on your vehicle will NEVER change regardless of any modifications you make. Even if you remove the stickers, you're stuck with the VIN and those limits. Yes, you could add a lot of after-market modifications that might seem to make your truck more capable. However, if you are ever in an accident (especially one where there is loss of life), it will be easy to determine that your vehicle was significantly over-loaded (based on the factory design specifications for your VIN). Since you are over-loaded, you will likely be found to be responsible for the entire accident and consequences. JMHO

You are being very wise to ask all these questions ahead of time - good job!

[JJaxon]

I was in this very situation about a year ago. I had a 17' Ram 2500 crew 4x4 diesel, great truck, and payload was the same as yours, far below what I needed for 5th wheel rv. So I traded to a 19' Ram 3500, same everything except a long bed. I found after looking at a hundred trucks that every truck has a different payload sticker, even when equipped the same. I found a single rear wheel 3500 diesel with 4200 lbs payload and crossed 3 states to buy it. No regrets. If you want a 5th wheel toy hauler, get the most truck able to pull it safely. 1st thing I asked when I found the equipped truck I wanted was text me a pick of the payload decal. Sales people are puzzled, so I explained it. Most had no clue, and didnt care about my safety, only my wallet.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by JJaxon

I was in this very situation about a year ago. I had a 17' Ram 2500 crew 4x4 diesel, great truck, and payload was the same as yours, far below what I needed for 5th wheel rv. So I traded to a 19' Ram 3500, same everything except a long bed. I found after looking at a hundred trucks that every truck has a different payload sticker, even when equipped the same. I found a single rear wheel 3500 diesel with 4200 lbs payload and crossed 3 states to buy it. No regrets. If you want a 5th wheel toy hauler, get the most truck able to pull it safely. 1st thing I asked when I found the equipped truck I wanted was text me a pick of the payload decal. Sales people are puzzled, so I explained it. Most had no clue, and didnt care about my safety, only my wallet.

I went through the same exercise and bought the current truck in FL vs TX because what I wanted just couldn't be found. Did the same thing on the door sticker AND the trailer sticker. The salesmen on either end didn't know why I would need them and more importantly, care. When explaining to both of them what I was looking at; truck and trailer, they BOTH said "oh, a 3500? You won't have an issue pulling anything." Neither had any in depth understanding of weights or towing but the WALLET is definitely a big factor for them so buyer beware and do your own homework instead of listening to a salesman.

[xrated]

Originally Posted by sourdough

I went through the same exercise and bought the current truck in FL vs TX because what I wanted just couldn't be found. Did the same thing on the door sticker AND the trailer sticker. The salesmen on either end didn't know why I would need them and more importantly, care. When explaining to both of them what I was looking at; truck and trailer, they BOTH said "oh, a 3500? You won't have an issue pulling anything." Neither had any in depth understanding of weights or towing but the WALLET is definitely a big factor for them so buyer beware and do your own homework instead of listening to a salesman.

So true ^^^^ Most of them don't know the difference between Payload and a Payday candy bar. I just sayin'

[MikeRP]

Ok I will be the lone dissenter. Your truck will tow that trailer no question. You will need to put a good set of air bags on the rear. Weigh your truck at a cat scale and stay under your tire ratings. Air Lift makes a nice set with bump stops in case if failure.

Also don’t carry 3000+ lbs of gear. Stay around 14,000 lbs gross loaded and you’ll be fine. If you need to go to 16,000 lbs then you’ll need to look at 295/70R18’s with 4080 lbs capacity each. I use these tires.

No need to put $35,000 in a new truck so the sticker looks better in my humble opinion.

I respect everyone’s opinion here but the 2018 Ram is a super competent vehicle in this load range. With the tow hauler you’ll also be able to manage the pin weight with your toys.

In my opinion, do these simple steps a hook er and go.

No flames please, I won’t respond. I’ve given my opinion much the same as you all. In addition you'll still be able to add a Aux fuel tank and you will need a slider type hitch or an authorized gooseneck. There are some others also.

Peace

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by MikeRP

Ok I will be the lone dissenter. Your truck will tow that trailer no question. You will need to put a good set of air bags on the rear. Weigh your truck at a cat scale and stay under your tire ratings. Air Lift makes a nice set with bump stops in case if failure.

Also don’t carry 3000+ lbs of gear. Stay around 14,000 lbs gross loaded and you’ll be fine. If you need to go to 16,000 lbs then you’ll need to look at 295/70R18’s with 4080 lbs capacity each. I use these tires.

No need to put $35,000 in a new truck so the sticker looks better in my humble opinion.

I respect everyone’s opinion here but the 2018 Ram is a super competent vehicle in this load range. With the tow hauler you’ll also be able to manage the pin weight with your toys.

In my opinion, do these simple steps a hook er and go.

No flames please, I won’t respond. I’ve given my opinion much the same as you all. In addition you'll still be able to add a Aux fuel tank and you will need a slider type hitch or an authorized gooseneck. There are some others also.

Peace

No flaming here and don't care if you respond but your comments require a knowledgeable response. There is a reason you are the lone dissenter.

I had a 3/4 Ram as does the OP. My payload was 3190 vs his 1609. My new trailer has a gvw of just a tad more than his. There was NO way, repeat none, that I was putting this trailer on my 3/4 ton with almost double the payload of his. That's real life and staying safe. Previous comments have been spot on. Adding air bags and new tires don't, and won't, make you safe, legal or strengthen the running gear of the truck.

Load to 14k and he'll be OK? GVW of the trailer is 14k so you recommend loading to gvw or over just like the truck? What about gawr or gcwr - I'm sure they don't matter. Then you say if he wants to load the trailer on up to 16k just get even bigger tires (2k over the trailer gvw)? That advice is wrong on so many levels. You don't buy a new, bigger truck to tow a bigger RV to make "the sticker look better", you buy it to keep you, your family and others on the road safe....and keep you out of jail or from becoming destitute.

[LewisB]

Originally Posted by MikeRP

Ok I will be the lone dissenter. Your truck will tow that trailer no question. You will need to put a good set of air bags on the rear. Weigh your truck at a cat scale and stay under your tire ratings. Air Lift makes a nice set with bump stops in case if failure.

Also don’t carry 3000+ lbs of gear. Stay around 14,000 lbs gross loaded and you’ll be fine. If you need to go to 16,000 lbs then you’ll need to look at 295/70R18’s with 4080 lbs capacity each. I use these tires.

No need to put $35,000 in a new truck so the sticker looks better in my humble opinion.

I respect everyone’s opinion here but the 2018 Ram is a super competent vehicle in this load range. With the tow hauler you’ll also be able to manage the pin weight with your toys.

In my opinion, do these simple steps a hook er and go.

No flames please, I won’t respond. I’ve given my opinion much the same as you all. In addition you'll still be able to add a Aux fuel tank and you will need a slider type hitch or an authorized gooseneck. There are some others also.

Peace

Wow! If you ever wanted an example of misguided forum posting, there it is. The OP (original poster) questioned if it was ok to purchase a trailer with a pin weight that exceed the total payload of his tow vehicle by 400 pounds. This guy's opinion was that was "good to go" and then recommends he also add a slider hitch and auxiliary fuel tank to this already overloaded truck...

...Flames don't work on ignorance.

[travelin texans]

Originally Posted by MikeRP

Ok I will be the lone dissenter. Your truck will tow that trailer no question. You will need to put a good set of air bags on the rear. Weigh your truck at a cat scale and stay under your tire ratings. Air Lift makes a nice set with bump stops in case if failure.

Also don’t carry 3000+ lbs of gear. Stay around 14,000 lbs gross loaded and you’ll be fine. If you need to go to 16,000 lbs then you’ll need to look at 295/70R18’s with 4080 lbs capacity each. I use these tires.

No need to put $35,000 in a new truck so the sticker looks better in my humble opinion.

I respect everyone’s opinion here but the 2018 Ram is a super competent vehicle in this load range. With the tow hauler you’ll also be able to manage the pin weight with your toys.

In my opinion, do these simple steps a hook er and go.

No flames please, I won’t respond. I’ve given my opinion much the same as you all. In addition you'll still be able to add a Aux fuel tank and you will need a slider type hitch or an authorized gooseneck. There are some others also.

Peace

You must be a RV salesman???? Can you say "it'll tow anything on our lot"?
This is the same very POOR, lack of any kind of towing knowledge advice you'll get from most every RV or truck salesman that's only objective is making a sale, PERIOD.
PLEASE! Any & all newbies reading this DO NOT take any part of this advice as useful, it's total BS, its towing usafe & it'll only get you in a bind at some point.
There's nothing you can do to any truck to increase it's weight carrying abilities other than getting MORE truck. Airbags or springs won't do it & adding a 200-300lb hitch with another 50+ gallons of fuel sure ain't gonna help.

[MikeRP]

Well I’m not calling anyone irresponsible, ignorant, or unknowledgeable. I’m none of these. In fact, if he has the money and wishes to expend it, I would certainly recommend a 3500/350. Matter fact I rarely ever recommend buying a 2500. But that doesn’t take away from the his truck’s core capability.

I don’t recommend someone use scarce funding that may be needed for other things for his family.

For less than $2500 his truck will be fine. No truck is static. They charge their capacity as options are added/taken away. Everyone wants to point out lawsuits and the like but in fact lawyers can make cases either way. We all know that but rarely listen to the other side.

These are my opinions, I respect your opinions. Please respect mine.

Peace.

[flybouy]

Originally Posted by MikeRP

Well I’m not calling anyone irresponsible, ignorant, or unknowledgeable. I’m none of these. In fact, if he has the money and wishes to expend it, I would certainly recommend a 3500/350. Matter fact I rarely ever recommend buying a 2500. But that doesn’t take away from the his truck’s core capability.

I don’t recommend someone use scarce funding that may be needed for other things for his family.

For less than $2500 his truck will be fine. No truck is static. They charge their capacity as options are added/taken away. Everyone wants to point out lawsuits and the like but in fact lawyers can make cases either way. We all know that but rarely listen to the other side.

These are my opinions, I respect your opinions. Please respect mine.

Peace.

It's OK to opine but facts are facts. The FACT is his truck will be overloaded and your opinion on adding larger tires and yet overloading it further is FACTUALLY incorrect and therefore inconsistent with the undisputed facts. You may disagree with those facts but they do remain the reality. To recommend otherwise in my opinion is irresponsible.

[MikeRP]

Also we often forget safety.

Assured clear distance. Practicing driving the Coach even when it’s not hooked up.

Speed limits. 65 - 67 are my limits.

Proper maintenance in tires, hitch truck etc.

Driving while sleepy.

Stopping to take frequent walks.

Planning the route.

Weather emergencies.

Tire pressure temperature monitoring. Tire age etc.

I’m sure we can all think of more.

Any of these are as important as a properly setup truck. GVWR does not mean the truck can’t be setup properly. My 2018 3500 with a 3825 lb payload is no more capable than his truck properly setup. Once we grapple with that 10,000lbs is an artificial GVWR, we can start to grapple with what’s really important to be truly safe in my opinion.

Peace

[flybouy]

" that 10,000lbs is an artificial GVWR, " Misinformation yet again. It's not artificial, it's a limitation provided by the manufacturer in accordance with a Federal law that states it must be displayed on the vehicle. I don't understand how you can discredit that. When you start certifying vehicles then you can claim what you like.

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by MikeRP

Also we often forget safety.

Assured clear distance. Practicing driving the Coach even when it’s not hooked up.

Speed limits. 65 - 67 are my limits.

Proper maintenance in tires, hitch truck etc.

Driving while sleepy.

Stopping to take frequent walks.

Planning the route.

Weather emergencies.

Tire pressure temperature monitoring. Tire age etc.

I’m sure we can all think of more.

Any of these are as important as a properly setup truck. GVWR does not mean the truck can’t be setup properly. My 2018 3500 with a 3825 lb payload is no more capable than his truck properly setup. Once we grapple with that 10,000lbs is an artificial GVWR, we can start to grapple with what’s really important to be truly safe in my opinion.

Peace

I'm thinking you don't get it. There ARE differences between the 2500 and 3500 beyond the "sticker". RAWR is the beginning then suspension and drivetrain. I know there is a small group of folks that think a "truck" is a "truck" and they're all the same....just add an air bag, bigger tires etc. That is just factually and technically wrong. It may be your opinion but it is beyond irresponsible to advocate something like that to someone unknowledgeable looking for good, sound advice - it is not.

[xrated]

Originally Posted by MikeRP

Ok I will be the lone dissenter. Your truck will tow that trailer no question. You will need to put a good set of air bags on the rear. Weigh your truck at a cat scale and stay under your tire ratings. Air Lift makes a nice set with bump stops in case if failure.

Also don’t carry 3000+ lbs of gear. Stay around 14,000 lbs gross loaded and you’ll be fine. If you need to go to 16,000 lbs then you’ll need to look at 295/70R18’s with 4080 lbs capacity each. I use these tires.

No need to put $35,000 in a new truck so the sticker looks better in my humble opinion.

I respect everyone’s opinion here but the 2018 Ram is a super competent vehicle in this load range. With the tow hauler you’ll also be able to manage the pin weight with your toys.

In my opinion, do these simple steps a hook er and go.

No flames please, I won’t respond. I’ve given my opinion much the same as you all. In addition you'll still be able to add a Aux fuel tank and you will need a slider type hitch or an authorized gooseneck. There are some others also.

Peace

You are either trolling.....or simply do not have a clue! I'm not sure which, but as some of the others above my post have pointed out your bad or misinformed or irresponsible information, I'll just let it go with what they have already written. WOW!

[wiredgeorge]

Mike sat on the shore with his fishing poll and shiny lure and cast into the lake. He pulled out quite a number of guppies! Mike, you can't be serious?

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by wiredgeorge

Mike sat on the shore with his fishing poll and shiny lure and cast into the lake. He pulled out quite a number of guppies! Mike, you can't be serious?

Not particularly guppies, just folks that recognize things for what they are but can't let irrational remarks go unchallenged when we have so many new and novice RV owners that don't know different.