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Old 08-31-2020, 09:00 AM   #1
Brianb84
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Going bigger !

Just went to a bigger truck, looking into a bigger camper and looking for advice from the pros.
I have a 2017 Ford F250 Lariat Crew Cab Diesel, not a dually.
We are getting a 2020 Raptor 356.
Would air bags help with the squatting of the truck? smoother ride? safer?
How do I determine if this combination is legal by the DOT?
I appreciate it.
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Old 08-31-2020, 09:28 AM   #2
jsb5717
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First, Welcome aboard! You've come to the right place to find experienced, knowledgeable answers.

Your truck will easily pull that trailer. However, the real issue is the truck's payload. There is a yellow sticker inside the driver's side door that will tell you the maximum load weight - you can post a pic of it if you like.

I'm not sure what trailer you're talking about. You said Raptor so I assume Toy Hauler but the number you gave doesn't work. If it's a 5er you would need to figure 20% of the trailer's GVWR as a minimum for your pin weight (15% for a TT). Add to that number total occupants and gear. Is your total weight higher or lower than your trucks stated payload? That's how to decide what you can legally tow.
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Old 08-31-2020, 09:44 AM   #3
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Welcome Brian, not sure which Raptor your looking at. The smallest Raptor floor plan I can find is a 351. These are big toy haulers. 13k dry weight and 3,000 lbs on the pin. I just don't know of any 3/4 ton trucks with a payload that would allow for 3k+ pin weights.
Are you looking at something smaller??
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Old 08-31-2020, 09:56 AM   #4
Brianb84
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Typo, Actually buying the Raptor 356
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Old 08-31-2020, 10:00 AM   #5
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Ah, that trailer weighs 17k lbs. Your pin weight would be at least 3400 lbs. Your 3/4 ton truck simply isn't enough truck to pull it safely. You would need a minimum of a 1 ton and likely a dually.

Added: Fully loaded with people, gear, etc. you will have a total weight requirement of at least 4000lbs. You will likely be 1200-1500 lbs (or more) over the payload of that truck.
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Old 08-31-2020, 10:05 AM   #6
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A raptor 356 is simply too much trailer for your truck. Air bags may help the squat, but they won’t increase your payload capacity as written in the certification label.
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Old 08-31-2020, 10:14 AM   #7
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Way too much weight for any 3/4 ton truck.
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Old 08-31-2020, 10:51 AM   #8
Brianb84
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They posted the hitch weight at 3,175lbs.
Is that based on the Dry weight or the GVWR ?
I am assuming the GVWR.
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Old 08-31-2020, 11:01 AM   #9
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They posted the hitch weight at 3,175lbs.
Is that based on the Dry weight or the GVWR ?
I am assuming the GVWR.

The hitch/pin weight on the website is "dry". It is a 17k lb. trailer so figure about 20% of gvw for pin weight = 3400. I think that is probably irrelevant anyway. What is the payload of your truck? A 17 F250 diesel Lariat CC.....23-2500lbs.?? A no go from the git go IMO.

https://www.keystonerv.com/toy-haule...56-toy-hauler/
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Old 08-31-2020, 11:15 AM   #10
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2,137lbs according to the stick inside of the drivers door. I don't think I have seen a fifth wheel toy hauler below 2800 on the hitch weight.
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Old 08-31-2020, 11:18 AM   #11
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Brian, it is suggested in dozens of places on this and other RV sites to BUY THE RV FIRST, THE TV SECOND. All of the posters above are exactly correct, with jsb being the most pointed.
The specs on that RV are GVWR, 17,000 lbs., Hitch Weight, 3,175 lbs. That hitch weight is dead empty as shipped from the factory. when you have your goodies loaded things go from bad to worse. Your F250 ain't even close, sorry.
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Old 08-31-2020, 11:48 AM   #12
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2,137lbs according to the stick inside of the drivers door. I don't think I have seen a fifth wheel toy hauler below 2800 on the hitch weight.
You're already ahead of the game simply by asking these questions now rather than after you've bought yourself a safety hazard. Good on you.

Now that you know that you will be around 1 full ton over the capacity of your current truck you'll have some hard decisions to make about a different, much lighter 5er or a different truck. Please keep us informed on your journey.

More questions? Just ask. Someone here will have the answer.
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Old 08-31-2020, 11:54 AM   #13
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We have pretty much been living in a campground here in VA for the last 3 months. I am surprised at the number of people I see pulling very large toy haulers with 3/4 ton trucks. I appreciate everyone's feedback.
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Old 08-31-2020, 12:08 PM   #14
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2,137lbs according to the stick inside of the drivers door. I don't think I have seen a fifth wheel toy hauler below 2800 on the hitch weight.

Brian, you will over your payload if you buy anything other than the smallest half-ton towable fifth wheel. If you need a toy hauler and don't want to spend the money on a new truck, perhaps look at the Springdale and Hideout lines; both of which have bumper pull toy haulers your truck would be comfortable with. There is only about half as much weight on your truck with a bumper pull compared to a fifth wheel so payload isn't as critical. There may be other bumper pull toy haulers that fit the bill as well.
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Old 08-31-2020, 01:39 PM   #15
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We have pretty much been living in a campground here in VA for the last 3 months. I am surprised at the number of people I see pulling very large toy haulers with 3/4 ton trucks. I appreciate everyone's feedback.
I'm surprised too. Those smart enough to ask and calculate (like yourself) will come out ahead in the end. Looking at the Raptor 356 pictures it shows a 3 axle FW. Personally I think as a rule, 6 wheels in the back should equal 6 wheels in the front (dually) as a minimum, but I have seen that violated as well.
As mentioned good for you asking and listening. I had the same "upgrade dilemma" but already had purchased the trailer, so the decision was easy for me,got a bigger truck. Good luck.
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Old 08-31-2020, 02:10 PM   #16
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... I am surprised at the number of people I see pulling very large toy haulers with 3/4 ton trucks. I appreciate everyone's feedback.

Yep, and we are all forced to share the roads with those folks who are either ignorant of the danger they put themselves and the rest of us in, or are too arrogant and foolish and think that math works differently for them.

I'm glad you're paying attention.
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Old 08-31-2020, 02:46 PM   #17
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For that rv a diesel dually would be minimum.
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Old 08-31-2020, 03:09 PM   #18
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For that rv a diesel dually would be minimum.
Got that right!! And I’m leaning towards a 2 ton.
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Old 09-01-2020, 04:58 AM   #19
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FWIW, I wouldnt pull 17K with my 1 ton, its a SRW. I honestly feel around that weight a dually would be a smart investment.
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Old 09-03-2020, 06:29 AM   #20
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I have a Raptor 356 and pull with a 17 Ram SRW long bed diesel. Cargo capacity from the door sticker 4207#. I BARELY have enough truck and that's only because I'm no where near GVW. I also have all the crap in the garage and that includes the case of water. Only 1/3 tank fresh water and 0 waste. I do have an aux fuel tank that I can only fuel to 1/2 capacity. Can you pull it, yes since you have the same engine as I do. Can you stop it, MAYBE. Will you be overloaded in available cargo capacity, rear axle rating and probably tire ratings, absolutely.

EDIT adding. I have made a few trips to the scales, truck bare with fuel and me only, trailer empty the day I came home from the dealer, (overweight on rear axle 200#) and on my current trip "loaded for bear" well small bear. With everything loaded, full fridge, motorcycle and all dear, tools, extra supplies in the garage I'm still over the rear axle 200# so that means a 200# or 30 gallons of diesel reduction. I'm still good for the tire weight ratings but I don't have 20" tires either. Course of the next couple weeks I'll lighten the fridge some, it's really full now.
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