Actual payload of my '13 f-250

[LittleJoe]

DOT will care only that you are not over any axle GAWR and not over max tire carrying capacity.

[Javi]

Originally Posted by LittleJoe

DOT will care only that you are not over any axle GAWR and not over max tire carrying capacity.

Yeah, pretty much

[bpurvis]

on my 13' f250 diesel , the drive axle weighed today at 3460 lbs, so i can put another 2640 lbs to reach my max GAWR 6100 lbs. The 5th wheel im looking to buy has a dry hitch wt of 1860 lbs.....the salesman tells me i have plenty of truck, but im sure he just wants his comm

[Javi]

Originally Posted by bpurvis

on my 13' f250 diesel , the drive axle weighed today at 3460 lbs, so i can put another 2640 lbs to reach my max GAWR 6100 lbs. The 5th wheel im looking to buy has a dry hitch wt of 1860 lbs.....the salesman tells me i have plenty of truck, but im sure he just wants his comm

Sounds like you got a bunch of stuff in the bed

[bpurvis]

the truck is a month old, nothing was in the bed? is there a certain way it needs to be centered on the CAT scale?

[Javi]

Originally Posted by bpurvis

the truck is a month old, nothing was in the bed? is there a certain way it needs to be centered on the CAT scale?

What was the front axle weight

[bpurvis]

the steer axle was 5120 lbs, drive 3460, total 8580 lbs. had 3/4 tank full of diesel and wife plus the 2 kids

below the 5th wheel im looking at

Unloaded Vehicle Weight 9,925 pounds
Dry Hitch Weight 1,860 pounds

http://www.wagnersrv.com/newinventory.php?s=i&item=3371

[SteveC7010]

Originally Posted by bpurvis

the steer axle was 5120 lbs, drive 3460, total 8580 lbs. had 3/4 tank full of diesel and wife plus the 2 kids

Can you tell us more about your truck? In particular: wheel base, box length, 2x4 or 4x4, trim level, special tires or rims, 10K# GVWR option, fuel tank size. We can look at Ford's specs and see the differences.

I just ran through some numbers on my truck for this conversation and I don't think yours are out of line.

What worries me a bit is the 1,800# quoted tongue weight that you mentioned in your first post. Keystone's specs for the '13 Laredo 302BH are 10,105# dry, 2,395 capacity (which equals a GVWR of 12,500#), and a pin weight of 1,830#. Apparently you are looking at a used unit? The problem is that factory spec for pin weight presumes an empty trailer. We all know that people carry stuff and the bigger the trailer, the more stuff we carry. And the more stuff we carry, the heavier the trailer and the pin weight. So it's easily conceivable that you'd have an actual pin of 2,000# or more. That is really eating into the 2,600# or so that you think you have available on the rear axle.

Ford rates the F250 at 16K# plus for fifth wheel towing capacity so you're in good shape there. In round numbers, you are at least 25% under the max. That's a good place to be.

Given the reported robustness of the current Super Duties, I think you're going to be OK, but the pin weight needs to be watched carefully. If you scale your rig fully loaded and find the pin weight is significantly heavier than 2,000#, you may want to try moving some gear around in the trailer to see if you can adjust the pin weight down a bit. As I mentioned in my earlier post, you'll want to air up the rear tires to 80 PSI (or whatever the max is for your tires) when towing to achieve max capacity. Air bags might also be a consideration. They won't increase your payload capacity, but they will level up the rear of the truck and give a more comfortable ride.

[SAD]

Dang. Y'all's f250s weigh more than my quad cab, long bed, 4x4 dually...

[bpurvis]

ok, its a month old 2013 4dr crew cab, 4x4 lariat, 6-3/4 bed. factory rims & tires (chrome clad 20" rims) ...The door does show 10K# GVWR. I am looking at a new Laredo, but the place I'm looking to buy it from did not have the specs on their web site (i just found that link and assumed it was the same)... i haven't installed a hitch yet either?

that pin weight is throwing me for a loop, i just sold my 06 bumper pull and don't want to make a mistake on my next purchase. We are planning a trip in July to go from Houston to Tenn. for a few weeks, and would prefer to get a 5th wheel (in my mind, they seem more stable to tow)

OHH and most important....the wife likes the floor plan and look of 302BH

[bpurvis]

i did ask the salesman if i can text drive it before i buy, i could tell he didn't like the idea, but seem to be willing to do so. (i don't think he will let me take it to the nearest cat scale)

[labs4life]

My truck is also CC short bed 4x4 lariat. Has 6 3/4 bed. Weighed 7900 and change. Mine is cat scale weight. Actual is back in this thread.

[bpurvis]

i will re weigh it tomorrow and see if i get the same reading?

[Javi]

Originally Posted by bpurvis

i will re weigh it tomorrow and see if i get the same reading?

That's 580 more than my 172" with two 300+ adults, a full toolbox in the bed and a full 37 gallons of fuel. It weighed 7980, it is an XL with power door locks and windows.
I know the extra drive axle adds some weight but thats a bunch of difference

[labs4life]

Steer axle weight rating is 5200 on mine. You are only 80 pounds away now.

[bpurvis]

Originally Posted by labs4life

Steer axle weight rating is 5200 on mine. You are only 80 pounds away now.

yep, its the same for mine... i going to go to two diff CAT scales today, and will see how close they are?

[BlindGuyNAR]

Originally Posted by Javi

Indeed, the limiting factor for the '12 & '13 F-250 is the tires... My '12 172" WB has a stickered payload of 2629 lbs... however... running it across a scale full of fuel and ready to travel with DW et la... I have only 2081lbs to payload... now looking at the axle ratings and tire ratings... I have slightly under 3K left on the rear and about 700 left on the front...

Tires are rated at 3160 each... and rear axle is rated for 6100, although the same axle in the 350 is rated for more...

Agree, but it's more than tires. You have to consider the entire package.

Part#'s are the same for axle shafts and axle housing here are part#'s

The housing is part # BC3Z*4010*D the driver axle is BC3Z*4234*C and the passenger is BC3Z*4234*D look them up. They are the same between 250 and 350.

So the rawr rating of 6100 on an f250 vs. 7280 on f350 isn't axle strength. In fact sterling rates the axle at around 9300 lbs..

In the case the f250 it is springs, lift blocks, and tires that to bring it down to 6100 and reduce its payload.

First tires:
I wonder if anyone reads the white sticker in the door? Does anyone catch the words "with tires rims psi cold" the last word on each line.

A previous f250 I owned said.
6100lb WITH
LT275/65R-20E TIRES
20x8.0J RIMS
65 PSI COLD

Pay special attention to the word "with". That means if that setup changes the rating changes.

Anyway I read this as Its rated at 6100lb's "with" those tires and those rims at that psi.

In fact those tires have a max rating of 3750 per tire at 80psi which is the psi on an f350 door tag. Lets do the math. 3750 x 2 = 7500 max load.

Well that's pretty close to 7280 for the f350's axle rating so lets see what else it can tell us about that same tire. 3750 x 2 = 7500 / 80 = 93.75 lbs of load per psi.

Now lets use that and the 65 psi rating for the f250. 93.75 x 65 = 6093.75. I think we just found the 6100 lb load rating of the f250 axle.

Now springs/blocks:
The f350 has an overload spring where the f250 does not. The law states in laymans terms that while hauling your rated load your headlamps can't blind on-coming traffic. If your truck is low in rear and high in front this will occur.

So the extra spring will resist more weight and ride more level. This is even more true since the back of an f350 sits 2 in higher due to 4 in lift blocks rather than 2 in on an f250.

Looking at the specs on the springs you'll see the overload is rated to deflect 465 lbs per spring x 2 = 930 extra load support.

So a combination of this extra 930 lbs extra load capacity, in addition to sitting 2 in higher in the rear, and the tires give the f350 it's higher rating.

If someone were wanting to exceed a f250 rating all aspects would need addressed not just tires to bring it up to an f350 level.

[Javi]

This will blow that pressure/load theory out the window....

Tires ARE the limiting factor... IF you consider that the axle is the same F250/F350 SRW.... But I do find it interesting that the limit is still 6100 lbs even with tires having a much greater load capability... they simply reduce the tire pressure to compensate..

While it may be feasible to swap out the springs and block to match the F350's... it still won't change the little white sticker on the door post... and if one did make the swap or simply add some airbags to level the truck... the axle gearing would come into play as one swapped tires and rims to match the load range needed...

On my truck with 3:31 gears, I would need to go to those 20" tires you mentioned and that would require changing to 3:73's to keep the approximate rpm range as it is now; or 4:10's to add a little punch...

Cheaper to just buy another truck.....

[BlindGuyNAR]

Originally Posted by Javi

This will blow that pressure/load theory out the window....

Tires ARE the limiting factor... IF you consider that the axle is the same F250/F350 SRW.... But I do find it interesting that the limit is still 6100 lbs even with tires having a much greater load capability... they simply reduce the tire pressure to compensate..

While it may be feasible to swap out the springs and block to match the F350's... it still won't change the little white sticker on the door post... and if one did make the swap or simply add some airbags to level the truck... the axle gearing would come into play as one swapped tires and rims to match the load range needed...

On my truck with 3:31 gears, I would need to go to those 20" tires you mentioned and that would require changing to 3:73's to keep the approximate rpm range as it is now; or 4:10's to add a little punch...

Cheaper to just buy another truck.....

I agree with everything you say including the tires limit it. Read my post they are the most limiting followed by blocks and springs.. However my f250 and f350 are both 3.55's gears and have the same wheels and tires so clearly in some cases the differences is just blocks, springs, tire pressures while other trim levels will have more differences.

But not in all cases would it be cheaper considering sales taxes, fees, and other charges.

The little white sticker is a requirement between ford and the government. You aren't bound to it in any legal form.

Think about it. If as you say you put diff tires on the truck the sticker is invalid at that point since size or rating would no longer match sticker. Change gears same deal.

The sticker states GAWR":" 6100lbs "with" (look at the sticker you posted. it actually says "with") that combo ford rates it at a certain load. The ":" is important as it says everything after is an encompassing statement of GAWR.

I read this sticker as Its rated at 6100lb's "with" those tires and those "rims" at that "psi" "cold".

So lift a truck (chg springs) or new tire/rim combo or gears and the sticker no longer applies.

If you agree those things aren't illegal to do to your truck then by definition the sticker on the door can't be legally binding since we just legally invalidated it without a court or a lawyer.

Just my 2 cents for which I owe the bank 3 cents.

[Javi]

As far as I know in Texas the sticker don't matter unless you are hauling commercial, may be that way in Arkansas also... I don't know...

I do know that in my case to change gears buy new tires and wheels, springs and blocks is more expensive than the hit I would take trading the truck in...

I looked at all of that when the DW found her dream 5'er and after considering all the options I decided she should look at other trailers which our truck could haul and after a bit we found a 5'er with the same bells and whistles but not as heavy... so all is good.

Once we get back from our 40th anniversary trip and get the house remodeling out of the way I'll put in the order for a new Cougar 333 MKS...

unless she finds something else before I get the chance...