Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×
 

Go Back   Keystone RV Forums > Keystone Tech Forums > Tow Vehicles
Click Here to Login

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 10-03-2020, 08:33 AM   #1
BeagleMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Key West
Posts: 300
F-350 and F-450

Morning! Need more advice here. Trust factors are higher here than on some other boards for me.

I am about 6 months out in getting a new TW. It will be a new F350 or F450. Most likely a 450. In a dually. What are some of the limitations on these 2 vehicles? I am reading about the following: I may need a CDL to drive a 450--I live in AL, will I need some special insurance? Register it as a commercial vehicle or personal vehicle? Some have said that the insurance is okay, but get killed on tags and registration. Heck, I found out there are cities that do not even allow a F-350 in the cities to be parked for more than 12 hours. HOAs doing the same things. WTH? What exactly are some pitfalls that await me?


AC
__________________
2021 Montana 3763BP / 2019 Ford F-450 Lariat
Husband to the Sweetest Girl in MO
Adventure Seeker/History Buff
Roll Tide Roll
BeagleMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 08:38 AM   #2
chuckster57
Site Team
 
chuckster57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Modesto
Posts: 20,235
as far as I know:

F350 is still in the Light Duty category and 450 is Medium Duty.
F450 has "commercial" tires on 19.5" rims and have a speed rating of 6X MPH.

F450 has a TIGHTER turning radius and ONLY comes in DRW.

I looked into them and decided the insurance, and tags weren't worth the tighter turning radius. YMMV

All of this is based on what I FOUND, And I am not saying that I know EVERYTING about these two models.

My F350 DRW sits on my driveway, but I refuse to live in a HOA and Modesto doesnt have any rules that I know of about duallies being parked on the street for less than 24 hrs.
__________________

2012 Copper Canyon 273FWRET being towed by a 1994 Ford F350 CC,LB,Dually diesel.
Airlift 5000 bags, Prodigy brake control, 5 gauges on the pillar.Used to tow a '97 Jayco 323RKS.

Now an RVIA registered tech. Retired from Law enforcement in 2008 after 25+ yrs.
chuckster57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 08:39 AM   #3
wiredgeorge
Senior Member
 
wiredgeorge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,392
First, your questions are specific to where you live. Call your DMV or local tax office to answer most of these questions unless we have Alabama members who can fill you in. As far as a HOA, gessh, time to move. Not allowing a 1 ton truck to park for more than 12 hours in some cities? Time to move.
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
wiredgeorge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 08:46 AM   #4
BeagleMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Key West
Posts: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiredgeorge View Post
First, your questions are specific to where you live. Call your DMV or local tax office to answer most of these questions unless we have Alabama members who can fill you in. As far as a HOA, gessh, time to move. Not allowing a 1 ton truck to park for more than 12 hours in some cities? Time to move.
Thats just what I found out. I do not live in a HOA or will I ever. I am in my Aussie till I get into my house in a couple/3 months.

Ok, I can call those folks and find out. Thanks.
__________________
2021 Montana 3763BP / 2019 Ford F-450 Lariat
Husband to the Sweetest Girl in MO
Adventure Seeker/History Buff
Roll Tide Roll
BeagleMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 08:52 AM   #5
Javi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
Both are 14K GVWR
The F450 has a tighter turning radius
The F450 has larger brakes
The F350 probably has more payload

Can't speak about Alabama law.
In Texas both cost the same to register, it is based on GVWR
Both are registered as Truck because both are titled with more than 2000 pounds of capacity.
Insurance is the same based on cost, home address and credit history.

I can't speak for other cities and certainly not HOA's but here soccer moms drive duallys.

I could have bought either for the same money but chose the F350 because I had no plans to buy a trailer with more than 16K GVWR to make use of the extra braking of the F450 and the turning radius wasn't important to me.

And the larger tires on the F450 cost a lot more, and are more likely a bit more difficult to find.
__________________
2015 Ford F350 DRW 6.7 Diesel XL
2020 Avalanche 313 RS
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 08:53 AM   #6
BeagleMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Key West
Posts: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckster57 View Post
as far as I know:

F350 is still in the Light Duty category and 450 is Medium Duty.
F450 has "commercial" tires on 19.5" rims and have a speed rating of 6X MPH.

F450 has a TIGHTER turning radius and ONLY comes in DRW.

I looked into them and decided the insurance, and tags weren't worth the tighter turning radius. YMMV

All of this is based on what I FOUND, And I am not saying that I know EVERYTING about these two models.

My F350 DRW sits on my driveway, but I refuse to live in a HOA and Modesto doesnt have any rules that I know of about duallies being parked on the street for less than 24 hrs.
I guess that might be a deal changer. If I do go that route of yours, would the 350 DRW have any problem towing whatever 5er I would end up with? When I built and priced them, I can get a 450 XLT with a lot of Standard equipment, for about $3-$4K more than the optioned up 350 XLT. You think its not worth the hassle?
__________________
2021 Montana 3763BP / 2019 Ford F-450 Lariat
Husband to the Sweetest Girl in MO
Adventure Seeker/History Buff
Roll Tide Roll
BeagleMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:00 AM   #7
wiredgeorge
Senior Member
 
wiredgeorge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javi View Post
Both are 14K GVWR
The F450 has a tighter turning radius
The F450 has larger brakes
The F350 probably has more payload

Can't speak about Alabama law.
In Texas both cost the same to register, it is based on GVWR
Both are registered as Truck because both are titled with more than 2000 pounds of capacity.
Insurance is the same based on cost, home address and credit history.

I can't speak for other cities and certainly not HOA's but here soccer moms drive duallys.

I could have bought either for the same money but chose the F350 because I had no plans to buy a trailer with more than 16K GVWR to make use of the extra braking of the F450 and the turning radius wasn't important to me.

And the larger tires on the F450 cost a lot more, and are more likely a bit more difficult to find.

My county road ends in a sort of cul de sac and I often wish I had an F450 so I didn't have to do a 3 point turn (I think that is what they are called). My F350 has the turning radius of the Queen Mary. Today I bought water softener salt at the True Value in the nearest town and had to wait for a guy to pull out so I could back up (to get tail gate down) as my turning radius wouldn't allow me to back into the space as the parking lot is curbed too high to run over. I am thinking about hiring a jockey to drive for me... lots of pro drivers out there who would probably work for beer?
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
wiredgeorge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:08 AM   #8
Javi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
It's more about where you start the turn than it is about the radius unless you're turning curb to curb.
__________________
2015 Ford F350 DRW 6.7 Diesel XL
2020 Avalanche 313 RS
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:11 AM   #9
wiredgeorge
Senior Member
 
wiredgeorge's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: Mico, TX
Posts: 7,392
Quote:
Originally Posted by Javi View Post
It's more about where you start the turn than it about the radius unless you're turning curb to curb.

I have been driving for 55 plus years and my driving is about where it was when I started at 15. I can ride a motorcycle quite well but cars and trucks, not so much.
__________________
wiredgeorge Mico TX
2006 F350 CC 4WD 6.0L
2002 Keystone Cougar 278
2006 GL1800 Roadsmith Trike
wiredgeorge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:19 AM   #10
Javi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by wiredgeorge View Post
I have been driving for 55 plus years and my driving is about where it was when I started at 15. I can ride a motorcycle quite well but cars and trucks, not so much.
My DW is blessed with that gene as well, she will run the right rear tire over every curb in town. I keep telling her to not turn until half the vehicle is passed the curb.
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:22 AM   #11
BeagleMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Key West
Posts: 300
Another question....Is it imperative that a F450 be in 4x4?
__________________
2021 Montana 3763BP / 2019 Ford F-450 Lariat
Husband to the Sweetest Girl in MO
Adventure Seeker/History Buff
Roll Tide Roll
BeagleMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:29 AM   #12
Javi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeagleMan View Post
Another question....Is it imperative that a F450 be in 4x4?
Until 8 years ago I have owned 4X4 trucks exclusively, then I analyzed how often and why I used 4X4.. I determined that 4X4 usually got me into more trouble than it got me out of..

Now if I lived in the snow belt, I'd still have one.
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:34 AM   #13
chuckster57
Site Team
 
chuckster57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Modesto
Posts: 20,235
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeagleMan View Post
I guess that might be a deal changer. If I do go that route of yours, would the 350 DRW have any problem towing whatever 5er I would end up with? When I built and priced them, I can get a 450 XLT with a lot of Standard equipment, for about $3-$4K more than the optioned up 350 XLT. You think its not worth the hassle?
In MY case it isnt worth it. YOU have to decide what's best for you. Im not buying a bigger/heavier trailer so Im DONE, maybe a newer 1 ton.
__________________

2012 Copper Canyon 273FWRET being towed by a 1994 Ford F350 CC,LB,Dually diesel.
Airlift 5000 bags, Prodigy brake control, 5 gauges on the pillar.Used to tow a '97 Jayco 323RKS.

Now an RVIA registered tech. Retired from Law enforcement in 2008 after 25+ yrs.
chuckster57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:39 AM   #14
BeagleMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Key West
Posts: 300
When building and pricing, would you guys get the 5er hitch prep package? Or just let my 5er dealer do it? They did a heck of a job on my hitch package for my Outback. ANd installed my Brake Controller as well.
__________________
2021 Montana 3763BP / 2019 Ford F-450 Lariat
Husband to the Sweetest Girl in MO
Adventure Seeker/History Buff
Roll Tide Roll
BeagleMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:39 AM   #15
flybouy
Site Team
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Joppa, MD
Posts: 11,714
George I wouldn't make that beer payment to your driver until they return you home.

Javi my wife has the same driving habit but somehow manages to do it to a 4 tire positions. I think it's from bank drive thru but as long as there's no blood on the truck I don't ask anymore. My tire dealer gives me "that look" and I just shrug my shoulders and tell him "what can I say? The little woman likes to use ALL the rubber on the tires."
__________________
Marshall
2012 Laredo 303 TG
2010 F250 LT Super Cab, long bed, 4X4, 6.4 Turbo Diesel
flybouy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:40 AM   #16
chuckster57
Site Team
 
chuckster57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Modesto
Posts: 20,235
If your odering, get the hitch package...That way the RV dealer CANT screw it up.
__________________

2012 Copper Canyon 273FWRET being towed by a 1994 Ford F350 CC,LB,Dually diesel.
Airlift 5000 bags, Prodigy brake control, 5 gauges on the pillar.Used to tow a '97 Jayco 323RKS.

Now an RVIA registered tech. Retired from Law enforcement in 2008 after 25+ yrs.
chuckster57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:42 AM   #17
BeagleMan
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Key West
Posts: 300
Quote:
Originally Posted by chuckster57 View Post
If your odering, get the hitch package...That way the RV dealer CANT screw it up.

__________________
2021 Montana 3763BP / 2019 Ford F-450 Lariat
Husband to the Sweetest Girl in MO
Adventure Seeker/History Buff
Roll Tide Roll
BeagleMan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 09:49 AM   #18
Javi
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Waco, Tx
Posts: 5,456
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeagleMan View Post
When building and pricing, would you guys get the 5er hitch prep package? Or just let my 5er dealer do it? They did a heck of a job on my hitch package for my Outback. ANd installed my Brake Controller as well.
I love the factory Puck system, although I do wish that I'd gotten the turnover ball as well. I got my Reese/Ford hitch in trade from one of my archery students who bought a new truck with the hitch installed and only used the ball.
If I had to buy a hitch it would be the B&W for the Puck system.
Javi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 10:08 AM   #19
JRTJH
Site Team
 
JRTJH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Gaylord
Posts: 26,836
Quote:
Originally Posted by BeagleMan View Post
When building and pricing, would you guys get the 5er hitch prep package? Or just let my 5er dealer do it? They did a heck of a job on my hitch package for my Outback. ANd installed my Brake Controller as well.
First, the OEM puck system is standard equipment on the F450, optional on the F350.

There is a SIGNIFICANT difference between the OEM/Aftermarket fifth wheel puck system. The OEM system is a "one piece under-bed unit" and is typically not available once the truck leaves the assembly line. The reason is: The bed has to be removed to install the one piece unit.

The Aftermarket unit is a 2 piece system and can be installed without removing the truck bed...

Problem: The OEM puck system is rated at 18,000 (fifth wheel) and 27,500 pounds (gooseneck) which is 2500 pounds higher than the maximum trailer weight than the "similar 2 piece" Aftermarket system. The reason: Two pieces don't offer the same "rigidity" attained by the single piece system which ties BOTH truck frame rails together as a "single unit".

If you're ordering a "new truck" to specifically tow a fifth wheel, I'd recommend ordering it with the OEM puck system, NOT the Aftermarket system.
__________________
John



2015 F250 6.7l 4x4
2014 Cougar X Lite 27RKS
JRTJH is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2020, 10:15 AM   #20
chuckster57
Site Team
 
chuckster57's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Location: Modesto
Posts: 20,235
Leave it to someone that has nothing better to do than sit at a screen and dig into the depths of stuff

I wouldn't have known the difference if you didn't tell me..I guess I can sleep better now

At the risk of offending someone;

THIS POST IS SARCASTIC!!!
__________________

2012 Copper Canyon 273FWRET being towed by a 1994 Ford F350 CC,LB,Dually diesel.
Airlift 5000 bags, Prodigy brake control, 5 gauges on the pillar.Used to tow a '97 Jayco 323RKS.

Now an RVIA registered tech. Retired from Law enforcement in 2008 after 25+ yrs.
chuckster57 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3
Disclaimer:

This website is not affiliated with or endorsed by the Keystone RV Company or any of its affiliates in any way. Keystone RV® is a registered trademark of the Keystone RV Company.


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 06:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.