Chinese Tire "Bombs" - Fact or Fiction?

[KenBob]

Originally Posted by michol02

Had a blowout on rear RV tire today, so I'm going to Walmart in the morning to try to find a replacement(on vacation miles away from home). I'm wondering if I can use E rated truck tires instead of trailer tires.

IF the load capacity is equal to or more than the tire being replaced, you should be fine. (Check the wheel for weight capacity) Also, You may be wise to purchase two tires as the new tires may have the same size designatiuon on the side, the standing height or diameter may be different. If they are different, obviously put them on the same axle. JMHO

[kenn209]

Originally Posted by Festus2

kenn209 -

Just recently, I ran into that same problem ----- "Sorry, we're out of stock but should have some in 5-10 business days". I placed an order on the condition that they would be in by April 4th. "No problem". A day later, Discount Tire phoned and said they were somewhere on board a freighter and might be here in 2 weeks "or so".

I couldn't wait that long so told him to cancel the order and to refund payment. He then told me in would check around and 1 day later phoned me back saying he had located a set of 4 Maxxis and they would be in his shop in 2 days.

If you have a Discount Tire near you, get them to do a search. You may get lucky - worth a try.

Yeah they called a day after I placed the order, He said could be up to 12 weeks to get them in. No stores here, just the website.

[michol02]

Wound up buying Carlisle E rated trailer tires from tire dealer. Probably not the best replacement, but better than the D rated Road Riders I have. Replaced both tires on curb side for now until I get home, then I'm going to replace the other 2. I'm darn lucky all it tore up was the plastic wheelwell trim. I was doing about 70mph passing a slowpoke, and I had just got back into the right lane. Guess they really mean it when they say don't go over 65mph with cheap trailer tires.

[therink]

My buddy bought a set of Carlisle Es last summer and "made in USA" was stamped on them. Check yours out. I heard Carlisle started making STs in the USA.
Steve

[michol02]

Mine are made in China. Still better than what I had before.

[diugo]

I had a failure with one of my OE Towmax STRs yesterday. I had just rotated in the spare, after the other four clocked 4000 miles. I was amazed that the spare was the one that failed, just 3 hours after I verified 65psi. It only lasted 150 miles!

I run Maxxis tires on my mountain bike. So clearly, Maxxis knows how to make tires. Prior to acquiring my 5er, I had never heard of Power King before. So I'll be making the switch to Maxxis M8008s in ST LRD.

I had originally planned to buy just one Maxxis right now, and replace the other four two years from now. But a previous post suggested it may be problematic to mix different manufacturers on the same axle, so I'm now thinking maybe two.

I just checked Summit Racing and they can supposedly deliver in 14 days at $147 each, with free shipping and no sales tax. It'll cost another $16 each to get them mounted and balanced.

[dave-g]

The problem with a lot of product coming out of china is quality control. we have all heard story's of lead paint on kids toys. The dot is a standard- not a testing facility- there is no spot checking.

Trailer manufactures buy on price ( so do most people till something goes wrong) so tires from china are a way of life.

When towing- I check pressure at start, every stop or fuel stop. I also feel the tires for heat. a quick walk around could save a big problem.

I have a 5 year old enclosed trailer- and when I went to use it this year- I found the tire on the sunny side- dry rotted and cracked. About 2500 miles on the tire- pressure was always good. ( still had 35psi in it). I'm now going to buy tire covers for the toy hauler.

[diugo]

Finally got my pair of Maxxis replacements two weeks after I ordered them from autoplicity.com. However, I'm still comfortable running the 3 y/o Power Kings as the other pair. Why?

Well, since my failure, I've had nearly three weeks to think about it. First and foremost, I likely drove many miles while the tire was slowly disintegrating. During this time, the other "China bomb" on that side of the trailer dutifully supported a double load, at the full 65 mph rating, in hot weather. Ya just have to give credit where credit is due---imagine if it had failed as well.

Second, what was different about the failed tire from the three others? Turns out, several things:

1. Its only "service" had been that of spare. Maybe a nonrotating tire is more brittle and thus more susceptible to bumps in the road?

2. It was improperly mounted on the tire rack by Keystone. The tire was bolted so tightly against the rack's vertical support, that it had a very noticeable curved indentation after I removed it. (It also broke a weld in the rack.) The indentation seemed to go away after a few days, so I thought nothing more of it. But perhaps it had stretched internal fibers and belts inside, weakening the whole tire structure.

3. It got more UV than the others. During Yuma winters I always park south, with the spare facing the sun all day long. After a couple of years I had to replace the original Keystone cover, because it had gotten badly sun damaged. I noticed that when I replaced it, that a lot of tire was exposed on the back side---the original cover was much smaller than the new one. UV could have reflected off the back of the shiny trailer and made one side of the tire more brittle than the other.

4. The spare tire was originally mounted on a steel rim, but I swapped it with one on an alloy rim when I rotated it in. In the process, a new 65psi "low pressure" valve was installed. Operating pressure likely exceeded 65psi, so the valve may have slowly leaked, ultimately resulting in a progressive failure two hours into the drive.

My trailer only weighs 9100lb fully loaded, and 1900 of that is borne by the hitch, so each tire is only supporting 1800lb on average---yet they are inflated to the full 65psi / 2540lb LRD sidewall pressure, per "industry" recommendation. IMHO they are grossly overinflated by over 40%. I will be personally discussing this issue with RVSEF next month when they weigh my individual wheels in Gillette, Wyoming.

[Festus2]

Originally Posted by diugo

My trailer only weighs 9100lb fully loaded, and 1900 of that is borne by the hitch, so each tire is only supporting 1800lb on average---yet they are inflated to the full 65psi / 2540lb LRD sidewall pressure, per "industry" recommendation. IMHO they are grossly overinflated by over 40%. I will be personally discussing this issue with RVSEF next month when they weigh my individual wheels in Gillette, Wyoming.

diugo -

Interesting read- thank you. I am a bit puzzled about your feeling that the "industry recommendation" of 65psi is suspect and is "grossly over inflated by over 40%". I think it is common knowledge and a widely-accepted fact that one of the biggest causes of tire failure is under inflation - quite the contrary to what you are suggesting.

If we were to reduce the recommended cold pressure of 65 psi by 40% that would result in a pressure of approximately 40psi which would seem to be grossly under inflated. Wouldn't this very low pressure be a major contributing factor in possible tire failure?

I think that most of us are quite diligent about checking our RV tires for pressure, heat and the wheels for proper torque. If I were to find that one of my tires was 40% under inflated, the first thing I would do is to put air into it and bring it up to the recommended pressure..... 65psi, 80psi or whatever is stamped on the tire.

[Bluewater]

I have over 25000 miles on my OEM China Bombs that came on my 2011 5er with no problems so far but this summer is new tire time. I agree it's checking air pressure that makes the big differance.

[diugo]

Hi Festus,

Don't get me wrong! I firmly believe the general 65psi industry recommendation is a sound one in the vast majority of cases. By running at the full sidewall pressure, the tire has less opportunity to flex sideways. It is for that reason alone that I am still currently running 65psi on all four of my tires.

However, even RVSEF has backed away from this, saying "unless this causes a severe over-inflation situation (20psi+), often referred to as the ‘basketball effect’. If this is your situation allow a 10 – 15psi safety margin above the minimum required inflation pressure." (http://rvsafety.com/2011/09/tire-loa...lation-ratings)

I have yet to do the individual wheel weighings. The wheels average 1800lb each---suggesting the "correct" pressure is just 37psi---but that doesn't mean it can't be 1700+1900 or even 1600+2000 per axle, and it's the highest number that counts when setting the same pressure for both tires.

But I could well be leaving Gillette with 60, 55, or even 52psi in my particular rare case where the tires are actually a bit overspec'd with regard to the weight of the trailer.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by diugo

Hi Festus,

Don't get me wrong! I firmly believe the general 65psi industry recommendation is a sound one in the vast majority of cases. By running at the full sidewall pressure, the tire has less opportunity to flex sideways. It is for that reason alone that I am still currently running 65psi on all four of my tires.

However, even RVSEF has backed away from this, saying "unless this causes a severe over-inflation situation (20psi+), often referred to as the ‘basketball effect’. If this is your situation allow a 10 – 15psi safety margin above the minimum required inflation pressure." (http://rvsafety.com/2011/09/tire-loa...lation-ratings)

I have yet to do the individual wheel weighings. The wheels average 1800lb each---suggesting the "correct" pressure is just 37psi---but that doesn't mean it can't be 1700+1900 or even 1600+2000 per axle, and it's the highest number that counts when setting the same pressure for both tires.

But I could well be leaving Gillette with 60, 55, or even 52psi in my particular rare case where the tires are actually a bit overspec'd with regard to the weight of the trailer.

I wouldn't say that "even RVSEF has backed away" the first sentence that you omitted in your quote from the RVSEF website indicates that the industry experts still recommend maximum inflation pressure "UNLESS" and then your quote.....

The actual complete quote is:

"Note: Towable – Travel Trailer/ 5th Wheel owners Due to the sever use conditions experienced by tires when axles are very close together – tire industry experts recommend maximum (sidewall) inflation pressure for towable tires unless this causes a sever over-inflation situation (20psi+), often referred to as the ‘basketball effect’. If this is your situation allow a 10 – 15psi safety margin above the minimum required inflation pressure."

With most of us who use 14 or 15 inch tires, running at 50PSI (LRC) or 65PSI (LRD) will never encounter a 20+ PSI overinflation condition. And inflating to 10-15PSI above the recommended pressure would put us at "max" PSI anyway. Keep in mind that the manufacturers also recommend increasing the pressure 10PSI (above the maximum recommended pressure) if plans include travel at speeds above the 65MPH recommendation. So now, we're looking at 20-25PSI increase over "actual load recommended inflation pressure" which is the maximum recommended inflation pressure listed on the sidewall.

For LRE tires, this "could become" a consideration, but even then, it would probably be best to maintain maximum inflation to offset the heat buildup and the severe conditions that ST tires encounter.

[diugo]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

I wouldn't say that "even RVSEF has backed away"

I was entirely correct in my post. I didn't include RVSEF's "actual complete quote" because I unequivocally stated the exact same thing in my own first paragraph.

Your personal recommendation that 50/65/80psi for LRC/D/E "would probably be best" is not universally valid. I am sorry, but the fact that my particular tires are currently 28psi over the spec on the published load table is a valid cause for concern, and RVSEF is now recognizing that---even if you don't.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by diugo

I was entirely correct in my post. I didn't include RVSEF's "actual complete quote" because I unequivocally stated the exact same thing in my own first paragraph.

Your personal recommendation that 50/65/80psi for LRC/D/E "would probably be best" is not universally valid. I am sorry, but the fact that my particular tires are currently 28psi over the spec on the published load table is a valid cause for concern, and RVSEF is now recognizing that---even if you don't.

You have all the information you need to make the choices that affect your specific RV/tire combination. Your concerns are valid for your application. However, the information you posted, if viewed by a "novice" who has load range C or D tires on his RV, should he follow your "advice" would be towing with grossly underinflated tires and endangering himself and those with him.

My response was to include the ENTIRE quote (for clarification), not just the part that was applicable to your situation. The reason for adding the rest of the information was to help clarify your post for those with LR C/D tires so someone without your vast experience would not underinflate his tires thinking that it was the appropriate thing to do.

[hankpage]

Originally Posted by diugo

I was entirely correct in my post. I didn't include RVSEF's "actual complete quote" because I unequivocally stated the exact same thing in my own first paragraph.

Your personal recommendation that 50/65/80psi for LRC/D/E "would probably be best" is not universally valid. I am sorry, but the fact that my particular tires are currently 28psi over the spec on the published load table is a valid cause for concern, and RVSEF is now recognizing that---even if you don't.

If you are not weighing each tire separately under different conditions you can not inflate your tires correctly using your theory. Crown of road and bumps will shift weight from wheel to wheel. A 2" bump on one side will transfer all the weight from one wheel to the other overloading it. If your tires are capable of carrying greater loads at reduced heat and rolling resistance why not take advantage of it???? If you only need 10 gallons of fuel to make a trip, is that all you put in the tank????? I hope your system works well for you but I would be very concerned with heat build up at highway speeds. JM2¢, Hank

[diugo]

JRTJH, now I see your point. I should have used the complete quote for emphasis, if nothing else.

Hank, there is more to overinflation than the benefits of increased load, reduced heat, and reduced rolling resistance. Reduced braking, reduced traction, and increased/uneven tread wear, to name a few.

I wasn't suggesting that I run my trailer tires at just 37psi---they would then be highly vulnerable to the variable load conditions you mentioned. The guiding benchmark that seems to be emerging from all the posts from all the sites on the subject seems to be "15-20%"---add 15-20% to the static load of the higher loaded tire on the axle, then set both tires to that one pressure.

This way, all reasonably foreseeable load conditions are handled, with fewer of the negatives of overinflation.

[diugo]

Well, I went for a long walk and when I got back, decided to put my money where my mouth was---I reduced the pressure on the two new Maxxis ST225/75R15Ds to 55psi.

I based this on the aggregate weight on the four tires, with the reasonable assumption that the right side of the 5er is 500lb heavier than the left: 7220/4 = 1805 + (500/4=125) = 1930 plus 18% = 2280lb --> 55psi by my reckoning.

We'll see how it handles in a couple of weeks. With my new TPMS I'll be able to see if those tires run noticeably hotter than the 65psi Power Kings on the front axle.

[jsmith948]

Originally Posted by diugo

Well, I went for a long walk and when I got back, decided to put my money where my mouth was---I reduced the pressure on the two new Maxxis ST225/75R15Ds to 55psi.

I based this on the aggregate weight on the four tires, with the reasonable assumption that the right side of the 5er is 500lb heavier than the left: 7220/4 = 1805 + (500/4=125) = 1930 plus 18% = 2280lb --> 55psi by my reckoning.

We'll see how it handles in a couple of weeks. With my new TPMS I'll be able to see if those tires run noticeably hotter than the 65psi Power Kings on the front axle.

Wow! Seems to be a note of contention in this thread! The way I see it, they're your tires and it's your money! I just hope that, if you're wrong, we aren't sharing the road the day YOUR tire explodes into my lane - good luck

[davidjsimons]

As a rookie, I have followed the advice of the members of this group with many more miles of experience. I bought a TPMS, have meticulously maintained my pressures at 65 psi cold, and my observation are as such:

Over 5,000 miles on a set of factory installed Tow Max tires.
Good even tread wear, tread depth is still in excellent condition.
I seem to only gain about eight or nine pounds of pressure at 65-70 mph.
So far tire temperatures have only ran several degrees cooler than the ambient air temperature.

The advice has been good so far. Thank you!



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[ftwildernessguy]

I have installed a TST monitor on my trailer and tow vehicle. I also keep my speed at around 50-55 mph. In addition, I use an infrared thermometer to check wheel temps at all rest stops. Tires are at 65 psi at the start of every trip. I have seen many rv's with tire failure on the side of the highway, and often these were on trailers that flew by me earlier, and while I can't say for sure, they sure did look like they were overloaded judging by the amount of stuff on the roof and rear bumper.