Poor Planning

[HeadHam]

Just a general observation on the 2023 Cougar 29RLI. With a little bit of planning, if they had moved the kitchen island back by just 1", you could open the refrigerator door with the slide in.

[jxnbbl]

Yup, that is one of the things we do when we 'tour' a trailer please close all the slides and we then give it a rating on how functional it is at a 'rest stop'.

[peanut]

Originally Posted by HeadHam

Just a general observation on the 2023 Cougar 29RLI. With a little bit of planning, if they had moved the kitchen island back by just 1", you could open the refrigerator door with the slide in.

If it is just one inch it seems that it would be an easy DIY mod. All RV islands I have ever seen sit on top of the floor so it's just a matter of finding all of the screws holding it in, removing them, repositioning, and re-screwing. Just be sure there is still enough room on the other side - - the dinette, theater seat side.

Should be enough play in the plumbing to accommodate one inch. On my last trailer, when I rebuilt the bath and kitchen countertops there was plenty of slop to move things around a little bit. At worst, maybe a little abs drain work.

[PolarisCobra]

I would seriously consider trimming the counter to get clearance. Might be easier than you think to get a neat enough job, and be less disruptive.

Or just open the slide an inch to get clearance when you need it and be done with it.

[Cheesehead4Life]

Just keep in mind that if you do open the slide just a few inches to open the fridge, it’s a good idea to fully open the slide before re-closing it so the seals go through the full cycle and properly re-seat. And depending on how you are parked, that me not be possible.

[peanut]

Originally Posted by PolarisCobra

I would seriously consider trimming the counter to get clearance. Might be easier than you think to get a neat enough job, and be less disruptive.

If that paper covered, particle board counter were trimmed, you would NEVER be able to replicate that detailed, rolled edge. You could mickey-mouse some laminate to it (to hide the particle board edge). But it would, IMO, look like crap unless you trimmed the ENTIRE counter to look the same.

[LHaven]

Even-money that in that same model trailer that other people own, the fridge clears just fine. Nothing a laser designator at the factory couldn't fix... but they're still using dowsers.

[jxnbbl]

Originally Posted by Cheesehead4Life

Just keep in mind that if you do open the slide just a few inches to open the fridge, it’s a good idea to fully open the slide before re-closing it so the seals go through the full cycle and properly re-seat. And depending on how you are parked, that me not be possible.

This is the reason I carry a fiberglass "driveway snow stake" with us. I always check the seal as sometimes they are not positioned properly even at full extension. I can "flick" the seal with the driveway stake and ensure it is properly seated.

[coastn]

What LHaven said. My door clears just fine on my '22 29RLI.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by LHaven

Even-money that in that same model trailer that other people own, the fridge clears just fine. Nothing a laser designator at the factory couldn't fix... but they're still using dowsers.

Originally Posted by coastn

What LHaven said. My door clears just fine on my '22 29RLI.

There's a "reason why the holes under any cabinet are so large" (much larger than the pipe going through the hole)... I call it "assembly line variability".. Other's may call it "best guess measurements" or maybe "make the hole big enough we don't have to cut it again down the line" or "hey, as long as the hole doesn't show up outside the cabinet, it's good to go"...

Whatever you call it or whatever the "assembly line justification", if it's close, it's good enough seems to be the mantra....

After all, what's an inch here or there between trailers ?????

[Cwinch44]

HeadHam, I own a 2023 RLI and withe the slide in my fridge door will hit just like in your picture.

[sourdough]

I think the whole thing revolves around luck of the build, an individual's personal preferences etc. I don't care if I have access to the RV when traveling because I "take care of business" where we stop, find something to eat where we stop, fuel up and move on. By luck of the draw I guess I've always had access to the bedroom/bathroom. Never used them (in the last 30 years) but it might be beneficial in some situation.

The slide/fridge deal doesn't mean anything to me....except in this trailer. When I did my walk through the front of a fridge door was dented; I insisted it be replaced and it was. Did another walk through and it was perfect. We closed it up, closed the deal, hooked up and went home. Upon opening it up.....a dent in the front of the SS fridge door. Every time I walk in the RV is stare straight at that dent and say "dang, a 1/2" would have fixed that" and move on.

[Rogersn]

As I look to get a newer trailer, I’ve come to the conclusion that those who can’t , design and build travel trailers! It’s upsetting!

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by Rogersn

As I look to get a newer trailer, I’ve come to the conclusion that those who can’t , design and build travel trailers! It’s upsetting!

Sometimes, I think the same. Other times, the reality of how these things are built determines how things fit. Consider that the same frame design may be used on 8 floorplans with the tanks in specific locations that can't be moved and slides that fit the same size sidewall opening but have the refrigerator in opposite ends of the slide. One model has a 48" island the other has a 58" island (so the drain still reaches a gray tank).

Maybe, in the above situation, Keystone has to "weigh the option" of designing/building a "one of a kind chassis made by Lippert" or use the "same chassis as the other 7 floorplans that use the common Lippert frame. They (Keystone) has to weigh the cost of designing a unique frame, the cost of not building that floorplan (to compete with the other manufacturers) or install a smaller island where the drawer fronts that are built by the thousands may not fit or leave out some other facet of the island, or accept that there's a "damn one inch overhang that prevents the refrigerator from opening when the slide is closed"....

In other words, there's a hell of a lot of other considerations when using "common bulk produced components" to build multiple floorplans"... Some of those considerations boil down to a decision to "make the floorplan or move on and not have a trailer to compete in a specific market.

It's not a "engineering for the consumer is the only consideration" but also cost to manufacture, profit for the investors, parts supply and storage at the factory of "one of a kind components" as well as "that one inch that some people find a problem"....

[jasin1]

Mine is the same way…I guess they install the island when the refrigerator slide is not even in the Rv yet..they then put the slide in and I guess depending on how the slide fits in the opening plus how far back they recessed the refrigerator ( if that is adjustable) determines if it will hit or not…im sure they could probably move it over an inch but there are so many variables that I guess it gets overlooked. They should have a jig made up to place the island but in the name of speedy construction they would rather correct that in the future presumably then go back and fix what they have

[jimd1050]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

There's a "reason why the holes under any cabinet are so large" (much larger than the pipe going through the hole)... I call it "assembly line variability".. Other's may call it "best guess measurements" or maybe "make the hole big enough we don't have to cut it again down the line" or "hey, as long as the hole doesn't show up outside the cabinet, it's good to go"...

Whatever you call it or whatever the "assembly line justification", if it's close, it's good enough seems to be the mantra....

After all, what's an inch here or there between trailers ?????

Sad, but WAY too true!!!

[sourdough]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

Sometimes, I think the same. Other times, the reality of how these things are built determines how things fit. Consider that the same frame design may be used on 8 floorplans with the tanks in specific locations that can't be moved and slides that fit the same size sidewall opening but have the refrigerator in opposite ends of the slide. One model has a 48" island the other has a 58" island (so the drain still reaches a gray tank).

Maybe, in the above situation, Keystone has to "weigh the option" of designing/building a "one of a kind chassis made by Lippert" or use the "same chassis as the other 7 floorplans that use the common Lippert frame. They (Keystone) has to weigh the cost of designing a unique frame, the cost of not building that floorplan (to compete with the other manufacturers) or install a smaller island where the drawer fronts that are built by the thousands may not fit or leave out some other facet of the island, or accept that there's a "damn one inch overhang that prevents the refrigerator from opening when the slide is closed"....

In other words, there's a hell of a lot of other considerations when using "common bulk produced components" to build multiple floorplans"... Some of those considerations boil down to a decision to "make the floorplan or move on and not have a trailer to compete in a specific market.

It's not a "engineering for the consumer is the only consideration" but also cost to manufacture, profit for the investors, parts supply and storage at the factory of "one of a kind components" as well as "that one inch that some people find a problem"....

I think the points you bring up aren't generally thought about by potential or new buyers. They think of an RV like they are buying a house spec'd out like you want, built to meet certain codes and standards while being subjected to inspection of the buyer at all steps along the way. The houses I've had built got to see me 2-3 times a week during construction and almost every day once they were finishing out the inside. That does not happen with an RV.

The concerns of an RV manufacturer extend FAR beyond giving the buyer a perfect product. A product that sounds fun and offers convenience, adventure, change of scenery while keeping the comforts of home at an acceptable price point - yes. Quality at all costs? No way.

I try to be objective about most things but with an RV you have to be objective to a fault to keep your sanity. It takes years to adjust to try to see things from their perspective and realize that compromise WILL be required no matter what you buy or where. I've always said RV ownership takes a certain mindset and it assuredly does if one wants to stay happy and enjoy what it has to offer.

[CedarCreekWoody]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

There's a "reason why the holes under any cabinet are so large" (much larger than the pipe going through the hole)... I call it "assembly line variability".. Other's may call it "best guess measurements" or maybe "make the hole big enough we don't have to cut it again down the line" or "hey, as long as the hole doesn't show up outside the cabinet, it's good to go"...

Whatever you call it or whatever the "assembly line justification", if it's close, it's good enough seems to be the mantra....

After all, what's an inch here or there between trailers ?????

Just be thankful if they actually cut a hole rather than just taking a hammer and bashing one.

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by CedarCreekWoody

Just be thankful if they actually cut a hole rather than just taking a hammer and bashing one.

About 10 or 12 years ago when I was at the factory for a tour (been several times since then) there were two workers on the roof of a Montana trailer (3/8" OSB roof decking) and one worker was showing the other how to "knock a vent hole in the OSB" rather than walking to the scaffolding to get a hole drill to cut a proper hole. He "slammed the hammer into the OSB, then used both hands (maybe all his strength) to push a bigger hole by breaking the shards of wood. End product was a "shoddy hole with rough edges", but once the EPDM (at that time TPO wasn't used) was installed and the roof vent was glued/screwed in place, it would have been impossible to know how the hole was created.... When I asked the tour guide about what he'd done, the guide (who was one of the line managers in a coat and tie) just shrugged his shoulders and moved us on down the line to the next "point of interest"...

Since then, Keystone only offers visitor tours of the assembly line when the crews are finished for the day, which is usually after 2PM. I won't suggest that my question was the motivation for that tour schedule change, but I've no doubt that Keystone doesn't really want the public observing some of the "shortcuts" that workers take on the line to keep up with the rapid paced schedule.....

[markdol1]

Thats strange ,i have a 2023 33rli and it clears the counter. had to be the installers not setting it on the mark. They usually have a template to go by