2014 RAM 2500 6.7l HITCH WEIGHT 5TH WHEEL TOY HAULER

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by Bman916

So on the pin weight.... i called keystone and they tell me that the listed hitch weights are based on the loaded weight of the trailer...16500... I called a few times to see if I got the same answer and every time they put me on hold to call the carbon team and came back with the same answer...

Had no idea about the CHP and the impound.... maybe I'll put the 3500 decal on where it says 3500 lol....totally kidding

Every other Keystone product is listed at "empty (shipping) weight", empty tongue/pin weight and cargo capacity. The GVW is calculated by adding the "shipping weight and the cargo capacity" the empty tongue/pin weight does not include the batteries, propane (tanks are included but not the propane) and any optional equipment ordered by the dealer/customer is also added to the shipping weight. That would include larger refrigerators, generators, second A/C unit, king bed option, washer/dryer, etc.

If Carbon lists their pin weight as "GVW pin" they are the only Keystone division that has broken the "general rule" on Keystone's specifications. I'd urge you to be very cautious with believing that any 38' toy hauler would have an empty pin weight of 2300 pounds. Toyhaulers are manufactured "pin heavy" so the cargo load in the garage can be "balanced" and maintain the required 15-25% of total trailer weight. If the pin were "light" any cargo in the garage would cause instability by making the pin too light. Since you're only using the garage as a playroom for your children, you'll not have any benefit of heavy cargo to reduce the pin loading during travel. You'll likely find that your pin weight is even heavier than what's posted and likely to be closer to the 25% calculation because of the light loading in your garage. That will make your overloaded truck situation even more dangerous.

Good Luck,

[chuckster57]

PM received, PDF forwarded. Hope it all makes sense to you.

[Bman916]

Well.... already own the 357 so I just told my wife I need to trade in my 11 month old 2014 2500 for a 3500....... please forward all messages to the Emergency room in 3....2.....1...

[chuckster57]

Originally Posted by Bman916

Well.... already own the 357 so I just told my wife I need to trade in my 11 month old 2014 2500 for a 3500....... please forward all messages to the Emergency room in 3....2.....1...

Sutter or Kaiser

Did you get the PDF?

[JRTJH]

Originally Posted by Bman916

Well.... already own the 357 so I just told my wife I need to trade in my 11 month old 2014 2500 for a 3500....... please forward all messages to the Emergency room in 3....2.....1...

LOL Yes, I can relate to that. We 'upgraded" to a larger fifth wheel last summer and the first order of business was the "kitchen table negotiations" about needing a new truck.... After a few long evenings of explaining, I got the "reluctant" "If you think we really have to, but I just don't understand" and I left it at that. Somehow I managed to stay out of the ER during that one..... Good luck with your "wait time in the ER" LOL

[PARAPTOR]

I have been reading/chasing your posts, seems obvious to me that you are looking for endorsements for your selection of TV and Toyhauler. Been there did that. Also started with a 2500HD based on talking to various truck and RV dealers along with pulling info from the Internet. Numbers looked good to me based on my knowledge at that time, and all the supposed experts were saying "NO PROBLEM" so went with it. Towed the Raptor once before the end of the Season with no issues. Over the winter I had a chance learn more from the Internet. After doing the simple calculation myself, the safety impact, and understanding the concequences of being stopped or being in an accident reguardless of whose fault, the 2500 was sold as you can see by my Sig.

Based on my knowledge your combination is not even close. In my talks with Keystone regarding the Raptor weights the pin weight was related to rig dry weight as John has mentioned. If I recall Raptor pin weight about 22% rig weight.

Two solutions that I can see for "Have to make it work" 1. upgrade TV, 2. Select another (smaller) 5th wheel. May not be a TH. Personally I can not see a 2500 pulling a TH. My two cents.

Good luck and Be Safe

[notanlines]

Bman, the one thing about this whole discussion is that NOTHING brings out the posters and opinions like this problem. It is both entertaining and informative every single time. Brenda and I are new to 5ver's, but hardly new to hauling heavy loads. Believe John when he tells you your pin weight will be 3500 pounds. And welcome to the world of Keystone, buying new trucks and trying to keep the DW out of every Camping World you pass. Another couple of years and two more trailers and she'll be telling YOU it's time for a new truck.

[smokeyfl]

Let's do the math - You said you weighed the truck and it weighs 7860 with a capacity of 10,000. That leaves you a weight carrying capacity of 2140. You are over the truck capacity already based on the pin weight in your post. Were you in the truck when it was weighed? Do you have a 5th wheel hitch in the truck? If no to the above subtract at least 300# from the capacity. Now you are down to 1840. How about passengers and gear?
The advertised dry pin weight per JRTJH is 3060# which is reasonable for a 39'
5th wheel. Add an extra battery, fill the storage, clothing and gear and you can see where this is going. Being over a bit is an understatement.

[Ken / Claudia]

What ever you do regarding a truck. You have a good test area. Go north on I-5 into Medford Oregon and back. You will know if you have enough truck and your wife will enjoy it or hate it. Just do it when there is no ice.

[chuckster57]

Are we talking Ashland grade?

[bsmith0404]

Once my DW realized how much she enjoyed camping, she started dictating what we own for a 5er. She keeps selecting bigger campers, I keep getting bigger trucks. Easy discussion for us....if that's the camper you want, this is the truck I'm getting. Never turns into a debate over if it's safe, it's just a discussion about having the right equipment so we can enjoy ourselves with peace of mind.

[Barbell]

There is no question that your truck will PULL this trailer. The question is, can you stop it? All air bags do is help keep the truck level and make it easier to handle. They do not increase its capacity. You are going to be overloaded even without all the junk we accumulate on our trips. Even with properly adjusted trailer brakes, emergency stopping will be an adventure to say the least. Smaller trailer or bigger truck, IMHO.

[GaryWT]

Always interesting. Has the OP posted anything since telling his wife the news. As it is clear here you are way over. So many TV run out of payload before tow capacity. Unfortunately if you had a F250 instead, the payload would be around 3200 lbs.

On a side note, not to sound rude, I don't get the toy hauler for a play area for the kids? Thinking that camping is an outdoor activity.

Another solution would be to find a nice campground close by and place the trailer on a seasonal site for a few years until you can upgrade the truck without taking a loss. Good luck.

[Desert185]

Originally Posted by Ken / Claudia

What ever you do regarding a truck. You have a good test area. Go north on I-5 into Medford Oregon and back. You will know if you have enough truck and your wife will enjoy it or hate it. Just do it when there is no ice.

I just did the road from Stovepipe Wells in Death Valley to Beatty, NV. With the SRX. The climb over the pass takes you from sea level to 5,000' in 10 miles with a fourth gear, exhaust brake descent down the other side. Wouldn't want to do the climbing part in the heat of summer, and no way my truck would properly tow the Carbon.

[chuckster57]

Originally Posted by Desert185

I just did the road from Stovepipe Wells in Death Valley to Beatty, NV. With the SRX. The climb over the pass takes you from sea level to 5,000' in 10 miles with a fourth gear, exhaust brake descent down the other side. Wouldn't want to do the climbing part in the heat of summer, and no way my truck would properly tow the Carbon.

I did that stretch back in the early '90"s. Middle of summer- thermometer in the shade at the lonely gas station said 128.

[Desert185]

Originally Posted by chuckster57

I did that stretch back in the early '90"s. Middle of summer- thermometer in the shade at the lonely gas station said 128.

You DA MAN!

[Ken / Claudia]

The Ashland is alittle more north, but thats a good grade also. The up hill from Redding over Shasta is long and the down grade into Medford is long and steep.
If a 1 or 2 day shake down trip is taken. You will know if the truck will pull/stop safely or blow tires or over heat trannys etc.

[chuckster57]

Originally Posted by Ken / Claudia

The Ashland is alittle more north, but thats a good grade also. The up hill from Redding over Shasta is long and the down grade into Medford is long and steep.

If a 1 or 2 day shake down trip is taken. You will know if the truck will pull/stop safely or blow tires or over heat trannys etc.

Yup!! Both are a workout.

[racin500]

Originally Posted by JRTJH

T....

Of course, you can always go in "upside down", add air bags, heavier tires and pretend you'll be OK, but if you're ever involved in an accident, almost any "ambulance chaser" will easily identify that you were overloaded and then things will become very expensive very fast....

If you've got the bucks, upgrade the truck. If not, be careful on the road.

JRTJH, this is the best advise I've seen. Many people think that just because their not a commercial driver/rig, their somehow exempt. If you really read your policy, your probably NOT insured if you are not in compliance. It's one thing to loose your own stuff, but what if you involve someone else's.

[Bman916]

Okay, so here is where we landed.

Took the test for my non comerical and have the road test set up for this week.

Went to the cat scales and my rear axle weight is 6480 with the fam in the truck and all our gear in the trailer my tires are 3640 each so I'm good there. so that puts me under on that axel by 20lbs. my gross weight was 21000lbs so I;m 4k under my max of 25000lbs

Sunday I went up to shasta and back. Had no issues at all... other than the gas milage. Even had to lean on the breaks once when i was cut off.... did just fine. The temp did get up to 210 on the grade, but i was able to keep it at 45 all the way up in 4th gear. BTW ... LOVE THAT EXHAUST BREAK!!!!!

** as for the geting a Th for the kids to have a play room.... We go to a lot of places that do not have hook ups, Wanted the gen and larger fresh tank. I do see a quad or 2 down the road...

Thanks everyone for the input and thoughts. The 2014 ram 2500 6.7L is a beast and I've seen 1500's pulling tripple axels (saw 3 on the sunday test trip) not saying they should or shouldnt do it, but i will be getting into a 3500 next time.