King pin weight

[3wheeler]

Hi, New member here. Ive been reading this forum for a few days and its very informative. I currently own a 2005 cougar 281 bunkhouse and am wanting to upgrade to a toy hauler. My TV is a 2007 silverado classic 2500 duramax. After reading a lot about weights on here, looks like my only option is gonna be the cougar 326 srx. I really want the raptor 332 or fuzion 331 but looks like there too heavy on the pin. I don't really want a DRW. I was curious so I looked up owners manuals online for various years of silverados and I was a little surprised. Up until 2011, there is no difference in hitch weight capacities for the 3500 single or dual wheel that I could find. Here is what I found:

2001-02, 2500 or 3500, 2500#max
2003-10, 2500, 3000#max
2003-10, 3500, 3500#max
2011-13, 2500, 3000#max
2011-13, 3500srw, 4000#max
2011-13, 3500drw, 5500#max

It looks like if you have a 3500 pre 2011 your overloaded with just about all raptors except maybe the 300 and it might be close by the time its fully loaded for the trip. Am I looking at this right?
I also think it is interesting to see a 2000# difference between the older vs newer 3500 drw. I knew they were supposed to be stronger but thats a big jump.

[Hoojs12840]

I have a 2013 2500 CC regular bed with the duramax. I tow a 2014 Cougar 330 RBK.

Fully loaded, including gamily and fuel for a week in Florida here are my weights.



GCWR- 24,500-I have 19,260.
Max trl weight-15,800-I have 11,260
Rear axle rating-6200- I have 5920
Rear tire ratings-6370-I have 5920
Trailer GVWR-12,200-I have 11,260
Truck GVWR-10,000-I have 10,660.

So I'm over on GVWR of the truck. Which is really arguing semantics. Since the only difference in 2500 and a 3500 SRW is the rear overload spring, which I have more than compensated for with Timbrens. There is nothing unsafe about my setup. legally with the state, yeah I'm over my tags allowed GVWR. If I felt inclined to give MD more tag fees (or unload 1/2 the house we took with me I could get it under. 10k. I could be legal with them as we'll. Not that there's ever a chance of anyone actually stopping me and checking it.
The factory 10k limit is so it can be registered like any vehicle. It's a gimmick to get around the law. That said, I am at the upper limits of the trucks components and I drive it as such. Just like when I drove 18wheelers. When I had a flatbed, awkward load or a tanker, I allowed additional margins.

If you always have toys in the back you would probably be fine on pin weight. Unfortunately you really need to scale it to know, or find someone that has a similar setup and see what they weight in at.

[LittleJoe]

Last time I weighed my 325SRX loaded incl bike in garage, I was at 2400 on pin and 12000 trailer weight. With my 04 DRW I am just under 21000 combined . Weights very widely between what book says and reality.

[canesfan]

First of all, it's good you took the time to do some research. With that said and with all due respect, I'm not sure where you got those numbers, my owners manual doesn't tell me I have 3000lbs for hitch weight (although the "brochure" I have tells me it has a payload capacity of 3342lbs for a "base model" 4x4). I'd really like to see where you got those numbers. I can't find anything about "hitch weight" in any of my paperwork, although I see plenty about Max Trailer weight for both ball hitch and 5th wheel towing.

Each and every trucks payload capacity is going to be different depending upon the actual weight of the truck, accesories, people, dogs, etc. I have a 2004 2500HD D/A with a GVWR of 9200lbs. Running the truck across the scales tells me I have ~1600lbs of payload. Yes, that's it. I have a Raptor 300MP whose pin weight is ~2700lbs without any toys in the garage and I am over my trucks GVWR per the scales. I'm good on my front axle, 35 lbs over on my rear axle, more than good on my upgraded from OEM tires, but 1000lbs over total GVWR. You need to know how much YOUR truck weighs and go from there as to how much payload it has. All these toyhaulers are heavy. Even if I upgraded to a 3500SRW I'd be overweight. I don't want a DRW, but I might be looking for a nice used Freightliner RV Toter. Weigh your tuck and then you'll know for sure where you are. Don't use somebody else's numbers. And

[therink]

Many folks use rawr as a guideline for tongue weight which is fine, but a pin weight on some larger fivers will put you over a 3/4 ton trucks gvwr by a considerable amount. While the mechanical difference between a 3/4 and 1 ton SRW may only be larger Springs, the gvwr (per the manufacturers stickered ratings) of most 1 ton SRW trucks is about 800 lbs more than a 3/4.

[3wheeler]

Canesfan,
I went to mychevrolet.com and downloaded the owners manual for your truck. On page 4-83 it says "fifth wheel or gooseneck pin weight should be 15 to 25 percent of trailer weight not to exceed 2500# maximum." I put 3000 in my post but evidently I was wrong. You can also get the info from "fifth wheel st.com"

[Hoojs12840]

Your allowed 3,000lbs on a 2500 GM truck, 4,000lbs on a 3500 SRW GM truck.

[canesfan]

I went to mychevrolet.com and downloaded the owners manual for your truck. On page 4-83 it says "fifth wheel or gooseneck pin weight should be 15 to 25 percent of trailer weight not to exceed 2500# maximum." I put 3000 in my post but evidently I was wrong. You can also get the info from "fifth wheel st.com"

Thanks for that. I'll pull out my printed owners manual and double check it with the online version. GM is known for their inconsistencies in information versus printed info, PDF files and non-PDF info on websites. My owners manual and the glitzy color brochure supplied by GM have inconsistent info regarding my truck.

At any rate the key phrase they left out of the online manual you referred to is this "Addition of trailer kingpin weight cannot cause vehicle weights to exceed RGAWR or GVWR" leading some people to think they can drop 2500-3000 lbs on their truck without considering anything else.

My point was not argue and/or disagree with you, my point was that each truck is different in how much it weighs and how much it can carry and/or tow and each person has to take their truck into consideration, not a blanket statement in an owners manual with important wording being left out.

[3wheeler]

Originally Posted by Hoojs12840

Your allowed 3,000lbs on a 2500 GM truck, 4,000lbs on a 3500 SRW GM truck.

For 2011 and after, you are correct. Before 2011, from what I've found, its 3500lbs on a 3500 single or dual.


Canesfan,

I agree with everything you are saying. As long as you don't go over on GAWR and GVWR, your ok. You are right, the heavier the truck, the less you can haul or tow. Actually most 3/4 tons can tow a heavier trailer than 1 tons because of the weight difference in the truck. Same applies with reg cab vs crew cab. The GCWR is the same for all configurations. The lighter the truck, the heavier the trailer can be.

You are also correct about the inconsistencies of their literature. For example, the 2003 and 2005 manual for your truck says 3000 but the 2004 says 2500.

[canesfan]

3wheeler you are so correct with the above statements and a lot of people don't understand that. But when you think it through it does make perfect sense, all things being equal, of course.

[PARAPTOR]

Originally Posted by 3wheeler

For 2011 and after, you are correct. Before 2011, from what I've found, its 3500lbs on a 3500 single or dual.


Canesfan,

I agree with everything you are saying. As long as you don't go over on GAWR and GVWR, your ok. You are right, the heavier the truck, the less you can haul or tow. Actually most 3/4 tons can tow a heavier trailer than 1 tons because of the weight difference in the truck. Same applies with reg cab vs crew cab. The GCWR is the same for all configurations. The lighter the truck, the heavier the trailer can be.

You are also correct about the inconsistencies of their literature. For example, the 2003 and 2005 manual for your truck says 3000 but the 2004 says 2500.

Its an OR rather than an AND. GVWR will generally be exceeded before GAWR