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Old 01-09-2016, 04:29 PM   #1
sourdough
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Another Battery Question - Water usage?

There's a thread going about batteries but didn't want to hijack that thread.

Checked my batteries yesterday. One of the batteries needed twice the water that the other one did - a lot more. I filled them both at the end of Oct.- I think. What is that telling me?

I do very little dry camping. I seldom use the trailer using batteries only and if so, for a very short period (no more than an hour). It is generally plugged into shore power. It's a 2014 Keystone Cougar High Country and I have two 12v batteries.

The trailer came with one battery and I had them add the 2nd when I purchased it. The first one may have been on the trailer for a few months...I don't know, but surely it wasn't used much since it was new.

We'll be leaving for FL the last week of March for 2 1/2 months (granddaughter's high school graduation) and just want to make sure I don't have some sort of issue brewing. I've not encountered this situation before. I thought about just not worrying about it.....but, I'm the worrying type and I know there are lots of folks on here that have a lot of answers. Thanks - Danny
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Old 01-09-2016, 04:38 PM   #2
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I don't know that it's telling you anything. Assuming they are wired properly in parallel, are they exactly the same type (make/model)? We know they're not the same age, it's going to be hard to guess why one took more water.

I don't know how much water you added, but assuming it wasn't "too" much - meaning you could see the lead plates (that's too late), then you're probably fine. I'd recommend checking them at least twice a year.

If you're really concerned about it, pull them, put them on an auto-charger then have them load tested (usually free) at your local Autozone or similar.
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Old 01-09-2016, 05:05 PM   #3
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Most dealerships don't install any battery in an RV until it's sold. The battery is installed as a part of the "prep for delivery". So, I'd suppose that if you bought your RV new, then both batteries are the same age and have the same use history. That said, if one battery is evaporating more water than the other, it could be an internal issue or it could be corrosion on one of the battery connections. A "thin plate" or a "shorted plate" or a "corroded plate" on a single cell may be the cause of your problem, or it could just as easily be simply that the "other battery" has a loose connection or corroded terminal, causing the "dry" one to receive more of the charge from your converter.

If it were mine, I'd swap the battery position, ie: change the electrical connections so the other battery is "electrically connected" where the "dry" one is and place it where the "less dry" one was. First of all, that will "disconnect and reconnect all the electrical connectors. You'll then know they are tight and not corroded. It will also give you an indication in a few weeks of whether the "dry one is still dry" or if the "wet one becomes the dry one"... What will that tell you? Whether it's the charging system "overcharging" the first battery in parallel or whether the "dry" battery has some internal issue.

As long as you're maintaining a charge and the batteries are "lasting as long as before" you probably haven't damaged them, but I'd want to know if there's something else "about to happen"..... Good Luck.
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Old 01-09-2016, 05:54 PM   #4
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sourdough, Howdy;

JRTH has some good thoughts but I'd still check to see what the dates are
on the batteries. One (dry), may be older than the other.
My Cougar had a single 12 in it when I checked it out before deciding to
buy it, asked for the 12 to be replaced with a pair of 6's. Some times they
put an older battery like the one from mine into on for someone that wants
a pair of 12's ... my Cougar is a 2008 and I bought it in 2011, the battery in
it was a 2008 when I looked and was another reason for asking for the swap.

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Old 01-09-2016, 10:04 PM   #5
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Thanks all. I've checked the connections and they are clean, tight and free of corrosion. I think I will swap them around to see if there is some correlation there. I think I'll also put the trailer on batteries only at the storage area and see how long they last....they may just be on the verge of dying...I don't know. I left the trailer on battery power one time (not living in it) and in one week they were dead so I'm not sure if they are up to par or not.
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Old 01-10-2016, 09:06 PM   #6
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Sourdough, The proper dual batt.hookup should be pos.take off on one batt. and neg. take off on other batt. in the pair. this gives equal load and charge to both batts. if your hookup had both on the same batt. perhaps that accounted for the unequal water useage. ---Lou---
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Old 01-10-2016, 10:42 PM   #7
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Sourdough, here is a pic for batt hookup.also " phantom loads " radio memory,propane detector,refrige control board,etc can run down batts.in storage if not disconnected .---Lou---
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Old 01-12-2016, 01:57 PM   #8
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Thanks for the additional info. I'll be out there tomorrow so I'll check the wiring as well. I've "looked" at it but not REALLY looked at it.
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Old 01-12-2016, 04:19 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trucker LOU View Post
Sourdough, The proper dual batt.hookup should be pos.take off on one batt. and neg. take off on other batt. in the pair. this gives equal load and charge to both batts. if your hookup had both on the same batt. perhaps that accounted for the unequal water useage. ---Lou---
This is likely your answer. ^^
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Old 01-14-2016, 05:41 PM   #10
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Update on water usage

A quick update on the battery water usage.

Went out this evening to finish polishing the trailer and check the batteries. As soon as I opened the storage building door I heard hissing. Upon checking the battery that had been so low on water when refilling was hissing/burbling and was very warm to the touch. The other battery was nice and cool. Ambient temp was about 62 degrees.

I checked the wiring - it is correct, and unplugged the trailer from shore power. The dates on the batteries were not punched so don't know if they were the same or not; could not find any other indication of a date. Both are Exide deep cycle. The bridging wires are a gauge or two smaller than the battery cables but don't think that would cause the overheating and water usage; possibly a deterioration in performance so will replace with larger gauge in the near future. When I left about 2 hours later the hot battery was still giving off a little psst every couple of minutes so....?

My assumption is I have a bad battery. My DW says she is positive they were using a battery when we were looking at the trailer before the sale plus the salesman said it had been on the lot for quite a while so it may be shot. I don't think the converter is overcharging or the 2nd battery would be warm as well I would think? We will have owned the trailer 2 years at the end of Feb. and we bought it new. I have not maintained the batteries as I should and let them get very low on water on the first refill (15-16mos) so I may well have done the damage myself.

Any additional thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated.
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Old 01-14-2016, 05:48 PM   #11
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Have a volt meter? Check the no-charge voltage on both. Plug the RV in. Check the charge voltage on both. Report back.

One theory: The boiling battery has a bad cell or the top of the plates were damaged. Converter is trying to bring it up to voltage with the remaining cells/damaged plate and it's overheating. Confirm that this might be right by measuring under 14.7v with it charging (and boiling).
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Old 01-15-2016, 10:13 AM   #12
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I'll check them this afternoon after my doc appt. or in the morning and report back. Thanks.
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Old 01-17-2016, 03:33 PM   #13
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Finally made it out to the trailer today to check on the batteries again and don't know what I learned, if anything.

The batteries had been disconnected from shore power since I first posted. With shore power and converter connected each battery read 12.8 volts. I disconnected the bridging straps and measured voltage on both batteries; each had 11.8 volts. I measured the voltage coming from the converter; 13.5 volts. I figured I would use a hydrometer on them and see what it told me. I was going to use it on the battery that sounded like it was boiling last time. When peering into the battery I could not see water. The first cell didn't have enough water to float the indicator in the tube but it was already well into the white and probably would have gotten to the red if there had been enough water. The next cell had enough water to just fill the end of the tube and that was it. The next cell had nothing. Cells 4-6 had some water except 5 which was dry. I didn't even use it on the other battery; just looked in the caps and the water was at the bottom of the rings where it should be. It had been approx. 2 weeks since I had filled both batteries when I removed power.

I also said on a previous post that the batteries weren't dated. I was wrong. I missed one of them thinking it was just a grease overlay. I gave it a good brushing and it is dated March 2013 - it's the battery that is boiling and the original on the trailer. It's been on it since it was built I suppose although it is a 14 model and we purchased it at the end of Feb.14. The second battery, which seems to be fine, was added in March of 14.

I wonder about my converter boiling the water out but it should do it to both batteries and not just one I would think - and there is a huge difference in the two as far as water usage. John had mentioned the possibility of a converter issue (staying in the "bulk" mode for charging) when I was having so many 12v LED failures so that made me wonder but now I'm thinking it has been the battery.

Any further thoughts or suggestions are appreciated.
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Old 01-17-2016, 04:03 PM   #14
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The dry battery has a shorted plate or plates. Replace it and you should be fine.

Even deep cycle batteries have a limited number of cycle life. Every time you drain one you kill one of its lives.

I've had them short after as few as 3 or 4 fully drained cycles.

If it were me, I'd just take that one out of the trailer and use a single battery. But we don't dry camp, if we were to start I'd switch to dual 6 volt.
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Old 01-17-2016, 06:26 PM   #15
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sourdough, Howdy;

I was told, a long time ago, that it was best to keep the age of batteries
as close as possible. Took a bit of searching but i found this article. It's
first answer has a lot of sicence-speak to it but it gets to the point right
at the end and the second amplifies on it some.
http://electronics.stackexchange.com...-old-batteries
If you just replace one right now then you will just be making the one you
don't change be the one that will be the overheating battery.

hankaye
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Old 01-17-2016, 07:18 PM   #16
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Thanks! I think I'm going to have to go with 2 new 24 batteries. I would like to go with 2 Trojan 6 volts but my battery tray is too small I'm afraid...it fits the 2 24's almost exactly.

I appreciate all the help and info....that's why I really love this site.
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