Black an grey valve issues on brand new FZ395

Blowin by · 02-25-2013, 06:24 PM

Hi all. New fuzion owner and have to say I thought buying a brand new unit would be trouble free! I've already had the genset fuel pump replaced (unit had .3hrs on to!) now after only the 2nd trip the dump valves (2 black n 1 grey) dont seem to be operating correctly. When we went to dump sewage free flowed as if the valves were open! After a very awful fight I got the hose connected and dumped all tanks, the black valves seemed to move free but the grey felt like it was binding up? Well got home used the power flush until water looked semi clean and shut valves, came home next day pulled off main cap an again fluid flowed out??? I have to say after spending this kind of
Money I expect better quality! Any tips are appreciated as the closest rep is over an hour from me

Jason

SteveC7010 · 02-25-2013, 06:45 PM

Most Keystones seem to have remote dump valves that are controlled by a handle and a 6' cable. These cables can have issues and the valves themselves can have issues, especially the black gate.

Cables first.... they're simply a piece of stiff wire inside a sheath. The wire is attached to the handle on the outside and the valve on the inside. Pull the handle to open the gate; push to close it. Two basic issues: lubrication and/or a kink in the installation of the cable. Kinks are easily found by eyeballing the entire length of the cable from the handle to the valve. It it's kinked, adjust it.

There's another thread on lubrication of the cables. DO NOT USE WD-40!!!! It is a solvent, not a lubricant. It will dry out and whatever it dissolved will harden up again. Silicone lube works well. Unless you have one of the little doo-dads that clamp on the end of the cable and enable you force the spray into the full length of the cable, it's a tedious process is get enough lube into it, but it can be done.

The gates themselves are held in place with a rubber ring on each side that sits in a plastic shell. It's possible, especially with the black tank, that there is a solid lodged in there preventing the gate from fully closing which would result in the immediate flow of sewage when you remove the cap. If the flow were gray water, you'd then need to look at one or the other of the gray gates.

It there is an obstruction, you can sometimes loosen it by blasting water back up from the dump point. There are some fittings available to help with this. Or you can get one of those "wands" that sticks down the toilet and blast from the inside. That only works if your toilet drain pipe is straight. A number of Keystones have drains with one or more bends in them making the wand useless.

Once you get the dump gates clear and functioning properly, you'll want to lube them periodically. Folks report good luck with dumping some fabric softener into an empty tank every once in a while, and then working the gate in and out to spread it where needed.

Truth to tell, everyone has issues with their holding tank systems sooner or later. Learning how to deal with them is part of responsible RV ownership in my opinion. And it's not a Keystone thing by any means. It happens to all brands and manufacturers.

Blowin by · 02-26-2013, 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveC7010

Most Keystones seem to have remote dump valves that are controlled by a handle and a 6' cable. These cables can have issues and the valves themselves can have issues, especially the black gate.

Cables first.... they're simply a piece of stiff wire inside a sheath. The wire is attached to the handle on the outside and the valve on the inside. Pull the handle to open the gate; push to close it. Two basic issues: lubrication and/or a kink in the installation of the cable. Kinks are easily found by eyeballing the entire length of the cable from the handle to the valve. It it's kinked, adjust it.

There's another thread on lubrication of the cables. DO NOT USE WD-40!!!! It is a solvent, not a lubricant. It will dry out and whatever it dissolved will harden up again. Silicone lube works well. Unless you have one of the little doo-dads that clamp on the end of the cable and enable you force the spray into the full length of the cable, it's a tedious process is get enough lube into it, but it can be done.

The gates themselves are held in place with a rubber ring on each side that sits in a plastic shell. It's possible, especially with the black tank, that there is a solid lodged in there preventing the gate from fully closing which would result in the immediate flow of sewage when you remove the cap. If the flow were gray water, you'd then need to look at one or the other of the gray gates.

It there is an obstruction, you can sometimes loosen it by blasting water back up from the dump point. There are some fittings available to help with this. Or you can get one of those "wands" that sticks down the toilet and blast from the inside. That only works if your toilet drain pipe is straight. A number of Keystones have drains with one or more bends in them making the wand useless.

Once you get the dump gates clear and functioning properly, you'll want to lube them periodically. Folks report good luck with dumping some fabric softener into an empty tank every once in a while, and then working the gate in and out to spread it where needed.

Truth to tell, everyone has issues with their holding tank systems sooner or later. Learning how to deal with them is part of responsible RV ownership in my opinion. And it's not a Keystone thing by any means. It happens to all brands and manufacturers.

Thanks for the input I'm just frustrated, this is my first new unit. i have always had to work on the used campers I've had in the past, figured I'd at least get some good use before this kinda of stuff started happening!

Javi · 02-27-2013, 02:26 AM

Same thing happened to me with my new Passport... dealer ended up replacing the entire black tank and all plumbing including both grey tank valves... said it was all screwed up..

Just be aware that the repair will probably take a month, 29 days for paper work and shipping and 1 day for the actual repair....

I will say this.... the valves work flawlessly now

**JRTJH** · 02-27-2013, 05:43 AM

I'm sure you've already considered this, but I'll throw it out there just as a reminder to those who may not have been caught in this trap yet. We all will, eventually experience this unless you think about how you dump your tanks.

As the contents of the black tank are being emptied, there are chunks of solids and paper passing through the gate valve. If you close the valve during dumping, there is a good chance that bits of paper and undissolved solids will be caught on the edge of the sliding valve and be forced into the rubber ring. As this happens, it makes it hard for the valve to seal properly and it starts a minor leak. Then, with the paper not exposed to water, it dries out enough to become even harder. Let this happen over and over again and it becomes a part of the rubber ring. Once this happens,, the slide vavle will no longer seal properly and trying to slide past or over the hardened paper blocking the way inside the seat in the rubber ring, the valve becomes impossible to open or close completely.

The only way out of this mess (literally and figuratively) is to dig your way out. That means disassembling the valve, removing the debris with a wooden pick or in some cases a screwdriver, reinstalling the valve and lubricating it so it'll work again. This chore, when it happens to you, usually means dropping the bottom cover at least enough to access the valve assembly, possibly removing even more of the plumbing than just the valve and the unpleasant task of opening a full tank if the valve won't open.

My advice is to not close the valves until the tank is flowing relatively clear discharge, lubricate the rubber ring by using a small amount of RV antifreeze and olive oil to keep the ring supple and the valve sliding and to lubricate the cable runs as a part of regular maintenance. Otherwise....... YECHT

Pmedic4 · 03-20-2013, 06:28 PM

Gotta love these comments. I too had a brand new TT, and the BW valve opened, waste ran out, but it wasn't easy to tell if the tank emptied.
Next trip, had a little smell, same thing, opened BW valve, little ran out, and thought all was good.
Third trip, not so good a smell - it ripened. Assumed it was just cause the trailer had set for few weeks and it was hot. Well, this time, went to dump, and nothing - knew there was a problem. Seemed when they put it together, there was some junk in the BW dump line.

If you ever watched the movie "RV" with Robin Williams, and the dumping the BW tank, it was worse. At least from my perspective.

gepaine · 03-20-2013, 07:42 PM

My new Cougar TT had a very similar problem from Day 1. The black tank valve would appear to close completely, but in fact it would only partially close. Of course, this led to a nasty surprise when removing the dump cap.

It took two trips to the 60-mile distant dealer to correct the problem. (Dealer couldn't find anything wrong during the first trip.) 2nd time around, they removed the "T" pipe that connects the black valve and gray valve to the dump port (to see if anything was obstructing the black valve).

Everything looked OK so they went to put it back together and found they couldn't. This is when they discovered the problem. The black and gray tanks were installed too close to each other resulting in the "T" pipe having to be forced in place between the tank valves. This put excessive force on the black tank valve, warping it and preventing the valve from fully closing.

The dealer had to shorten the "T" pipe to get it to fit properly.

Inherentwired1 · 03-23-2013, 02:55 AM

Ours tended to open magically on the highway, so I attached a small bungee cord to the handle of the black tank dump to keep it closed...hopefully it will get stiffer with age

rjsurfer · 03-23-2013, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Inherentwired1

Ours tended to open magically on the highway, so I attached a small bungee cord to the handle of the black tank dump to keep it closed...hopefully it will get stiffer with age

Why change that !

That's a feature

Ron W.

**JRTJH** · 03-23-2013, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rjsurfer

Why change that !

That's a feature

Ron W.

Years ago, there was a "option" on motorhomes to inject a small amount of black waste into the exhaust system of the vehicle and burn it as one travelled down the road. There was a small pump on the black tank and an injector installed in the exhaust. Back then, there was much less "environmental concern" and a few people I knew installed those systems on their travel trailers. Since there wasn't an exhaust system to mount the injector, they simply mounted it under the RV and pointed it down. During travel, they "ejected their black tank contents onto the roadway.

Before anyone cries "FOUL" (pun intended) Back then it was also common practice for toilets on passenger trains to dump their contents onto the railway. Often, as a kid, walking the train tracks out to the river, we'd step around piles of TP dried on the crossties.

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