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Old 09-19-2019, 08:19 AM   #41
pdaniel
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Originally Posted by capnkirk4 View Post
to get something done with Keystone, I used 2 choices: first, send a private msg to Keystone on FB. You tell them the problem and that if you don't hear from them in x amount of time you will make the private msg public. Second, you write up all the complaints to a RV mag. like RV Life and get them to publicly shame Keystone into responding. Good luck. It worked for me in half the cases. Kirk
Two years ago I submitted a query to Keystone. Still waiting for a response.
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Old 09-19-2019, 08:19 AM   #42
marktaco
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This type of poor design is so common in the RV industry, not just with Keystone. I have had 4 different brands and they are all like that. They are in such a hurry to rush them out, as light as possible as cheaply as possible that they just do garbage construction.
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Old 09-19-2019, 08:25 AM   #43
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After fighting poor quality issues with my 3 previous trailers, I bought a brand new high-end Triple slide TT (not Keystone). After owning it for 3 years, paying out about $4,000 in out of warranty repairs, plus whatever it cost me to pull to the factory 3 times, I sold it back to my dealer. I had returning delaminization, a soft spot in the floor (even though there was no evidence of water damage), and a stuck black water valve. Bottom line is RV quality is poor. I keep hoping Toyota or Honda will get in the game and give the RV industry the same lessons they gave the big 3 car guys.

So I asked my self, why do I do this ? And my answer is the same as ctbruce
A friend of mine purchased a brand new Allegro Bus. And it needed warranty work right out of the chute. He told me that we, the buyers, are the quality control department.
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Old 09-19-2019, 08:40 AM   #44
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Agreed!

I have had to shore up and rebuild just abut every shelf in our trailer, none of them had any structural integrity.

Pretty piss poor, but we still love the trailer, it is perfect for the 2 of us and now that I have fixed it, we have had no more issues.

-Brian

This is why we prefer lightly used to new.
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Old 09-19-2019, 09:11 AM   #45
Fuzion 369
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Good point no tan lines. We have had several trailers and this is by far the best manufacturer in our opinion.
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Old 09-19-2019, 09:51 AM   #46
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We've had our tt for a little over two years and knowing that a light weight tt is going to be made lighter we expected some problems but I have to say that we really love going camping as a whole family and we do a lot of preventative maintenance.
I spend a lot of time taking care of problems before they become problems. It's what it is and we love the time with the kids.
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Old 09-19-2019, 10:04 AM   #47
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We took our Pastor and his Wife up to the Upper Peninsula last year in our 2018 Bullet Premier. We had a great time, but did have one major problem with the RV.
The supports for the table top conversion to a bed were stapled in, and one of the supports gave way, causing the table top to fall. Luckily we had a piece of plywood that fit under the support, after we re-attached it to the cabinet wall, and rested against the floor, so no more problem with the "bed",
After coming home, the Wife and I used screws in all three supports , which work a hell of a lot better than staples.
I understand their use of staples, which are faster for attaching, but you would think that for supports that the table top rests on when using it as a bed, would be better served using screws and a good glue.
All in all, we are happy with our RV so far.
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Old 09-19-2019, 11:24 AM   #48
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I have to doubt that the worker on the line putting those shelves in had specific instruction to staple them from the bottom or some drawing telling him to. More likely they were put in while the cabinet was upside down and that seemed like the right way to do it or it was easier to put staples in from the underside. I doubt any engineer ever considered the direction of the staples. Just a guess...
That actually sounds pretty plausible. Somebody did not understand how a cabinet is built. Clearly they didn't understand the necessary orientation of the Shelf in relation to the hangers. That's really not a forgivable thing. Should have been handled under warranty, at no cost to the consumer.
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Old 09-19-2019, 11:55 AM   #49
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Don’t get me wrong we have had our share of issues but I think the way our trailer is built and the overall performance has been better than forest river. Ours will be 2 years old this thanksgiving.
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Old 09-19-2019, 01:38 PM   #50
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A friend of mine purchased a brand new Allegro Bus. And it needed warranty work right out of the chute. He told me that we, the buyers, are the quality control department.
Yeah - Quality Control is poor at best in the Industry. I was invited to a factory tour at the manufacturer of an RV that I had just purchased, and they probably should not have let me see what goes on. The workers were really hustling to get trailers out the door. I asked why they were literally running from one place to the other. The answer I got was: "They get to go home after they get 12 trailers out the door". And that was ALL they cared about. Quality was NOT a consideration. It was all about volume. There were several issues with my rig, not the least of which was a lug nut what was cross-threaded, but they drove it on with an impact wrench anyway. They just don't care.
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Old 09-19-2019, 03:15 PM   #51
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That is just Crazy!
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Old 09-20-2019, 06:12 AM   #52
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We've owned three different 5vr's from three different makers, and all of them have had senseless engineering issues, and that includes present our Keystone product. It's a common issue with all the makers that I doubt will ever be resolved. Besides engineering snafu's, there are assembly issues that need to addressed.

All you need to do is visit the RV shows and look at the RV's on display. That's when you can see some of the glaring engineering and design mistakes.
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Old 09-20-2019, 08:52 AM   #53
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This is not idiotic design, but have seen that in other areas of the TT. While replacing my brake assemblies after a 6k trip, it was discovered that the shackles, bushings and equalizers were very near failure. Lucky us, but I planned to change all out after returning to our home base. Replaced all with Dexter Heavy Duty, and Dexter 4400# brake assemblies (yes 4400#). Before anyone says we have overloaded the TT, it has been on the scales fully loaded for 5 and 6 week trips which are 4 to 6K trips. TT is a 2017 Bullet.



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Old 09-20-2019, 09:07 AM   #54
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This is not idiotic design, but have seen that in other areas of the TT. While replacing my brake assemblies after a 6k trip, it was discovered that the shackles, bushings and equalizers were very near failure. Lucky us, but I planned to change all out after returning to our home base. Replaced all with Dexter Heavy Duty, and Dexter 4400# brake assemblies (yes 4400#). Before anyone says we have overloaded the TT, it has been on the scales fully loaded for 5 and 6 week trips which are 4 to 6K trips. TT is a 2017 Bullet.



I only had 5-6k on my last 5th wheel & the shackles & plastic bushings were worse than yours + plus all 4 brake assemblies were full of grease from the factory or dealer using the EZ lube feature. Fortunately the manufacturer reimbursed me for parts as it was only 9 months old, my labor was free.
You made a good choice with the upgrade, money well spent.
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Old 09-20-2019, 09:15 AM   #55
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1. All RVs regardless of manufacturer use the same parts and appliance sources for the most part. If an appliance dies, it may be a junk appliance OR improper install by the manufacturer. All appliances are somewhat suspect these days having come over on a boat from a third world country.

2. The folks slapping the trailers together are basically unskilled laborers who learn on the job and likely receive little, if any, training. Just given a hammer and told go get her! These ain't Amish craftsman as some manufacturers claim and in fact the word craftsman doesn't work.

3. HIGH HIGH turnovers in these factories. A lot of it is pressure to get units out the door, little training and McDonalds probably is hiring for about the same amount. You will note in RV industry job postings most emphasize that there is no mandatory drug test. Think about that when you complain about shoddy assembly.
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Old 09-20-2019, 11:08 AM   #56
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Replaced all with Dexter Heavy Duty, and Dexter 4400# brake assemblies (yes 4400#).


I really like the grease fittings on the shackles. That makes so much sense! DO they list an interval for regreasing those?
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Old 09-20-2019, 11:56 AM   #57
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Factory Dexter Suspension VS Dexter Heavy Duty

The Dexter specs do not say, but I plan to check about every 1500 to 2000 miles.

BTW, sorry for the photos being so large they are per website max pixel size. Also, I forgot to mention that my TT max capacity is 8800# and it scaled out at 1k less.
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Old 09-21-2019, 03:45 PM   #58
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I have begun to think we are part of the problem! Putting shelves in like that among other things is bull. If everybody complains you get somewhere,,, instead we say,,,, oh I will just fix it myself
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Old 09-22-2019, 04:53 PM   #59
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I have begun to think we are part of the problem! Putting shelves in like that among other things is bull. If everybody complains you get somewhere,,, instead we say,,,, oh I will just fix it myself
It's probably by design. Most stuff is relatively easy to fix thankfully. They have made it so difficult to get any kind of warranty work and regular work is backed up for months so you are forced to fix it, live with it or be without your rig for extended periods.

Stuart
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Old 09-23-2019, 02:20 AM   #60
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I pulled this ad from the Goshen, Indiana area.

RV Plumber
H L Enterprise Inc.
Elkhart, IN 46516
$15 - $18 an hour

Full Time experienced Recreational Vehicle Plumber. Must be able to install all water lines, drain pipes, toilets, holding tank/s install, water pumps, and pluming fixtures which must include RV terminations and adherence to RVIA pluming codes. Maintain a good work area and environment with little to no supervision.

Job Type: Full-time

Salary: $15.00 to $18.00 /hour

I don't know if this is in line with what most of you thought was paid to their 'craftsmen,' but this is the real world.
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