Keystone Electrical Issue - THIS IS A MUST READ

Bob Landry · 03-28-2011, 03:25 PM

I just took delivery of a new Outback this weekend. Got home and had to fix the usual array of things that come loose in the initial travel. Did some repairs and reinforcements, no big deal. Then I pulled the panel off of the table between the chairs(Mine is a RL) to see how I was going to install my EMS and here is what I found. The shore power cord that pushes into the mousehole stores in that small compartment. It goes to a household type electrical box where it is wire nutted to the wires that feed shore power to the converter. The Romex that feeds shore power to the converter is only 12 ga. That means it is only rated for 20A, not 30A like the big shore power cord is. Operation-wise, it wouldn't be an issue because this is not air conditioning weather, however, when it gets hot and the air conditioner runs along with all of the other 110V devices, that 12 ga wire can easily be overloaded and heat up to the point of causing a fire, because the 30A breaker probably would not trip. I know of what I speak because I've been doing installations and repair of 30 & 50A marine shore power systems for around 15 years and I have been called in by insurance companies to evaluate damages and prepare estimates for repair of boats that have been incorrectly wired and burned.

This is not a "sky is falling" post, nor is it a flame to Keystone. I personally like the trailer and I think it is a good value for the money. I've had to fix a couple of things, but nothing that I would call serious. This is serious.
If your trailer's shore power is set up so that your shore power cord directly feeds the converter, then none of this is likely to apply to you. On the other hand, if the shore power inlet is remote from the converter, such as probably all of the RL type layouts, you would do well to verify that your trailer is wired correctly. This can easily be a life and death situation if not addressed. Note I said could, not will be. Electricity is serious stuff and it needs to be done right. I'm going to call Keystone tomorrow and see if I can reach someone in production and see how this should be addressed because the trailer is not safe in it's current wiring configuration. I do know that Keystone has had a lot of orders for this particular trailer, and it's very likely the production people grabbed what was handy because they were in a rush. It's also possible that some purchasing agent found a great dealon smaller wire. We'll see how it resolves and I'll keep updating this post as I get information.

Be safe..

ktmracer · 03-28-2011, 05:53 PM

Our 295RE is wired correctly with #10 between the shore power and converter panel. Was doing some upgrades this summer and always have a habit of checking for correct wiring. I'll bet "gilligan" was either colorblind, or wasn't paying attention. Hope the dealer can correct it in your case, but glad you caught it now!. wire runs in the underbelly so fixing it isn't much of a problem, just the time it takes to drop the underbelly.

Terrydactile · 03-29-2011, 03:13 AM

Wow Bob, that kind of thing should never happen and I hope they didn't build any other units like that. I know mine is wired directly into the converter and I thought all would be wired this way. It only makes sense to run the shore power directly to the converter. I wonder if its the rear lounge floor plan that is done this way? That 12 ga wire would have gotten red hot shortly after you started any summer camping trip because of the amp draw. We all know that we bump the 30A limit in the summer and maybe in cooler weather if running a couple of space heaters. Glad you caught it now. Let us know what Keystone says. Hopefully it was an honest mistake and not in the design. Maybe they should do a recall for that.

campingcpl · 03-29-2011, 06:48 AM

Our power cable is/was wired direct to the converter. We had a problem at one campground post and it ended up frying our converter and it melted the 30A plug so I changed it over to a detachable power cord and used 10 ga to connect the trailer plug to the converter. I never liked trying to snake that power cord in and out of that mouse hole anyway specialy when it was cold.

jq1031 · 03-29-2011, 04:47 PM

I have the same unit in the LAREDO, IT THE 297RL. Being a novice when it comes to this type of situation, how do I identify the problem once the front panel is removed. I've had a fire in a previous RV & don't want to go through situation again. THANKS, JOE

Bob Landry · 03-29-2011, 05:11 PM

I talked to a tech at Keystone this AM and got everything cleared up. 10ga romex is orange. Mine is OK. When I disconnected everything to install my EMS, I was able to read the "10" on the romex. All is well. I do recommend some kind of protective device between the shore power inlet and the converter. The only thing protecting is it the breaker in the pedestal. That's not much protection.

Handysam · 03-29-2011, 05:33 PM

Bob, what made you think it was 12ga. to begin with? Also could you describe how you hooked up your EMS? Thanks, Sam

Bob Landry · 03-29-2011, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handysam

Bob, what made you think it was 12ga. to begin with? Also could you describe how you hooked up your EMS? Thanks, Sam

When I first looked in the small table where the shore power comes in, I saw the shore power wires wire-nutted to some romex that was coming up through the floor of the cabinet. I didn't undo the wire nuts, but just looked at the wires that were connected and there seemed to be a big difference in the diameter of the wires. Turns out that was just a difference in the thickness of the wire covering. I was in HD today and I checked the romex in the electrical department and orange romex is infact 10ga. it also said so on the wire after I removed the wirenuts and pulled it out so I could read it.

EMS.. It's going to be installed under the center table(RL model) right where the shore power comes in the trailer. SP inlet feeds the EMS, EMS feeds the converter.. Very simple..

DTJ9610 · 03-30-2011, 07:25 AM

For us rather new to camping and technically illiterate, what's and EMS and what would it be used for.

Thanks

**hankpage** · 03-30-2011, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DTJ9610

For us rather new to camping and technically illiterate, what's and EMS and what would it be used for.

Thanks

For all practical purposes it is a high tech surge protector. The Electrical Management System controls voltage and frequency of shore power supplied by campgrounds, which in many cases can be unreliable.

Bob Landry · 03-30-2011, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hankpage

For all practical purposes it is a high tech surge protector. The Electrical Management System controls voltage and frequency of shore power supplied by campgrounds, which in many cases can be unreliable.

It doesn't control it, it monitors several conditions and shuts down power to the trailer if it senses a problem. The progressive Industries version shuts down power completely. There are some more sophisticated versions that will turn of individual appliances.

DAF · 04-04-2011, 10:32 AM

As a long time RVer, I always get a laugh when I see the RVIA sticker on all RVs certifying that the unit has been built following all applicable codes and standards for plumbing and electric. We all know better!

**JRTJH** · 04-21-2011, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DAF

As a long time RVer, I always get a laugh when I see the RVIA sticker on all RVs certifying that the unit has been built following all applicable codes and standards for plumbing and electric. We all know better!

Sad to say but it appears RVIA has gone the way of many other "consumer protection organizations" They got their reputation, now all they want is the money. Matters not whether products meet "their" standards as long as the consumer pays for the sticker on the outside, RVIA is happy.....

I wonder which government overseer would handle this potential fraud?????

You may also like: