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View Full Version : What to do... What to do????


rvhammer
12-02-2012, 05:01 PM
removed....

f6bits
12-02-2012, 06:13 PM
I know it's too late, but once you take delivery, the dealer is much less motivated to solve the problem. As you discovered, it was no longer a sales department problem. In my case, I discovered a tiny issue during walkthrough and refused to drive the trailer off the lot until they replaced a broken part. They complied.

Trailers are assembled by hand in a hurry and they don't catch everything. So they rely on the customer being the final stage of quality control. Most of the time, problems are rare.

You might have to bite the bullet and drive the trailer in for inspection. Make an appointment with that warranty administrator so you won't be kept waiting and/or be without your trailer for any amount of time.

Oh, and if Keystone reads this forum, they've never admitted it. Those who care are busy enough with good customer service. Through this experience, you may discover who that person is.

rvhammer
12-02-2012, 06:50 PM
removed.....

Javi
12-03-2012, 05:24 AM
I know it's not a help but despite the 60K you spent, the trailer and its accouterments were assembled by workers who are most likely on a production bonus system with no cut back for warranty charges.. This will always lead to shoddy workmanship, especially when coupled with trailer manufacturers penchant for using 2nd in material..


Stuff like the chair issue is best dealt with at the dealer level, but if that fails a phone call to Keystone service is the way to handle the problem... or as many of us do... just fix the small stuff and learn to accept that a travel trailer isn't a custom built house that cost you $500K...

rvhammer
12-03-2012, 06:08 AM
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JRTJH
12-03-2012, 06:39 AM
rvhammer,

I completely agree with your final statement: "A shoddy seat assembly is hardly worth getting my knickers in a knot."

Life is far too short and too complicated to go around "looking for reasons to be upset" It's a product, not a loved one's life, let it go, say, "so what" and get it fixed.

My grandfather had a term I heard him say often, "What was I worried about this time a year ago." After hearing him utter that phrase in stressful situations for most of my childhood, when I was in my 20's, I asked him to explain. He simply said that when life gets rough, think about what was so terrible on this same day a year ago. It might have seemed unbearable then, but if you can't even remember what it was today, it wasn't that big a deal then either. Today is going to be next year's forgotten issue.

Smart old man, my grandfather. I'm so lucky to have known him and learned from him.

SAABDOCTOR
12-03-2012, 08:20 AM
RVHAMMER WOW YOU ARE SURE GETTING THE DEALER RUNAROUND.AND THAT IS IT Dealer. relax like you said you can fix it! I do not know how far you have to drive for this fun and games they are putting you through. as others have said sometimes it is just better to take care of it yourself. this what most of us do here. also how is the rest of the unit? you only mention this oneproblem. if that is all then you are one of the lucky ones. remeber this.. Don't sweat the small stuff..It's all small stuff!. you won't be any good if you run your blood pressure up and .... relax in another chair for now and have an adult bevverage then fix it and be proud of what you have done then go and enjoy camping and have fun!! next time you go and buy a camper you may want to pass this dealer up. good luck and happy holidays':)

fla-gypsy
12-03-2012, 09:54 AM
What to do? Contact the manufacturer and be nice, reasonable, yet firm in what is required to fix this and chances are you will get this resolved with no hassles. They may even recommend a better dealer or repair facility for you to deal with.

rvhammer
12-03-2012, 10:28 AM
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SAABDOCTOR
12-03-2012, 10:40 AM
COOL You will go and enjoy. did you contact keystone customer service.a few of them there realy do a good job with helping you out. as fla gypsy said be nice to him/her and maybe you can get some assistance or leads to a better dealer. good luck

geo
12-03-2012, 11:42 AM
Oh, I guess I'll add my 2¢.

In the past, there has been one fairly long thread concerning the speculation if Keystone monitors this Forum. I have talked with Keystone about the Forum and have learned that they are aware of this Forum but no one at Keystone is assigned the task to watch it, monitor it, or given the "work opportunity" to view it. I was told if the Forum is being watched, it is on a Keystone's employees own personal time. So, the broadcast "messages" hoping to reach Keystone via this Forum are for naught. Only Forum members and Guests are here! Along with us chickens! :D

In the mass production world of RVs, each RV has a set amount of time to be "located" at any particular "build station". When the alloted time has ended, the RV must be moved to the next station. Thus if something happens that not all the tasks are completed at one station, the workers have to hope that someone at the next station might find the time to complete the task or the RV rolls out the door with that task incomplete. If something is not completed, oops, the RV must advance along the line no matter what. Once that RV is off the production line, it waits in an adjacent lot to be towed to the designated RV dealer - there is no one with a QC checklist. If you use Google Maps and StreetView, you can look at the Keystone complex in Goshen, IN and see the assembly buildings and waiting-transport RVs.

It is my understanding that Keystone and most other RV manufacturers provide a certain "credit" to each RV dealer to quality check the RV, fix anything not done at the factory or any transportation problems, to prep it for the customer, and provide the PDI (at no charge to the customer). If anything is wrong, and is caught by the customer, that problem(s) is to be fixed by the dealer once approved by Keystone warranty (customer service), and once corrected, delivered to the customer. Note: even if "everyone knows the problem", the problem should be fixed before acceptance. Once accepted, then the warranty chain becomes longer - schedule warranty service call with dealer, dealer sends warranty request to Keystone customer service, Keystone customer service either disapproves or approves the work, but if approved, the labor and parts charges have a limit placed upon them. If Keystone must furnish parts, those are scheduled and shipped. All this has been well discussed on the Forum before. However, notice that Keystone Customer Service is in place to interact with the dealer, not the ultimate Keystone RV owner. If Keystone Customer Service is contacted by the ultimate Keystone RV owner, the solution revolves around contacting a dealer. And Keystone is neutral on dealers - it's up to the owner to decide. About the only thing I have observed is that Keystone Customer Service will send new graphics to an owner - but it is up to the owner to either apply the graphics or find someone who will.

However, Keystone Customer Service is very picky about modifications within the one year warranty period. They will repeated tell you that modifications will void the warranty on what ever item you are modifying. For that reason, personally, I would encourage anyone considering any Keystone RV modifications not to do those mods until after the one year warranty period has passed. Keystone wants any and all work on the RV to be performed by a dealer's service department and at the quoted Keystone reimbursed rate. Note: owner might incure additional charges. (I didn't follow this advice, I had to fix my own fresh water fill problem. Thus, my fresh water system from fill to pump dropped off warranty.)

Now, if one purchases a custom built or near-custom built RV, that still doesn't assure "no problems". Yes, these are more expensive RVs than the Keystone and other manufacturers RVs. Purchasing a New Horizons fifth wheel will not assure you of no problems, but you might have to return to Kansas to get something fixed! Purchasing a DRV will not assure you of no problems, but it seems like there is more acceptance between DRV dealers to quickly work on DRV fifth wheels that were not sold by that dealer. These RVs are more expensive than the Keystones, etc. But they too have problems.

Now, let me defend Keystone for a second on their furniture, then I'll be finished. Most of the Keystone RV furniture I have personally seen has been manufactured by Flair Industries. Flair Industries just is not the highest quality furniture one can find on the market. I would rate them quite a bit below Lazy-Boy in comparisons to S&B furniture. RV furniture is built to be disassembled and tranported in/out the RV door. Problems with the furniture comes back to the furniture manufacturer's warranty, just as all the other appliances in the RV do. I know, I had a poorly built sofa - just search for it on the Forum! But the furniture cannot be top line Bradd & Hall or FlexSteel, etc., and still be in line with the price point of the assigned Keystone RV level! Example: do the search of my comments on the Flair Industries sofa, and then look at the FlexSteel sofa I replaced it with. You can find the Flair sofa for around $460 on the Web - my fix of a replacement FlexSteel was $2K. (By the way, I kept the FlexSteel!)

As others have said, if you are an RV owner, just like a boat owner, etc., you have two choices - if you are handy with tools, you will be fixing a certain amount of problems yourself; if you are not handy with tools, you will be paying someone to fix something.

Ron

SAABDOCTOR
12-03-2012, 12:26 PM
geo Very well put!!

Bob Landry
12-03-2012, 12:47 PM
The lesson to be learned is that the days of doing business with a handshake are gone. If you want something done after you leave the lot, you better have an agreement in writing stating what is to be done and who committed to it. The problem in the original post, should belong to the sales department. That salesman sure didn't mind getting his commission from the sale.

I had a similar, but not as serious issue with a trailer I purchased from a dealer in League City. The letter "K" was missing on one side of my new Outback, The "tech" doing the PDI didn't even notice it, I had to bring it to his attention. The service manager told me he would order one and call me when it came in. I told him I wasn't going to pull the trailer 150 miles to get a stick-on decal applied and he could have it sent to me. I never heard from the dealer or received a decal in the mail. I ended up calling Keystone and after explaining my situation, they sent me the decal and I had it in three days. I didn't see a need to raise cane with the dealer over it, I simply talk with my checkbook and I won't buy another trailer from them because of it. I did haveone fairly serious warranty issue that my local dealer fixed under warranty, and I didn't even buy the trailer from them.(They didn't have what I was looking for). That's the difference in dealerships who are interested in having a satisfied customer and one that is simply looking for the next sale. Since then I have had a couple of minor problems that I resolved myself and all is well.