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jmgreer1
01-05-2021, 02:08 PM
I'm sure this topic has been beaten to death so I apologize. The wife wants a TT and I've been researching/reading/racking my brain to educate myself on this entirely new world. We've got some TT choices but still need to personally walk in them to make sure it's what we want. Before I get too deep, I'm looking for confirmation my tow vehicle is capable of pulling such rigs.

I have a 2017 GMC Sierra 1500 outfitted with some factory add-ons. The particulars as follows:

GVWR: 7,200
Max Payload: 1,542
Max Trailer Weight: 10,800
GCWR: 16,700
Max Tongue Weight (with WDH): 1,250

The TT we are looking at are all mid-6,000's dry. I know I'll be at the upper end of the capacity, but would you say I am too ambitious??

TIA,
JG

jsb5717
01-05-2021, 02:15 PM
Welcome aboard! And thanks for taking the time to ask this important question.

Can you tell us which trailer, specifically, you are looking at? The weight that matters for calculation is the trailer GVWR. Approx 10-15% of that weight can be used to calc pin weight.

You might be OK given the numbers you've given but more detail will help button it down.

Northofu1
01-05-2021, 02:16 PM
Hello and :wlcm: to the forum
Don't look at dry weights. Figure out how much weight you're going to put in the truck before hitching up and go from there.
Should be about 13% tongue weight of trailer gvwr. Just because you can max out doesn't mean you should. :)
Good luck

jmgreer1
01-05-2021, 02:27 PM
Hello and :wlcm: to the forum
Don't look at dry weights. Figure out how much weight you're going to put in the truck before hitching up and go from there.
Should be about 13% tongue weight of trailer gvwr. Just because you can max out doesn't mean you should. :)
Good luck
Exactly. I don't want to max out and sacrifice safety for a bigger rig.

jmgreer1
01-05-2021, 02:29 PM
Welcome aboard! And thanks for taking the time to ask this important question.

Can you tell us which trailer, specifically, you are looking at? The weight that matters for calculation is the trailer GVWR. Approx 10-15% of that weight can be used to calc pin weight.

You might be OK given the numbers you've given but more detail will help button it down.

Specifically, we like the Outback 291UBH. The Keystone specs claim 6,600 dry with trailer capacity of 1,600. They also claim a tongue weight of 655.

wiredgeorge
01-05-2021, 02:35 PM
Specifically, we like the Outback 291UBH. The Keystone specs claim 6,600 dry with trailer capacity of 1,600. They also claim a tongue weight of 655.

You are looking at a 8000 lb plus camper when actually set up to camp. Your tongue weight will be in the neighborhood of 1000 lbs. Your payload is 1500 lbs so keep your cargo and passengers in the truck to 500 lbs and you will be at the limit of what you can safely drag down the road. Another important factor is that most anything over 25 ft long will be a chore with a 1/2 ton. Some smarter folks have come up with better numbers but if you get a 30' camper it will be wiggling all over behind you and your 1/2 ton won't be a happy drive as it will be pushing. If your missus is wanting a camper and as most gals do, like what they see in bigger campers, well have her OK a more capable tow vehicle.

flybouy
01-05-2021, 02:37 PM
I'm sure this topic has been beaten to death so I apologize. The wife wants a TT and I've been researching/reading/racking my brain to educate myself on this entirely new world. We've got some TT choices but still need to personally walk in them to make sure it's what we want. Before I get too deep, I'm looking for confirmation my tow vehicle is capable of pulling such rigs.

I have a 2017 GMC Sierra 1500 outfitted with some factory add-ons. The particulars as follows:

GVWR: 7,200
Max Payload: 1,542
Max Trailer Weight: 10,800
GCWR: 16,700
Max Tongue Weight (with WDH): 1,250

The TT we are looking at are all mid-6,000's dry. I know I'll be at the upper end of the capacity, but would you say I am too ambitious??

TIA,
JG

Yes it's been discussed ad nauseum.

Let's go over the important number Max Payload. That' you say is 1,250. IF that's the correct number from the yellow sticker on the door then that's the max when the truck left the factory. Subtract any and all added equipment such as light bars, running boards, tonneau cover, bed liner, mud flaps,floor mats, infant car seats, change in the cupholder, stuff ion the glovebox, tool box, tools, etc. Then subtract the weight of occupants (include the dog if you have one) and anything you might take along for the trip like snakes, drinks, toy for a kid, etc. Now that number also won't include the WDH (weight distributing hitch) say 110 lbs.

Now the trailer. Any "mid 6K trailer empty will end up around 7- 7,500 lbs when loaded. Those empty weights don't include dealer installed battery, LP tanks, spare tire, or any of the "essential" items to use the camper like a water hose, waste dump hose, levelers or leveling blocks, water or wastewater. It also doesn't include stuff you will need like food, drinks, clothes, linens for the beds, towels, pots pans, plates, cups, coffee pot, toilet paper, toothpaste & brush, soap, shampoo, first aid kit, toys, and the list goes on.

The "standard: tongue weight for travel trailers is calculated using 10-15% of the trailer weight. Most folks use 13% as a "best guess". Since you don't have the trailer weight and can only get a true weight by driving it on a scale use the Gross trailer weight to be safe. So with your hypothetical mid 6K that's really going to end up closer to mid 7K use 7,500 X .13= 975 lbs. Add the 110 for a WDH and you're looking at a hitch weight of 1,085 lbs of your 1,250 lbs. used up before you lay your hand on the truck. I'll bet that you likely have more than the 165 lbs. of remaining payload in stuff in your truck right now.

A 1/2 ton truck is not made to haul that much weight. There's a difference between pulling and carrying a load. The max trailer weight doesn't translate to hauling a travel trailer. That number is only useful if you are pulling a hay wagon or a flatbed trailer full of lumber with very little weight on the tongue.

With such limited payload you are realistically looking at about a 5,000 lb GVW travel trailer.

wiredgeorge
01-05-2021, 02:43 PM
Read what he said again... he said his payload is 1542 and his max tongue weight is 1250 lbs with a weight distribution hitch. I don't really follow that at all; is that some number from the hitch? I seem him right at his upper edge weight wise either way.

flybouy
01-05-2021, 02:50 PM
Read what he said again... he said his payload is 1542 and his max tongue weight is 1250 lbs with a weight distribution hitch. I don't really follow that at all; is that some number from the hitch? I seem him right at his upper edge weight wise either way.

My bad for mixing that up but it really won't m,uch matter. He'll be at or over either way.

The best thing to do is load it up as if your going camping (load up the DW, kids, dog, food, ise chest, etc.) fill up the gas tank and throw the wdh in the bed of the truck and go to a CAT scale and weight the truck. Take the weight of the truck from the scale slip and subtract that number from your 7,200 lb GVW. That will be your remaining payload. You'll find that payload number will shrink amazingly fast.

Northofu1
01-05-2021, 02:55 PM
That trailer is the best part of 34 feet, too long for that truck

Hankster
01-05-2021, 04:19 PM
We pull a Keystone Bullet 261RBSWE with our similarly equipped Ram 1500 , the gvw is close to the same. The trailer has a gvwr of 7650 and our pickup handles it adequately with just the wife and I and a couple hundred pounds of gear. I am at the upper end of my payload, if not slightly over it. I would not want to have to deal with anything bigger or have a truck full of passengers unless we upgraded to a 3/4 ton truck.

JRTJH
01-05-2021, 04:24 PM
Read what he said again... he said his payload is 1542 and his max tongue weight is 1250 lbs with a weight distribution hitch. I don't really follow that at all; is that some number from the hitch? I seem him right at his upper edge weight wise either way.

It's the maximum receiver rating (with a WD hitch). I believe that receiver is rated 550 max "dead weight" hitch capacity.

jmgreer1
01-05-2021, 04:25 PM
Yes it's been discussed ad nauseum.

Let's go over the important number Max Payload. That' you say is 1,250. IF that's the correct number from the yellow sticker on the door then that's the max when the truck left the factory. Subtract any and all added equipment such as light bars, running boards, tonneau cover, bed liner, mud flaps,floor mats, infant car seats, change in the cupholder, stuff ion the glovebox, tool box, tools, etc. Then subtract the weight of occupants (include the dog if you have one) and anything you might take along for the trip like snakes, drinks, toy for a kid, etc. Now that number also won't include the WDH (weight distributing hitch) say 110 lbs.

Now the trailer. Any "mid 6K trailer empty will end up around 7- 7,500 lbs when loaded. Those empty weights don't include dealer installed battery, LP tanks, spare tire, or any of the "essential" items to use the camper like a water hose, waste dump hose, levelers or leveling blocks, water or wastewater. It also doesn't include stuff you will need like food, drinks, clothes, linens for the beds, towels, pots pans, plates, cups, coffee pot, toilet paper, toothpaste & brush, soap, shampoo, first aid kit, toys, and the list goes on.

The "standard: tongue weight for travel trailers is calculated using 10-15% of the trailer weight. Most folks use 13% as a "best guess". Since you don't have the trailer weight and can only get a true weight by driving it on a scale use the Gross trailer weight to be safe. So with your hypothetical mid 6K that's really going to end up closer to mid 7K use 7,500 X .13= 975 lbs. Add the 110 for a WDH and you're looking at a hitch weight of 1,085 lbs of your 1,250 lbs. used up before you lay your hand on the truck. I'll bet that you likely have more than the 165 lbs. of remaining payload in stuff in your truck right now.

A 1/2 ton truck is not made to haul that much weight. There's a difference between pulling and carrying a load. The max trailer weight doesn't translate to hauling a travel trailer. That number is only useful if you are pulling a hay wagon or a flatbed trailer full of lumber with very little weight on the tongue.

With such limited payload you are realistically looking at about a 5,000 lb GVW travel trailer.

I appreciate the comments, albeit, not the ones I would prefer. I hoped for more and I'm surprised at the estimations on the weight of gear brought along in the truck and TT. Jumping up to 3/4 ton truck more than doubles payload capacity, which seems to be the most limiting factor. I was hoping to make do with what I already have.

jmgreer1
01-05-2021, 04:34 PM
Payload was printed on the door sticker. The max tongue weight (with WDH) was noted in my owners manual at 1,250. Conventional hitch dropped the max tongue weight down to 800.

wiredgeorge
01-05-2021, 04:36 PM
I appreciate the comments, albeit, not the ones I would prefer. I hoped for more and I'm surprised at the estimations on the weight of gear brought along in the truck and TT. Jumping up to 3/4 ton truck more than doubles payload capacity, which seems to be the most limiting factor. I was hoping to make do with what I already have.

When we go to an RV show (a pre Covid thing as I recall) my wife is always drawn to the 44' fifth wheels with two bath rooms and the front living room. How good the ergonomics of a trailer is is more or less proportional to the room in the trailer. That is why my wife feels an affinity for the big trailers. Of course the floor plan and lay out are also a big factor but there is only so much that can be done with a 19' trailer and add a few more feet, even more can be done. If you folks are serious about camping, perhaps buy used for the first trailer to get a better idea of what is really important and if not used but new, then get a truck that meets the minimum ergonomics that you and your spouse are comfortable with. For my wife and myself as once a month campers about 30' fifth wheel is right as it meets our minimum needs. Yours will obviously be different. Also consider where you will be camping as in Texas two AC units are more or less a must in triple digit temps.

jmgreer1
01-05-2021, 04:45 PM
When we go to an RV show (a pre Covid thing as I recall) my wife is always drawn to the 44' fifth wheels with two bath rooms and the front living room. How good the ergonomics of a trailer is is more or less proportional to the room in the trailer. That is why my wife feels an affinity for the big trailers. Of course the floor plan and lay out are also a big factor but there is only so much that can be done with a 19' trailer and add a few more feet, even more can be done. If you folks are serious about camping, perhaps buy used for the first trailer to get a better idea of what is really important and if not used but new, then get a truck that meets the minimum ergonomics that you and your spouse are comfortable with. For my wife and myself as once a month campers about 30' fifth wheel is right as it meets our minimum needs. Yours will obviously be different. Also consider where you will be camping as in Texas two AC units are more or less a must in triple digit temps.

Campers would be myself, wife, and two children (11,6) so we are drawn to the bunkhouse models. We live in south MS and are familiar with high temps (plus humidity) so 2 A/C units are a must. The trips we would like to take could take us anywhere from SW USA to NE USA, but we have yet to take a trip still...

flybouy
01-05-2021, 05:00 PM
Campers would be myself, wife, and two children (11,6) so we are drawn to the bunkhouse models. We live in south MS and are familiar with high temps (plus humidity) so 2 A/C units are a must. The trips we would like to take could take us anywhere from SW USA to NE USA, but we have yet to take a trip still...

You have things to think about and consider for sure. Don't be fooled by the 3/4 ton capacity unless you really look into it. Most diesel 3/4 ton trucks don't have much more payload than some 1/2 tons. It depends on configuration, i.e. crew cab, super cab, single cab, 4 WD or 2 WD and trim levels all effect payload.

If you are seriously considering upgrading your truck I'd suggest considering a 1 ton. Not much more money and with kids that age they will dpo nothing but grow and want to bring along friends and more toys. With a 1 ton you have the capacity to grow into a fifth wheel without chasing another truck right away.

Asking the questions, and not being angry at the answers are the right direction. No one will have a good time if the trailers pushing the truck around and you're on edge driving a "white knuckle" handful dreading every truck that passes by and pushes you toward the shoulder then sucks you back into the next lane. Many of us here have BTGT.

Good luck in your new adventures and stay safe.

notanlines
01-06-2021, 01:58 AM
All things considered, it would be my opinion that you don't have enough truck for that trailer. The RV weighs too much, it is considerably too long, and your pickup, while not so light as to be classified as a 'grocery-getter,' is very, very much a lightweight.
I've read all the comments above and I agree with almost every one. Three very important things to take away from this thread:
Yellow sticker 'cargo capacity should not exceed' number is king
CAT scales are your friend
1/2 ton pickups have no business towing 34' trailers

Hankster
01-06-2021, 05:29 AM
While I am definitely not one to advocate that half ton trucks arent capable of safely hauling anything over a popup camper I concur with the others here, and I believe that that combination is definitely one I would not recommend, . EspecialEspecially and their guaranteed extras are being added to the equipment pile. You are entering the realm of 3/4 ton tow vehicle with that combination.

bbells
01-10-2021, 08:26 AM
My experience offers a simple answer. If you want a comfortable tow, get a trailer that has a loaded weight 1/2 of your truck's tow capacity. Plus, spend the extra money to get a better wd hitch with sway control built in. Your drive will be more comfortable. Better gas mileage. Easier to park. I went from a 26ft to an 18ft with my half ton and I now enjoy the trip.

Mikelff
01-10-2021, 10:48 AM
You are asking the right questions BEFORE you buy. I agree with most of the recommendations. Shorter smaller TT OR a bigger truck. If you want something around 30’, its at least a 3/2 ton truck for sure. Me, I would buy a late model, low mileage, used 3/4 ton. Let the original owner take the largest depreciation hit. Good luck and safe travels.

bbells
01-10-2021, 11:43 AM
My experience offers a simple answer. If you want a comfortable tow, get a trailer that has a loaded weight 1/2 of your truck's tow capacity. Plus, spend the extra money to get a better wd hitch with sway control built in. Your drive will be more comfortable. Better gas mileage. Easier to park. I went from a 26ft to an 18ft with my half ton and I now enjoy the trip.

Oh, remember kids love tenting it while you are in the RV.

Gunny Mike
01-10-2021, 12:04 PM
We full timed in the Dallas area for thee years and we just had one AC unit. Having two AC units is definitely a must during the summer if their is no shade.

Robert Campbell
01-11-2021, 04:17 AM
That is WAY too much camper for your truck. It is that simple. Don't let an RV sells person convince you otherwise. I agree with a previous reply in that you should purchase a TT 25 ft and under. Good luck with your purchase.

P&DZ
01-11-2021, 07:08 AM
JMgear1
Welcome to the forum. You have received some great advice from very knowledgeable members on how to calculate the safe towing capacity for your truck.
I own a similar truck albeit my payload is a bit higher at 1,925lbs. My Cougar 21RBSWE has a GVWR of 7,200. My CAT scale weight for the TT fully loaded for a two week trip is 6,600. In my experience I would not want to tow any more with my 2018 GMC 1/2 ton. Just my input.

travelin texans
01-11-2021, 08:31 AM
We full timed in the Dallas area for thee years and we just had one AC unit. Having two AC units is definitely a must during the summer if their is no shade.

Would never purchase any rv over 24' without 2 acs, one is NOT enough if camping in high temps.

wiredgeorge
01-11-2021, 09:15 AM
Would never purchase any rv over 24' without 2 acs, one is NOT enough if camping in high temps.

Many campers in the 24-30' range don't come with a 50A / second A/C option. That will require some research. We use a 14K BTU portable exhausted out a window and do fine in conjunction with our 15K BTU Brisk II.

Javi
01-11-2021, 09:25 AM
Many campers in the 24-30' range don't come with a 50A / second A/C option. That will require some research. We use a 14K BTU portable exhausted out a window and do fine in conjunction with our 15K BTU Brisk II.

Our old Passport 2890RL did just fine with one 15K A/C... The 333MKS Cougar 5th wheel would cool the bottom with 1 15K if we kept the bedroom door shut.. but the bedroom was hot and we were glad to have the 13.5 in the bedroom..

The Avalanche has two 15K's on it.. in full sun and 108` this past summer it was a tad bit warm but not uncomfortable..

BobD
01-11-2021, 11:26 AM
You might look at the Passport Ultra Lite line. We have a 2010 2850RL that we love. It is quoted at 5,095 lbs dry and a load capacity a bit over 2k. The tongue wt is quoted at 650 lbs. A properly equipped 1/2 ton should be able to handle that. We use a Curt weight-distribution hitch and have easily towed that all over the mid-west and mountain states regions for 3 years with a 2010 Chevy Avalanche, 5.3L V8.



That said, after reading the weight limit posts for the past year, I finally weighed the truck, then truck and trailer and found I was over loaded by 150 pounds or so. But a 1/2 truck has more weight capability than the Avalanche, which is essentially a Suburban with a pickup bed. We loved the versatility and ride of the Avalanche, but traded it for a new 2500 HD this fall so we have plenty of margin for our current trailer plus capability for a larger trailer should we decide at some point to go that route.

mjsibe
01-11-2021, 12:06 PM
Often overlooked are Chevy or GMC Full size Passenger vans.
I tow a Passport 3100Rk
I think the GVW on the trailer is 7400.
( it's covered now)
My 2014 Express 3500 Passenger van 6.0 gas
Payload is 3342 lbs.
Tow compasity 9700 lbs.
Ball Park 1k hitch weight fully loaded.
Something to think about with a few kids & there stuff
Combined GVW 16000 LBS.
Maxed out for a 6 week trip truck scales had me @ 13756 lbs.
Well with in the comfort zone

jxnbbl
01-12-2021, 08:31 AM
First the most valuable resource on this topic was to watch the following video:


https://www.keepyourdaydream.com/payload/


From my perspective I've towed trailers (boats and large snowmobile/utility) my entire life, but never owned an TT. And we set out and bought a TT early fall for the first time. I did the research prior to pulling the trigger with our 2016 ram ecodiesel at the TV option. We eliminated trailers anything above 5500/7500ish dry/gross and 700 hitch.


We were buying this for long term use with grandchildren (bunks) + fold out for their parents and us. Short term we wanted this for our first/only (maybe) 3800 rt mile to our son's wedding. We would have eliminated what you are looking at and had VERY limited selection due to inventory but luckily found a Bullet 273bhs which seems to fall into the ballpark of what you are looking for. It is a bit smaller, but probably due to the lack of outdoor kitchen and bunk house instead of bunks with curtains it is lighter than just being a bit shorter.


We bought it pulled it a number of miles in the NH White Mountains (where we live) so that I could get use to handling it. The combination was fine and if 1. our first trip wasn't 3800 miles RT, 2. our long term use probably will be only longer trips with grandchildren (we live in a vacation area) 3. didn't want to be counting pounds especially when bringing a couple of extra people in the tow vehicle and maybe the entire groups luggage in the TT 4. it was about family (easy to convince my wife) 5. was somewhat in the market for a new truck. We decided to get a larger truck.


Next came the availability thing AGAIN -it wasn't easy to find a 1 ton and pretty difficult to find a 3/4 ton that we wanted (we wanted a Cummins diesel). Due to covid/various reasons it created a supply/demand thing that it was hard to work a deal on anything. We ended up with a Ram 2500 Cummings Crew Cab and its a great package. My "one an done" wife is hooked and our next trip will be a 'long trip to nowhere' (no plans wake up and just plan 1 day at a time).


Anyways, i ended up with the new truck but if you go through that video it would have been a prerequisite if the target purchase was the TT that you are looking at.

Beast2017
01-18-2021, 03:37 PM
I'm sure this topic has been beaten to death so I apologize. The wife wants a TT and I've been researching/reading/racking my brain to educate myself on this entirely new world. We've got some TT choices but still need to personally walk in them to make sure it's what we want. Before I get too deep, I'm looking for confirmation my tow vehicle is capable of pulling such rigs.

I have a 2017 GMC Sierra 1500 outfitted with some factory add-ons. The particulars as follows:

GVWR: 7,200
Max Payload: 1,542
Max Trailer Weight: 10,800
GCWR: 16,700
Max Tongue Weight (with WDH): 1,250

The TT we are looking at are all mid-6,000's dry. I know I'll be at the upper end of the capacity, but would you say I am too ambitious??

TIA,
JG

You might be ok - hitch capacity and payload may be maxed or slightly over. My last TT was 31’ and 7400 loaded with a hitch weight of 1160. That’s a lot for a 1/2 ton truck. I’ve upgraded my TV now though because I also upgraded the camper. TV is now a F350 6.7

Ibdagriz
01-20-2021, 01:12 PM
I have a 2017 GMC Sierra 1500 outfitted with some factory add-ons. The particulars as follows:

GVWR: 7,200
Max Payload: 1,542
Max Trailer Weight: 10,800
GCWR: 16,700
Max Tongue Weight (with WDH): 1,250

The TT we are looking at are all mid-6,000's dry. I know I'll be at the upper end of the capacity, but would you say I am too ambitious??

TIA,
JG

I'd highly recommend renting a couple in various sizes from 24' to 30' and see how they pull/feel behind your vehicle. I have a 35' TT and pull it behind an F-250 because it is 9k loaded to camp with 1400 lbs on the hitch.

Griz

Marke
01-20-2021, 01:57 PM
Campers would be myself, wife, and two children (11,6) so we are drawn to the bunkhouse models. We live in south MS and are familiar with high temps (plus humidity) so 2 A/C units are a must. The trips we would like to take could take us anywhere from SW USA to NE USA, but we have yet to take a trip still...

Hello from a fellow south Mississippian.

Bill2e
01-25-2021, 04:53 PM
Good job asking these questions now rather than before you buy your camper.

Most of the pertinent information has been covered here. I recently bought a single rear wheel ram 3500 short bed in hopes of buying a new fifth wheel.

I looked at all the numbers and knew I’d be fine, but I neglected to look at the payload capacity.

After much research I ended up canceling the order for the 42 foot fifth wheeler Wheeler.

Fortunately we still have a keystone cougar 27SAB. Which I found out I was overloading my old ram 1500.

It had a tow capacity of 8800, which why we purchased he 6600 lbs Cougar. The Payload was only 1800. 900 hitch weight takes me down to 900 for me, my wife, daughter, two dogs all our stuff in the bed, hitch, tools, cooler of food and beer. You get the idea.

Disappointed we can’t get the fifth wheel we wanted, but happy a have a much SAFER truck to pull out Cougar.

Good luck, but it may be time to consider a 2500.

Bill2e
01-25-2021, 05:17 PM
First the most valuable resource on this topic was to watch the following video:


https://www.keepyourdaydream.com/payload/


From my perspective I've towed trailers (boats and large snowmobile/utility) my entire life, but never owned an TT. And we set out and bought a TT early fall for the first time. I did the research prior to pulling the trigger with our 2016 ram ecodiesel at the TV option. We eliminated trailers anything above 5500/7500ish dry/gross and 700 hitch.


We were buying this for long term use with grandchildren (bunks) + fold out for their parents and us. Short term we wanted this for our first/only (maybe) 3800 rt mile to our son's wedding. We would have eliminated what you are looking at and had VERY limited selection due to inventory but luckily found a Bullet 273bhs which seems to fall into the ballpark of what you are looking for. It is a bit smaller, but probably due to the lack of outdoor kitchen and bunk house instead of bunks with curtains it is lighter than just being a bit shorter.


We bought it pulled it a number of miles in the NH White Mountains (where we live) so that I could get use to handling it. The combination was fine and if 1. our first trip wasn't 3800 miles RT, 2. our long term use probably will be only longer trips with grandchildren (we live in a vacation area) 3. didn't want to be counting pounds especially when bringing a couple of extra people in the tow vehicle and maybe the entire groups luggage in the TT 4. it was about family (easy to convince my wife) 5. was somewhat in the market for a new truck. We decided to get a larger truck.


Next came the availability thing AGAIN -it wasn't easy to find a 1 ton and pretty difficult to find a 3/4 ton that we wanted (we wanted a Cummins diesel). Due to covid/various reasons it created a supply/demand thing that it was hard to work a deal on anything. We ended up with a Ram 2500 Cummings Crew Cab and its a great package. My "one an done" wife is hooked and our next trip will be a 'long trip to nowhere' (no plans wake up and just plan 1 day at a time).


Anyways, i ended up with the new truck but if you go through that video it would have been a prerequisite if the target purchase was the TT that you are looking at.



This is a great video to break it all down.

RVDad89
02-08-2021, 05:45 PM
I'm new to the forum and ONLY giving my experience, new to heavy towing! I have a 2020 F150, 4WD and max tow, and we just purchased an Outback 341RD which weights 8450 dry and 10500 GVWR. We just picked up the TT last week and towed it home approx 150miles. The F150 handled the trailer fine, minimal sway and no issues with pulling power. There was a bit more squat than I wanted, even though the dealer set the TT and hitch up and the truck sits "level", so I ordered and installed Summo rear springs to help. I haven't had a chance to hook up the trailer and see how it sits but we're heading out Friday so we'll see. I was concerned when I saw the size of the TT with the truck connected but I'm happy with how well it handed the TT. I've towed many trailers but nothing this heavy or length, 38'8"! Please don't beat me up, I'm new to this but just wanted to share my experience so far! Thanks!

JRTJH
02-08-2021, 06:27 PM
I'm new to the forum and ONLY giving my experience, new to heavy towing! I have a 2020 F150, 4WD and max tow, and we just purchased an Outback 341RD which weights 8450 dry and 10500 GVWR. We just picked up the TT last week and towed it home approx 150miles. The F150 handled the trailer fine, minimal sway and no issues with pulling power. There was a bit more squat than I wanted, even though the dealer set the TT and hitch up and the truck sits "level", so I ordered and installed Summo rear springs to help. I haven't had a chance to hook up the trailer and see how it sits but we're heading out Friday so we'll see. I was concerned when I saw the size of the TT with the truck connected but I'm happy with how well it handed the TT. I've towed many trailers but nothing this heavy or length, 38'8"! Please don't beat me up, I'm new to this but just wanted to share my experience so far! Thanks!

Your signature says you've got a F150 3.6L engine ???

Regardless, I'd urge you, when you get everything packed and ready for the weekend, I'd tow across the nearest CAT scale to get some "real world numbers" for your rig. You may be OK, you may just as likely be overloaded on either the receiver, the rear axle or possibly the front axle. It's always better to know for sure and make appropriate decisions than to wonder or worse, do the "head in the sand" thing.... Hopefully, you're OK in all categories.

Gunny Mike
02-08-2021, 06:31 PM
We have an Outback 341 RD as well and we tow it with a 2006 F250. I'm using an equalizer hitch and I have some squat as well. Dealer setup as well. Keep me posted on your spring upgrade as I'm looking at upgrading the rear-end as well. Towing with a F150 I would stick to lower elevations and keep it out of the mountains.

markcee
02-08-2021, 06:31 PM
I'm new to the forum and ONLY giving my experience, new to heavy towing! I have a 2020 F150, 4WD and max tow, and we just purchased an Outback 341RD which weights 8450 dry and 10500 GVWR. We just picked up the TT last week and towed it home approx 150miles. The F150 handled the trailer fine, minimal sway and no issues with pulling power. There was a bit more squat than I wanted, even though the dealer set the TT and hitch up and the truck sits "level", so I ordered and installed Summo rear springs to help. I haven't had a chance to hook up the trailer and see how it sits but we're heading out Friday so we'll see. I was concerned when I saw the size of the TT with the truck connected but I'm happy with how well it handed the TT. I've towed many trailers but nothing this heavy or length, 38'8"! Please don't beat me up, I'm new to this but just wanted to share my experience so far! Thanks!

That's a really big trailer for a 1/2 ton! Your trailer's GVWR is just above 10K. At 13%, your tongue weight alone will be around 1300 pounds. What is your truck's payload ("cargo and passengers should not exceed......") capacity as listed on the yellow/white sticker on the driver's door jamb?

The tongue weight above, approximately 100 lbs for the hitch, the weight of you and all other passengers, pets, add-ons such as tonneau cover, toolbox, plus all other cargo such as firewood etc. carried in the truck all need to be deducted from your truck's stickered payload. If you exceed this stickered payload, you are over loading the truck. You will also likely be close to or exceeding your truck's rear axle rating. I had a 2019 F150 max tow when we bought our current travel trailer (GVWR 9500 lbs) and I was about 20 lbs under it's rear axle rating when CAT scaled. Be aware that while Sumo springs or Timbrens or airbags will level out your ride, they do not increase the vehicle's payload/carrying capacity.

In addition to the weight issue, the long length of that trailer will be difficult for an F150 to handle, particularly in windy conditions or should you need to make an emergency stop/maneuver.

Sure don't want to make you upset, but I've been in your situation myself - with a 6' shorter trailer with 500 lb. less GVWR. It was a real chore to even be close to 'legal' and it was only 2 of us and 2 small dogs in the truck, with essentially zero cargo in the bed.

LHaven
02-08-2021, 06:42 PM
That's a really big trailer for a 1/2 ton! Your trailer's GVWR is just above 10K. At 13%, your tongue weight alone will be around 1300 pounds. What is your truck's payload ("cargo and passengers should not exceed......") capacity as listed on the yellow/white sticker on the driver's door jamb?

The tongue weight above, approximately 100 lbs for the hitch, the weight of you and all other passengers, pets, add-ons such as tonneau cover, toolbox, plus all other cargo such as firewood etc. carried in the truck all need to be deducted from your truck's stickered payload.

The payload on my F-150 (with no extra comfort packages or options) was 1726, and with 4WD would have been lower.
I suspect this setup is in the orange zone.

RVDad89
02-08-2021, 06:44 PM
Thanks to all for the info, I really appreciate it! I planned to hit the scales this weekend on our trip! The highest towing capacity for the F150 is with the 3.6L twin turbo. The door sticker says 12,500 and it was verified by the dealer. Ford says the tongue weight allowed is %10 so I might be a tad over that but well within the towing capacity. We will be heading through the mountains this weekend so I'll post after on how we did, I may be trading up to a 250. We had a different TT picked out be then saw this model and fell in love! I realized it would be pushing the limits of our truck and hopefully it works out! I have to give the dealer credit, they recommended the hitch they sell and I bit, minimal sway, way less than I expected!! The hitch isn't the traditional friction sway it is a solid bar connected straight to the hitch so really can't sway!

sourdough
02-08-2021, 06:52 PM
Thanks to all for the info, I really appreciate it! I planned to hit the scales this weekend on our trip! The highest towing capacity for the F150 is with the 3.6L twin turbo. The door sticker says 12,500 and it was verified by the dealer. Ford says the tongue weight allowed is %10 so I might be a tad over that but well within the towing capacity. We will be heading through the mountains this weekend so I'll post after on how we did, I may be trading up to a 250. We had a different TT picked out be then saw this model and fell in love! I realized it would be pushing the limits of our truck and hopefully it works out!


Realize that the "towing capacity" of the truck is not pertinent. Your other weights will get you first; payload, gawrs, gvwr, gcvwr etc. The "towing" capacity is a sales number to draw folks in to buy a cheaper truck with ads saying they can do far more than they can.

What is the payload listed on the black/yellow/white sticker inside the driver door? THAT is the beginning number to start with. Look at the sticker on the front driver side of the trailer; what is the total of the unloaded trailer weight vs carrying capacity (gvw)? "Pulling" the trailer up and over anything has absolutely nothing with its ability to "carry" and support that load safely.

LHaven
02-08-2021, 06:52 PM
Thanks to all for the info, I really appreciate it! I planned to hit the scales this weekend on our trip! The highest towing capacity for the F150 is with the 3.6L twin turbo. The door sticker says 12,500 and it was verified by the dealer. Ford says the tongue weight allowed is %10 so I might be a tad over that but well within the towing capacity.

Dealers always push the "towing capacity." It's a meaningless figure, unless what you're towing has a wheel in all four corners... and RVs don't.

The figure you always exceed first is payload. And 10% is... well, advantageous to the dealer. The ideal range is 10-15%, which is why we use 13%.

If you're interested in plugging your configuration into a worksheet, there's a good one here (http://changingears.com/rv-sec-calc-trailer-weight-tt.shtml). You'll get unbiased results, and you'll understand where all the skeletons are.

markcee
02-08-2021, 07:00 PM
Thanks to all for the info, I really appreciate it! I planned to hit the scales this weekend on our trip! The highest towing capacity for the F150 is with the 3.6L twin turbo. The door sticker says 12,500 and it was verified by the dealer. Ford says the tongue weight allowed is %10 so I might be a tad over that but well within the towing capacity. We will be heading through the mountains this weekend so I'll post after on how we did, I may be trading up to a 250. We had a different TT picked out be then saw this model and fell in love! I realized it would be pushing the limits of our truck and hopefully it works out!

The sticker below is the one I am talking about. See what number yours shows. That 12.5K brochure 'towing capacity' is a largely meaningless number in regards to TT/5th wheel towing as it's calculated with a load of cinder blocks on a flat trailer - not a 12' high 'sail'.

I would urge you to use great caution - particularly in mountain towing. We live in AZ and to state the obvious, the difference in pulling our trailer up/down grades is night and day between the 1/2 ton and 1 ton. Even in our brief stint with the F150 there were a couple of white knuckle moments where I really felt like the trailer was driving the truck!

RVDad89
02-08-2021, 07:06 PM
Well it seems I'm a bit ignorant about the more important numbers of towing, my bad! I'll check the payload capacity on the door sticker tomorrow and go from there! Thanks for the information I don't want to be unsafe in any way I just had no idea about the importance of those other numbers! I would like to plug my trucks numbers into a spreadsheet to see, it's on this website?

Again I truly appreciate all the info, always learning!

sourdough
02-08-2021, 07:13 PM
The numbers are numerous and can be confusing. The key is to know what they all are and make sure that your rig fits within them all; it's not a pick one or the other - you have to know and meet them all. Good luck.

LHaven
02-08-2021, 07:39 PM
I would like to plug my trucks numbers into a spreadsheet to see, it's on this website?

The link is in my previous post, just click the words.

JDDilly
02-09-2021, 06:21 AM
It can be confusing. I got caught by this about a year ago when we purchased our HC 381TH. Took one trip and traded my 2500 SRW for a 3500 DRW. Made a huge difference and I am much more relaxed when towing.

Check your numbers and move forward from there.

RVDad89
02-09-2021, 11:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LHaven View Post
Dealers always push the "towing capacity." It's a meaningless figure, unless what you're towing has a wheel in all four corners... and RVs don't.

The figure you always exceed first is payload. And 10% is... well, advantageous to the dealer. The ideal range is 10-15%, which is why we use 13%.

If you're interested in plugging your configuration into a worksheet, there's a good one here. You'll get unbiased results, and you'll understand where all the skeletons are. Quote


Again thanks for all the info/input I really appreciate the help! I ran the numbers in the worksheet and it came back with max TT as 8497, DOH! That's what the 341RD weighs dry! So what does that mean? Frustrating to say the least, what good is the towing capacity then? I specifically picked the F150 due to the highest capacity in the 1500 market! I had 2-3 RV dealers tell me subtract 10% from max capacity and that's plenty safety buffer with the right WDH!!

LHaven
02-09-2021, 01:51 PM
I ran the numbers in the worksheet and it came back with max TT as 8497, DOH! That's what the 341RD weighs dry! So what does that mean? Frustrating to say the least, what good is the towing capacity then?

Well, if you ever needed to tow a choo-choo train (https://www.cnn.com/videos/business/2019/07/23/ford-f150-electric-pulls-train-cars-ge-lon-orig.cnn-business), Bob's your uncle.

I specifically picked the F150 due to the highest capacity in the 1500 market! I had 2-3 RV dealers tell me subtract 10% from max capacity and that's plenty safety buffer with the right WDH!!

Yup, as did many of us. Dealers earn money by selling trucks. And a lot of them know less than the buyer does about trailering. (I had one that kept correcting me every time I used the term "tongue weight" -- he insisted it was "pin weight." Yeah, if I had a 5th wheel, but I don't. And then the payload percentage would be even greater, and he'd fail it worse.)

WDH matters in only two cases -- to keep the steering tires properly loaded, and to unload the rear axle if that's a problem. In many cases with trailers in the 8-9K range, the rear axle is quite happy, but the payload is used up. (We use the WDH anyway to keep the steering happy.)

It's a shame that the natural order of things is to buy a trailer, perhaps buy a truck, and then join a trailering forum. If we could just get the world to work backwards there, we could save a lot of RV owners a lot of grief.

SummitPond
02-10-2021, 02:42 PM
<snip>
Again thanks for all the info/input I really appreciate the help! I ran the numbers in the worksheet and it came back with max TT as 8497, DOH! That's what the 341RD weighs dry! So what does that mean? Frustrating to say the least, what good is the towing capacity then? I specifically picked the F150 due to the highest capacity in the 1500 market! I had 2-3 RV dealers tell me subtract 10% from max capacity and that's plenty safety buffer with the right WDH!!

You mentioned you might upgrade to a 250. Others will tell you that a 350 is not that much more expensive. I wish I would have known when we bought our truck (used).

wiredgeorge
02-10-2021, 04:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LHaven View Post
Dealers always push the "towing capacity." It's a meaningless figure, unless what you're towing has a wheel in all four corners... and RVs don't.

The figure you always exceed first is payload. And 10% is... well, advantageous to the dealer. The ideal range is 10-15%, which is why we use 13%.

If you're interested in plugging your configuration into a worksheet, there's a good one here. You'll get unbiased results, and you'll understand where all the skeletons are. Quote


Again thanks for all the info/input I really appreciate the help! I ran the numbers in the worksheet and it came back with max TT as 8497, DOH! That's what the 341RD weighs dry! So what does that mean? Frustrating to say the least, what good is the towing capacity then? I specifically picked the F150 due to the highest capacity in the 1500 market! I had 2-3 RV dealers tell me subtract 10% from max capacity and that's plenty safety buffer with the right WDH!!


RVDad89, What good is the "towing capacity". In the real world NOTHING. In the heavy duty truck shoot outs in magazines what compare these numbers; well bragging rights. Ever hear a truck commercial on the television claiming HIGHEST TOWING CAPACITY IN ITS CLASS? It is a sales ploy to make you think you have the biggest ability to tow compared to other trucks in the same class. And the trucks they talk about ain't yours. They are some specially equipped and stripped model made just to come up with a number and the number is obtained by testing that is meaningless in the real world. Who pulls a flat bed trailer with blocks? Best selling, most durable, highest owner satisfaction... the list goes on.

nellie1289
02-10-2021, 04:50 PM
It is my opinion that they use this "towing capacity" as a marketing ploy too, and that they are always underrating the "tow capacity". Does anyone really think that the tow capacity of 2013 ram, same chassis, same HO engine, aisin tranny, was magically transformed to 2020, when the max towing is suddenly 6,000 lbs more than it was, with no suspension, tranny, or engine changes? they always hold some back so they can boost it each year until the next model comes out. That being said, the payload never changes on this same example, cause it cant "take more" until they actually redesign it. I cant prove this, but I personally think it is 100% fact.

Jim2366
02-10-2021, 07:17 PM
I watched this video tonight before reading this and thought it was really good and getting a handle on the weight ratings and terms.

https://youtu.be/zCxyJL94rJQ

MarkEHansen
02-11-2021, 11:58 AM
RVDad89 - really sorry to see you fall into this trap. The same thing happened to us. Before we knew about the weight numbers and how to interpret them, the RV dealer said our previous vehicle was plenty big enough to tow our current trailer.

It was not. It more than just what it can pull with the engine/turbo. The truck needs to be able to manage the load as well. Especially in emergency situations, like when blowing a tire (on the truck or on the trailer), quick diversions to avoid animals jumping out in front of you, etc.

The other thing is the length of the trailer. On a light-weight truck like the 150/1500, it will cause a lot of sway. Just search youTube for trailer sway crashes to see what these look like. For a trailer that size (both weight and length) you really need a heaver truck, like the 250/2500 or better, the 350/3500.

Ask your questions - everyone is here to help you.

Good luck.

Weldon
03-03-2021, 08:13 AM
I really hate to stick my neck out here, since I'm a new TT owner and drive a 1500 RAM with the 5.7 Hemi. But maybe by doing so, a potential TT buyer won't do what i did. Our dealer told me it would be "no problem" on a Friday at 4:00 pm for me to pull our TT home, even though I had (a) no sway bars and (b) no WDH. Plus I had my 9-yr old daughter riding with me. I white knuckled the TT to our storage facility at 45 mph, dropped my daughter off at home, then went directly to HF and bought the WHD and 2 sway bar control kits. Dealing with our small time dealer was a great experience, but he could have gotten myself and my daughter killed by telling us that we could pull the TT 2-hours on major interstates with "no problem" using only my ball hitch. I look back at that now and thank my guardian angels for getting us home safely.

I have the build sheet for my truck, and all the #s for our TT. I used the calculator that was posted above, and thankfully, we fall within specs. I always drive with the tanks dry. I've had no problem pulling our TT but have been nervous several times through places like Blood Mountain near Helen, GA. Very curvy and hilly. On a very windy day on flat interstate roads, I can feel the TT sway, but a gentle tap of the breaks brings it back. With the 2 sway bars and the WDH, pulling the TT doesn't frazzle my nerves anymore, but the first 2 or 3 trips were intense.

To me, driving with a TT is like driving a motorcycle...you look ahead and side to side, watching for the stuff that is likely to make you lock up the brakes or have to swerve. I've found that most of the times that I've almost wrecked were the results of other folks, and only by watching everything around me, could i avoid a bad situation. In other words, be patient, be present, and be persistent. My TT can be replaced, but my family cannot.

travelin texans
03-03-2021, 08:37 AM
I got severely scolded yesterday on another forum when a fellow said he'd traded his TT for a 30'+ 10k lb 5th wheel & looking for a good hitch for his F150. I made the remark that he should check the numbers & do some calculations on towing that much rv with a F150. That got me a scolding from a moderator telling me that my remarks about weight had absolutely nothing to do with the question asked. Then from OP that stated it was well within all the numbers, he had driven trucks, knew all about weights & didn't need to do any calculations. So then he decides he's putting in an automatic slider hitch for another 200-300 lbs in the bed of that F150. I told them I was only concerned for their safety & everyone else on the highway with them.
What say you? Should I have kept my nose out of it?

Weldon
03-03-2021, 08:44 AM
I got severely scolded yesterday on another forum when a fellow said he'd traded his TT for a 30'+ 10k lb 5th wheel & looking for a good hitch for his F150. I made the remark that he should check the numbers & do some calculations on towing that much rv with a F150. That got me a scolding from a moderator telling me that my remarks about weight had absolutely nothing to do with the question asked. Then from OP that stated it was well within all the numbers, he had driven trucks, knew all about weights & didn't need to do any calculations. So then he decides he's putting in an automatic slider hitch for another 200-300 lbs in the bed of that F150. I told them I was only concerned for their safety & everyone else on the highway with them.
What say you? Should I have kept my nose out of it?

Not if you truly believe he could have endangered himself or others. I think you did the right thing.

sourdough
03-03-2021, 09:25 AM
Danny, I too belong to several other RV forums. Some I have no doubt do not like to address weight - everyone is supposed to be a "happy camper" and the forum is to revel in whatever it is you have or do...period. Sort of like a Ram forum, Cummings forum, Ford forum etc. All are "beasts" and no matter what you do or discuss everything is "hunky dory".

The above attitude I truly believe is one of the primary reasons we see SO many folks overloaded with RVs that should never be on a particular truck - why so many think if you have a 3/4 ton with diesel you can pull the Titanic and you should never look further. A problem in and of themselves IMO.

This forum has lots of new members. As we see we are getting more and more with different brands. Of all the forums I'm on this one stresses weight issues by far the most. Personally I think it is pretty much a mandate to inform folks of potential problems, some possibly life threatening, for their families. I think it is a disservice to the member and their family to completely ignore the viper about to bite them in the neck because they don't see it. As we see in the posts from members that have asked, and many that haven't, they appreciate those things being pointed out. Generally they were completely unaware and would have been had one of us not pointed it out then explain how, and why, you calculate the numbers and what they mean.

As far as I'm concerned you didn't do anything wrong by advising the poster of your concerns and what to check - I think it is trying to take care of a fellow RVer. The mod sounds like another forum I'm on, maybe the same one; nothing should be said about anything that might make someone question anything they've said or think - YOU are at fault. I've gotten those scoldings and PMs as well - Oh well, the truth is the truth and trying to help is a good thing IMO.

flybouy
03-03-2021, 09:39 AM
Agree with the Dannys! I look at it like this.... it's the same as if my neighbor's kid asks for advice on his car repair. He asks me to look at the brake rotor. I walk over there and in the sloped driveway he has his car jacked up with the toy scissors jack that came with the car. No other support. He sticks his head under the rotor anmd says "what do you think?"

I think you need to properly support the damned car, that's what I think. Then I would explain how to SAFELY support the vehicle and the ramifications if he doesn't before proceeding. Is that insensitive? f it is maybe he's in the wrong place. Go talk to your therapist and get a hug if you can't handle some advice on safety.

JMHO/YMMV

jsb5717
03-03-2021, 10:22 AM
Another ditto. There's ignorance (I don't know what I don't know), then there's willful ignorance (now I know but I choose to ignore it). Some just call that stupid...and you can't fix that.

One of the many things that I appreciate about both this forum and the Keystone forum is the willingness of experienced members to warn folks of dangerous weight mismatches. I agree that we should all try to help keep each other safe. Sounds like that other forum is based on the ridiculous notion that everyone should get a trophy just for showing up.

wiredgeorge
03-03-2021, 12:12 PM
Ahhh keep your nose out of it! When a kid wants to put his/her/it's hand on a hot stove, let 'em! They won't do it again. Just kidding. I am a member of a couple of RV forums and a couple of them have more unsafe advice being given out that I often feel that trying to say something that actually makes sense is an infraction of forum rules. "Well, just go ahead and add some air bags if your rear bumper is dragging the road surface after you hook up your new mega-camper!"

markcee
03-03-2021, 01:56 PM
I got severely scolded yesterday on another forum when a fellow said he'd traded his TT for a 30'+ 10k lb 5th wheel & looking for a good hitch for his F150. I made the remark that he should check the numbers & do some calculations on towing that much rv with a F150. That got me a scolding from a moderator telling me that my remarks about weight had absolutely nothing to do with the question asked. Then from OP that stated it was well within all the numbers, he had driven trucks, knew all about weights & didn't need to do any calculations. So then he decides he's putting in an automatic slider hitch for another 200-300 lbs in the bed of that F150. I told them I was only concerned for their safety & everyone else on the highway with them.
What say you? Should I have kept my nose out of it?

Heck no! And what forum if you don't mind sharing?

notanlines
03-03-2021, 02:02 PM
Like Mark, I also am interested in what forum this took place. And Danny, if you'd rather not say here, then PM me.

Northofu1
03-03-2021, 02:33 PM
I want to know too, sounds like fun.

wiredgeorge
03-03-2021, 08:57 PM
Danny is likely hesitant to name the forum as he knows a bunch of rowdy folks from this jungle will invade that forum, make trouble and tell 'em Danny sent us!

jmgreer1
03-11-2021, 06:22 AM
UPDATE

We purchased the 2021 Keystone Outback 291UBH! I pulled it back from the dealer, a distance of 100 miles, equipped with an Andersen WDH. Gotta say, it did just fine. Note, it was fully unloaded. A few weeks ago, we pulled it to a local state park for a weekend camping test fully loaded and thought it did ok (the camping experience was a different story...).

Fast forward to this week. We pulled it down to the beach, fully loaded, about 250 miles each way. I wouldn't say I was "white knuckled", but it was not an easy drive. The wind blew me all over the road. After arriving, I felt like I had been deep sea fishing all day!

I need to say that I am within the specs of my truck, albeit, at the upper limits. And I never felt the truck was out of control either. The truck averaged 11MPH over the entire trip. If I were only going to pull to places nearby and park, I would consider keeping what I have. But we plan to see a lot of the country and the extra comfort from a HD truck would help make a better experience.

I'm shopping for a bigger truck now. I had a chance to compare my truck to my BIL F250 diesel and there is a major difference. Less bounce, better highway speeds, overall more comfortable. Honestly, fuel tank capacity is likely one of the very top reasons I am now shopping as we could only get approximately 230 miles per tank, a very limiting factor. Worrying about fuel is not something I'd like to have to plan around.

I appreciate all the opinions and advice of the forum. It was worth it for me to try at least!

notanlines
03-11-2021, 06:34 AM
Be sure to jump to a 350/3500 and pass on anything lower.

rhagfo
03-11-2021, 07:12 AM
Be sure to jump to a 350/3500 and pass on anything lower.

X2!
Donít buy a 3/4 ton diesel, low payload, go straight to a one ton.

JRTJH
03-11-2021, 07:32 AM
Nowhere in your posts do you say that you actually "towed to a CAT scale to see how much the rig weighs"... All of your assumptions are based on "it felt great" or "It towed just fine". Those are "never towed a fifth wheel before, inexperienced assessments" about something you've never done before, with only the input of a short tow with a larger vehicle that was "a noticeable improvement in towing".

I'd first suggest that your "in all the numbers" is a "brochure guesstimate" that's not based in reality.

You should find a CAT scale and get some "real world reality" on which to base your decisions. In reality, your trailer pin may be heavier than the payload in your BIL's truck or your trailer pin may be light enough that payload is not an issue with either truck. Until you get "real weights" you're only guessing or grasping about what decision to make....

There's a CAT scale at Kasko's in Brookhaven, one at Love's in Magnolia and one at Love's in Magee. It'll be the best $14 you'll spend.

It's simple to weight, just follow the diagram on how to park on the scale pads (truck and trailer diagram) at https://catscale.com/how-to-weigh/. Without moving the rig, loosen the weight distribution bars and reweigh the rig. Then pull off the scale and park the rig, unhitch, return to the scales and reweigh (straight truck diagram on same page). Go inside, pay your $14 and based on those three weight slips, do some math to get exactly what your rig weighs.

Then you can make some "valid decisions about what to do"....

Right now, you're just as likely to buy a diesel F250 and find that you're still overloaded, even though it "tows better".... Don't buy three trucks to get it right, go to the scales and know what you're doing......

sourdough
03-11-2021, 07:36 AM
I will agree with the previous posts; just go to the 1 ton - btdt. The 3/4 has lots of built in limitations when it comes to todays larger and heavier trailers. The 1 ton will give you approx. 1k+ lbs. additional payload and cost almost nothing more than a 3/4 ton. Same trim levels etc. Ride and mileage are about the same. It will certainly improve the handling you experienced with the 1/2 ton - which is typical due to their limitations and what many call "just fine".