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mmessuri
10-20-2020, 01:07 PM
Please don't mind the following rant as its frustration more than anything:

So less than 30 days ago I purchased a brand new 2021 Cougar 26BS, brought it home, and set it up as a home office (for now). Well to my frustration, after the first real rains we have had in a long time (and while I was on a VTC) I started to hear dripping sounds :( . After completing my VTC, I began to investigate the noise and quickly found that the sky light above the shower was dripping (see pics).

Well, since the trailer is only less than a month old, my first action was to call the service department of the dealership where I purchased to trailer at and their response was:

"It sounds like the sky light needs to be re-sealed and that is not covered under warranty so you will need to pay for the technicians time and any material he/she uses". This was followed up with "Seals need to be checked every 30 to 60 days", in which I replied, "I have only had it less then 30 days".

To my surprise (I was kinda expecting a "Oh, thats not cool, bring it in and we will get if fixed right away for you at no cost") I just received a slight chuckle (similar to a: Sucks to be you). Heck, every car dealership I have ever bought a vehicle from has covered minor repairs (if it was found to be faulty before I purchased it) for the first 30-40 days at little to no cost to me.

Now I am not faulting Keystone as things happen and seals go bad; however, it is very frustrating to be dealing with such issues not even 1 month into ownership (its making me wonder "what next??").

Ok, ill get off my soap box now and I hope the next time I post here it will be with a better set of experiences (I wont be using the trailer for anything other than an office for the next few months thanks to COVID).

BTW: I did not notice the hairline crack above the one screw until I took the picture.

-- Michael --

chuckster57
10-20-2020, 01:16 PM
Welcome to the forum:wlcm:

Your dealer is trying to deflect their lousy PDI. Any decent tech that does a half way decent inspection would have caught that when they looked at the roof.

First off, the Dicor self leveling sealant to fix that is about $15.00, I would get a tube from anywhere BUT your dealer. Dry the sealant on the roof, and apply new/more dicor. Then write it off and donít patronize them any more. If you need more specific instructions feel free to PM me.

mmessuri
10-20-2020, 01:26 PM
Thanks for the advice. I will defiantly pick up a tube of Dicor self leveling sealant and follow your instructions.

My only concern is voiding the warranty as the trailer comes with this "warranty forever" program and has a section under Maintenance Requirements: "All maintenance must be performed by a professional repair facility" and Inspect roof and seal roof where necessary is one of the items they call out

JRTJH
10-20-2020, 02:07 PM
There are a couple of ways to approach this issue. First, you'll need to determine if you want to "break it off in the dealer's behind" or if you want to take the "easy way out" and just fix it yourself, use this as a learning experience and NEVER spend another dime at that dealership.....

If you want to take the "easy way out", just buy a tube of DICOR self leveling sealant, clean the area around the skylight and apply new sealant. Be sure to inspect the skylight outer dome to be sure it isn't damaged or cracked. If it is, then it will need to be replaced, not just sealed...

On the other hand, if you want to "push the point" you'll "win" the battle, but maybe not the war....

The one year limited warranty does cover water leaks... Go to your owner's manual, page 10 and read the third bullet statement:

"Any water leaks or related consequential damages that arise after the limited one-year base warranty expires (water leaks are covered under the base warranty and not the structural warranty);"

The warranty "clearly states that water leaks ARE covered under the base warranty".....

I'd suggest you spend some time on this and other forums to research your "forever warranty"... It's anything but free and it only covers very limited items, typically things that do not fail often. So, your "forever warranty" is actually a "cash cow for the dealership"... It's the same "ponzy scheme" type program as the older "forever warranties" on vehicles that required all maintenance and periodic servicing to be done (at retail pricing) at the dealership.... It's a "program to keep you spending money at their service department and in the first 3 or 4 years, they'll make literally thousands of dollars from you while not providing anything but a "that's not covered and you'll have to pay" response......

Dump that dealership, but if you want to be a "horse's patoot", you can use the owner's manual to ram this one home, then hope they actually do fix your RV rather than break something else......

flybouy
10-20-2020, 02:14 PM
"Forever warranty" definition ... You'll be waiting "Forever" to get anything paid for under the "Warranty".

mmessuri
10-20-2020, 03:33 PM
JRTJH:

Thank you for all the background information and for going the extra mile to point out what page I should look at!

Now, having both digested the information you provided (along with all the other posts) I have made the tough choice of fixing the item myself rather than sticking it to the dealer (I actually prefer to be a jerk about the issue; however, the dealer is an hour away and its not worth my time nor the cost of gas).

As for the Warranty Forever stuff, all I can say (after doing more research) is that I am not only glad that I did not pay for it but I now see it for what it really is (a flaming pile of horse manure).

Thanks again everyone and I hope you all don't mind if I ping you with help on this and future issues.

-- Michael --

chuckster57
10-20-2020, 04:15 PM
Feel free to stick around and ask any questions about anything. The only dumb question is the one not asked.

JRTJH
10-20-2020, 04:16 PM
I think the current frustration you feel is a very real part of the "RV ownership experience" that every one of us has grown to love and to hate at the same time. Every RV experience is a learning event and we all "just keep on learning" as we use and enjoy our RV's.

Welcome to the forum and to Keystone's version of "The Rocky Horror Picture Show"..

There will be days that you would never trade for anything and the very next day, you'll be ready to just sign the title and walk away.... That's RV'ing at its finest LOL

LHaven
10-20-2020, 04:51 PM
I have the same model (I think) two years removed, and I can tell you that cowl crack is not unusual. If you look around the cowl, you'll probably find several more you didn't notice. The rear is hollow, and just seating the mounting screws is enough to create cracks in it. I took mine off and put some reinforcement (plastic strips and glue) on the backside to stop the cracks from spreading but more cracks just developed in other locations. The plastic is way too friable. When chunks start falling off, I guess I will order a new cowl, but I'll probably dip it in something like a dilute epoxy before installing it because it's truly a chickens*t part.

Of course, none of those cracks has anything to do with your leak, which is supposed to get shortstopped at roof level.

I guess you could consider yourself lucky that the leak was over your shower pan, and not your bed. :eek:

sourdough
10-20-2020, 05:04 PM
Michael, first and foremost your dealer isn't a dealer, he's a shyster. Any decent dealership would have done exactly what you thought; so sorry we missed that, bring it in and we will take care of it right away (at no cost). These guys are hiding behind anything/everything they can throw at you (whether they are right or wrong) to dodge their responsibilities. Run from them.

You could try to "drive this home" with them and I have no doubt you could get it done, but, at what cost? They agree to fix a $15 problem and keep it for 6 months? They're not worth dealing with. We always say to research the dealer and make sure they are worth the salt and this is why.

That shroud cracking is pretty normal; nothing behind it, cinch down the screws and that "plastic stuff" just wants to crack. No big deal - just fix the sealing.

I don't know your dealer nor their structure but I would definitely, certainly, no kidding run this little deal right up their command structure.:D Good luck on getting it repaired; it's simple and if you have any questions there are plenty of folks to help you get it done.

mmessuri
10-28-2020, 11:35 AM
Ok, I have finally found some time to both order the DICOR self leveling sealant and get up on the roof to do the repair; however, once I was up there I noticed that the root cause of the problem is that the plastic dome of the skylight is cracked in at least 4 different areas (see pictures).

At this point is it recommended to just seal up the dome myself (perhaps with a different product as the DICOR is white), remove the dome and replace it, or call up the dealers service department and have some issues with them.

Thanks.

-- Michael --

mmessuri
10-28-2020, 11:41 AM
Ah the joys of posting your problems :) Just after posting my status update I came to the conclusion that the smartest thing to do would be to quickly apply some clear Silicone sealant (followed up with some clear all weather tape if needed) and not bother packing up the trailer and heading out for a 1 hour drive to the dealers service department (just not worth the back pain!).

Thanks for the venting session and now I just need to figure out how much to bill myself for the repairs :)

tech740
10-28-2020, 12:35 PM
Bill yourself 6 or 12 of something good. I would still replace the skylight. With temp changes and expanding and contracting the plastic will continue to crack more and more unless you drilled stop holes. Even with stop holes I would change the skylight.

Sarge2
10-28-2020, 01:47 PM
Wow! Brand new unit... I'd be ticked off too... as was said, probably better to just replace it.... or I'd be making the hour drive for them to do it..... but that's just me... give me a chance to have my say so to speak...
That whole installation looks pretty bad to begin with ... I was up on the roof the other day on mine (laying on it on a sheet of plywood actually as you can't walk on mine) putting a cover on... my skylight doesn't look as hacked up as yours does... doesn't seem right at all... JMHO.. :eek:

sourdough
10-28-2020, 01:58 PM
Michael, IMO that skylight needs to be replaced. As was mentioned it is just an issue that will recur. Water running into and down to the lower edges of that skylight is not good. Like you said, it probably isn't worth trying to take it back to that dealer but you know what I would do? I would give them another run just to let them know that they owe you a skylight; that began leaking in the first rain it encountered; 30 days after picking it up new from them.....and it had 4 cracks in it they missed. Tell them you will install it. Wouldn't hurt to give it a shot and, if done like I would do it.....I would feel much better no matter how it turned out. :D

notanlines
10-28-2020, 02:56 PM
Michael, all good advice so far. Yes, I also would replace the skylight, even at my own expense. Then you won't keep remembering this every time you look at it.
Now, keep in mind that we can be a somewhat vindictive group, you need to post your entire experience on EVERY SINGLE SPECK of social media available. Start by naming the stealership right here. Then on to Facebook and right on down the line. Only tell the truth, but the whole truth including all the names.
And be sure to keep us informed of your progress. Be sure to include the parts like when you punch the sales manager, and....well, maybe it shouldn't advance that far, but if it does we want to know about it.

Steveo57
10-28-2020, 09:00 PM
I admin a Facebook group for Keystone Cougars and we have seen a rash of new trailers with cracked skylights. I talked to a contact at Keystone and they are aware of the problem and have recently switched vendors for the skylights.
I would contact Keystone and work with the dealer to get a new one installed.

wiredgeorge
10-29-2020, 03:58 AM
My skylight broke after getting into a fight with a tree limb a couple years ago. I carefully measured the outside dimension which is much more importan than the inside dimension. On the old skylight, noted that if the screws were overtightened, the plastic cracked easily. In any case, I bought a new skylight from an eBay seller who makes them himself out of Lexan. You can find this guy on ebay by using the search term "skylight lexan". He always shows his product using a picture of him standing on one to show its strength.

I cleaned all the old Dicor from around the hole and left the inside garnish and lower plastic in place. I set the new Lexan skylight on top a bed of butyl tape and used new screws to retain it. I used Dicor self leveling sealant to seal the outside on the roof. I understand there may be special sealants for skylights but didn't know this at the time. I got the dark tint skylight. On many of this guy's auctions he lists a price of $999.99 and I believe that is a code to contact him directly.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LEXAN-Heavy-Duty-THICKER-RV-Skylight-22x14-ID-17x25-OD-SMOKE-TINT18X26/231515438084?hash=item35e7653c04:g:LRoAAOSwhvFZHk7 1

bigguy0602
10-30-2020, 10:45 AM
I just bought a 2021 Cougar 22rbs. Brought it home last week. Today noticed a leak in the shower around the sky light. Upon further inspection found a crack in the skylight cover on the roof. Bought the RV from Camping World. I am about to give them a call. Hopefully with better results.

chuckster57
10-30-2020, 11:49 AM
No special sealants needed. Butyl or putty tape on the roof surface and Dicor self leveling on the edge making sure to cover the screws. Forest River uses eternabond instead of Dicor. Probably cheaper and faster but I’m not sure it makes replacement easier.

Maineiacs
10-30-2020, 12:00 PM
On many of this guy's auctions he lists a price of $999.99 and I believe that is a code to contact him directly.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/LEXAN-Heavy-Duty-THICKER-RV-Skylight-22x14-ID-17x25-OD-SMOKE-TINT18X26/231515438084?hash=item35e7653c04:g:LRoAAOSwhvFZHk7 1


Not familiar with ebay protocols. Is the actual price of the skylight $999.? From the customer reviews that were posted it seems to be around $45. Unless that's just the shipping cost.


At this point, just curious but could be important down the road! Thanks!

wiredgeorge
10-30-2020, 12:09 PM
Not familiar with ebay protocols. Is the actual price of the skylight $999.? From the customer reviews that were posted it seems to be around $45. Unless that's just the shipping cost.


At this point, just curious but could be important down the road! Thanks!


That is not the actual price; not sure why the guy listed as such but a direct message to him will get his contact info and see what is up. I sent a PM with the guy's actual email address and biz name.

InkedMarie
10-31-2020, 01:14 AM
I admin a Facebook group for Keystone Cougars and we have seen a rash of new trailers with cracked skylights. I talked to a contact at Keystone and they are aware of the problem and have recently switched vendors for the skylights.
I would contact Keystone and work with the dealer to get a new one installed.

I was just going to post this very thing, about a rash of this issue. Iím in your group (or at least I assume itís the same one lol)

Is a new skylight something that my husband can install? We just got our Cougar two weeks ago & he already checked the roof & skylight, resealed too.

Roscommon48
10-31-2020, 09:07 AM
sorry but welcome to rving.
if you can get it to dealer let them do it but keep a tube of sealant in the trailer for future issues.

ewbldavis
10-31-2020, 10:01 AM
I'd have to agree with the replacement sentiment.

It's cracked - should be under warranty still so I'd call and get it scheduled. Definitely something worth hauling it in.

flybouy
10-31-2020, 10:22 AM
I would have the dealer replace it under warranty. That way it's documented incase there's an issue with rot where it leaked. Also if you do it and something happens where you damage the roof it's all on you.

chuckster57
10-31-2020, 11:24 AM
If nothing else take pictures and send them to your dealer and Keystone.

Horse Doctor
11-01-2020, 10:10 AM
The same thing happened with our 2019 Cougar 29WERLD. Tacoma RV got it in promptly and resealed the skylight. No questions asked.

cavie
11-01-2020, 01:26 PM
ah the joys of posting your problems :) just after posting my status update i came to the conclusion that the smartest thing to do would be to quickly apply some clear silicone sealant (followed up with some clear all weather tape if needed) and not bother packing up the trailer and heading out for a 1 hour drive to the dealers service department (just not worth the back pain!).

Thanks for the venting session and now i just need to figure out how much to bill myself for the repairs :)

no silicone!

NH_Bulldog
11-01-2020, 02:15 PM
It looks like someone or something pushed down on the bubble dome cracking it in the weakest spots; the corners. The exterior dome is just a bubble with a flange that sits on the roof and is stapled or screwed down (hopefully with a strip of butyl tape between the roof and the bubble flange). The cracks on the inside flange have no relation to the issue up top except as an indication that someone was a little overzealous with the screw gun that day. I would insist the dealer fix it, because if you do it yourself and any other issue crops up down the road with the roof or the skylight, or the ceiling or condensation or the price of coffee in Columbia, Keystone will deny your warranty because it wasn’t fixed by an “approved” facility.

kcamp99186
11-01-2020, 05:35 PM
I see you've gotten some excellent advice from this group. I've been looking at new campers and was at a Camping World in PA last month during some rainy weather. A saleslady was showing me thru a new Jayco and I found water leaking in the hall just up the stairs. Was coming from the antenna/wifi (I think). In any case it was something mounted on the roof that was leaking. She made quite a show of calling "maintenance" to repair it at once! lol

rlh1957
11-01-2020, 06:57 PM
Tell the dealer it is BS and You are calling the Manf.
Go ahead a make appointment.
It should be a simple reseal on the roof since itís new.
But Yes it is covered directly and indirectly. The manufacturer doesnít want their name or products to go out messed up.

wiredgeorge
11-01-2020, 08:26 PM
Skylights are made of fairly cheap and thin plastic. They are set on a bed of butyl tape and held in place by screws. The penetration is covered with self leveling Dicor sealant. The screws, if tightened too much, will cause cracks and I am guessing that is why so many are cracked. The hole is not precision cut and the skylight may not be wide or long enough for the screws to be screwed in place to catch wood so many may be screwed in at an angle and I am sure some electric or air driver is used for speed which doesn't increase feel for how tight the screws are. All leading to potential cracks.

rlh1957
11-01-2020, 08:47 PM
You can take the cover ring inside off and someone ďrainĒ it with a hose and see if that identifies area.
Certainly a good covering with Dicor will solve it.
Donít ever use silicone around a roof for anything.

Sleeve66
11-02-2020, 04:27 PM
It sounds like you have a terrible dealership. We bought a used 2015 Cougar back in 2016 from a private party and had a front cap leak just above the bed the second night when it rained. We took it to our local dealer and they said it was covered under warranty. Since they were only going to do what was necessary to fix the leak I offered to pay to have them re-seal the entire roof and all vents. It was worth it as I haven't had a leak since. If I were to get another leak in the future I would just buy a can of flex paste or flex seal and take care of it myself. I have used that stuff and it works really good.

NH_Bulldog
11-02-2020, 05:25 PM
I would strongly discourage using Flex-whatever products on the roof as that product can have a negative reaction with the roof membrane and you wind up doing more harm than good. Dicor is safe and performs excellent.