Vantage for full-time?

[kb0zke]

We've been full-timers for six years in a 40' motor home. It is now for sale, and when it sells we're going to go to a travel trailer. We've been looking at used Airstreams, and a neighbor suggested we check out the Vantage. I found a few on rv trader, and a couple look interesting. All of them are 2012 models, and it seems to me I read somewhere that the Vantage was only made for a short time.

1. Is that last statement true? How long were they made? Why are they no longer made?

2. Are they of sufficient quality to stand up to full-time living? What are the known issues that should be checked?

3. Is there some place where I can see the various floor plans, lengths, models, etc.?

[wiredgeorge]

Never heard of the Vantage line but I have lived a sheltered life. Probably not many sold. Appears they are all 35' and lightweight meaning likely not the best choice for full timing as light generally means flimsy materials and little insulation. I am sure some of the smarter folks can chime in here. BTW... you can full time in any trailer and a lot depends where you full time; Light trailers are not as likely to be a good idea where the temps get sub freezing a lot and a 30A power cord means one A/C and in a 35' camper that won't cut it in South Texas at least. I think there were only a couple floor plans based on this review:
https://www.trailerlife.com/rv-gear/rvs/keystone-rvs-vantage-32fls/

The 32QBS appears to be a bunk house model. Last issue regarding full timing is small gray/black tank sizes; that might be important if you are traveling in the camper or want to boon dock.

[notanlines]

I have never understood a draw to an Airstream. Not just a little cramped, but VERY cramped. I know it is a 'to each his own' world, but I see very little about them to draw an interest.

[sourdough]

I have never understood a draw to an Airstream. Not just a little cramped, but VERY cramped. I know it is a 'to each his own' world, but I see very little about them to draw an interest.



^^^^^x2! An Airstream has never been a thought for us as an RV; SO many drawbacks. I've got a friend who owns a nice RV park and he has 2. They cost a fortune to maintain and to go in one and think about actually staying a week? Ain't no way. Maybe for a novel 1 day weekend but to actually spend time...won't happen for us.

[kb0zke]

Our biggest interest in the Airstream is the lack of slides. I'd be much more interested in the Vantage if there was a no-slide plan. The floor plan of the Vantage reviewed above is pretty much what we are looking at in an Airstream, only without a slide. Yes, there are differences, but they are pretty minor.

The biggest drawback to an Airstream is the aluminum skin is riveted to the aluminum wall framework, and then the interior aluminum skin is attached to that, with only a bit of insulation between the two. No matter how much insulation there is, though, heat will be transferred between the inside and outside.

The tank sizes are very much like the Airstream. Most of the Airstreams we've looked at also have a single a/c and 30A service. We would upgrade to a second a/c and 50A service in any trailer that doesn't have those things.

[sourdough]

You may want to rethink buying a 30A and then trying to make it 50A. Depending on the trailer that could be a daunting, not to mention very expensive, task. Trying to equally redistribute power for the 50A in a trailer never meant to be that way could prove to be problematic very quickly. I would be looking at a 50A from the gitgo.

[JRTJH]

Don't forget that if you do purchase a 30 amp Airstream and decide to upgrade it to 50 amps, there's no way to run the ROMEX for a second air conditioner "through the walls/ceiling"... You'll be removing the inner skin to access the ceiling spaces since the outer walls are "buck riveted" with blind rivets that can't be replaced if the interior walls are attached to the ribs.

[travelin texans]

Airstreams to full-time in, NO WAY for us! They have very limited storage inside & next to NO storage outside, you'll have tow it with a long bed truck with a topper to haul all your stuff you had in the motohome, at least that's what we determined.
Another NO WAY for us would be the "no slides", we had a 40' 5th with 3 slides that we fulltimed in for 10+ years & there were times it felt very cramped. Moving from a 40' motorhome to a 25-30' TT, especially an Airstream, with no slides will feel like you've moved into a closet.

[kb0zke]

Friends, don't worry about the slides or the apparent difference in length. We're in a 40' motor home with now slides. The driver's and navigator's seats, although turned 90*, are still pretty much useless for us, but have been claimed (both of them) by the cat. From where they are to the front bumper is about 6', so a 34' Airstream inside is actually about the same inside area as what we now are in. Part of what attracted us to this MH, and now to the Airstreams, is the NO SLIDES. We don't want them! Since we're buying used, we'll take what we find that best suits us, knowing that it won't be exactly the way we would design it if money were no object.

I'm more interested in the questions I posted in the first post. Why the short life of the Vantage? Is it up to full-time use? Are there any known issues with them?

Current trailers of that style all seem to be limited to about 24' or less. I've been told that making bigger ones is very difficult. Is that why the Vantage line went away?

[Ken / Claudia]

JMO, it seems to me the bigger trailers in TT and 5ers are all looking at sq ft floor space. Current park we are in as trailers with as much as 6 slides. Nearly all have at least 3. Older units may only have 2.

[sourdough]

OP, I had heard of Vantage trailers but I've not seen one or heard of anyone on this forum that has one. I could be wrong, or someone may have owned one but I don't recollect the trailer being in a signature of a member.

I think your questions about the Vantage may be several years too late. Looks like they were made 2012-13? A copy of the Airstream style, all fiberglass top to bottom, heavy, no room and more expensive. I may have just highlighted some of the reasons it met its demise. The field of potential buyers was small and I figure the trailer was more expensive to make to Keystone so it couldn't carry its weight. They have done that before. I was looking at a brand they had a few years back (for the life of me I can't remember the name) that was VERY nice, with slides, full fiberglass and paint. I think it met the same fate for the same reasons. The Keystone Cougar High Country I bought new was the same deal. It was very nice, upgraded all kinds of stuff but had sat on the lot for more than 6 months. The owner told me they could not move them because the price was in the 5th wheel range and that's what people would buy at that price point. Bought it the last day of Feb. 2014, had warranty work performed in August and the parts for it were already obsolete and the line discontinued.....

[SummitPond]

<CLIP>

I'm more interested in the questions I posted in the first post. Why the short life of the Vantage? Is it up to full-time use? Are there any known issues with them?

Current trailers of that style all seem to be limited to about 24' or less. I've been told that making bigger ones is very difficult. Is that why the Vantage line went away?

I didn't do a search of the site, but I seem to recall there was a thread suggesting Keystone had never attempted construction such as the Vantage line had and was having some serious manufacturing quality issues (which I don't recall what they were) which is why they terminated the line after a short while.

There are some photos that pop up at the top of the main page of a Vantage trailer, so someone at one time or another had one who used to frequent this forum. I'm not sure if there's a way to search for a user and their model; one of the moderators will have to chime in about that.

[kb0zke]

Thanks. I hadn't thought about the fact that parts may be unobtanium. The 32FLS looks very much like the Airstreams we're considering, but is somewhat lighter, slightly more cargo weight capacity, and considerably less expensive than a similar age and size Airstream.

One of the moderators did, indeed, tell me how to contact a Vantage owner. I have sent a PM to one who is active here, so maybe I'll get an answer or two soon.

Thanks to all of you who have helped in my research.

[Fishsizzle]

I remember them. We walked through and them and thought they were nice. But again, space was a premium.

When we bought our Wildcat, Forest River was trying to get us into their “Aviator” which was their airstream Knock off

https://www.smartrvguide.com/L51692447

[gearhead]

Look at Bigfoot or Oliver. They may not be big enough though. The Bigfoot is all fiberglass "clam shell" construction. Real gel coat fiberglass, not thin filon. No slides. Very low production numbers, very high quality. I assume Oliver is the same. Bigfoot is made in British Columbia Canada and Oliver is Tennessee, I think.
http://www.bigfootrv.com/

[JRTJH]

David,

Something I'm sure you've considered (but maybe not) is storage space. You're coming from a 44' motorhome with a considerable storage capacity under it, as well as much of the "house functions" are built into the basement. Moving into a travel trailer will CRITICALLY reduce the available storage space compared to what you currently enjoy. In most travel trailers, there is "precious little" outside storage and even less inside storage. Things like a "full length wardrobe, a "honest to goodness" pantry, even storage for bulk paper products are significantly limited or even non-existent....

Do a thorough comparison of where you're going to put what you'll need with you in the trailer. Even things like a couple of lawn chairs may be "too much to fit" with the necessary items any full timer will need to carry.

Fifth wheels have considerably more storage space (front basement storage) but they don't compare to the basement on a 44' diesel pusher. Even with a large fifth wheel, many (probably not most) full timers will tow a small to medium sized enclosed cargo trailer behind their fifth wheel to provide a place to keep the "rest of the stuff" they need to live on the road....

Doing what you're anticipating in a Vantage, with the minimal storage available may make it impossible to travel extensively away from home base where everything else is in a storage facility....

[Snoking]

OP, I had heard of Vantage trailers but I've not seen one or heard of anyone on this forum that has one. I could be wrong, or someone may have owned one but I don't recollect the trailer being in a signature of a member.

I think your questions about the Vantage may be several years too late. Looks like they were made 2012-13? A copy of the Airstream style, all fiberglass top to bottom, heavy, no room and more expensive. I may have just highlighted some of the reasons it met its demise. The field of potential buyers was small and I figure the trailer was more expensive to make to Keystone so it couldn't carry its weight. They have done that before. I was looking at a brand they had a few years back (for the life of me I can't remember the name) that was VERY nice, with slides, full fiberglass and paint. I think it met the same fate for the same reasons. The Keystone Cougar High Country I bought new was the same deal. It was very nice, upgraded all kinds of stuff but had sat on the lot for more than 6 months. The owner told me they could not move them because the price was in the 5th wheel range and that's what people would buy at that price point. Bought it the last day of Feb. 2014, had warranty work performed in August and the parts for it were already obsolete and the line discontinued.....


I thought the Vantage would be heavy also being fiberglass however a 35' 10" OAL trailer with a 8200 GVWR is a lite style trailer. Our little Laredo 225MK less than 27' OAL has a 8K GVWR.

[JRTJH]

Vantage was a "novel approach to light weight towing, intended to appeal to the "Airstream followers" at a cheaper price point... It was also one of the first steps into using NORCO stamped frames. The frame is extremely light weight, mostly held together with Huck fasteners (not welded). The trailers had some very innovative design features, both in how the trailer was built and also how it was equipped.

You can download the 2013 Vantage brochure here: https://www.keystonerv.com/media/2377/vantage-2013.pdf There was no Vantage brochure in 2012 nor in 2014, so it appears it was only "marketed by Keystone" in 2013 (which really means from around April 2012, when the 2013 models were introduced, through around March or April 2013, when the 2014 models hit the dealership lots.

Whether it will become a classic or a dinosaur ??? Like vintage Mustangs and Camaros or more like Furys and Belvederes, they will have a following, but how much value they hold and the collector's desire ???? Who knows....

[sourdough]

I thought the Vantage would be heavy also being fiberglass however a 35' 10" OAL trailer with a 8200 GVWR is a lite style trailer. Our little Laredo 225MK less than 27' OAL has a 8K GVWR.


I agree. The thought on it being heavy was conjecture on my part as part of a possible reason that it might have met its demise. The quality issues above would also seem to make sense.

[Texas Steve]

There was a forum member "Lumberwagon" with a Vantage trailer. Look him up on the directory for some interesting pictures of the trailer being towed by a Buick Roadmaster!

[kb0zke]

Thanks for the additional information. We're still studying and asking questions. I've heard from the individual I sent the PM to, and have asked some additional questions.

The storage space issue has been taken care of. We'll have a cap on the bed of the pickup, and the bed will be fairly full, but we don't carry a lot of "extra" stuff.

Of greater concern, though, is that all of the trailers we've seen for sale have only one a/c, and that just won't cut it when the temperature is 100 outside. On the other side, of course, is that even here in SE NM it gets to below freezing at night during the winter. Also, being an "orphan" what about Vantage-specific parts, like the end caps. If one of them is badly damaged, does that mean that the trailer is considered a total loss because replacements are not available?

[Snoking]

Just a question. Why are you so down on having a slide or two? Chris

[sourdough]

Just a question. Why are you so down on having a slide or two? Chris


My thought exactly. Why fixate on a trailer that you know is going to be problematic, parts not available etc. and discontinued years ago? Sort of like buying a 32 roadster and hoping to find OEM piece parts....?

Did that unit come with 50A standard? If not 2 ACs is out of the question without major modifications and major expense....to accomplish what? Your signature says you are in SD but you worry about SE NM. I lived there for 30+ years and live now 60 miles from that portion of the state. 100+ is normal; 30-50 mph winds are normal. Winter temps run all over the place from balmy 50 degrees and blue skies to -10 and 40 mph winds...I had go work outside in all of it for many years.

You can get what you want but seems to me that acquiring something that is supported, has a good history etc. would be far more enticing, and beneficial, than searching out a known problem.

[kb0zke]

We're full-timers, and SD is one of the three best States for full-timers. (The other two are FL and TX.) All are without income taxes and all allow the use of your mail service address as your domicile address. Last year we leased a lot at The Ranch, an Escapees co-op between Carlsbad and Artesia. The plan was that we could use that as a winter base. We got back here in November and planned to leave in March. Well, plans got changed. We finally left here in May, headed to IA for a wedding, then to SD to renew licenses. After that we didn't know.

While we were driving through Aberdeen I got a phone call. Our church in Riverton, WY is looking for an associate pastor/head teacher. Such men are out there, but are rare, so they decided that I could fill the head teacher role. (I'm not a pastor, but I am a retired teacher and had certification as an administrator.) The position is a temporary one and part-time. As a result, we visited Theodore Roosevelt NP, then headed south back to The Ranch so we could repack. This weekend we'll head back north to Riverton.

Anyway, we don't have any slides in our Foretravel, so we don't miss them. From what I've read on various RV forums, both brand-specific ones and general ones, slides are the most frequent cause of colorful language. Sometimes they won't extend when commanded to, and other times they refuse to retract. While they do provide more interior room, that room comes at a price of increased weight and complexity. That said, though, part of the reason for switching from the MH to a TT is that a TT is far less complex than our MH. I expect to reduce maintenance costs by at least 50%.

Our 1993 Foretravel U300 is old enough and unusual enough that we've only seen a few other Foretravels in our travels, and only two others similar to ours. I suspect that we'd be in a similar position with a Vantage.

[sourdough]

We're full-timers, and SD is one of the three best States for full-timers. (The other two are FL and TX.) All are without income taxes and all allow the use of your mail service address as your domicile address. Last year we leased a lot at The Ranch, an Escapees co-op between Carlsbad and Artesia. The plan was that we could use that as a winter base. We got back here in November and planned to leave in March. Well, plans got changed. We finally left here in May, headed to IA for a wedding, then to SD to renew licenses. After that we didn't know.

While we were driving through Aberdeen I got a phone call. Our church in Riverton, WY is looking for an associate pastor/head teacher. Such men are out there, but are rare, so they decided that I could fill the head teacher role. (I'm not a pastor, but I am a retired teacher and had certification as an administrator.) The position is a temporary one and part-time. As a result, we visited Theodore Roosevelt NP, then headed south back to The Ranch so we could repack. This weekend we'll head back north to Riverton.

Anyway, we don't have any slides in our Foretravel, so we don't miss them. From what I've read on various RV forums, both brand-specific ones and general ones, slides are the most frequent cause of colorful language. Sometimes they won't extend when commanded to, and other times they refuse to retract. While they do provide more interior room, that room comes at a price of increased weight and complexity. That said, though, part of the reason for switching from the MH to a TT is that a TT is far less complex than our MH. I expect to reduce maintenance costs by at least 50%.

Our 1993 Foretravel U300 is old enough and unusual enough that we've only seen a few other Foretravels in our travels, and only two others similar to ours. I suspect that we'd be in a similar position with a Vantage.


Slides, if functioning properly and cared for, make a non slide unit seem like 1950. The most frequent cause of "colorful" language would not be a slide from my experience. Try water intrusion and other malfunctions.

Slides are the "modern" enhancement to an RV that gives the owner SO much more room, latitude, kitchen, living room etc. vs feeling like you are stuck in a gopher hole (btdt).

MH vs TT? Unless you live in a MH and use the "drivetrain" constantly to warrant the cost and maintenance it's a complete waste of money. When we retired I was going to have a very nice class A pusher. Crunching numbers showed that it was a total waste of 420k. Maintenance, drivetrain, etc. etc. never used for anything. Toad? Who wants one when you can have a wonderful "truck" to drive around?

Mtce costs from MH to TT? I would suspect it would be more like a 75% reduction vs 50%. There are SO, too many, things to constantly keep up with on a nice MH. I visited with a friend last year in this park that had a new Expedition diesel RV. He related that the cost was astronomical for what you got.

Having spent many, many years in the Carlsbad/Artesia area I know exactly where your park is....right down the road from Brantley Lake where I almost sunk a boat.

IMO trying to find, acquire and own an "unusual", never seen before, long discontinued model of anything is not conducive to having fun, being able to fix things or happiness. YMMV

[Huntme]

JMO, it seems to me the bigger trailers in TT and 5ers are all looking at sq ft floor space. Current park we are in as trailers with as much as 6 slides. Nearly all have at least 3. Older units may only have 2.

hope things are going well for you and your Boss,the Dog,Ha Ha just kidding,the Boss is your wife,hope the house situation is getting fix.

[Lasam2]

Hi. We purchased a 2012 Vantage thus year. It’s our first RV so ain’t can’t compare it to another one. It’s a 32FLS. I’ve read the comments. There is not much storage underneath but a good amount inside. Enough for me, my husband and our fur baby for sure. I’ll be glad to answer any questions that I can pertaining to using it. Sherry

[Homer & Marge]

Check the Vantage owners group here. We bought the last Vantage (used as a demo at camp Keystone and then sort of misplaced)#186. Bought May of '13. These units were manufactured without any input from the sales force and most all parts were sourced from new places. Great trailer but did'nt get much support from sales force. We spent 5-6 months in ours and wintered in central Florida the last 3 years. Did a few modifications, axle flip to keep the tail from occaisionaly dragging. We loved it but sold it last month to buy a class C. Tons of room for the two of us. We used the Bunkhouse for a walk-in closet and storage and towed with an F250 with a fiberglass cap. It had lots of interior space due to the curved roof and sides. Grey fiberglass oxidizes if not kept after a couple of times a year. Slide had no problems. (cable slide) but no slide topper so you have to keep the pinecones off when retracting. Single 15,000 BTU a/c always worked great and was enough for us with a few easy mods to the ductwork. We spent a few weeks where the temp was low 20's to upper 20's and windy. We used a lot of LP and even though Vantage has coroplast covered and heated underbelly, cold weather camping is not fun. Curved windows needed to be re-gasketed over time to cut down on air leakage. Ours never leaked and never had major issues although there were a couple soft spots in the floor in front of the counter where we always stood to cook and do dishes. We are sorry to see it go. We had a great time in it, fled 3 hurricanes in it and towed it 40,000 miles very comfortably. Bought an 18 ft sunshade for the awning and strapped it down for a huge outside area. Everything worked for the whole time we owned it except when I stored it in Florida without winterizing and the toilet valve froze! You should be able to find one for very little cash. Perfect trailer to park beside the lake at a local seasonal place. Sleeps 2 large adults on queen, 2 average on left bunks, 2 light weights on 2 right bunks and 2 medium kids on jack knife, and 2 small kids on dinette! Our Frenchie, Angus loved to wake up in the morning and be able to look out the big window in front without having to get up!

[ShermV]

Hey all! My wife and I own a Vantage trailer (32’ QBS). We regularly camp about 30 days a year in it. We have owned it since 2015. We are based in the Tacoma/Seattle. There was a recall regarding the “tape” that sealed the edges of the roof. Most of the RVs (ours included) had the tape replaced.

My biggest hang up is the lack of outdoor storage space. We have one bin under the starboard bunk. I keep my 3 burner Camp Chief and 3 totes of stuff in it.

One repair that needed to be done was the connection to our kitchen sink drain. It broke when the gray water backed up and over loaded to plastic coupling. We added another fabric support and all has been good since.

[CWtheMan]

The Keystone Vantage TTs are well apointed but heavy for a TT and that may have been their down-fall.

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