Rear axle replacement

[CraigB]

I recently had to replace my rear axle on my 3402 RL Montana 5th wheel. The tires were wearing on the inside badly. My question is why would the rear axle sag and not the front or both? I don't have any extraordinarily weighty items or even a generator.

[CWtheMan]

Are you the original owner?

Is the trailer traveling nose high? Or parked nose high?

Load it up and find some scales. They may answer the question for you, especially if you're traveling with an onboard water supply.

[CedarCreekWoody]

My Laredo is in the shop now for an axle replacement now. It had bent spindles, factory is replacing the axle.

[LewisB]

Could the axle have been bent somehow? Did you recently have the tires replaced or the bearing/brakes checked & serviced?

(Just wondering if someone put a floor jack on the center of that back axle and tried lifting the trailer that way. One would think if the center of the axle was bent UP it would cause the outside of the tires to wear, but who knows.)

[rhagfo]

Are you the original owner?

Is the trailer traveling nose high? Or parked nose high?

Load it up and find some scales. They may answer the question for you, especially if you're traveling with an onboard water supply.

I agree, are you towing nose high??

[GHen]

Most likely if the rear axel is bent it is from turning sharp corners. I’m not criticizing anyone’s driving, it’s these cheap axels can’t take twisting that happens during tight turns. Some people have had success with having an alignment shop resetting them. Last resort would be to replace with a heavier model.

You can take a straight edge or even a string across the face of tires and see pretty quickly if there are any gaps. If the gaps are front to rear then it’s bent from turning. If they are not level up and down and it could be a weight issue bending them.

[JRTJH]

If I'm remembering all the information I got from my axle failure, Keystone uses the same "axle tube/spindles" on their 3500, 4400 and 5000 pound axle assemblies. The difference is in the 3500 pound rating, there's small outer bearing and 10" brakes. In the 4400 pound rating, there's larger outer bearing and 12" brakes and in the 5000 pound rating, there's larger inner/outer bearings and 12" brakes.

I don't know if the larger axles are similar or not, but I'd guess the 6000, 7000 and possibly the 7500 pound axle ratings could well use the same axle tube/spindles with similar upgrades to support the increased weight.

I'd suppose Keystone isn't going to spend more money on upgraded components than any other manufacturer. The old phrase, "Industry Standard" for me anyway, just means "they all do it the same way"... (safety in numbers ????)

[Cbrez]

I had the same issue several years ago during a trip to Alaska. Had the rear axle replaced in Goshen. We hit a bazillion crevasse-like pot holes during the trip so always figured that’s were the damage occurred. Doesn’t explain how only the rear axle got bent though. I had it replaced with a thicker axle tube. Even though it was only slightly more expensive than replacing in kind, it was all the insurance company needed to deny the claim.

No idea why the rear axle bent and not both of them, so perhaps my theory is wrong.

[travelin texans]

At the factory the axles are shipped separately from the frames so it's not unlikely that the truck driver threw a chain or strap over the load & cranked it down bending several axles in the process, the factory workers don't check them just quickly bolt them on.

[Tireman9]

If I'm remembering all the information I got from my axle failure, Keystone uses the same "axle tube/spindles" on their 3500, 4400 and 5000 pound axle assemblies. The difference is in the 3500 pound rating, there's small outer bearing and 10" brakes. In the 4400 pound rating, there's larger outer bearing and 12" brakes and in the 5000 pound rating, there's larger inner/outer bearings and 12" brakes.

I don't know if the larger axles are similar or not, but I'd guess the 6000, 7000 and possibly the 7500 pound axle ratings could well use the same axle tube/spindles with similar upgrades to support the increased weight.

I'd suppose Keystone isn't going to spend more money on upgraded components than any other manufacturer. The old phrase, "Industry Standard" for me anyway, just means "they all do it the same way"... (safety in numbers ????)




I understand bigger brakes & hubs & tires on "heavier" axles but I do wonder how one would establish a load rating on the tube. Maybe as long as warranty claims are low enough the design is good enough. Haven't heard about many axles actually "failing", but if you figure the average trailer maybe sees a few thousand miles in 1st year (warranty) then you can wash your hands of the product can't you?
Would be interesting to get camber readings when new and each 3,000 miles of use along with scale weight. If there was any change in camber and load was always under the rating then the axle would IMO be too small for the application. Camber is easy to measure and getting one axle on truck scale is also easy.

[flyingjack]

Tireman, do all Dexter axles have a camber built in OR are they straight across? My 2013 Mountaineer has what looks to be equal camber (high point of curve in middle of trailer) so load would flatten/straighten axle flat. Maybe mine are also bent??
Thanks

[Tireman9]

Tireman, do all Dexter axles have a camber built in OR are they straight across? My 2013 Mountaineer has what looks to be equal camber (high point of curve in middle of trailer) so load would flatten/straighten axle flat. Maybe mine are also bent??
Thanks


Sorry I don't have specs on Axles The issue is not if the axle ture is straight, most are not but the spindle plate has to be welded on with a "Camber angel"


You can get low cost Camber measurement too (https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=camber+measurement+tool)l for $20 or less which would be good enough. Dexter should be able to tell you their spec

[FlyingAroundRV]

Very interesting post.
We too have a bent rear axle on our 272UFL. I've been trying to figure a way to solve or diagnose this long distance (we live in Australia and the trailer is in Dallas) but haven't started anything yet because of the virus and now the violence situation. In he mean time, we're likely to come up against the warranty limits. I think the axles have a 5 year warranty, but I'd have to check the docs (which are in the trailer) to know for sure.
Curious that just the rear axle bent. Our hitch was set up by a specialist hitch shop in Elkhart, so I'm banking that they knew what they were doing.
BTW, I completely don't buy the idea that simly turning the trailer can bend the axles. I know the trailers are built cheap, but I don't believe they would be built such that you would bend axles in the first campground you backed into. I've experienced very few CGs that didn't require sharp turns to get into the campsites.

[tech740]

Very interesting post.
We too have a bent rear axle on our 272UFL. I've been trying to figure a way to solve or diagnose this long distance (we live in Australia and the trailer is in Dallas) but haven't started anything yet because of the virus and now the violence situation. In he mean time, we're likely to come up against the warranty limits. I think the axles have a 5 year warranty, but I'd have to check the docs (which are in the trailer) to know for sure.
Curious that just the rear axle bent. Our hitch was set up by a specialist hitch shop in Elkhart, so I'm banking that they knew what they were doing.
BTW, I completely don't buy the idea that simly turning the trailer can bend the axles. I know the trailers are built cheap, but I don't believe they would be built such that you would bend axles in the first campground you backed into. I've experienced very few CGs that didn't require sharp turns to get into the campsites.

Good luck with warranty. Dexter is replacing my rear axle as a customer concession, not a warranty. They have an entire host of reasons that they will use to not warranty an axle. Really what they are avoiding is paying labor costs.

Below is what I got as a reply:
Good morning,



We have assigned case number: CAS-66745 for the tracking of your reported bent axle issue causing inside tire wear.



Possible causes of Inside tire wear are static or dynamic overloading/overstressed condition, loss of camber, not towing the unit level, worn or loose suspension parts, out of balance tires and wheels, defective tires, or toe-out or alignment issues.



Our warranty policy does not arbitrarily cover alignment, bent axle/spindle, camber, toe, abnormal tire wear complaints or regular or inadequate maintenance issues. We have no control over how the unit is towed, loaded, serviced or what other conditions the axles or parts may encounter during usage so our warranty policy normally does not arbitrarily cover these conditions, unfortunately we must respectfully decline warranty consideration for this claim request.



What we can offer to help assist the customer with this reported issue would be a customer concession for a replacement rear axle shipped to you at No Charge. We would not be able to cover labor or any other expenses for this reported issue that is not covered under our warranty policy.



When Dexter Axle agrees or offers to supply a replacement rear axle to a customer as a “customer concession” this is being done strictly as a goodwill gesture. Customer concessions are not intended to convey or construe this action as warranty.



Where would you like us to ship the replacement rear axle to?



Thank you,



David Switalski

Dexter Axle Warranty Department

[Tireman9]

Hey why would you provide an axle good for 50,000 miles when you can plan on 90% of them to be out of warranty in 3,000 miles?
The mentality that Detroit had in the 70's is still strong in the RV market today. People shop for low price and "bling" not for durability as that will cost more.

[KOZKO]

ME TOO! Bent back axle and badly worn tires and the goodwill crap - it should be warrantied for poor quality plain and simple. I don’t believe any of it. Dexter has sold some bad axles, but I guess at least they paid for the replacement. Not the tires though, I had to pay for them:nonono: I sent them email about the tires and never got any response... The new axle has no issues but more miles than the 1st. Original front axle still good. How can it possibly be my fault or anybody’s fault? how could you ruin an axle with tires 5 inches behind the front? You don’t hit one bump and not hit it with both on that side. Hmmm :facepalm: Sorry I’m still mad about having to buy tires:lol::lol:

[CedarCreekWoody]

Keystone just replaced an axle and tire on our Laredo. The tire wore out on the inside after 2300 miles, our second trip. This was handled by our dealer (Welome Back RV, Athens TX) and Keystone, not directly with Dexter.
Edit: We paid for installation of a lift kit at the same time. We were nose high.

[GHen]

This happened on my daughters trailer. If the tire wear is on the inside and just on the rear axel, then it could be bent from sharp turning, not weight issue. Dexter sent replacement axels and paid for installation, unit was still under warranty.

[KOZKO]

This happened on my daughters trailer. If the tire wear is on the inside and just on the rear axel, then it could be bent from sharp turning, not weight issue. Dexter sent replacement axels and paid for installation, unit was still under warranty.

I don’t believe that answer every campsite is a sharp turn! Pulling into my driveway the tire looks like it’s gonna rip off - inward , BUT why did the first axle “bend” and the second axle didn’t? I’ve pulled in my driveway more times on the second axle than the first one???

[Big 417]

Next time you hit a dip in the road with a longer 5th wheel, watch your trailer in the mirror. Your rear axle will take the brunt of the load, especially with large trucks. The pin won't take any on the down pressure, it's mostly taken at the rear axle. Watch how much your trailer bumper goes down versus the pin.

[RoadToad]

Most likely if the rear axel is bent it is from turning sharp corners. I’m not criticizing anyone’s driving, it’s these cheap axels can’t take twisting that happens during tight turns. Some people have had success with having an alignment shop resetting them. Last resort would be to replace with a heavier model.

You can take a straight edge or even a string across the face of tires and see pretty quickly if there are any gaps. If the gaps are front to rear then it’s bent from turning. If they are not level up and down and it could be a weight issue bending them.

Most axles I have seen have an intentional upward bow in the middle.
This is to allow for "camber" and "toe-in" to be achieved.
The upward arch should be slightly behind verticle.
The spring pads are welded at this strategic geometrey to get the desired camber/toe-in.
This geometrey is needed to keep the trailer tracking "true", without "wandering" back and forth.

[bigbluejmc]

We have changed two rear axle on our 2012 327RES cougar. After several worn tires and one blowout (blamed the China bombs) we found a REAR axle with a spindle that was not pressed straight. Dexter said that it could have happened for many reason and mostly my bad driving. Axel shop said it was manufacturing bad quality they are seen more and more. Put new axle on and 20 months later driving through Louisiana (really bad roads) hit a road to bridge junction and tire sensor indicated a front axle tire rapid air loss. By the time we stopped the tire was very low and I replaced it. In the way home on a routine tire check I noticed that the rear axle tire on the same side was showing heavy inside wear. By the time we got home it was bold. Took rv to axle guy and he showed me where axle spindle was bent. No off road or heavy load or driving nose high, just normal road hazard for a trailer with bad quality axle.

[FlyingAroundRV]

I think rather than a Dexter fault, this is a Keystone fault.
Dexter make axles to take a certain load. Keystone put them on trailers that are usually greater than that load, relying on the TV carrying some of that weight.
In my case, my trailer is rated for #7600 gross. But the trailer has two 3,500# axles.
That works until you put a weight distribution hitch on and start loading the truck. The hitch redistributes weight from the trailer to the front wheels of the truck, but it is not unidirectional. So it redistributes weight from the truck back to the trailer as well. So how's that looking for the axles now?
IMO that's why we're bending axles.

[CedarCreekWoody]

We are discussing a bent axle on a 5th wheel trailer. There is no weight distribution hitch involved. That being said I, too share your concern on axles with minimal capability.

[bigbluejmc]

My concern is that the original axel had a manufacturer problem and the second new axel could not take a dip on the road. My axel guy said that the loading was ok for the axel and we both wondered why the front axel took the hit ok but not the rear. Since the front takes the hit first and elevates the rv, why did the rear suffered the damage.....I know it has independent suspension so they will both take the hit, but he rear should have much less weight on it at the time of impact.

[FlyingAroundRV]

We are discussing a bent axle on a 5th wheel trailer. There is no weight distribution hitch involved. That being said I, too share your concern on axles with minimal capability.
Woody:
Yes, fifth wheelers have the same issues because the RV manufacturers rely on a certain amount being supported by the TV. I agree that the loading of the TV doesn't have the same affect on the 5ers as with the bumper pulls. But the manufacturers still skimp on the axle ratings.
Having a trailer with axles that are only rated to the limit of the load rating of the trailer (or less) is not so much an issue with utility trailers etc that are usually loaded well below their maximum, but I think it's unacceptable with trailers that run most of their lives at or near their gross load limits.
IMO, like with the tires issue, the RV manufacturers need to provide some safety margins in the axles. Yes, I know it will make the trailers more expensive, but when so many are faced with expensive repairs for bent axles, the small increase in purchase price is premium I'm willing to pay. After all, the cost of the repairs is not where the costs to me as an owner end. There's down time and the hassle of finding a reputable repair shop, and loss of amenity with my rig and the extra cost of worn tires.

[CedarCreekWoody]

I agreed with you, just pointing out the weight distribution hitch is not the issue.

[CWtheMan]

What consumers often overlook is the maximum figures provided with a trailer’s certification label.

GVWR is a maximum limiter for vehicle total weight.

GAWR is the maximum limiter for the axle (s) on that vehicle.

With trailer axles they are not required to provide any “wiggle room”. Multi-axle RV trailers are notorious for having an overloaded axle or an overloaded wheel position. It is the consumer’s responsibility to operate their trailers inside of the maximum parameters provided with the vehicle certification label.

All RV trailer manufacturers’ have the authority to SET GAWR limits lower than the axle manufacturers maximum load limit. Therefore, for all practical purposes, a 7000# axle set for a vehicle certified 6750 # GAWR, has 250# of load capacity reserves

[FlyingAroundRV]

I agreed with you, just pointing out the weight distribution hitch is not the issue.
Yep, I understood that. I hope you didn't think I was criticising. Just adding a bit more of my opinion on the matter.

[JRTJH]

The "critical factor" is weight reduction to achieve all of the "advertised" ultralight and half ton towable features. You can't (or Keystone can't) build a 35' travel trailer that weighs 4800 pounds without reducing weight in EVERY component. Starting with appliances (17" range, smaller refrigerator, etc) and going to the frame (NORCO stamped vs Lippert welded) and even the size of the propane tanks (20 pound vs 30 pound), plastic toilet vs ceramic, plastic faucets vs cast, and yes, even replacing those "heavy 5000 pound axles" with lighter versions...

Every pound adds up and designing a lighter trailer results in decreased durability in order to achieve increased "small vehicle towability"...

Then along comes the new owner who packs it full of things like solar systems, dual or triple battery systems, replaces the propane tanks with 30 pound tanks, adds a rack on the back to carry a 3500 watt generator (to run the A/C while boondocking down a rutted gravel road) and … well hopefully you get the idea....

Nothing is more confusing than believing you've got an "ultralight RV" and thinking it's "built like a tank".... Ain't gonna happen....

Even with "luxury, heavy RV's" you'll find weight reduction/weight savings a major consideration in design. In order to include those wood floors, ceramic tile bath floors and solid surface countertops, pounds must be "shaved somewhere else" and it's typically a reduction from 8000 pound axles to 7000 pound ones or even 6000 pound ones and "cutting the margin of overkill" in every possible component. Heck, just adding 14 ply tires increases the trailer weight significantly over those 10 ply "may-pops"...

I'm not defending the industry, just pointing out that you can't "beef up every component in an "ultra-light trailer" and still sell it as an ultra-light....

It's possible that the industry should consider heavier axles, but to keep the trailer weight below the requirement, keep the payload at/above the requirement, what would you cut from the list of "features that make it better than Jayco" ?????

[ChuckS]

Yes.. the Dexter axles come pre bent to provide proper camber when installed and weight applied to the frame...

This link will tell you just about anything you’d want to know regarding Dexter axles specs, etc

https://www.dexteraxle.com/docs/default-source/dexteraxle/product-documentation/sprung-axles/catalogs/applications-manual-(lit-008-00).pdf?sfvrsn=aedb1548_4

[RoadToad]

Yes.. the Dexter axles come pre bent to provide proper camber when installed and weight applied to the frame...

This link will tell you just about anything you’d want to know regarding Dexter axles specs, etc

https://www.dexteraxle.com/docs/default-source/dexteraxle/product-documentation/sprung-axles/catalogs/applications-manual-(lit-008-00).pdf?sfvrsn=aedb1548_4

Toein is also addressed in the above link.

[hitchikerman]

Yup just had mine changed on my 2012 318 SAB. With a new tire total cost was $1300.00. I don't remember exactly when it happen but when I left New port richey FL and got to Adairsville GA the left side rear axle tire was worn down to no tread what so ever. I had filled my water tank with water thinking that had something to do with but I'm not sure. I sold the trailer

[Mwoods321]

Do you have any after market suggestions for a more heavy duty axles(s) to replace the stock ones?

[LewisB]

Do you have any after market suggestions for a more heavy duty axles(s) to replace the stock ones?

Unfortunately, that's almost impossible to answer. RV manufacturers grab parts off the shelf and those parts can change from day-to-day and supplier-to-supplier. So you can't just order replacement parts for a certain year, make, and model trailer and be certain you will get the right parts - replacing an unknown with a stronger unknown just is not likely to work.

So, yes, you can (example) replace 4000 lb axles with 6000 lb axles, but what are the correct dimensions, width, spring perches, springs, spindles, drop, etc. Your best bet is to get complete measurements on what you have, then get with Dexter and start talking with them. They are very helpful on the phone. This is not all that hard, but it will take some work on your part. The attached docs are old, but these will give you an idea about what is involved:
29109
29110
29111
29112
29113
29114

Hope that helps!

[KingFisher]

Good luck with warranty. Dexter is replacing my rear axle as a customer concession, not a warranty. They have an entire host of reasons that they will use to not warranty an axle. Really what they are avoiding is paying labor costs.

Below is what I got as a reply:
Good morning,



We have assigned case number: CAS-66745 for the tracking of your reported bent axle issue causing inside tire wear.



Possible causes of Inside tire wear are static or dynamic overloading/overstressed condition, loss of camber, not towing the unit level, worn or loose suspension parts, out of balance tires and wheels, defective tires, or toe-out or alignment issues.



Our warranty policy does not arbitrarily cover alignment, bent axle/spindle, camber, toe, abnormal tire wear complaints or regular or inadequate maintenance issues. We have no control over how the unit is towed, loaded, serviced or what other conditions the axles or parts may encounter during usage so our warranty policy normally does not arbitrarily cover these conditions, unfortunately we must respectfully decline warranty consideration for this claim request.



What we can offer to help assist the customer with this reported issue would be a customer concession for a replacement rear axle shipped to you at No Charge. We would not be able to cover labor or any other expenses for this reported issue that is not covered under our warranty policy.



When Dexter Axle agrees or offers to supply a replacement rear axle to a customer as a “customer concession” this is being done strictly as a goodwill gesture. Customer concessions are not intended to convey or construe this action as warranty.



Where would you like us to ship the replacement rear axle to?



Thank you,



David Switalski

Dexter Axle Warranty Department

I got that exact same email from that same guy back in February when I found I had a bent axle.

[twhalen54]

Just had my rear axle replaced while on trip. Relatively new, had blowout with low quality original tire (driver side) replace all 4 with 14 ply on first long trip 2019. Rear driver side tire wearing on inside (belt starting to show). Replaced axle in Arizona along with new tires on rear axle.

Keystone says sorry, but too hard to tell what causes axle problems. Have a nice day.

Who have you contacted to get any kind of financial reimbursement?

[KingFisher]

Just had my rear axle replaced while on trip. Relatively new, had blowout with low quality original tire (driver side) replace all 4 with 14 ply on first long trip 2019. Rear driver side tire wearing on inside (belt starting to show). Replaced axle in Arizona along with new tires on rear axle.

Keystone says sorry, but too hard to tell what causes axle problems. Have a nice day.

Who have you contacted to get any kind of financial reimbursement?

Read the post above yours.

[hitchikerman]

Dexter...hands down