Covid vs. the flu

[gearhead]

Yes covid is worse than the flu.
I'm watching the Sunday morning talk shows. On one of the local shows it was mentioned that we've had 79 covid deaths in Houston, but in 2018 we had 2,000 flu deaths.
This just ain't right.

[fatcatzzz]

Yes covid is worse than the flu.
I'm watching the Sunday morning talk shows. On one of the local shows it was mentioned that we've had 79 covid deaths in Houston, but in 2018 we had 2,000 flu deaths.
This just ain't right.

Only if you watch the media is the covid-19 worse than the flu. If you do your own research you will find that in MOST of the country the number of deaths from china flu is less than the everyday versions of the flu. Most of the country does not live 30 stories on top of one another. Me thinks we are being played here.

[notanlines]

A week ago the entire state of Texas had just over 400 deaths. The number of deaths in the 2017-18 season from the flu was almost 10,000. This is from Houston Chronicle about 5 days ago. Hmmm... I'm just sayin'

[dutchmensport]

So, "They" are reporting Covid-19 deaths, been doing so since around February (THIS YEAR) till now. Has anyone seen actual numbers for Flu death during this same time period (THIS YEAR)? I know I have not. It's because "they" are attributing every death to Covid. Flu, heart attacks, pneumonia's, someone falling off the roof of their house! If someone stands in the middle of the street and gets hit by a dump truck and dies, THEY are blaming THAT on Covid also! This whole thing is so twisted it's ridiculous. Don't sheepishly blindly accept what you hear. I grew up in the middle 1950, 1960's, and survived high school in the early 1970's. I caught the tail end of that Woodstock generation that questioned everything! I still do. It's time the rest of us question what's going on too.

Stay safe... absolutely agree... but don't blindly accept every jot and tittle what you hear on the news.

[ctbruce]

Think how deadly the flu would be if we didn't have a vaccine. It's pretty bad stuff but we don't treat the flu the same way we treat the Covid 19. If everybody stayed home, wore masks, washed hands, and coughed into their elbow, the flu wouldn't be as bad either.

[JRTJH]

Thinking "rationally" (for me this is rational, maybe you don't agree and that's OK)….

We had a "flu epidemic in 1917 that killed hundreds of thousands)… we didn't shut down the economy.

We had leprosy in the 30's that killed thousands of people... we didn't shut down the economy.

We had tuberculosis in the 40's that killed thousands of people... we didn't shut down the economy.

We had Polio in the 50's that killed thousands of people... we didn't shut down the economy.

We had HIV in the 70's that killed thousands of people... we didn't shut down the economy.

We had swine flu in the 80's that killed thousands of people... we didn't shut down the economy.

We had bird flu in the 90's that reportedly could kill thousands of people... we didn't shut down the economy.

We had Ebola in the 2000's that killed thousands of people... we didn't shut down the economy.

We've got COVID-19 now that has killed (statistically) thousands of people... We link any possible death to COVID-19 whether it's the "real cause of death or not". We've destroyed our entire economy in an attempt to control a virus that's still active but will likely diminish "naturally" when the sunlight and warmer temperatures prevail.

We've solved the "other big health issues" in time with vaccines and treatments. None of them are a continued threat that shuts our economy, even though "flu" still kills more people annually in this country, even with the available vaccines, and we "live through flu season every year" without shutting down the economy.

Why didn't we react this way with any other "health threat" during the last century?

Hmmmmm http://www.sherv.net/cm/emoticons/confused/confused-face-smiley-emoticon.gif (http://www.sherv.net/)

[dutchmensport]

JRTJH, you and me should have a beer together someday!

https://i.imgur.com/7pFM88k.jpg

[hankpage]

JRTJH, you and me should have a beer together someday!

https://i.imgur.com/7pFM88k.jpg

Just one now gents. Consider the danger of alcohol lowering your immune system. :party:

[chuckster57]

Just one now gents. Consider the danger of alcohol lowering your immune system. :party:

Really? My copious amounts of FireBall intake is what I believe has prevented me from getting sick. :facepalm:

[gearhead]

I just finished a liter of Evan Williams that was 100 proof. I've been having a dull recurring headache the last few weeks. Can't decide if it's from looking at the internet and TV too much or just being cooped up with Betty for 6 weeks or the virus. I'm thinking that 100 proof should have some internal disinfecting properties.
I'm thinking we're being played.
There's an election this year right? Uh-huh.....

[flybouy]

I see a couple of issues with what's happening in the world today. First (and most impactful in my opinion) is the lack of trust in the media. I grew up when what Walter Cronkite said was taken as gospel. Living around Baltimore there used to be 2 newspapers (The Sun and The News American), one liberal one conservative. When the News American went out of business there was no competition and The Sun went down in flames by displaying their bias like Pravda. They ended up with almost all AP stories and no investigative reporting. This was pre internet. Once the internet proliferated they were done.

So today, with the widespread use of social media watching the "news networks" or the "national news" is much like reading the front page of The National Enquirer. Who can you really trust to give you the "straight scoop"?

Comparing Covid-19 to the "Spanish Flu" of 1918 (which killed 17 million) was a different time/world. In 1918 it took someone a week or more to go from Europe to NYC). Today, tens of thousands come to this country DAILY in a matter of hours from Europe, less than 1 day from anywhere in the world. So while you may think you're safe in your "east of nowhere" town who knows what the possibility is? In the county I live in the first Covid-19 death was a man in his 20's who had visited NYC (about 170 miles away, or a couple of hours at the most from anywhere in the lower 48).

As for an immunization don't hold you're breath. There still isn't any immunization or vaccines for AIDS 18 years later, or SARS, or most of the influenzas' that we've seen over the last 50 years.

To my thinking the most dangerous effect of this epidemic and the resultant shut down are:
1. The overreach of government powers in the most illogical measures, i.e. not allowing attending church services while in a car, not allowing WalMart to sell "non food items", not allowing gun stores to open, stopping interstate travel, and the list of offences to our Bill of Rights go on. Thomas Jefferson said "power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely". I shudder to think what the "new normal" is the politicians are talking about.

2. The delay of the millions of "elective surgery" and treatments will have. People are afraid to get dialysis treatments and chemotherapy. Telemedicine doesn't screen for hypertension or lung issues. The doctor on your phone isn't listening to your heart, lungs, or digestive sounds. No cardiac tests, no blood test for A1C and other diagnostics.

3. The economic impact. I believe this will affect the poorest, least educated the hardest as it typically does but it will have a severe impact on everyone. Look at the restaurant industry which has been devastated by this. If you're a cook or waitstaff and where you worked doesn't come back then what are your options? Same with many manufacturing jobs. You can't follow the work if there isn't any.

The economic effect will also have an impact on health. Stress, eating less healthy, unaffordable medicines. There are over 100 million diabetics in this country now. Everyday diabetics die because they can't afford insulin which cost's have increased over 1,000% in the last decade.

How will we pay for all of this? The government handing out Trillions (fIn the American system one billion is 1,000,000,000 and a trillion is 1,000,000,000,000 so one trillion is one thousand times one billion. In the British system one billion is 1,000,000,000,000 and one trillion is 1,000,000,000,000,000,000 so one trillion is one million times one billion.)
That's a lot to say the least but who pays for it? We do obviously. If the government just "prints more money" then the value of each dollar is less in a direct relation to how many dollars are printed (remember that big number? ). That leads to runaway inflation and a whole other can of worms. This "printing money" issue is a result of the Federal Reserve Note. It used to be the US was a "gold standard", a ten dollar bill was worth the equivalent of the weight of ten dollars worth of gold at current rate. The federal government confiscated those notes and issued the current note that is basically a promissory note by the Federal Reserve Bank that they will stand behind it. The Federal Reserve Bank doesn't have and endless supply so if the Government print's money they go to the bank and take out a loan but they sell their debt to remain solvent. For the last 4 decades or so the entity buying our debt has been China.

So as for the "lockdowns" of states that aren't as affected I think this was to prevent a mass exodus. Anyone remember seeing the images of the roads before Katrina hit NOLA? NOLA is a city of about 400K. Can you image the tens of millions trying to flee the North east?

This I know is a "bleak outlook" but it's how I see how things happen and why. I may be wrong and I pray that I am but nothing get's folks to comply like fear does, whether that's fear of a dictator's tyrannical actions or a fear of death from a disease. How rapidly the citizenry of this country to comply to the fear of this virus scares the hell out of me. There are some small pockets of resistance pocking up so how the response to that plays out I think will be an indicator of what "the new normal" will look like.

JMHO

[sourdough]

I have mentioned in the past about the "old" days and watching Walter Cronkite giving us the "news". It WAS the news. It wasn't twisted, convoluted and destroyed with personal agendas and political direction. That kind of news doesn't exist any longer. WE, the citizens, are now charged with actually having to think, watch and understand all the ulterior motives within the news articles and particularly the wording.

I am amazed on a daily basis in my discussions with people that they are completely unable to recognize inflection, misdirection and misleading comments....they are "news" and "gospel"....really? Forget rhetoric...everytime. Look at facts and stats - not "it could", "looks like", "possibly", "so and so organization thinks" etc. - it's ridiculous and assumes none of us has a functioning brain IMO. That's all beside the point.

The current damage done to our country, and millions of our citizens....which will be life altering for them, is not warranted by the facts...in any way. It has been generated by media, folks susceptible to "fear" and the "unknown". Even the government (all levels) attribute the panic buying to public "fear"....generated by what? The media. Facts? No. As has been pointed out, various entities have decided to track Covid and nothing else...it is THE horror of our time; stats don't even come close to showing that.

I am secure. Yes, I've lost a lot of money that will recover but even my "protected" money is making money. So many others are losing their lives, including my offspring....and they were relatively well off. I have said it before, and I'll say it again, the cure cannot be worse than the disease and so far the "cure" is killing millions that the disease would never touch. We have to find a way to stop digging in this rabbit hole - use common sense as we have in the past....it's unproductive, dangerous (civil liberties) and extremely damaging.

[socoinc1984]

Well said sourdough & flybouy

[Aireman]

Don’t know how ya’ll are doing numbers, but the flu season is all year. CV-19 didn’t establish in the US until February. In less than two months we are at 55,000 deaths. So, pretty close to 60,000 by the end of the month. Deaths won’t end April 30th. We don’t have a vaccine or an established medical treatment. Social distancing has slowed it down but won’t stop the spread. This isn’t fake news, it’s cold hard facts. Our medical system is far and away better than it was in 1918, but in the cities it’s stretched to the limit. Rural areas have escaped the worst of it, for now, but there are areas of the country where it’s got its claws in.
Hopefully we can keep the deaths in the 1% range because it seems about half the infections are asymptotic. That still leaves the possibility of up to 3 million American deaths. This is just getting started folks. I pray that I’m wrong. A couple more months won’t kill us, but the virus could. You want to take that risk? Fine, but think about it. How comfortable are with the possibility that someone you infect might die?
Rural areas don’t have the hospital beds cities do, nor access to many of the drugs or treatments. Best case? We keep deaths to just 50,000 a month until we get a good treatment or vaccine. A vaccine may take at best a year and a half to develop and a year after that, with the best of actions, to roll out to us. Of course we’ll connected will get it first. Again, I pray I’m wrong, but this is just the beginning.

[McRod]

Good to read the common sense posts. You don't quarantine the healthy. You quarantine the sick. Immune systems get compromised if not exposed - that's how they work. If someone gets infected, blame mother nature...not those of us with common sense. 90% of those infected recover with no lingering effects. The more testing we do, the lower the death rate - think about that statement before replying.

[wiredgeorge]

Some good discussion. I will point out that we will likely never know how many people around the county have actually contracted the virus because many have and didn't have sufficient symptoms to warrant testing or no testing is/was available and in most cases recovered. While it is easy to pan the government, either local, state or Federal about over reach on their attempt to contain the spread through somewhat draconian measures, the spread has been slowed down a lot by these measures. While many of us haven't seen the effect, if places like NYC had isolation in place, perhaps more would have made it that perished from the bug. While healthy people who hae been exposed and may be communicable or those with little evidence of the symptoms don't appear to be greatly at risk, mixing them with elderly and/or at risk seems like a poor idea to me and must be balanced with getting our economy back on its feet. In Texas, according to the state Dept of Heath Service there have only been three deaths in the 20-29 age range but 134 in the 80 year and plus range. The mortality rate for those with very advanced age is surely higher than that for the young but how many would have survived if there had been no attempt to isolate during this season of plague? I am glad I didn't have to make these decisions. Did government over reach? Dunno but I think lives were saved and does government have the wisdom to transition safely out of all the rules set up to isolate? Probably not but who does?

[fatcatzzz]

Good to read the common sense posts. You don't quarantine the healthy. You quarantine the sick. Immune systems get compromised if not exposed - that's how they work. If someone gets infected, blame mother nature...not those of us with common sense. 90% of those infected recover with no lingering effects. The more testing we do, the lower the death rate - think about that statement before replying.

This is absolutely true. It is Natures way.

[kksfish]

I read an article this morning which indicated that As many as 1 in 3 cause of death on death certificates is incorrect. This is due to many reasons. The article also said that Medicare pays three times as much for COVID-19 patients as it does for regular flu deaths AND five times as much or about $15K if the patient goes on a ventilator! Sure would be easy just to make all deaths COVID related.....

I won’t suggest fraud on the part of hospitals but that certainly would provide an opportunity for additional income at a time when hospitals are supposedly losing money and several rural facilities have closed.

[fatcatzzz]

Just had a good family friend die from kidney failure. Kidney problems for last 3 years. Death cert. had Covid listed as cause of death. Autopsy test were covid negitive. Family has contacted attorney.

[+Ruff Rider]

Remember they are now talking about tracking you if you get this crap. No way would i tell the government or my doctor who I came in contact with. if I had contact with a friend I would personally contact them. It's getting scary out there. How do you feel about getting a I'm immune? Not for me. I do my part but this is getting old. I feel sorry for those that die from this but I feel sorry for those that die from many other things.

[gearhead]

"I won’t suggest fraud on the part of hospitals but"

I would.

[travelin texans]

"I won’t suggest fraud on the part of hospitals but"

I would.

Maybe not so much the hospital as much as the.source they report to.
uTube already has numerous videos of "celebrities" (some I've never heard of) that have passed due to COVID 19.
CV19 is news, heart attacks, kidney failure, natural causes are not.

[Canonman]

Many of the people who die after contracting the covid virus, die from multiple organ failure. "The most severe cases — about 6% of patients — end up in intensive care with multi-organ failure, respiratory failure and septic shock, according to a February report from the WHO."
Some very interesting information here about How Patients Die after contracting the virus: https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2020/02/14/805289669/how-covid-19-kills-the-new-coronavirus-disease-can-take-a-deadly-turn.
Note, in this article, Dr Fauci says "It's acting much more like a really bad influenza." comapred to SARS.

[wiredgeorge]

In our county (Medina County Texas) there have been 19 confirmed cases and two deaths. Thirteen have fully recovered and four are "active cases". None of the active cases are hospitalized so guessing they are not dangerous. Unfortunately, there is no indication of the demographics; especially of the deaths. I think one of the reasons for the very low number of cases is that there is virtually no testing in my county that I know of. The relaxed rules allow for restaurants to open but with 25 percent capacity; not sure how that will affect those businesses. Must be based on building occupancy I guess... I can't imagine playing a round of golf with a bandana over my kisser.

Texas Governor Abbott today loosened the guidence/rules:
AUSTIN — Gov. Greg Abbott on Monday said his statewide stay-at-home order will expire on Thursday as scheduled, while Texas malls, stores, restaurants, movie theaters and restaurants may open the next day -- with 25% occupancy.

Barber shops, hair salons, gyms, massage establishments, tattoo parlors, video arcades and bowling alleys must wait until mid-May at the earliest to reopen, he said.

Outdoor sports such as golf and tennis may resume with no more than four participants in a match, and they must observe social distancing guidelines, he said.

Businesses will be free to choose not to open, and in less populated counties with five or fewer confirmed cases, they will be able to open at 50% capacity, he said.

Museums and public libraries can reopen, again with the 25% capacity limitation. However, a city doesn’t have to let them do so, Abbott said. And in shopping malls, he said, food courts, play areas and interactive displays and settings must remain closed, he said.

The Republican governor “strongly” recommended that Texans wear masks while in public. However, he said local requirements imposed by Democratic-controlled commissioners courts in Dallas and Harris counties -- as well as elsewhere -- are superseded by his new orders. No one can be fined by a locality for not wearing a facial covering, he said.

[aaron_huber]

Doing some quick math, if we assume a 1% death rate and we just let 'er rip and get to max "herd immunity" as quickly as possible by letting everyone get infected, and given that the vast majority of the people who die would be older generations, that would be about 3 million fewer people to vote in the next election who predominantly lean to the right (https://www.people-press.org/2018/03/01/1-generations-party-identification-midterm-voting-preferences-views-of-trump/)...

Hmm, trying to look for the downside here.

<extreme sarcasm obviously>

Stay safe everyone, we'll get through it. :angel:

[travelin texans]

Once the virus quits being the top headlines & things get back to normal, whatever that may be from here on, you can bet your a## this will be about politics, one group blaming the other for how it was handled, or mishandled.
Not trying to bring up politics here, but we all know what's coming from ALL the media, after all it's an election year & there has to be someone to blame.

[SummitPond]

Here are some state-wide numbers from Florida. I'm intrigued that the distribution of confirmed cases (the multi-color bar chart) is basically a Gaussian distribution by age bin. Mortality information is provided in a (now) 570 page report (it gets longer every day) that one can download but is not available on the web site graphically by age.

[McRod]

Some good discussion. I will point out that we will likely never know how many people around the county have actually contracted the virus because many have and didn't have sufficient symptoms to warrant testing or no testing is/was available and in most cases recovered. While it is easy to pan the government, either local, state or Federal about over reach on their attempt to contain the spread through somewhat draconian measures, the spread has been slowed down a lot by these measures. While many of us haven't seen the effect, if places like NYC had isolation in place, perhaps more would have made it that perished from the bug. While healthy people who hae been exposed and may be communicable or those with little evidence of the symptoms don't appear to be greatly at risk, mixing them with elderly and/or at risk seems like a poor idea to me and must be balanced with getting our economy back on its feet. In Texas, according to the state Dept of Heath Service there have only been three deaths in the 20-29 age range but 134 in the 80 year and plus range. The mortality rate for those with very advanced age is surely higher than that for the young but how many would have survived if there had been no attempt to isolate during this season of plague? I am glad I didn't have to make these decisions. Did government over reach? Dunno but I think lives were saved and does government have the wisdom to transition safely out of all the rules set up to isolate? Probably not but who does?

George, alot of issues here that are problematic. We are finding that ALOT more people have been exposed/had COVID19 than originally thought. This is because testing was not done on perfectly healthy people. Only those who showed symptoms. The result is that it diminishes the previously thought deadliness of the virus. It also demonstrates that social distancing DIDN'T help near as much as we thought. The virus is running it's natural course as mother nature intended. We have simply punished ourselves for thinking we could control mother nature. If the unhealthy are vulnerable, I agree, they should be isolated. But medical practices never quarantine the healthy. It's harmful to the immune system. Everyone's immune systems NEED to fight viruses. That's how they get stronger.

[McRod]

Doing some quick math, if we assume a 1% death rate and we just let 'er rip and get to max "herd immunity" as quickly as possible by letting everyone get infected, and given that the vast majority of the people who die would be older generations, that would be about 3 million fewer people to vote in the next election who predominantly lean to the right (https://www.people-press.org/2018/03/01/1-generations-party-identification-midterm-voting-preferences-views-of-trump/)...

Hmm, trying to look for the downside here.

<extreme sarcasm obviously>

Stay safe everyone, we'll get through it. :angel:

Hrmmm. Also might extend the current social security projections past 2035...👍

[Northofu1]

Once the virus quits being the top headlines & things get back to normal, whatever that may be from here on, you can bet your a## this will be about politics, one group blaming the other for how it was handled, or mishandled.
Not trying to bring up politics here, but we all know what's coming from ALL the media, after all it's an election year & there has to be someone to blame.

Sad but true

[Aireman]

To the people who won’t wear masks or social distance to build “herd immunity”.
I have three words for you. Polio, tuberculosis and small pox.
Do those first and then I might listen.
We’ve tested about 2% of the population and have lost more people in two months than the entire Vietnam War. The failure is glaring.

[flybouy]

Airmen I agree. Darwinian socialism would certainly "thin the herd if left to the uninformed". I'm guessing the same proponents of "herd immunity" don't have their children immunized? Do they let them get exposed to measles, mumps, rubella, polio, the flu? And while we're going down the happy "build your immunity trail" why bother with pasteurized milk? And put down that bottle of water! Drink right out of the pond or stream those little little swimming things you see in the microscope make you stronger!

Wash your hands? Why? Do you expect people handling your food at the deli counter or in a restaurant to wear gloves? How silly, why you're preventing your immune system from fully developing.

And one final thought. Allowing the "natural progression" of disease that disproportionately effects the elderly I guess is a great idea if that prevents you from enjoying your desires and wants. But I'm guessing that sacrificing that segment of society won't be such a great idea once you become part of the group.

There will be plenty of blame to go around, plenty of fingers to point, plenty of "I told you so" to go around to last the country for generations to come but I'd suggest folks take a breath, think things thru, use some common sense. Try to "ignore the noise" after all it's an election year and politics are running rampant and rabid. Who's saying what and WHY? Statistics can be and are manipulated to prove any theory or thought. Hitler had his scientist "prove" that Germanic people were "genetically superior" to the other races. He and his followers had tens of millions of people executed in the name of his "facts". He instilled enough fear that this seemed reasonable to the Nazi Party.

Let's think and not let fear grip our thoughts and words so radically. A little common sense goes a long way.

[wiredgeorge]

Doing some quick math, if we assume a 1% death rate and we just let 'er rip and get to max "herd immunity" as quickly as possible by letting everyone get infected, and given that the vast majority of the people who die would be older generations, that would be about 3 million fewer people to vote in the next election who predominantly lean to the right (https://www.people-press.org/2018/03/01/1-generations-party-identification-midterm-voting-preferences-views-of-trump/)...

Hmm, trying to look for the downside here.

<extreme sarcasm obviously>

Stay safe everyone, we'll get through it. :angel:

Thanks for sharing your opinion; I wasn't going to comment but your culling the herd comment stuck with me. My Daddy fought in WWII because there was another gentleman who was big on culling the herd. In fact he was darn good at it and put up many gas chambers to do just that. You being from the leftist coast and assuming everyone who would be culled would be a geezer would be taken out of the voting pool is telling. I guess since the demographics showing elderly are especially at risk will be balanced by the higher incidence of certain racial groups so the culling may not have such a happy effect on voter turn out as you hope. Just out of curiosity, have you ever served others; say in the military or a volunteer fireman? That sort of thing. Hard to take culling the herd comments for me anyway. Good luck and enjoy your life.

[wiredgeorge]

Airmen I agree. Darwinian socialism would certainly "thin the herd if left to the uninformed". I'm guessing the same proponents of "herd immunity" don't have their children immunized? Do they let them get exposed to measles, mumps, rubella, polio, the flu? And while we're going down the happy "build your immunity trail" why bother with pasteurized milk? And put down that bottle of water! Drink right out of the pond or stream those little little swimming things you see in the microscope make you stronger!

Wash your hands? Why? Do you expect people handling your food at the deli counter or in a restaurant to wear gloves? How silly, why you're preventing your immune system from fully developing.

And one final thought. Allowing the "natural progression" of disease that disproportionately effects the elderly I guess is a great idea if that prevents you from enjoying your desires and wants. But I'm guessing that sacrificing that segment of society won't be such a great idea once you become part of the group.

There will be plenty of blame to go around, plenty of fingers to point, plenty of "I told you so" to go around to last the country for generations to come but I'd suggest folks take a breath, think things thru, use some common sense. Try to "ignore the noise" after all it's an election year and politics are running rampant and rabid. Who's saying what and WHY? Statistics can be and are manipulated to prove any theory or thought. Hitler had his scientist "prove" that Germanic people were "genetically superior" to the other races. He and his followers had tens of millions of people executed in the name of his "facts". He instilled enough fear that this seemed reasonable to the Nazi Party.

Let's think and not let fear grip our thoughts and words so radically. A little common sense goes a long way.

If natural selection were a factor in the gene pool, how did so many evade culling that are obviously dumber than a brick.

[aaron_huber]

Thanks for sharing your opinion; I wasn't going to comment but your culling the herd comment stuck with me. My Daddy fought in WWII because there was another gentleman who was big on culling the herd. In fact he was darn good at it and put up many gas chambers to do just that. You being from the leftist coast and assuming everyone who would be culled would be a geezer would be taken out of the voting pool is telling. I guess since the demographics showing elderly are especially at risk will be balanced by the higher incidence of certain racial groups so the culling may not have such a happy effect on voter turn out as you hope. Just out of curiosity, have you ever served others; say in the military or a volunteer fireman? That sort of thing. Hard to take culling the herd comments for me anyway. Good luck and enjoy your life.

Apparently my sarcasm was missed despite calling it out explicitly. None of what I said was intended literally, and my apologies if anyone took it as such.

I do find it puzzling that some who are calling for the restrictions to end are in the groups most likely to be impacted, and in fact are saying that they are willing to "take one for the team" if it saves the economy, like Dan Patrick (Texas Lt. Governor).

I personally have zero desire for any generation to be impacted at all, much less "culled" (your word, not mine), and I hope that the states starting to open back up don't see a rebound effect.

[roadglide]

I caught Covid in Mississippi this year. Took about two weeks to come down with any symptoms started off with a slight loss of energy and appetite and continually got worse lost 15 pounds, for me the covid was a mixture of pneumonia and flu that lasted nine days with the temperature . The drag is the symptoms linger on loss of hair smell and taste but I am slowly getting back. I took ibuprofen and drink TheraFlu. I was not vaccinated but will be soon. I was in Michigan at RV park and was not going to report myself to the authorities self isolating , didn’t matter I didn’t feel like doing anything to begin with. When I came back to New Mexico With no fever and feeling better I tested negative. The fear mongering the news and cdc puts out about Covid , somebody that had the disease could die from thinking about what they have been told over and over again.

[LHdream]

I am very glad that such an important topic is being discussed here and that there are indeed many sensible people with critical thinking (or just adequate thinking) who know how to analyze information and not take for granted everything we are told on TV or the news. In this whole situation, they publish the kind of news they want us to hear, not that which is 100% true. And many people blindly believe

[msubobcats]

And rachel maddow will not apologize for saying over and over that anyone that gets the jab WILL STOP the spread,, they CANNOT pass on the vitus...

[Badbart56]

My wife and I got it in December of last year(2020). We lost our sense of smell and sense of taste was also affected, but somewhat to a lesser degree. We couldn't get tested at the time as they didn't have enough test apparently.

Symptoms were similar to a cold. I was tired, slept a lot for about 5 days, but no fever detected. My wife wasn't affected as much. Sniffles mostly.

In August of this year we got the Delta variant. Congestion in my lungs was hard to expel. Very "sticky", more so than I've ever experienced with colds or the flu, but not debilitating. It was a little scary, especially as I actually knew several people who got this version and were hospitalized as in ICU. And these were healthy, strong men between the ages of 30-50 years old.

We are not vaccinated and have no intentions in doing so. It has become apparent that the vaccines, (1) Don't stop the spread, and (2) don't stop you from getting it.

While it may or may not lessen the symptoms I believe our exposure has strengthened our immune system. I personally don't think there is a definitive answer in getting a handle on this but if the government was truly concerned for our safety they would start by stopping the thousands of unvaccinated people coming into our country through the southern border.

Not downplaying the virus by any means but the fact is the survival rate is over 99%, yes?

[wiredgeorge]

My wife and I got it in December of last year(2020). We lost our sense of smell and sense of taste was also affected, but somewhat to a lesser degree. We couldn't get tested at the time as they didn't have enough test apparently.

Symptoms were similar to a cold. I was tired, slept a lot for about 5 days, but no fever detected. My wife wasn't affected as much. Sniffles mostly.

In August of this year we got the Delta variant. Congestion in my lungs was hard to expel. Very "sticky", more so than I've ever experienced with colds or the flu, but not debilitating. It was a little scary, especially as I actually knew several people who got this version and were hospitalized as in ICU. And these were healthy, strong men between the ages of 30-50 years old.

We are not vaccinated and have no intentions in doing so. It has become apparent that the vaccines, (1) Don't stop the spread, and (2) don't stop you from getting it.

While it may or may not lessen the symptoms I believe our exposure has strengthened our immune system. I personally don't think there is a definitive answer in getting a handle on this but if the government was truly concerned for our safety they would start by stopping the thousands of unvaccinated people coming into our country through the southern border.

Not downplaying the virus by any means but the fact is the survival rate is over 99%, yes?


Just curious. How did you know it was the delta that got you this time. Is there some test for that variant specifically? How do you differentiate between delta and omicron? Just curious...

[Badbart56]

Just curious. How did you know it was the delta that got you this time. Is there some test for that variant specifically? How do you differentiate between delta and omicron? Just curious...

Not 100% as again we didn't get tested, but just based on the timing and symptoms of those we knew who were hospitalized with the Delta Variant. This was before Omicron was identified as a variant.

Also, my sense of taste is nearly normal but my wife's is not. My sense of smell has not fully recovered nor has my wife's.

We haul test kits for pharmaceutical manufacturers and they have advised that the test kits cannot differentiate between the COVID virus and the flu, let alone which variant.

[wiredgeorge]

Not 100% as again we didn't get tested, but just based on the timing and symptoms of those we knew who were hospitalized with the Delta Variant. This was before Omicron was identified as a variant.

Also, my sense of taste is nearly normal but my wife's is not. My sense of smell has not fully recovered nor has my wife's.

We haul test kits for pharmaceutical manufacturers and they have advised that the test kits cannot differentiate between the COVID virus and the flu, let alone which variant.


Yeah, they pulled the main test off the market for that little item... perhaps that is one reason why so many folks tested positive in flu season.

[gearhead]

Latest news from Houston...Baylor College of Medicine has developed a new vaccine. Supposedly very effective. India is buying a lot of it.
https://www.texaschildrens.org/texas-children%E2%80%99s-hospital-and-baylor-college-medicine-covid-19-vaccine-technology-secures-emergency

[roadglide]

I caught Covid in Mississippi this year. Took about two weeks to come down with any symptoms started off with a slight loss of energy and appetite and continually got worse lost 15 pounds, for me the covid was a mixture of pneumonia and flu that lasted nine days with the temperature . The drag is the symptoms linger on loss of hair smell and taste but I am slowly getting back. I took ibuprofen and drink TheraFlu. I was not vaccinated but will be soon. I was in Michigan at RV park and was not going to report myself to the authorities self isolating , didn’t matter I didn’t feel like doing anything to begin with. When I came back to New Mexico With no fever and feeling better I tested negative. The fear mongering the news and cdc puts out about Covid , somebody that had the disease could die from t
hinking about what they have been told over and over again.. I got stuck this weekend 4 months after I got sick. I got Covid all over again the shot made me very tired lost of appetite , 101 fever chills ,pressure in my head no ice packs this time . The good thing it was over in 24 hours . The vaccine give me Covid so my immune knows how to fight it off . No need for second or third .

[jsb5717]

I'm just getting over a 2 week sickness. All the symptoms including loss of taste for a full week. However, tested negative for Covid...twice. One in home test, one drive in test. Not sure what to make of it. My wife has it as well...a little behind me in recovery and also tested negative.

I've never had a virus like this and was sure it was Covid

[wiredgeorge]

I'm just getting over a 2 week sickness. All the symptoms including loss of taste for a full week. However, tested negative for Covid...twice. One in home test, one drive in test. Not sure what to make of it. My wife has it as well...a little behind me in recovery and also test negative.

I've never had a virus like this and was sure it was Covid

Just read the CDC announced the in-home test kit doesn't work well for the omicron variant. Perhaps testing won't work well for this new bug. Many folks around my part of the country will have full symptoms for awhile as the Mountain Cedars are puking boy-pollen. Probably the worst I have seen; looks like a fire as this stuff billows with each gust of wind. I am not much affected but the missus is a bit. So much crud going around, who knows?

[flybouy]

Two funerals today. DW's aunt going to the funeral of her close freind age in her early 70's. Her freind was not vaxed.

Our son- in- law is at the funeral for his aunt age late 60's. She was not vaxed. Her husband , late 60's and son, around 45, both hospitalized and on death's door, both unvaxed. His uncle was buried last week. He was late 60's and not vaccinated. So our son-in-law's father buried a brother and his twin sister in less than a week. He's a Fire Chief and responded to the call when his sister died in her house. Our SIL has an uncle on his mother's side whose in his late 50's with Covid. He's not vaxed and so far not hospitalized.

Our daughter and her husband have one freind from Hawaii that came home to Phili for the holidays. He has it but not hospitalized. He's fully vaccinated. Another freind of theirs who's in his late 30's has it with sever symptoms. He had 1 shot. His wife has it but with mild symptoms. She had 1 vaccine shot only. One of their 3 kids has it. I think he's around 6 years old and having minor symptoms.

I feel blessed that none of our immediate family has contracted it. We are all fully vaccinated and it was our choice to do so. My DW, our 2 daughters, and me all have health issues that can comprimise our immune systems. I got the Pfizer, 3 were Moderna and 1 J&J. Our SIL also is immune compromised as he had his spleen removed when he was around 35 due to cancer.

DW and I also know several folks that have had the virus and survived. My godson had it last winter and spent 2 weeks in his camper so as not to spead it to his wife and daughters. He's in his late 30's and was ill before the vaccine was available.

So the virus is real, it does kill, and it can infect all ages. What anyone chooses to do reguarding the vaccine is their choice and I respect that. All I can attest to is my experience. Every since the DW and I slipped into our 50's we have had the flue vaccines. Neither of us has had the flue after that. Because diabetes I also get the pneumonia vaccine. Before that, I had several bouts of pleurisy but none after. From our experience with flue vaccines and considering the risk vs benefit it was an easy decision for us.

Hope everyone has a safe and happy new year.

[Scttw]

Think how deadly the flu would be if we didn't have a vaccine. It's pretty bad stuff but we don't treat the flu the same way we treat the Covid 19. If everybody stayed home, wore masks, washed hands, and coughed into their elbow, the flu wouldn't be as bad either.

You get the gold star for this response.

Shutting down the world is what it took to keep the deaths as low as they were with Covid (which isn't low) - had we gone on with our regular lives like we would with the flu ..... half the planet would be gone (exaduration).

Could be the difference right there!

Edit - on another note - my Mom lost 9 friends in the last year - NOT because of Covid, but it is because of Covid because they could not get the hospital care they required for other non Covid reasons.

Especially with Delta - we needed to get the shots to keep the beds open, which is exactly what the vaccines did. It saved many lives after we got the ICU's cleared out from all the Covid patients.

[wiredgeorge]

I think one of the issues with vax vs no jab is that the politics entered and so much misinformation was puked out by the govt and media folks were hesitant to believe what they were being told. Six feet went to three feet... mask, double mask, no mask... Pfizer 97 percent effective... really, if the media and government had stayed out of it or just let folks know what was known scientifically I think folks would have gotten on board for the best possible protection. Too much politics and too little expertise and the big boy docs in the govt are about as clueless as the average Joe like myself. You sit in a cushy office chair for 40 years and claim medical expertise? I could sit in my carport for 40 years and would never be a Lincoln Continental. Social media has done their darnest to stiffle any intelligent discourse on the science and best practices to keep the bug at bay. Oh, btw, the CDC has now made self-isolation five days and once again, the goal posts have moved.

[Javi]

Wife and I both had it in September, I ran no fever, felt about as tired as I do from a heavy day at work, didn't lose smell or taste, wasn't particularly hungry and I've been sicker from the flu by a long shot. But I tested positive 4 times over a 15 day period.

Wife was sicker and lost taste and smell with a fever for 3 days, she also tested positive twice..

All tests were the full deal administrated by family doctor.

[Lindyn]

My wife and I got it in December of last year(2020). We lost our sense of smell and sense of taste was also affected, but somewhat to a lesser degree. We couldn't get tested at the time as they didn't have enough test apparently.

Symptoms were similar to a cold. I was tired, slept a lot for about 5 days, but no fever detected. My wife wasn't affected as much. Sniffles mostly.

In August of this year we got the Delta variant. Congestion in my lungs was hard to expel. Very "sticky", more so than I've ever experienced with colds or the flu, but not debilitating. It was a little scary, especially as I actually knew several people who got this version and were hospitalized as in ICU. And these were healthy, strong men between the ages of 30-50 years old.

We are not vaccinated and have no intentions in doing so. It has become apparent that the vaccines, (1) Don't stop the spread, and (2) don't stop you from getting it.

While it may or may not lessen the symptoms I believe our exposure has strengthened our immune system. I personally don't think there is a definitive answer in getting a handle on this but if the government was truly concerned for our safety they would start by stopping the thousands of unvaccinated people coming into our country through the southern border.

Not downplaying the virus by any means but the fact is the survival rate is over 99%, yes?

I have had the China Virus thought I was going to die, I would not go to hospital, went home with home oxygen, I got a steroid shot, and like a z-pack, for 7 days. Told if I got worse go to hospital. I have total faith in this doctor known him all his life, his dad was our family doctor. The second day a friend who went to school with my wife, call and ask if we wanted to try HCQ, we both said yes, that after which was the second day, he delivered the HCQ, after two doses I was off home oxygen. My recovery was very slow, however I waited about 10 days before I went to doctor in the beginning. My wife's china Virus was very light after about 3 weeks we were tested again. Both test were positive. We waited 90 before we took the vaccine, I now know that was a mistake. I should not have listened to the CDC, nor Fauci. I will not take any more vaccine. I have not worn a mask except at yearly check up for my heart. I was forced to wear the mask. I no longer have that doctor. Mask do not work, not do the vaccine's prevent the China virus, nor keeps you from spreading the China virus. I do take the flu shot each year since the flu shots became available, I have not had the flu since I began taking the flu shots.This is my story, and I will not change. Good Luck.

Happy trails.

[gearhead]

I lost 2 good friends/coworkers early on. Betty and I both got the Moderna vaccines and booster. Two of our grandkids had it with mild symptoms. Just heard today our daughter inlaws grandmother has it. She has to be at least 80. Not a good future.
I wear a mask only when I have to. I worked around a lot of carcinogens and all field employees had to have mask fit tests annually with paper 3M masks to half masks to full face to Scott air paks. Those pretty fabric masks might be 25% effective at most. If it makes you feel better, go for it.
Baylor College of Medicine and Texas Children's Hospital recently announced they have a developed an effective vaccine that covers all variants and can be produced in mass easily.
Y'all stay safe out there. Happy New Year!

[travelin texans]

Back in February I had a mild ear infection that caused severe vertigo, went to the ER where they ran numerous test including for Covid. The final diagnosis was a ear infection resulting in vertigo, ground glass pneumonia with a positive Covid test. I ask if the pneumonia was Covid to which the Dr said unless they extracted fluid from my lungs or tested spuetum I coughed up they couldn't tell & they weren't doing either, but the treatment would be the same regardless. Was sent home with antibiotics & a 10 quarantine order. About 2 days of antibiotics the vertigo was gone & I felt fine. The DW was nor affected & hasn't ever been Covid tested & has way more health issues than I do.
We both have had the Moderna shots & booster along with the flu shot & pneumonia shot. I'd suspect that from now on the Covid boosters will be recommended annually just like the flu.

[wiredgeorge]

webmd says:
quote...Coronavirus. These tend to do their dirty work in the winter and early spring. The coronavirus is the cause of about 20% of colds. There are more than 30 kinds, but only three or four affect people. unquote

Seems the Covid-19 coronavirus wasn't in existence till the geniuses in a lab somewhere to the west of Texas started playing around with the bug that perhaps starts colds and supercharged it to see what zaniness they could cause. The common cold is often a coronavirus.

[wegone]

I am vaxed, boostered, and mask....

Last Sunday, the 16th January, I came down with it quickly, the omicron.
Chills, tired, body ache and pretty goof headache.
first 3 days, slept a lot, no real fever, just really tired.
Then came the cough, still hanging on even today, tho not coughing up much, more nagging hack.

Still not 100%.

I swear the mask make my breathing worse.
I really struggle wearing them, suffocating.
I have a really good sense of smell, very sensitive to perfume, air fresheners, etc.
Not sure if that plays a part or not.

My wife got it too.

I've been sicker before; this is just a real PITA thing.

Not sure if we will ever get the truth about this whole event, just too much cover your azz anymore.
Damn shame too.

[JRTJH]

Way back in early 2020, a niece was hospitalized downstate with some "strange disease that caused breathing problems, blood clots in her legs and other symptoms. Her mom and dad (our neighbors) went down to spend the week at the hospital with her. They came back, coughing, hacking and feeling like they caught the flu. We came down with the same symptoms a week or so later. The 4 of us finally got better after weeks of feeling like crap....

I'm convinced we had "the original COVID-19" but can't prove it.

We got all our vaccinations, boosters, protect ourselves when we can "reasonably do so" but have stopped avoiding life situations in the name of trying to stay well.. In other words, we're going to funerals, weddings, birthday celebrations, and plan on family holidays like Thanksgiving, Christmas, etc... We just have decided that it's not worth living a shallow life in order to "stay healthy at all costs"...

So, we've probably had some exposures to the latest strains, and will likely be exposed to the next mutation that comes along...

We support doing what each individual feels is necessary for their safety and health. We do not support further paranoia that "something could happen if we don't <fill in the blank>"... It's time that we learn to live with Covid, just like we learned to live with Flu, common cold, STD's, HIV and all the other things that came along, from small pox to tuberculosis....

To us, it's more desirable to live life with some level of risk than it is to avoid life to avoid all risk (only to still get sick).... YMMV.

PS: Here's hoping you and yours get well soon !!!!!

[wegone]

No, we can't avoid life, living in a bubble is not living.

My ex SIL was a very nervous sort.
She had a peanut allergy and swore that she'd go into shock by just smelling peanuts.
I am not really sure just how much you can really navigate through life under such constraint?
Now I do not recall growing up as a boomer that we had so many food allergies, nope, I don't recall any kids at school having to be fed different meals.
This ex SIL would take antibiotics if she was going to travel, "just in case" before she suffered any illness, or...
She seemed to get sicker and sicker.... looking, maybe from worry?

I do believe the body is best at achieving its own immune system, for its natural...
I recall it's the main reason babies were breast fed, now...formula, like it's trying to improve on what?

Maybe creating a market to sell folks stuff?

[sourdough]

I'm with John and others that think along those lines. I was concerned initially about this "covid" thing until I researched it and everything that goes with it. The variants are not going to stop until we make them stop. I'm vaccinated, immunized, boosted many times over for everything that might come along - where does it end? Locked up in the home with a gas mask on waiting for someone to drop a cup of soup on the doorstep? Nah.

We've spent enough time being "fearful" of whatever the next pandemic "might" be that the news is going to hyperventilate about. I'm not missing out on what's left of my life by locking myself up, avoiding what I enjoy, missing important family occasions OR having fun. Hell, you're far more likely to die in a fatal car accident than from one of these flus. Should we just sell the vehicles and walk as well? Life has risk....accept it.

[34kw]

No one has ever said the vaccine will keep you getting it or keep you from spreading it. For some reason this is what the media and the administration wants us to believe, but they stop short of actually making that claim. It simply isn't true. The vaccine eases the symptoms if you do get covid. That's it. In some ways that can be worse because a vaccinated sick person might feel good enough to go to work and thus become a 'superspreader'. Like all the other coronaviruses, Covid 19 effects everyone differently. In my case it was like a head cold for a couple of days and that was it.

[Ram Nation]

Between my wife and my allergies it's hard to tell if we've had it or not. I seem to smell pretty good and taste ok so hopefully were ok. I have had the J&J and booster through VA. My wife says she's done and only got the original J&J. I know one thing though. Living in Brownsville it's not hard to figure out who's scared and who's not. Plenty of masks to go round down here.

[Scttw]

No one has ever said the vaccine will keep you getting it or keep you from spreading it. For some reason this is what the media and the administration wants us to believe, but they stop short of actually making that claim. It simply isn't true. The vaccine eases the symptoms if you do get covid. That's it. In some ways that can be worse because a vaccinated sick person might feel good enough to go to work and thus become a 'superspreader'. Like all the other coronaviruses, Covid 19 effects everyone differently. In my case it was like a head cold for a couple of days and that was it.


Actually, with Delta the vaccine WAS really good at prevention, but with the new variant it just saves your life if you do get Covid! :D

[wiredgeorge]

I find it odd that no one has had a cold, influenza, an allergy or similar since the outbreak of Covid-19. That must be one side benefit! :popcorn:

[JRTJH]

I find it odd that no one has had a cold, influenza, an allergy or similar since the outbreak of Covid-19. That must be one side benefit! :popcorn:

LOL Yup, seems really strange that Flu has all but disappeared and nobody is saying they "caught a cold" last winter or this year... Hmmmmm:ermm:

[sourdough]

LOL Yup, seems really strange that Flu has all but disappeared and nobody is saying they "caught a cold" last winter or this year... Hmmmmm:ermm:


As we invent a new variant seemingly every couple of months it IS very strange that flu, colds etc. have disappeared and everything is now some sort of covid variant. There are multiple reasons for that misinformation and push to "scare" folks. Time to move on and "grow up" - the boogey man is waiting out there for everyone, for most this ain't it.

[flybouy]

I think the virtual absence of the traditional "flue and cold" season id due to isolation and awareness. Few folks in close contact and folks washing their hands and keeping things a bit cleaner. I think some actions are overdue and some folks overdue the precautions out of sheer terror. Like most things, I think a little common sense can go a long way.

JMHO

[wiredgeorge]

I think the virtual absence of the traditional "flue and cold" season id due to isolation and awareness. Few folks in close contact and folks washing their hands and keeping things a bit cleaner. I think some actions are overdue and some folks overdue the precautions out of sheer terror. Like most things, I think a little common sense can go a long way.

JMHO

I wash my hands constantly but having been doing so since I realized I was guilty. Anyone who thinks folks today have more common sense than any time in the past don't have any! :hide:

[Ram Nation]

I know the overwhelming majority of Brownsville residents heed the warning from the media concerning covid along with a big majority of winter Texans (Snowbirds) Masks on nearly everyone seen and the three local news outlets is all covid related. About tired of the media produced pandemic myself.

[Scttw]

LOL Yup, seems really strange that Flu has all but disappeared and nobody is saying they "caught a cold" last winter or this year... Hmmmmm:ermm:

John, I'm not sure why you're surprised. You where a mask everywhere you go - you don't shake hands - God forbid you kiss people, you likely stay at home and contain yourself to a small group, Oh, yeah, and you use hand san everywhere you go. All of these drop the likelihood of getting the common cold or flu by about 12 billion % (small exaggeration).

I do have friend that did get a cold couple weeks ago ..... tested neg to Covid, it was just the typical common cold that he thinks he got it from a check out machine that he had to push buttons on - no tap.

[JRTJH]

John, I'm not sure why you're surprised. You where a mask everywhere you go - you don't shake hands - God forbid you kiss people, you likely stay at home and contain yourself to a small group, Oh, yeah, and you use hand san everywhere you go. All of these drop the likelihood of getting the common cold or flu by about 12 billion % (small exaggeration).

I do have friend that did get a cold couple weeks ago ..... tested neg to Covid, it was just the typical common cold that he thinks he got it from a check out machine that he had to push buttons on - no tap.

I didn't say I was surprised... Quite the opposite. I said I find it strange that flu had all but disappeared and nobody was saying they caught a cold....

Nothing about this COVID circus is surprising (except possibly how many people have patiently just accepted being herded around crisis after crisis)... As an example, many are still wearing cotton masks, even though CDC studies have shown they are not effective at stopping or slowing cross contamination. And, another shocking (not surprising) example: When someone "doctor shops" tests as often as 2 or 3 times a day and has 8 or 9 "positive results", we're being told that there are "8 or 9 new cases"... All from the same person ???

And, being an "insider in disease reporting and medical statistics" I can assure you that it will take EONS to try to sort out all the hysteria in false reporting to determine who really "died with COVID" or "died as a result of COVID"...

I just shake my head about the STRANGE things going on, but none of it SURPRISES me... :popcorn:

[wegone]

Well I shared a few weeks ago I think my wife and myself had the omicron, our symptoms were exactly the same as listed.

I knew others I had been around had it too, same deal.

It seems it has affected me the most, not bad, just a stubborn cough mostly hangs on.

Over two weeks ago, when the Biden administration announced the free test kits, maybe more like 3 weeks ago, I signed up to receive them.

To this date, nothing, no kits, no follow up.... NOTHING.

I honestly think somewhere I have been added to the MASTER LIST of COVID outbreaks, merely because I was stupid enough to sign up, they took that as a positive test and added me to the grand total....

Maybe even 4 times, as that was how many kits they promised.

Just another failure by our government, like our schools, borders, etc....

End o' rant :)

[Ram Nation]

Island Eddie you don't have to look far in Brownsville for failure from our government. It's very easy to see.

[notanlines]

Eddie, these are to be delivered by the USPS. What rocket scientist/ brain surgeon determined that was a good idea?

[wegone]

Yeah....no kidding.

I recall years ago, two decades ago to be exact, I went away to rehab because of my drinking, been sober ever since, thank God!

But I heard there the definition of insanity, not sure if it was the very first time, or if it was the very first time, I paid attention....

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results.

Question then, are we crazy to keep electing these folks who created this mess, to begin with? :banghead:

[wiredgeorge]

Eddie, these are to be delivered by the USPS. What rocket scientist/ brain surgeon determined that was a good idea?

Apparently you don't use UPS or FedEx? Perhaps you feel one of these juggernauts of confusion would be a better distributor of our Chinese made free Covid tests? Better yet, let Amazon distribute... I would then have to go out to the road and check the brush for my test kits and get a little exercise at the same time. I wonder how much the Chinese benefit from producing all those tests and all the rest our medical supplies? :banghead:

[wiredgeorge]

Yeah....no kidding.

I recall years ago, two decades ago to be exact, I went away to rehab because of my drinking, been sober ever since, thank God!

But I heard there the definition of insanity, not sure if it was the very first time, or if it was the very first time, I paid attention....

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again expecting different results.

Question then, are we crazy to keep electing these folks who created this mess, to begin with? :banghead:

Elections are kind of like trying to decide which of the 3 Stooges would do the least amount of silliness if they were in charge. Politics is verbotten so will drop this line of chit chat but as a country, we need to wake up SOON.

[Carrottop]

I am struggling to see what this entire thread has to do with RVing. As we have been rightfully told many times that political or powder keg discussions (Covid is very political now) do not belong on this forum. I am curious how this is remotely related to Rving. I am sure I will get blasted for bringing it up but for those of us who might not share some of the opinions on Covid would not dare post about it on here with the comments being posted.

[notanlines]

John, while I see where you're coming from, I disagree where you maintain that the covid discussion doesn't pertain to RV'ing. It happens to have EVERYTHING to do with the subject.
I do see where the subject can vector off on a tangent to be more political than necessary, but the covid overall has had an effect and will continue to have an effect on our pastime for ages to come.
On a more positive note, you did present your argument in a very positive manner and I had a little trouble bringing my side to light without disparaging your views. I've seen a few threads lately that didn't pertain to RV'ing but chose to look the other way. Sometimes we have to broach a subject to keep everyone's interest.

[wegone]

I am sure I will get blasted for bringing it up but for those of us who might not share some of the opinions on Covid would not dare post about it on here with the comments being posted.

Interesting remark and kinda shows the problem with the world today....
A prejudice and defensive assumption that appears they already made up their minds prior to even engaging others in a said matter.

This COVID event is huge, it impacts pretty much everything in our lives presently.
I am not going to write a list other than to say it has impacted my trailering and camping a lot, which is what this forum is about, after all.

The crazy thing about censoring any dialogue in a so called "open forum" on the social media, allows disinformation, rumor, and ignorance to thrive, just the opposite of what it is attempting to avoid in the first place.

I personally feel let opposing issues and beliefs stand in comparison, side by side, and openly judged on merit, we will be all the wiser for it.
If the heat in the kitchen is above someone's comfort zone, then it's on them to exit the room, not demanding the kitchen be shut down....

I have had my own greatest personal growth when I challenged my own beliefs, that others shared with me as opposing views.

If I may ask you a question, why did you open this thread to begin with, if it held no value to your trailering?

Thanks.

[Scttw]

The issue is that people don't come to this forum to talk about Covid. They come here to find out why their water heater isn't working - etc etc etc .....

And although Island Eddie, you are 100% correct that Covid does indeed affect every area of life including RVing, people don't come here for that. So, it should likely not honestly be discussed. Yet, I have replied ......... lmao!

[Carrottop]

I am sure I will get blasted for bringing it up but for those of us who might not share some of the opinions on Covid would not dare post about it on here with the comments being posted.

Interesting remark and kinda shows the problem with the world today....
A prejudice and defensive assumption that appears they already made up their minds prior to even engaging others in a said matter.

This COVID event is huge, it impacts pretty much everything in our lives presently.
I am not going to write a list other than to say it has impacted my trailering and camping a lot, which is what this forum is about, after all.

The crazy thing about censoring any dialogue in a so called "open forum" on the social media, allows disinformation, rumor, and ignorance to thrive, just the opposite of what it is attempting to avoid in the first place.

I personally feel let opposing issues and beliefs stand in comparison, side by side, and openly judged on merit, we will be all the wiser for it.
If the heat in the kitchen is above someone's comfort zone, then it's on them to exit the room, not demanding the kitchen be shut down....

I have had my own greatest personal growth when I challenged my own beliefs, that others shared with me as opposing views.

If I may ask you a question, why did you open this thread to begin with, if it held no value to your trailering?

Thanks.

First I did not start this thread. I was simply stating that having seen many threads closed as they got hot in the kitchen as you say. I was simply stating that this particular thread "Covid vs. the Flu" has no relevance to Rving. It has been stated many times in the past that the moderators will shut down threads that do not directly relate to to Rving.

If this thread broached the subject of restrictions in certain areas or closures due to Covid you are 100% right they belong on here. I see nothing in the thread above that has to do with RVing as much as it does about commenting or complaining about Covid. There are plenty of other social media forums to do that. This is suppose to be about RVing. Not all the other things in the world that we like or dislike.

I am certainly not against debating opposing opinions as I have done many times on this forum and as general rule everyone is better for it as it increases everyone's perspective on a given issue.

I am not a moderator and have no say on what stays open and what gets shut down on this forum. I am simply stating my opinion and observations from what I have seen over the last 5 years of being on here.

[wegone]

And although Island Eddie, you are 100% correct that Covid does indeed affect every area of life including RVing, people don't come here for that. So, it should likely not honestly be discussed. Yet, I have replied ......... lmao!

LOVE IT, oh the irony :)

We all gobble click bait....hahahaha.

[wegone]

"Covid vs. the Flu" has no relevance to Rving

OK, I see your point the way it was "titled" in comparing the two.

Yes, I agree in that respect it is presented argumentized, and not solely about the impact that COVID is placing upon our travels.

I failed to see that to begin with, I stand corrected :)

[JRTJH]

I'd invite everyone to stop for a moment, take a look at the first thread in this section of the forum. It's titled: New forum for Covid-19 Topics - README

The last sentence in that sticky, detailing the rationale for the section reads:

"P.S. Now go wash your hands!" which, BTW, also isn't directly related to RVing (in the truest sense)....

The free expression if ideas (whether DIRECTLY related to Keystone RV's or not) is covered in the boundaries located in that Sticky.

We don't want to censor posts, are allowing as much "freedom of expression" as we can, so long as it doesn't become political. So far, it looks like the thread is "tip-toeing around the fringes"... Please think about what you post and how it comes across to others. If "a bull runs through the china shop" we'll have to close the thread.....

[jsb5717]

I'd invite everyone to stop for a moment, take a look at the first thread in this section of the forum. It's titled: New forum for Covid-19 Topics - README

The last sentence in that sticky, detailing the rationale for the section reads:

"P.S. Now go wash your hands!" which, BTW, also isn't directly related to RVing (in the truest sense)....

The free expression if ideas (whether DIRECTLY related to Keystone RV's or not) is covered in the boundaries located in that Sticky.

We don't want to censor posts, are allowing as much "freedom of expression" as we can, so long as it doesn't become political. So far, it looks like the thread is "tip-toeing around the fringes"... Please think about what you post and how it comes across to others. If "a bull runs through the china shop" we'll have to close the thread.....

Thanks, John, for the reminder of the boundaries. For my part, a properly focused Covid discussion has a great deal to do with RVing.

With the various mask mandates, and some places utilizing some kind of vaccine passports (whether or not they are constitutional or legal) has an impact on where we can go or what we can do. I, for one, pay attention to those kinds of restrictions or limitations in deciding where we will travel. For us, the reason to travel to a certain locale is to see and do what's available in that area. If the restrictions are too 'restrictive' then we'll plan to travel somewhere else.

Being aware of those regional issues, partly by reading other folk's experiences on this forum, helps in that planning. We all have opinions about all of this and some of those will become transparent in these discussions. For me, within the context of this forum, my distaste for Covid restrictions is related to whether or not I can freely go somewhere, do something, and enjoy it. If not, I'll take my trailer somewhere where I can.

[Scttw]

@john

see attachment

[wiredgeorge]

If I were in charge, I would ban everyone who posted in this thread... errrrr wait one on that brilliance. As far as the china flu, everyone has a take and an opinion. Some clash. Who cares? My wife makes me wear a mask when I come home after work... I am suspicious she is sick of looking at me. Now what did I do with my hand sanitizer? :popcorn:

This place is kind of like sitting down to Thanksgiving dinner with all the family and starting a discussion of politics or religion. That seems to work out about as well as a china flu discussion. :offtopic:

[jasin1]

I respect everyone’s opinions I really do but

How did we reach a place in the world where if one person doesn’t like what they hear then nobody’s allowed to hear it

Feels like we have made leaps and bounds in technology but going backward as far as dealing with people from day to day

I don’t like certain tv programming so I don’t watch it…I don’t write into the network and demand they take it off the air

Have a little flexibility people..life is hard enough at times

[wiredgeorge]

I respect everyone’s opinions I really do but

How did we reach a place in the world where if one person doesn’t like what they hear then nobody’s allowed to hear it

Feels like we have made leaps and bounds in technology but going backward as far as dealing with people from day to day

I don’t like certain tv programming so I don’t watch it…I don’t write into the network and demand they take it off the air

Have a little flexibility people..life is hard enough at times

When I worked for the Fed many moons ago, they had awareness classes on harassment. You know the kind. They stated that if an individual PERCEIVED a wrong word, look or anything, perception was their reality and YOU were in the wrong. This thinking has gotten to the point where I might need a safe space sitting in my closet. Now certain gaggles control the narative and if one speaks a different tune that person is either cancelled, banned or that person's right to breathe is questioned. Don't mean we can spout ad nauseum but somewhere the balance has been lost. This forum does a pretty good job of balancing.

[vampress_me]

Eddie, these are to be delivered by the USPS. What rocket scientist/ brain surgeon determined that was a good idea?

This made me giggle a little. There is an article in our newspaper today debating whether the tests sent out by the govt through the PO are any good after sitting in a mailbox at below zero temps for hours on end. Seems as how no one knows for sure since most of the tests say to store at 36-85 degrees F - and we’ve been sitting at highs in the single digits and lows below zero the past few days/ weeks in MN…. :lol: I’m not thinking the rocket scientist who came up with this brilliant plan understands or lives where it gets cold in winter….

[sourdough]

This made me giggle a little. There is an article in our newspaper today debating whether the tests sent out by the govt through the PO are any good after sitting in a mailbox at below zero temps for hours on end. Seems as how no one knows for sure since most of the tests say to store at 36-85 degrees F - and we’ve been sitting at highs in the single digits and lows below zero the past few days/ weeks in MN…. :lol: I’m not thinking the rocket scientist who came up with this brilliant plan understands or lives where it gets cold in winter….


Those "rocket scientists" don't understand the real world as they live in their "safe place" bubbles isolated from reality....and tell real life folks what to do...:facepalm:

[Badbart56]

How did we reach a place in the world where if one person doesn’t like what they hear then nobody’s allowed to hear it




Yes, THIS one sentence explains what's wrong with the world!

[JRTJH]

This made me giggle a little. There is an article in our newspaper today debating whether the tests sent out by the govt through the PO are any good after sitting in a mailbox at below zero temps for hours on end. Seems as how no one knows for sure since most of the tests say to store at 36-85 degrees F - and we’ve been sitting at highs in the single digits and lows below zero the past few days/ weeks in MN…. :lol: I’m not thinking the rocket scientist who came up with this brilliant plan understands or lives where it gets cold in winter….

Yep. I use Flonase in the winter to keep my sinuses clear. It comes from e-Scripts through the mail and is delivered to our mailbox down by the road... Glass bottles with liquid in them :) Well, the first 3 were all frozen and the bottles broken/cracked. I called e-Scripts, they resent the order. Sure enough, all the bottles were cracked/broken. I called e-Scripts, they said they'd send it UPS with instructions to only deliver with a signature (to assure the weren't left out in the cold)... I signed for the order, took it inside, opened the package, and sure enough, all 3 bottles were cracked/frozen... I went to WalMart and bought a bottle of Flonase that lasted until spring and now only order refills while the temperature is above freezing....

WHAT COULD GO WRONG WITH COVID TESTS MAILED IN THE WINTER ???? Hmmmmm :popcorn:

[Scttw]

John, you crack me up (pun intended).