Just An Observation On TV...

[Dan Lockwood]

I know from what I've read, (and no, I've not weighed anything yet, but plan to do so my first major trip out fully loaded) that I'm probably slightly over my limits on my 2012 RAM 3500 dually 4x4 LB 6.7L.

My observation, my RAM is a '12, my Raptor is a '12 model that's titled as a '13 because if was built in June of '13, for the year I have the heaviest duty TV short of a 4500, which most people did not purchase.

So if Keystone was aiming at a market size of trucks with the Raptor 395LEV, it had to be a F-350 or a GM 3500 or a RAM 3500. As I said other than a 4500 series there were no larger towing capacity trucks.

I think I'm just second guessing my combination a bit. After reading all the posts here about under powered TV versus their 5er's, I was a bit concerned that I was way under what I really needed. Yes today I could buy a newer truck with greater towing limits, but hey, they're both '12s so I'm going to just be satisfied with knowing that in '12 my truck was one of the best suited for the Raptor.

Am I being paranoid about all this?

Sorry if this is a redundant post from someone else, don't know.

Thanks and have a Happy Holidays!

[Tbos]

Dan,
Hope you will be pleasantly surprised when you weigh everything. Once you do you may be able to change the way you load things to help. I’m already looking at what I can move into the bed of the truck instead of the cargo bays on my Alpine. Since I’ve added my washer and dryer and 2 additional bikes I’m probably getting close on mine. My biggest issue is how much does all the “just in case stuff” weigh. I need to figure out exactly what I really need to carry. As you stated you bought one of the best trucks available at the time you bought the 5er. Not much else you can do except weigh it all, purge, and rearrange as needed. Good luck.

[rhagfo]

Dan, 2012 TV and TH, this is 2019 did you just purchase both? Did you have the TV and just purchase the TH?
The only number you might exceed is GVWR, in 2012 the Ram 3500 DRW was still rated at 12,300# GVWR, the same as my DD 2004 Ram 3500 DRW.
I have not looked at DD rear axle rating but I know it is likely near the 9,750# of out 2016 Ram 3500.
Your dry pin on the TH is 23% likely not to get any larger especially with the Harley's in the rear.
It will be interesting to see your weight as you head out.

2012 Keystone Raptor 395LEV Specifications
Length 42' 5"
Dry Weight 14,610#
Payload Capacity 3,390#
GVWR 18,000#
Hitch Weight (Dry) 3,560#

[Dan Lockwood]

Dan, 2012 TV and TH, this is 2019 did you just purchase both? Did you have the TV and just purchase the TH?
The only number you might exceed is GVWR, in 2012 the Ram 3500 DRW was still rated at 12,300# GVWR, the same as my DD 2004 Ram 3500 DRW.
I have not looked at DD rear axle rating but I know it is likely near the 9,750# of out 2016 Ram 3500.
Your dry pin on the TH is 23% likely not to get any larger especially with the Harley's in the rear.
It will be interesting to see your weight as you head out.

2012 Keystone Raptor 395LEV Specifications
Length 42' 5"
Dry Weight 14,610#
Payload Capacity 3,390#
GVWR 18,000#
Hitch Weight (Dry) 3,560#

They are both new to the wife and I. Purchased the truck in July and the 5er in August. The only towing so far has been from the Des Moines IA area to the greater St. Louis MO area. I've had it to the storage lot a couple of times and right now it's in my house driveway. I hope to have it loaded with my two Harleys and our new washer/dryer combo unit tomorrow and back out to the storage lot.

I've added Air Lift 5000's to help with a bit of sag, but that's it. Without the bags it doesn't seem to drop that much when hooked up, but thought the bags would also help with ride comfort when towing.

It is what it is, so nothing will change there. I'm just trying to get a grip that I didn't do something stupid with a much too heavy TH. But as the "observation" suggested, both the TH and TV were the best match in '12.

Tom, thanks.

[+Ruff Rider]

I do a lot of traveling . The first trip I found that i had to much stuff. So when i got home i did a clean out and removed what i didn't use on the trip. I did however need to buy some tools along the way for repairs to the RV. If you are going on a long trip think long and hard before you add a item that you may not even bring out. Next trip the chairs are not going. I have only used them once in 3 trips. Remember if you need something you didn't bring there is always some place you can buy it along the way.

[flybouy]

Dan not trying to be cynical but without having a cat scale weight and the information from your door sticker on your truck you may as well stop at a Carnival and ask the guy that's "guessing your weight for a cupie doll".

No one here can with any certainty know what you have added into your truck or trailer nor know what the actual carrying capacity of your truck is. Published empty weights are useless and "assuming" how much weight you have is well, you know what they say about what "assume" means. If you think "that I'm probably slightly over my limits" without visiting a scale then I think your visit to the scales will be an eye opening experience.

[sourdough]

"It is what it is, so nothing will change there. I'm just trying to get a grip that I didn't do something stupid with a much too heavy TH. But as the "observation" suggested, both the TH and TV were the best match in '12."

"So if Keystone was aiming at a market size of trucks with the Raptor 395LEV, it had to be a F-350 or a GM 3500 or a RAM 3500. As I said other than a 4500 series there were no larger towing capacity trucks."

"I think I'm just second guessing my combination a bit. After reading all the posts here about under powered TV versus their 5er's, I was a bit concerned that I was way under what I really needed. Yes today I could buy a newer truck with greater towing limits, but hey, they're both '12s so I'm going to just be satisfied with knowing that in '12 my truck was one of the best suited for the Raptor."


Dan, don't want to be a downer but I don't think I understand the above statements.

Your comment that "it is what it is" seems to allude to the fact that you will accept whatever overload you may have because, as the rest of your comments indicate, in your opinion, Keystone built your unit to fit a 350/3500 size truck although knowing that 450/4500s exist. What is the rationale behind that thought?

As in everything else, and as you know, the weight limitations are really there and the proposed weight of the RV is really there. The two shall be revealed at the scale. If you are severely overloaded you can do a few things; get a bigger truck, get a smaller trailer, or if possible, remove items from the truck/trailer; the same solutions every overloaded RV tower has. Where the notion that Keystone built your trailer to fit a 1 ton no matter the weight doesn't make sense to me. Just because they are what you have doesn't mean they HAVE to be compatible.

Again, not trying to rain on your parade but be realistic. Hopefully you find that you aren't overweight or that you can remove enough stuff to fit the weights but at the end of the day the weights stated for the vehicle, and the weights for the trailer from a scale, will tell the story. Good luck.

[Ken / Claudia]

I agree with Danny on the statements about made for a DRW 1 ton. And add, I would talk with an engineer/designer of the unit at Keystone if that is even possible before thinking it was made for a 1 ton TV. Here out west I do see DRW 1 tons pulling big 5ers and clearly some are overloaded. There are also many and I mean many 450s/550s and even larger pulling big 5ers. I have only walked through the largest 5ers at RV shows to just look and never tried to match any to a TV. I think the same applies here as in any other TV/RV combo. Match up the weights the best you can by whats listed on the truck and RV to have the right combo and still go weight and really find out where your at.

[rhagfo]

So here is my read as being a past bad boy on this forum.
2012 Ram 3500 DRW has a 12,300# GVWR our 2016 Ram 3500 DRW has a 14,000# GVWR. So there is a 1,700# difference in GVWR, our yellow sticker payload is 5,411# that less 1,700# = 3,711# of payload +/-. Now we both have the same size and capacity tires 235/70-17E's. Our 2016 is a Laramie, not sure of the trim level of your 2012 if less than a Laramie then a few more pounds of payload.
Looking forward to your scale weights, as I stated in my first post, you will likely be over your GVWR, with W/D as much as 500# or so. Well under tire and axle ratings, at that point it is your decision to tow over GVWR.

PS: You missed the 14,000# GVWR by one model year. The 2013 Ram's took a giant leap in GVWR, the 3500 DRW went from 12,300# to 14,000# mostly due to a stronger frame. Although the 3500 frame on my DD's 2004 3500 DRW is fully boxed so is yours.

[Dan Lockwood]

Hey everyone, thanks for the insight and thoughts.

I do have a Laramie equipped RAM.

Below are my door jam stickers.

I know about the upgrade in the '13 RAM, but I did get a great deal on this one and it's the last year pre-DEF. This did sound good to me.

When I scale my rig as loaded, I'll probably use the CAT scales along the road at a truck stop.

Not sure how they work. Do you pay for one weighing for the total overall TV a TH and then re-pay for each additional weighing?

I know I will need to have multiple weights. What exactly do I need? As long as the scales are, I can't get just a rear wheel weight without either the total truck, or if I pull up further I get the TH along with the rear axle of the TV.

Is there some chart that is best to follow?

Thanks and have a very Happy Holiday Season!

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL846/863774/24841920/414255939.jpg

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL846/863774/24841920/414350621.jpg

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL846/863774/24841920/414255936.jpg

[rhagfo]

Hey everyone, thanks for the insight and thoughts.

I do have a Laramie equipped RAM.

Below are my door jam stickers.

I know about the upgrade in the '13 RAM, but I did get a great deal on this one and it's the last year pre-DEF. This did sound good to me.

When I scale my rig as loaded, I'll probably use the CAT scales along the road at a truck stop.

Not sure how they work. Do you pay for one weighing for the total overall TV a TH and then re-pay for each additional weighing?

I know I will need to have multiple weights. What exactly do I need? As long as the scales are, I can't get just a rear wheel weight without either the total truck, or if I pull up further I get the TH along with the rear axle of the TV.

Is there some chart that is best to follow?

Thanks and have a very Happy Holiday Season!

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL846/863774/24841920/414255939.jpg

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL846/863774/24841920/414350621.jpg

http://pic80.picturetrail.com/VOL846/863774/24841920/414255936.jpg

Well you are far better off than I thought, 4,300# payload (Darn my Ram is fat! only 5,411# payload).
Depending how heavy you load your truck you could come in under all numbers, or at least only be over GVWR by a couple hundred pounds.

I also like the last label with the light load tire pressures, I would keep the fronts at 70 to 80 psi, but unloaded the rears at 40 psi will make for a softer ride.

[flybouy]

Go to https://catscale.com/ for all the info you need on weighing your rig.

[Dan Lockwood]

If I understand this correctly, the CAT Scales will have three load cells and I should be able to align my rig like this.

I'm guessing then that I will have three individual weights and one combined weight, correct?

Thanks again for helping out this rookie!

[Hellbilly13]

I just weighed at the CAT scale for the first time. Yes, you will pull up like in the pic and that will give you the 3 weights and an overall. Then you unhook and reweigh the TV. That will give you trailer weight when you subtract it from the overall weight.

It was about $14 for the first weigh and $3 for the second. I can't remember exactly.

[roadglide]

I'm wonder why you care about the trailer unhooked ? The 4 weights are steer axle,drive axle, trailer axles and gross weight. I have two 7K lb axles on my camper my cat scale weight at 11300 way under the 7 k axel and and 14 ply tires. You will add the steer and drive axles and that will give the GVW. My gross weight is way under the 25.000 GM has taged on the sticker. That's the way I read it . I'm right at the max with my rig and TV 11500 GVWR.

[rhagfo]

I'm wonder why you care about the trailer unhooked ? The 4 weights are steer axle,drive axle, trailer axles and gross weight. I have two 7K lb axles on my camper my cat scale weight at 11300 way under the 7 k axel and and 14 ply tires. You will add the steer and drive axles and that will give the GVW. My gross weight is way under the 25.000 GM has taged on the sticker. That's the way I read it . I'm right at the max with my rig and TV 11500 GVWR.

Two reasons;
To know how much pin on the trailer.
To Know how much the TV weighs without the trailer.

[Bolo4u]

You're going to be tight on your weights, especially the heavier you load. Your pin weight for your TH GVWR would be roughly: 20% = 3600, 22% = 3960, 25% = 4500. A lot will be dependent on how heavy and how you distribute the weight when you load the TH. Not knowing the hitch setup in the TV, you can save weight by switching to a goosebox setup. That way you can save ~150 pounds bed weight. Yes you're adding weight to the TH, but it will likely be less than a hundred pounds once you take off the old pin box and put the goosebox on. Maybe getting a true cat scale weight with truck empty (but full of fuel with hitch and the DW/kids), then with the trailer hooked up. Good luck!

[roadglide]

Two reasons;
To know how much pin on the trailer.
To Know how much the TV weighs without the trailer.

This is the way it works I know what the yellow sticker says on my truck with both on the scale and I come in under the 7200 lbs on the yellow sticker I'm good to go with the pin weight. With 3000 lbs in the garage that pin weight will change on the tv.

[flybouy]

This is the way it works I know what the yellow sticker says on my truck with both on the scale and I come in under the 7200 lbs on the yellow sticker I'm good to go with the pin weight. With 3000 lbs in the garage that pin weight will change on the tv.

Without the pin weight how do you know if the trailer load is distributed properly? If you're going to the scales what are you saving by not unhitching and a second weight? Four bucks and 20 minutes?

I must be missing something in this discussion, please enlighten me.

Thanks.

[Dan Lockwood]

I don't have any true weights of the truck with the hitch, but with a full tank of fuel and two of us inside, the truck weighed 8,400# at the county recycle center when I unloaded.

I'm guessing that the weight as has been said of the B&W companion is about right, 75# for the upper and around 125# for the base. I had no issues with the top part lifting it off and I was more than able to pull the base straight up the 6" to get the lower pin our of the bed.

So without any other items I'm going to be close to 8,600# with full fuel on the RAM.

It's going to be late winter or early spring before I get a CAT scale weight slip, but I will do the full up and then unhooked for the truck alone, why not...

I do appreciate all the input and discussions. I'm learning a LOT on this forum, thanks and have a great weekend... :)

[rhagfo]

I don't have any true weights of the truck with the hitch, but with a full tank of fuel and two of us inside, the truck weighed 8,400# at the county recycle center when I unloaded.

I'm guessing that the weight as has been said of the B&W companion is about right, 75# for the upper and around 125# for the base. I had no issues with the top part lifting it off and I was more than able to pull the base straight up the 6" to get the lower pin our of the bed.

So without any other items I'm going to be close to 8,600# with full fuel on the RAM.

It's going to be late winter or early spring before I get a CAT scale weight slip, but I will do the full up and then unhooked for the truck alone, why not...

I do appreciate all the input and discussions. I'm learning a LOT on this forum, thanks and have a great weekend... :)

You might squeeze within numbers depending on how the TH is loaded. Will be looking for weights in the spring.

[mikz86ta]

I have never seen any RV manufacturers post their 5ers or TT with the recommendation TV. Except recently they try to market some as 1500 truck compatable. But even most of those you are best suited towing with a 250/2500.
The salespeople will try to convince you into what they need to sell you. Lol
Some decent salespeople will steer you good.

Just have to research before you buy....overkill your TV or buy a different RV. If you got a TV already, you would buy a well within spec RV.

You got what you got now...go weigh your setup

[CaptnJohn]

4300# for a 2012 is not bad at all. However the newer you go payload magically increases. My 2019 F350 diesel dually 4x4 Lariat has a payload of 5598 on the sticker. Truck and trailer combined scaled at 25,220 loaded for 3 month snowbird trip. Have not weighed the truck separately yet. No rush as I know I'm under all numbers.

[Roscommon48]

Dan, you are over thinking this thing.


You have a one ton dually and you will do just fine. At some point you can look at a newer truck if you want but you'll be fine at this point...

[roadglide]

Dan, you are over thinking this thing.


You have a one ton dually and you will do just fine. At some point you can look at a newer truck if you want but you'll be fine at this point...
I agree load it up drive over cat scale get your weigh and drive off you will have 4 weighs on the yellow sheet . With my tv the drive axle is documented on the white sticker driver door jam and if the pin weight from the toyhuler comes in under which will be the drive axle weight shown on the certified yellow cat sheet . I was reading IRV2 toyhualer weights forum a guy with big Razer in the garage would take 900 lbs of the pin weight and add 2 k to the trailer axles . I assume he did the load and unloaded the garage.