Is this too much trailer for us? Truck Mods? [Archive]

MarkEHansen

11-19-2019, 04:52 AM

It's good that you're asking before you purchase. Do your research with one thing in mind: The truck and trailer dealers will not be honest about what you can pull with what. Even the sales/marketing brochures are misleading - all in the hope of making sales.

It's much more than just whether or not your engine has enough power to get the trailer moving down the road. The truck has to be strong enough to handle the load and the brakes have to be enough to stop the load, etc.

You must also consider what happens in unexpected emergency situations, like a large animal jumping in front of you, requiring emergency reactions, or you have a tire (or 2) blow out on the truck or trailer, etc.

There are several limits which you should not only not exceed, but you should allow for a buffer below them. These include the max payload on the truck, the gross axle weight rating, gross vehicle weight rating, trailer hitch/receiver weight ratings, tire weight ratings, etc. You should make sure you are below all of these.

Finally, don't use the dry weight reported for the trailer when considering these limits - rather you should use the GVWR noted on the trailer's weight sticker. Similarly, don't use the published tongue weight - you can estimate the tongue weight by taking a percentage of the GVWR for the trailer, or just go to the scales and have it weighed (when it's all stocked and ready to go camping).

Although the F150 looks like a real truck, you really are limited in what you can safely tow with it, so research wisely.

Good luck.

flybouy

11-19-2019, 05:32 AM

I have a 2018 F-150 V6 Ecoboost and the wife and I really like the Cougar line and are torn between the 27' 27SABWE or the 24' 24SABWE. How big of a towing experience do you think there would be and what truck modifications are recommended?

In my opinion the only acceptable modification is to trade up to a larger truck. The previous posts are spot on and another factor to consider is the "sail area" of a trailer that size. Crosswinds, trucks and buses passing creates a tsunami of air that pushes on the huge flat side area.

The other consideration is the fulcrum of the added length. Think of it this way. Take a 10 lb. sledge hammer, hold it at the head and extend your arm. No big deal to hold it out there right? Now take that same tool, hold it at the end of the handle and extend your arm with the handle parallel to the floor. It just got a lot heavier feeling didn't it?

Many, many people "drink the Kool-aid" offered by the misrepresenting auto and RV industries. When someone makes the "leap of faith" and trade in their Accord or whatever car and purchase a 1/2 ton pu they think they are "King of the Road" in their "Big Truck". It's completely understandable as relatively speaking it is a much larger/heavier vehicle and very capable of towing a box down the highway, just not a box that large and heavy. Then to "seal the deal" RV manufacturers use terms like "half ton towable" to sell the camper to the inexperienced truck owner.

So in my opinion you doing the right due diligence by asking the question. Read the responses, search the forum and make your decision. Good luck with your endeavors.

+Ruff Rider

11-19-2019, 05:39 AM

MarkEHansen

11-19-2019, 05:55 AM

Brakes, truck has them and the trailer has them so don't worry. If you listen to some guys here you will never leave the driveway without your lawyer on speed dial.

This is not a terribly responsible thing to say to a newcomer.

There are different levels of brakes. Brakes are generally engineered for the load they are designed to deal with. You can easily put a trailer behind a truck that causes more load than the truck brakes are designed for. You need to look at the ratings and make sure they are in line and provide sufficient breathing room.

As for the trailer brakes, there are some pretty simple failure scenarios in which the trailer brakes may fail to work when needed. Don't depend on them to save your life. If your truck cannot stop the combined weight in an emergency, you need a bigger truck.

To the OP: You're going to get a lot of advice and you'll have to decide what you do with it. I (and many others) will be willing to answer any questions you have so don't be shy.

JRTJH

11-19-2019, 05:58 AM

I have a 2018 F-150 V6 Ecoboost and the wife and I really like the Cougar line and are torn between the 27' 27SABWE or the 24' 24SABWE. How big of a towing experience do you think there would be and what truck modifications are recommended?

We would need much more specific data about YOUR TRUCK to make any recommendations. Ford sells an F150 with a 2.7L V6 EcoBoost with very minimal towing capability and they sell several versions of the 3.5L V6 EcoBoost, some with minimal capability, some with adequate capability for the 24SABWE. IMHO, none of the F150 trucks have the capacity to safely tow the 27SABWE when fully loaded.

At any rate, right now, we don't even know which V6 EcoBoost, what gear ratio, what cab configuration or whether it's a 2WD or 4WD version, so it's impossible to even offer recommendations specific to your truck. That said, generally speaking, the 2.7L is not suitable for towing large trailers and the 3.5L may (or may not) be capable in some configurations, but certainly not in "all configurations" of the truck. Depending on YOUR truck's equipment, you may be OK to tow the 24SABWE or you may be in the "buy a pop-up" category.

Give us more specific information regarding your truck's GVW, Payload, GCWR, RAWR, FAWR, tire size, hitch receiver rating, axle gearing ratio, truck wheelbase, cab configuration, drive type (2 or 4WD) and we can make some more "pointed recommendations"

But, with the current information, any recommendation (other than be careful, you might get in over your head) would be a guess...…

wiredgeorge

11-19-2019, 06:30 AM

I usually don't post when folks ask towing questions as we have a full complement of weight experts but when I looked at the specs for the 24SABWE, the GVWR for that trailer is 7800 lbs. The hitch weight is listed at 610 lbs. That just doesn't sound possible to my untrained self.

You won't be able to hop on down to the truck scales, as suggested, since you don't own the trailer but the published hitch weight seems plain ol' silly to me and I would guess more like 1000 lbs or even a bit more. Look at some of the posts on this forum where folks HAVE gone down to the scales and pin weight is 15-20 percent of trailer weight and if you figure that to be a more meaningful number, say 1200-1500 lbs roughly, compare that to your truck payload on the magic door sticker. Add the suspected pin weight to the weight of passengers and stuff in the truck to get an idea if you are OK or not.

travelin texans

11-19-2019, 07:53 AM

ABSOLUTELY DO NOT take the RV salesman word about anything concerning the ability of YOUR truck to tow any RV on their lot, look at the manufacturer sticker weights on the particular RV your looking at & the door jamb sticker on your truck, that salesman has 1 goal....to sell you a RV, doesn't give 2 hoots if you can tow it safely or not.
If you want post these weights on here & those with years of towing experience, that have been exactly where you are now, will be glad to help cipher whether it's possible or as John said "you're in the popup category". No one here wants you to "have your lawyer on speed dial", not trying to scare you, but will give you sound advice, what you decide to do with that advice is totally up to you.

Logan X

11-19-2019, 08:03 AM

I’ll share my experience. I have a Hideout 24BHSWE trailer which is 27 feet long and the gross trailer weight is 7800 pounds. I towed my first year with an F150 ecoboost, and it was ok. I’m fairly certain I was over my payload capacity.

I upgraded to a F250 and now towing is like a dream. I used to be constantly worried about being overweight and now I don’t even think about it. Having the larger truck to tow a trailer that size is extremely stable and comfortable to drive.

Like others have mentioned, and like you are already doing, do research and learn weights and true tow capacities before you buy.

Good luck!

foldbak

11-19-2019, 08:20 AM

I have a 2018 F-150 V6 Ecoboost and the wife and I really like the Cougar line and are torn between the 27' 27SABWE or the 24' 24SABWE. How big of a towing experience do you think there would be and what truck modifications are recommended?

I have a 2018 27SABWE and tow it with a Ford Expedition equipped with a tow package max tow 9000 lbs. I know I'm at my limit but I've been towing with Expeditions for 15 years. Pros are my 100 lb lab has lots of room. Cons the V8 is slightly under powered on severe grades but for the most part performs well in normal conditions. Good weight distribution and sway control is needed. I recently purchased an Anderson WD/Sway hitch and it is amazing.

The newer 10 speed v6 has much more HP and torque. Considering an upgrade.

sourdough

11-19-2019, 10:47 AM

"Brakes, truck has them and the trailer has them so don't worry. If you listen to some guys here you will never leave the driveway without your lawyer on speed dial."

I have to agree with Mark about this not being terribly responsible to say to a newbie. While it is true the "truck has them and the trailer has them", each set of brakes is built to control a certain, finite load; all brakes are "brakes" - they have their limits. Just an example: coming back from FL one year on the bridge over Mobile Bay, there was an accident up ahead and everyone was locking it down very quickly. My truck is more than enough truck for my trailer and my trailer brakes are excellent because they are checked/adjusted before each trip. As this scenario unfolded in front of us very rapidly the only thing I could do was hit the brakes...HARD. The truck would have stopped quickly but towing a big trailer it's more like a semi. Thankfully I had a good space between me and the car in front of me but I ended up with my bumper just a few short inches off his and I was angled right at the guard rail on the edge of the highway....dropping of into the Bay. I did not angle to the left because I would have pushed someone directly into 70mph oncoming traffic. IF I had been using my previous 1/2 ton I would have probably been in the bay or someone else (or all of us) severely injured. There's a whole lot more to it than "brakes is brakes" - and we NEVER know when "that moment" is going to occur. As far as never leaving without a lawyer on speed dial....I leave all the time and don't worry about a lawyer when traveling because I've made sure that my stuff is up to snuff.

As others have suggested, post the numbers off the sticker inside the driver door, they will tell you what you need to know and how your truck stacks up against the trailers you have looked at. Remember to keep a margin (10-15%) of safety between what you load your truck with and the maximum numbers for your truck. Look for the payload, gawr (frt/rear) and gvw of the vehicle for a start. Let us know and congrats on thinking ahead to try to match the combo instead of ending up behind the curve with a mismatched rig and finding yourself at the truck dealership trading for a larger TV as I and many others here have done.

Edit: Once you have posted, and if we find that the numbers support one or both of the trailers, I'm sure there will be some suggestions to improve the towing experience along the lines of air bags, shocks, LT tires etc.

+Ruff Rider

11-19-2019, 11:01 AM

This is not a terribly responsible thing to say to a newcomer.

There are different levels of brakes. Brakes are generally engineered for the load they are designed to deal with. You can easily put a trailer behind a truck that causes more load than the truck brakes are designed for. You need to look at the ratings and make sure they are in line and provide sufficient breathing room.

As for the trailer brakes, there are some pretty simple failure scenarios in which the trailer brakes may fail to work when needed. Don't depend on them to save your life. If your truck cannot stop the combined weight in an emergency, you need a bigger truck.

To the OP: You're going to get a lot of advice and you'll have to decide what you do with it. I (and many others) will be willing to answer any questions you have so don't be shy.
I guess you didn't understand my post. I clearly said that he had to look at the yellow sticker for the GCVW and not to exceed that. Next I said that both trailer have brakes and the (not mentioned in my post) are more than capable of stopping a fully loaded trailer, provided the correct axles are installed. Now we are getting in the weeds here a bit. I gave OP sound advice on what and where to look for the information about his truck in his driveway not something on a lot or brochure. I also told him to check the hitch on the truck to make sure it was correct for his trailer. Not one time did I mislead OP. I have done lots of research and more than 35,000 miles towing my RV. At this point I consider myself pretty good at it. i have backed up more than I care to count and never hit a thing. I don't always have my wife spot ether. I get out acess the spot and go for it.
I sure hope we helped OP decide on weather his truck is ok to tow with.

JRTJH

11-19-2019, 11:41 AM

There is a yellow sticker in the door that tells you the payload. You have to look at the hitch to make sure it meats the load capacity of the trailer. You don't want to exceed the GCVRW of the truck. That too is on the sticker. other than that you will be fine. You may want to get some air bags. The F150 has soft springs and the truck may sag even if under the payload of the truck. You need to be able to level the truck and trailer for a more comfortable tow. Get the correct load leveling hitch and have fun. Brakes, truck has them and the trailer has them so don't worry. If you listen to some guys here you will never leave the driveway without your lawyer on speed dial.

I'm going to beat on the dead horse for a moment, then encourage to OP to check, double check then triple check his truck's capabilities BEFORE committing to either trailer that he's interested in purchasing. It's clear to me that with the limited information he provided, he isn't aware of much that affects his truck's towing capabilities.

What that tells me is that he can't "read between the lines and interpret what we meant to say, but might not have been clear in saying"...…

So, it's true: "Brakes, truck has them and the traielr has them, so don't worry" Let's face it, as an experienced RV'er, I know that can be interpreted on its "face value" or it can be interpreted as "complete BS"... Without casting dispersions, if I can interpret it in more than one way, how can any of us be "even somewhat sure" of how a novice, asking for advice is going to interpret that sentence????

Literally, it's factual, they both have brakes... From a towing perspective, none of us can be even remotely sure that "he'll be fine". What was said has little or no "useful advice" other than acknowledging that both the truck and trailer have a means to stop them, but no means to even begin to establish whether that ability to stop is safe, adequate, even whether it will work together to stop the rig... (Remember, the OP is new and didn't even mention if his truck has a brake controller)…..

So, from a perspective of offering advice to a brand new RV'er who has never towed, hasn't even bought an RV yet, to say something like, "Other than that, you'll be fine" is a reassurance with no earthly means to know whether it's sound advice or about to get a "noobie in trouble".....

Ken / Claudia

11-19-2019, 02:17 PM

Check out my listed trailer regarding dry tongue wt. I beleive factory lists 560 lbs or close. I drove over a DOT scale while taking it loaded for 2 for 3 days of camping. It was 920 lbs. So, what ever the trucks payload rating is; Yes plan on 1,000 lbs of added wt. to truck just for the trailer tongue on the 24 footer.
Edit:
The following post is correct, the number Keystone, (ie a 24RKSWE) gives does not include the bumper and tongue. OR DMV figured that one out and takes money from me for a 27 foot trailer. Do not tell them, my tape shows it is 27 ft 4 inch's long.

Wyldfire

11-19-2019, 04:27 PM

24sabwe is like 29 foot. Not 24.

Tofan

11-20-2019, 06:09 PM

I have a 2018 F-150 V6 Ecoboost and the wife and I really like the Cougar line and are torn between the 27' 27SABWE or the 24' 24SABWE. How big of a towing experience do you think there would be and what truck modifications are recommended?

Not sure if anybody is familiar enough with towing heavy with F150s or not, since I didn't see this asked. The only thing that really matters is if you have the Max Tow package with the 3.5L V6 Ecoboost or the Max Payload and/or both.

I'm not sure what the truck would feel like without atleast a Max Tow package, but I do know that my 2016 F150 with the Max Tow package could tow that without a problem. If your not careful you could be well over the payload, but that could happen with any truck.

Ever since Ford came out with the Max Tow package that encompassed the 3.5L V6 Ecoboost, there are tons of people like me that got completely out of the diesel game. I think your own setup and preference matters more to "will the truck do it", remember these aren't the same 1/2 tons that maybe some of our older members are more familiar with. Payloads are way higher, brakes are bigger, frames are thicker, and finally now we have a gas engine that has a very similar torque curve to a turbocharged diesel engine.

Mods that I would do are Bilstein 5100 Shocks, Firestone Airbags or Sumo Springs, Weight Distribution Hitch, You could go E rated 10 ply tires just to make sure that you won't have any issues if you decided to go over legal payload.

Again this is assuming that you have either the Max Tow or Max Payload or both, I can't really speak on a F150 without one of those packages.

Logan X

11-20-2019, 07:05 PM

Tofan,

I agree with you that the F150 3.5l ecoboost with the max tow package is a capable tow vehicle. I strongly disagree with any suggestion of purchasing a truck or trailer that would exceed any weight limitation, including payload capacity.

Just stating my opinion, I’m not trying to criticize or start an argument.

Tofan

11-20-2019, 07:16 PM

Logan X,

No I agree 100%. I think it's important to make sure your trailer and truck can operate in a safe legal fashion to include not exceeding weight capacity.

But if he/she was gonna renegade it anyways and be overloaded, atleast the mods would make it a little more safer for everybody else!

travelin texans

11-20-2019, 07:46 PM

Just FYI to the OP!
Yes, you can add mods to your truck til the cows come home but there is NOT a single mod or combination of mods that will add 1 pound of payload or carrying capacity to any truck, most add weight that is subtracted from the posted payload. Basically overloaded is overloaded, pick one of two possible cures, less RV or more truck.
Also to compare a V6, boosted or not, to a diesel as a tow vehicle is comparing apples to gravy, ABSOLUTELY no comparison.

wiredgeorge

11-21-2019, 06:19 AM

flybouy

11-21-2019, 06:50 AM

Folks the OP posted and left and hasn't come back. Save your breath. Once again, a first time poster posted and fled the scene. Was that person really looking for advice? This seems to have become more common as of late. Some folks call this a troll.

I could have predicted as much after the first couple of replies. He already has a 1 - 2 year of truck so most likely won't take a bath on that. He said he and DW were "torn between 2 trailers" so they had made up their minds that one of them was coming home. He asked about "upgrades to his truck, makes me think he's committed to the truck he has and one of the two campers.

People disappear from the Forum for many reasons. Life happens, tragedies, illness, life changing events can make following up on a forum inconsequential. So no one knows with any certainty why he hasn't been back.

With that said, I do see a pattern of people who begin their first post with "can I tow x trailer with y truck". When the answers aren't confirmation that they are making a good choice they will flee, most likely while telling the screen what a "bunch of no nothing you know what's those guys are".

Of course this is just my opinion and I hope I'm correct for I wouldn't want any ill to befall him or his family. Hurt feelings from a post on a forum should heal quickly.
JMHO

Laredo Tugger

11-21-2019, 06:53 AM

Agreed George.
Another post on "Bad Customer Service" was a "light the fuse and run" effort as well. I guess if some do not get praise from their peers that their actions (over weight towing, excessive payloads ect..) are justified, they will go somewhere that people will tell them what they want to hear. Human nature really,but for those that stop and listen (on this forum) there is a wealth of knowledge on here.
RMc

kcamp99186

11-21-2019, 08:26 AM

I can relate this to my personal experience. I tow a 34 foot Premier that weighs (dry) 6800 lbs with an 8000 lb GVR. My previous truck was a 2013 F150 with the 3.5 EcoBoost and a tow package (not Max Tow). Loved the truck. Simply stated it would easily pull my trailer, up hill or down at any speed I choose. I dry camp every spring to fish and typically carry firewood, generator, spare propane tank, gas can, fish fryer and a bicycle in the bed of my truck. On my third such trip I had a busted rear shock on the truck which I replaced with "towing" shocks, there was a spring built onto the shock. In talking to the fleet mechanic at work, he told me that My truck did indeed have the power to pull but not the capacity to carry the load. I traded in that truck for an F250 with the 6.7 Turbo Diesel and have not been disappointed. No more "pucker factor" on our adventures. I have only a little reserve on this truck. My advice is to listen to the folks on this forum. You've gotten some excellent advice and they will continue to help you if you but ask.

+Ruff Rider

11-22-2019, 05:54 AM

I'm going to beat on the dead horse for a moment, then encourage to OP to check, double check then triple check his truck's capabilities BEFORE committing to either trailer that he's interested in purchasing. It's clear to me that with the limited information he provided, he isn't aware of much that affects his truck's towing capabilities.

What that tells me is that he can't "read between the lines and interpret what we meant to say, but might not have been clear in saying"...…

So, it's true: "Brakes, truck has them and the traielr has them, so don't worry" Let's face it, as an experienced RV'er, I know that can be interpreted on its "face value" or it can be interpreted as "complete BS"... Without casting dispersions, if I can interpret it in more than one way, how can any of us be "even somewhat sure" of how a novice, asking for advice is going to interpret that sentence????

Literally, it's factual, they both have brakes... From a towing perspective, none of us can be even remotely sure that "he'll be fine". What was said has little or no "useful advice" other than acknowledging that both the truck and trailer have a means to stop them, but no means to even begin to establish whether that ability to stop is safe, adequate, even whether it will work together to stop the rig... (Remember, the OP is new and didn't even mention if his truck has a brake controller)…..

So, from a perspective of offering advice to a brand new RV'er who has never towed, hasn't even bought an RV yet, to say something like, "Other than that, you'll be fine" is a reassurance with no earthly means to know whether it's sound advice or about to get a "noobie in trouble".....
Why is is that some people cant read.
Maybe you should go back and read my post again.
i am done with this. OP hasn't posted since he posted in the first place.

Horse Doctor

11-24-2019, 09:44 AM

We bought our new Cougar knowing we would be close to the limit on what we could tow with our F-150. After making sure we were not overloaded, we took a short trip. While the truck did fine, it was not a comfortable drive with the trailer at the truck’s towing limits. Hence, we now have a new F250 with the PSD.

SheriP

11-24-2019, 10:00 AM

We have the 2018 F150 Platinum with the Max tow, 5-1/2' bed and the 3.5liter with EcoBoost. We tow a 32' Crusader with a dry weight of 8500#. For the most part you don't even know the trailer is back there. The only mod we made to the truck was adding air bags. (Note: the picture in the signature is our first camper...a Cougar 1/2 ton 26SAB. Sadly we totalled it when it blew a tire).

FBO Cookie Monster

11-24-2019, 10:12 AM

IMHO, none of the F150 trucks have the capacity to safely tow the 27SABWE when fully loaded.

.…
The HDPP 3.5 could do it. First limit that would get hit would be receiver hitch limit of 1320.

As far as brakes, if you are below the limits on on weights gcvw etc, all good. The f150 has larger brakes than previous generation 1 tons, and the brake system is considered in great detail when the engineers are computing combined weights.

travelin texans

11-24-2019, 10:16 AM

FBO Cookie Monster

11-24-2019, 10:23 AM

flybouy

11-24-2019, 10:36 AM

Sorry Ford guys, but when you post your truck is the "Max Tow model with 3.5 liter V6" just doesn't compute to "Max Tow" to me. It at least should be a V8 to be called "MAX"!
Sort of like the "Anderson Ultimate" 5th wheel hitch weighing in at 35 pounds made of 1" aluminum piping, does not compute to ULTIMATE in my tiny brain.
Bigger is "Max" or "Ultimate"!!
I have a new Jeep with the 2.0 liter turbo & it runs like a turpentined cat, but they don't call it MAX or ULTIMATE.

The old "must be bigger" doesn't hold these days and if you talk to European gear heads they haven't understood how American car manufacturers could get so little power out of so much iron for so many decades. Nowadays they are squeezing more hp and torque out of 1/2 the size and at lower and lower rpm curves.

The "max and ultimate" verbiage is just sales hype. Think back to the 1070's and Volkswagen promoting the "Super Beetle". Like "new & improved", "fun sized" snacks, etc. it's all relative. I'll bet the professional haulers, 18 wheeler drivers, and heavy equipment operators get a good laugh at all of us rolling down the highway in our "toy trucks" pulling our "toys" behind.

Tom Slick

11-24-2019, 11:17 AM

I have the 24SABWE and tow it with a Nissan Titan XD Pro4X with a Cummins Diesel. I think I have the perfect tow vehicle for the Trailer. It's rated to tow 12,200# and the truck weights 8200 lbs. Its actually heavier than my buddy's Chevy 3500. The Titan XD is actually about a 5/8 ton so it makes a very solid TV for the 24SABWE.

JRTJH

11-24-2019, 11:42 AM

The HDPP 3.5 could do it. First limit that would get hit would be receiver hitch limit of 1320.

As far as brakes, if you are below the limits on on weights gcvw etc, all good. The f150 has larger brakes than previous generation 1 tons, and the brake system is considered in great detail when the engineers are computing combined weights.

That model F150, from what I can find, is a "one in 40 thousand" as they go down the assembly line. I've NEVER seen one on a dealer's lot, every dealer I'd chatted with says, "They're special order only, we can't sell them to regular buyers". That tells me, the average novice that comes here, looking for "Can my F150 tow...?" not only doesn't know what a HDPP 3.5 is, they've never seen one and don't have a F150 that's "comparably equipped'... So, while you have one, the next 40,000 owners won't have one and likely more than half (20,000) won't have ever seen one or even know they exist... So, telling someone, "Sure if your F150 is an HDPP 3.5, you'll be fine" is like saying, "If you have hen's teeth, you'll be fine".... or maybe, "If your unicorn is blue rather than pink...…"

While it's "possible" to equip and F150 to tow some heavy trailers, it's not "probable" that someone would "walk in off the street with those options"... That said, the typical F150 is not equipped to tow anywhere close to the HDPP 3.5... There's much more to towing with an F150 than just the emblem on the fender. YMMV.

FlyingAroundRV

11-24-2019, 11:49 AM

JM2¢ But if you are thinking of towing a sizeable RV you should at least consider upgrading to an HD truck. The HDs are designed from the ground up as towing vehicles and come with heavier suspension and running gear, trailer brake controllers as standard, transmission coolers and probably other things that you'd have to add to a 150 sized truck. By the time you add all those extras to a 150 sized truck, you'll probably be near the price of an HD truck and still be stuck with the posted payload limitation on the 150 for insurance purposes.
As others have said here, the ability of the truck to pull the load is one thing. The ability of the truck to stop it and control it when the semis roll past, or worse, a stiff crosswind over a bridge somewhere are another matter. That's without even considering what happens when you come undone somewhere and the insurance company goes looking for a reason to deny your claim.
And finally, towing with an undersized truck can be (and often is) a white knuckle experience, just do a search through the threads on the forum here. My point is, if your rig is a bear to drive, it acts as a deterrent to using it. Then you'll do one of two things; give up RVing or upgrade to what you should have had in the first place. Again, a search through the threads in the forums here will turn up lots of experiences with this.

LFord

11-24-2019, 12:05 PM

I have a 2018 F-150 V6 Ecoboost and the wife and I really like the Cougar line and are torn between the 27' 27SABWE or the 24' 24SABWE. How big of a towing experience do you think there would be and what truck modifications are recommended?

Not enough info about your F-150 to give an accurate reply. I have a 2013 F-150 Supercab (not Crew Cab) with the 3.5 liter V-6 Ecoboost. With the factory trailer tow package (but NOT the Max Tow Package), and 3.15 rear axle ratio, and a 1744 lb. payload, it is rated to tow 8,600 lbs. Therefore, wanting to have sufficient "head room" or margin between the tow rating and actual rig to be towed, I chose a Keystone Passport Ultra Lite Express 199ML with an EW of 3,600 lbs. and GVW of roughly 5,000 lbs. My F-150 easily handles that rig in mountains and elsewhere. Since it's just me, I probably don't get anywhere near the max loading of the 199ML.

Now, if I wanted to go to most 5th wheels or a longer, heavier travel trailer, then I'd need to move up to at least an F-250. Since I have no plans to do so, my F-150 is more than sufficient for present needs. Plus, with the 3.15 rear end (bought it used, so didn't order it that way), it gets between 23 and 24 mpg when not towing on highway/Interstate use.

You need to get more specific with the numbers on your F-150. You can call Ford Motor Co. customer service, give them the VIN for your truck, and they can give you more specific numbers.

flybouy

11-24-2019, 12:37 PM

That model F150, from what I can find, is a "one in 40 thousand" as they go down the assembly line. I've NEVER seen one on a dealer's lot, every dealer I'd chatted with says, "They're special order only, we can't sell them to regular buyers". That tells me, the average novice that comes here, looking for "Can my F150 tow...?" not only doesn't know what a HDPP 3.5 is, they've never seen one and don't have a F150 that's "comparably equipped'... So, while you have one, the next 40,000 owners won't have one and likely more than half (20,000) won't have ever seen one or even know they exist... So, telling someone, "Sure if your F150 is an HDPP 3.5, you'll be fine" is like saying, "If you have hen's teeth, you'll be fine".... or maybe, "If your unicorn is blue rather than pink...…"

While it's "possible" to equip and F150 to tow some heavy trailers, it's not "probable" that someone would "walk in off the street with those options"... That said, the typical F150 is not equipped to tow anywhere close to the HDPP 3.5... There's much more to towing with an F150 than just the emblem on the fender. YMMV.

From what I've read they are only available in XLT trim and basically is a fleet sale.

I think that unicorn is an albino unicorn. JMHO

LHaven

11-24-2019, 12:51 PM

I have a 2018 F-150 V6 Ecoboost and the wife and I really like the Cougar line and are torn between the 27' 27SABWE or the 24' 24SABWE. How big of a towing experience do you think there would be and what truck modifications are recommended?

I had an F-150, bought a 26' Cougar "Half-Ton Towable," discovered I was way over the safety numbers (in truck payload), and ended up having to buy an F-250.

I recommend this online worksheet (http://changingears.com/rv-sec-calc-trailer-weight-tt.shtml) to do your homework. It requires figures that you will have to find at least four different stickers or manuals to collect, and a few of them actually require weighing your TT loaded for travel (you can estimate, but don't be too optimistic). If you PM me, I'll send you a spreadsheet that gives you indications of where to find them and/or how to compute them, then use the online worksheet for the final analysis.

skids

11-24-2019, 03:23 PM

Because of the positioning on the trailer, batteries, propane, fresh water, and junk in the compartment can make tongue loading crazy! You can't just estimate load and assume 15% for the tongue. But that is the point... Don't expect that the distribution hitch can solve all of the problems.

efrulla

11-24-2019, 03:46 PM

I tow a Cougar Half Ton 25RES with an F-150 Lariat with a max tow package and have been doing it for a couple of years now. The truck handles the unit very well and I am pleased with the performance.

Before I purchased the 25RES, I dug out my vin number on the F-150 and called Ford Support. Not too worried about Ford Support trying to sell me another truck so I felt comfortable with the numbers they gave me.

The 25RES fit comfortably within the specs provided by Ford Support with plenty of capacity to spare. Lets look at some numbers

25RES
Hitch weight - 1505
Total weight - 7852

24SABWE
Hitch weight - 1739
Total weight - 6061

27SABWE
Hitch weight - 975
Total weight - 6679

Based on the info provided to me by Ford Support I would not feel comfortable towing the 24SABWE with my F-150 but would hook up to the 27SABWE without reservation.

Like I said, call Ford Support, give them your vin and have them tell you what you can tow then make a decision.

Having said all of this, if I was buying the tow truck first I would have purchased an F-350 if for no other reason than having the extra capacity to grow into.

Ed Frulla
www.MyRVNotes.com

FBO Cookie Monster

11-24-2019, 03:47 PM

From what I've read they are only available in XLT trim and basically is a fleet sale.

I think that unicorn is an albino unicorn. JMHO

Anyone can get one, my first came off a lot. It was not bare by any means, had nav, 110 volt inverter, tow mirrors, etc. Second one I ordered, and got as loaded as you can get one, which means also getting the geazzer step. Crew cab, 4x4, 2500 lb payload, 17,200 gcwr, 4800 rear axle. weighs just under 5200 lbs with 36 gallons of gas onboard.
So, not a unicorn, but you will likely have to wait 8 to 12 weeks for them to build it. Ford does not let dealers order them for the lot because the payload exceeds a 250 diesel, and thus may cut into potential sales.

efrulla

11-24-2019, 03:55 PM

Yeah except that my V6 with a Turbo outperforms my other F-150 with a V8 any day of the week. I have other trailers I tow besides my 5th wheel and I have learned thru EXPERIENCE that the V6 with the turbo is the go to vehicle.

sourdough

11-24-2019, 05:07 PM

The Ford 3.5 EcoBoost conversation, and the claims made for it, always amuse me. From those that are the "true believers" you would think it is the strongest engine in the world and bulletproof. Strangely, Ford offers no 3.5 EcoBoost pkg. in any HD truck in any form that I find....hmmm, so I'm not thinking they're worried about the engine itself taking away HD customers; maybe the "package" just doesn't measure up to an HD??

If you notice any truck meant for heavy towing, for long miles, has a "stout" engine; not an overly aspirated, small, V6 cylinder. Granted there are diesel 6 cylinders but they are nothing like the gas ecoboost. So, I'm thinking that those that love them can love them....until they need an actual HD truck, OR, that turbo(s) shell out and you have to pull 8k out of our pocket because you were trying to use it for something it wasn't meant for....:D JMO/YMMV

Pete54401

11-24-2019, 05:14 PM

Enter your VIN and I'll let you know what the tow rating is. Is this a conventional or 5th wheel? GVWR on the trailer? How often will you tow the trailer? How far?

Logan X

11-24-2019, 06:49 PM

Enter your VIN and I'll let you know what the tow rating is. Is this a conventional or 5th wheel? GVWR on the trailer? How often will you tow the trailer? How far?

I would use caution using the tow capacities Ford would tell you using the VIN. It may be more accurate than the sales brochure but it won’t account for what is loaded in the tow vehicle and how that will affect available payload (including the trailer tongue weight). Whatever Ford told you would be assuming a completely empty, right off the assembly line, weight for the truck. In reality, when you are towing, especially with an F150, your truck will weigh probably close to or over the gross vehicle weight rating.

Just my humble opinion.

flybouy

11-24-2019, 07:07 PM

Anyone can get one, my first came off a lot. It was not bare by any means, had nav, 110 volt inverter, tow mirrors, etc. Second one I ordered, and got as loaded as you can get one, which means also getting the geazzer step. Crew cab, 4x4, 2500 lb payload, 17,200 gcwr, 4800 rear axle. weighs just under 5200 lbs with 36 gallons of gas onboard.
So, not a unicorn, but you will likely have to wait 8 to 12 weeks for them to build it. Ford does not let dealers order them for the lot because the payload exceeds a 250 diesel, and thus may cut into potential sales.

Some people find 4 leaf clovers to. I think, and again this is my opinion just as you expressed your opinion in your last sentence that the reason the Ford dealers don't stock them is not because they want to sell F250's. I think it's because it doesn't make sense. A customer looking at the upcharge for a F150 that's been built "like" a F250 or F350 for nearly as much, if not more money will say "why should I buy an imposter when I can have the real thing". I'll bet the dealer will let you pry the badging off a F250 or 350 and replace it with a F150 badge if you ask them.
JMHO

Otty

11-24-2019, 07:24 PM

I’ve had several RVs. In my experience, 1/2 ton pickups are not suited for anything more than about 19’. Sure, many are rated to tow larger units. But at what cost? Terrible power, very low mpg, sagging rear end, stopping issues, problems with hills, etc.
I strongly suggest a 3/4 ton. You will not regret it.

Laredo Tugger

11-24-2019, 07:35 PM

Anyone can get one, my first came off a lot. It was not bare by any means, had nav, 110 volt inverter, tow mirrors, etc. Second one I ordered, and got as loaded as you can get one, which means also getting the geazzer step. Crew cab, 4x4, 2500 lb payload, 17,200 gcwr, 4800 rear axle. weighs just under 5200 lbs with 36 gallons of gas onboard.
So,not a unicorn, but you will likely have to wait 8 to 12 weeks for them to build it. Ford does not let dealers order them for the lot because the payload exceeds a 250 diesel, and thus may cut into potential sales.

Just think of the payload you COULD have if you did not get your truck with all those goodies. Heck, one post on this thread shows a towing combination (TV an F150 and 5er fully loaded) maybe 600 pounds less than my trailer. No thanks, I will take my package any day. I guess the OP should consider towing a 42 ft. Toyhauler using your numbers and logic. It is more of a misinformed new world than a brave one.
RMc

FBO Cookie Monster

11-24-2019, 08:52 PM

Some people find 4 leaf clovers to. I think, and again this is my opinion just as you expressed your opinion in your last sentence that the reason the Ford dealers don't stock them is not because they want to sell F250's. I think it's because it doesn't make sense. A customer looking at the upcharge for a F150 that's been built "like" a F250 or F350 for nearly as much, if not more money will say "why should I buy an imposter when I can have the real thing". I'll bet the dealer will let you pry the badging off a F250 or 350 and replace it with a F150 badge if you ask them.
JMHO

The reason for me is quite simple. I commute with the truck 98% of the time, and tow 2%. It gives me the best of both worlds, 22mpg on the commute, and drives nicer. Yet when I want to tow a small fiver or 9000 lb trailer, it is rated and capable of doing that too.

LFord

11-25-2019, 06:56 AM

Folks the OP posted and left and hasn't come back. Save your breath. Once again, a first time poster posted and fled the scene. Was that person really looking for advice? This seems to have become more common as of late. Some folks call this a troll.

If the original poster was legit, but left the discussion "early," he may have been like some folks and just came here to get his pre-conceived notions confirmed. Once he started hearing advice he didn't want to hear, he was outta here! Seems like there's a lot of that going around nowadays; just keep searching the Internet until you find what agrees with you!

flybouy

11-25-2019, 07:12 AM

If the original poster was legit, but left the discussion "early," he may have been like some folks and just came here to get his pre-conceived notions confirmed. Once he started hearing advice he didn't want to hear, he was outta here! Seems like there's a lot of that going around nowadays; just keep searching the Internet until you find what agrees with you!

None of us can say with certainty why the OP hasn't returned.

I do believe that there's a lot of people that "take their ball and go home" if they don't get a "trophy for participating".

JMHO

blubuckaroo

11-25-2019, 09:21 AM

Many don't pay any attention to the gear ratios available when buying a truck. Many owners wouldn't even be able to tell you the ratio they have.
The gear ratio means everything for your particular use of the vehicle. You need to decide whether you want a cruiser or a tow truck.

When we recently bought our 1500 Silverado, the axle ratio options were 3.08, 3.23, 3.42, and 3,73.
We saw a number of trucks with the "trailer Package" and 3.08 or 3.23 gears. WHAT A JOKE!

Now you might think that some of the new eight speed trannys will make the difference, but NO. You'll pull the guts out of it with a trailer.

Also, just moving to a 3/4 ton truck won't fix this. Some are being marketed with higher gear ratios for those who won't be towing.

Another thing to consider is your tire diameter. Whenever you put on tires with a larger diameter, you are reducing the tow capacity just as if you had a higher gear ratio.

You need to do the research.