Wheel bearing seals

[Bisjoe]

Our Springdale is in the shop for an annual service and inspection, which to me is worth the $129 for peace of mind. Unfortunately they found a problem. On one side, the wheel bearing seal failed, and the grease has contaminated the brake pads. Since they have to replace both sides the total comes out to about $600. I asked about the likelihood of this happening when the trailer is only 2 years old, with only about 1,000 miles on it.



His response was that when sitting all winter in the cold the seals get hard, and allow moisture from the air to penetrate into the grease, which then becomes thin like oil. When you first take it out in the spring, that gets by the seal and onto the brake pads. His only solution is to keep it in a heated storage space.:nonono:



Has anyone else had this problem? It seems like everyone would if this was true.

[travelin texans]

His explanation is a boat load of BS!!!!
Someone somewhere, probably your last annual visit, used the EZ lube bearing grease zerks on the spindle to "pack" your bearings & also packed your brake drums full of grease. If they charged you $600 last time & did it this way you got royally shafted, they didn't remove any wheels to do this so therefore didn't inspect any brakes.
Next time I'd either learn to do it yourself or find a different shop that won't blow smoke up your a## to cover up their mistake.
If you've only traveled 1000 miles in 2 years you won't need this done again for several years if you're don't plan on any more use the next couple years. This provided the shop doing your work actually does what they're charging you for this time.....

[Bisjoe]

No, they didn't pull the wheels last year, and didn't charge more than the $129. They just inspected from the outside, same as this year, but this time they saw the grease
on the outside. I have done this kind of work myself on many cars over the years, and could have saved the labor if I had known, but it's not like I could tell them not to fix it and tow it home that way. What I should probably do though is look for another shop to do the inspection or find the time to do it myself.

[chuckster57]

I too call BS!! What brand of axles? We have had LCI goodwill some in the past. There was a known issue for a while. Worth a call.

[JRTJH]

^^^ What they said. If they are LCI axles, they're warrantied for 6 years, if Dexter axles, 5 years. If (you may need to prove to LCI/Dexter) the axles have not been disassembled for inspection/maintenance (as you stated) then the seals should be covered and the grease damaged brakes should be repaired under the axle warranty.

As Chuckster stated, there was a problem with some seals on some LCI axles a couple years ago and they have covered repairs/replacements for a lot of customers.

If "your dealer" (I won't call them a "serviceman") doesn't contact LCI for you, and he probably won't because they'll reimburse him around $300 for the work and he can charge you $600 for the same work, then why would he want to take care of your problems under warranty?????

It sure sounds to me like you're being "dangled on the end of a money stick" by a dealer that's far too greedy and not nearly honest enough...... YMMV

[gearhead]

100% BS says gearhead, the Machinery Specialist 40 year veteran of the largest international oil company in the world, who has traveled nation wide trouble shooting all kinds of machinery issues.
BS

[Customer1]

$600 is awful high for 2 brake assemblies, seals, and labor. You're being hosed.

Last year at a local shop, I got 4 brake assemblies, 4 drums, 4 full bearing sets, all new wet bolts, new shackles, and 2 new equalizers for $1,000 including labor.

[tech740]

I have to agree with Texans. If that were the case every trailer in the north would need new brakes every year. Someone greased your bearings by using the ez lube not by taking the bearings out and doing it correctly. If the brakes are covered in grease then they do need replaced. But I don’t know that the same shop would be doing it.

[flybouy]

I'd suspect the shop used a pneumatic grease gun on the EZlubes. Their cost to rectify what they did is high. MHO

[chuckster57]

I'd suspect the shop used a pneumatic grease gun on the EZlubes. Their cost to rectify what they did is high. MHO

None of the 3 dealerships I have worked at spent the money for a pneumatic grease gun. All of them did have the good old hand pumper, I only use it on wet bolts.

[flybouy]

And the other mistake is that when using the EZ lube zerks you're supposed to jack the wheel off the ground and rotate the wheel while pumping grease in according to their directions. Personally, I believe that following their directions to the "T" will result in a blown seal the "majority" of the time. Repacking by hand will result in a cut and failed seal if you don't know what you're doing. Bottom line, to me, is if someone isn't mechanically inclined, firt time wrenching, pay someone to do it for you.

[JRTJH]

None of the 3 dealerships I have worked at spent the money for a pneumatic grease gun. All of them did have the good old hand pumper, I only use it on wet bolts.

Not to get into the pros/cons of pneumatic vs manual grease guns, but Harbor Freight has a pneumatic grease gun for $30. With the 20% off coupon, even cheaper. While it's not the "professional model with all the bells and whistles", mine is probably 10 years old and still going strong. It seems to not leak grease like my manual guns do so it's much less messy to use.

If you're looking for a pneumatic gun, no need to wait for the boss to buy one, "HF to the rescue" (again) https://www.harborfreight.com/air-grease-gun-with-12-in-hose-68293.html

HF has cheaper ones, but I opted for the 12" hose rather than the 6" style.

[ChuckS]

Pure BS regarding cold weather and those trailer grease seals. My fifth wheel sits from Oct until mid May every year. Our temps are down to -10 sometimes. Never had a rear grease seal on any of the 4 hubs leak.

$600 is just Hiway robbery and if you had basic mechanical skill sets, basic tools you could do all of this yourself for under $100.

I do not own and will not use a pneumatic grease gun. If the zerk won’t take grease with my 45 year old grease gun then there is an issue with either the zerk or the item itself.

I’d find somewhere else to get my work done after this ... the individual that told you that cold weather sitting hogwash is a disgrace to all the competent skilled mechanics out there

[flybouy]

Not to get into the pros/cons of pneumatic vs manual grease guns, but Harbor Freight has a pneumatic grease gun for $30. With the 20% off coupon, even cheaper. While it's not the "professional model with all the bells and whistles", mine is probably 10 years old and still going strong. It seems to not leak grease like my manual guns do so it's much less messy to use.

If you're looking for a pneumatic gun, no need to wait for the boss to buy one, "HF to the rescue" (again) https://www.harborfreight.com/air-grease-gun-with-12-in-hose-68293.html

HF has cheaper ones, but I opted for the 12" hose rather than the 6" style.

I bought the same one (probably the same sale) around the same time. After all the shoulder/cervical spine surgeries it's a lot less painful to pull the trigger.

[Hitsman3]

Where did you get the work done? We live in Shelton,Wa. & are looking at buying a 22’ Cougar.

[Bisjoe]

Where did you get the work done? We live in Shelton,Wa. & are looking at buying a 22’ Cougar.
Tacoma RV in Fife.


I didn't argue with the service guy because we did have a nasty snowstorm in February with 12" and drifts that covered the wheels for close to a week on that side that failed. It seemed to make sense when I thought about it, with the rubber seals freezing hard and then due to illness not moving the trailer until September. I have since bought wheel covers and will remove any snow that is in contact with them this winter.


I looked in my warranty binder and the brake parts were only covered for one year, and it's been two.

[bobbecky]

Maybe the brakes are only covered by Keystone for one year, but if they are Dexter axles and brakes, they should be covered for two years. http://www.dexterpartsonline.com/files/2036913/uploaded/Warranty%20Information.pdf

[flybouy]

Tacoma RV in Fife.


I didn't argue with the service guy because we did have a nasty snowstorm in February with 12" and drifts that covered the wheels for close to a week on that side that failed. It seemed to make sense when I thought about it, with the rubber seals freezing hard and then due to illness not moving the trailer until September. I have since bought wheel covers and will remove any snow that is in contact with them this winter.


I looked in my warranty binder and the brake parts were only covered for one year, and it's been two.

If you think about it the wheel assembly (brakes,bearings, seals, etc.) are engineered to be used in all types of weather. The rear seal is the one that typically fails from improper greasing and is the only seal that can leak and contaminate the brakes. The outer seal will leak out of the hub and onto the wheel if it fails. Having snow drifted against the tires will not be enough to get inside the drum and hub. Snow doesn't make metal any colder than the air temp. Tire covers are used to keep UV rays from deteriorating the tires. Hope this helps.

[travelin texans]

Where did you get the work done? We live in Shelton,Wa. & are looking at buying a 22’ Cougar.

If physically able, know which way to tighten/loosen bolts & enough tools to change a flat you could/should do it yourself. There's plenty of videos out there to show you or ask here, wish I had a dollar (use to be a nickel, but retired now & could use the $$$) for every time I've packed bearings. With a box of nitrile gloves from Harbor Freight you won't even get your hands dirty.

[ChuckS]

Dexter axle made this video on how to properly lube their EZ lube axle... while the EZ lube is a novel concept it also often leads to other issues...such as blown grease seals and brakes that don’t work because they are loaded with grease....

So... if the EZ lube system is so great then why does Dexters own how to video in an EZ lube setup show the “old school” method ? Simple.

Because it IS the proper way.....

https://youtu.be/GnH-h3W9XvI

[tech740]

I was so against doing it the old school way. Then I used the EZ lube. Man was it convenient. Then I had 2 brakes out of 4 that worked. Then I pulled it apart had to bad seals. After 4 new brake assemblies all new bearings and seals. I will NEVER do that again. The old way worked for many many years.

[ChuckS]

“Old School Way”.... lets see... when I was 12 my Dad taught me how to repack wheel bearings... a gob of grease in palm of hand dragging edge of bearing against grease in palm of hand till grease starts to come out the other edge...work it entire 360 degrees of bearing edge

53 years later this is still how I do tapered bearings... Old school... naw... it’s just the right way and always will be with tapered bearings

[flybouy]

“Old School Way”.... lets see... when I was 12 my Dad taught me how to repack wheel bearings... a gob of grease in palm of hand dragging edge of bearing against grease in palm of hand till grease starts to come out the other edge...work it entire 360 degrees of bearing edge

53 years later this is still how I do tapered bearings... Old school... naw... it’s just the right way and always will be with tapered bearings

I was about the same age that my father taught me that lesson. He also taught me a valuable lesson about greasing universal joints. For you younger lads yes they were not disposable back then. The joint had a zerk fitting so I grabbed the grease gun. That was another lesson in "the path of least resistance". He let me use the grease gun, then we removed the u-joint. One cup resisted the grease.
One of my happiest memories of him was seeing how proud he looked setting in his wheelchair watching me work on my truck. I thanked him for the life lessons that day and every day since his passing in 2001.

[ChuckS]

Flyboy yes our Dads had to learn to do it all...with little to no money...They taught us both many valuable lifelong lessons...

And don’t you just love the new “permanent sealed” front end components on many late model autos... Thankfully my GMC and wife’s Jeep have “old school” zero fittings on tie rods, ball joints, idler and pitman arms, etc...

I do however like the front sealed wheel bearings...But.. I’ve had two fail on left front and 1 fail on track front of my GMC...

And yes.. I too have greased many drive line U joints..
Gotta love it if you get careless and the tiny roller bearings come out...

[chuckster57]

Ah..Ujoints. If I have to take it apart to grease it, it needs to be replaced. Sealed front hubs: love the money I make changing them. I do have a shop press so I can do just the bearings, sometimes that single part and my labor is cheaper than a new hub.

[flybouy]

Getting a bit off track but .... had dodge Omni (was a re-badged VW) back in the early 1980's. Right front wheel bearing went bad 3 times. It was a "dual race, split inner race" sealed bearing. I thought it was my fault in how I pressed it on. So I was setting in the dentist waiting room reading a Popular Mechanics. There was a Q&A repair section where someone asked about the problem that I was experiencing. The answer, check the body ground strap connection. The braided ground strap would fail so the ground would circuit thru the wheel bearing causing the bearing balls to arc and pit. I checked and that was the issue. No more issues for the 100K miles after that.
So the point is not to overlook (or assume) that any preventive maintenance is unnecessary.

[Dan Lockwood]

If raising each wheel one at a time to hand pack, say on a triple axle RV with an 18k gross, about what weight would I have to lift with my floor jack to clear the tire off the concrete?

I have a 3-1/2T roller floor jack, but now wondering how much it would have to lift.

Thanks and sorry for hijacking this thread.

[allenclme]

His explanation is a boat load of BS!!!!
Someone somewhere, probably your last annual visit, used the EZ lube bearing grease zerks on the spindle to "pack" your bearings & also packed your brake drums full of grease. If they charged you $600 last time & did it this way you got royally shafted, they didn't remove any wheels to do this so therefore didn't inspect any brakes.
Next time I'd either learn to do it yourself or find a different shop that won't blow smoke up your a## to cover up their mistake.
If you've only traveled 1000 miles in 2 years you won't need this done again for several years if you're don't plan on any more use the next couple years. This provided the shop doing your work actually does what they're charging you for this time.....

Mine was full of grease from day one. Don't know what happened, but When I picked up our 3820FK from CW brand new, I complained that the braking was not what I would have expected and can't lock up the wheels. They told me since it was a larger 5er than my last one, I'll get used to it. Well, two years later, I took it in for a bearing repack at a trusted shop, not CW, and they found grease all over the back plates and brake shoes. They changed all new back plates, and brake components. Guess what - something amazing happened. My brakes will actually lock up now and work like you would expect. Whatever was wrong was original equipment.

[travelin texans]

Just reading another forum a fellow gives each wheel 4-5 pumps of grease through the EZ lube every time he pulls the RV??? What do you guys think the odds are that all 4 aren't full of grease??? I'd say a million to one that they are all 4 completely full & has no trailer braking!!! If not, he is one lucky SOB!

[jbsmith]

I replaced the electric drums on our Keystone Cougar 331MKS with electric over hydraulic disks. The factory drum brake cartridges were also full of grease when I tore them down. Like many others, I used the zerk fittings to add grease to the bearings.

The disk brakes are very easy to tear down to service the pads and bearings. The rear seals are visible from the back of the disks and much less likely to contaminate the pads if the seal should fail. Replacement pads are available at most any parts store. I replaced the bearing and race assemblies with Timken bearings and packed with Mystik JT-6. We ran over 4000 miles on them this summer.

2388323881

[mcomeaux]

Backing Plates with shoes attached as unit $70.00 ea maybe...Seals 8.00-10.00 ea. Labor shouldn't be more than 2.0 hrs.
I'm with the rest sounds like horse **** to me. I had a tire and
automotive shop for 35 yrs I've seen some real **** stories and testified
in 2 against shop owners for deceptive practice. Goes on a lot more
than most think...Its a lot easier to make it the honest way....

[mcomeaux]

I'd use a 20 ton post jack and a jack stand

[Weldon]

I'd use a 20 ton post jack and a jack stand

Although this thread is almost 2 years old, i used the 20 ton and jack stands recently to replace factory adjustable brakes with self adjusting, and replaced double lip seals.