Am I just nervous because it's all new?

[Michaeldt]

Morning,

I've been talking with friends and other campers in our church, our RV dealer, and scouring through the forum and not getting anywhere so thought I'd just ask.

When the Mrs. and I decided to shop for our first RV, I was looking at the RPod's and other smaller, very light campers. I figured a small one to start with would be great to learn, and then in a few years trade up to something larger. Most times camping will be us and our two dogs, but some times we'll have our grand children with us, sometimes 2 and sometimes all four.

What we liked about this particular model (other than the sales price) was that is has two bunks in the rear where all the grands could sleep, plus the dinette, and the queen master room.

So we decided on and purchased a 2019 Keystone Hideout 262LHS last month. Total length of this is 29'3". Our sales and service techs told us the weight on this camper is 4800lbs; sticker on the trailer itself shows GVWR at 7545 / GAWR at 3500lbs (each axle).

Our TV is a 2013 Ford F150 XLT, 5.0L V8; Sticker GVWR is 7100lb, front GAWR is 3450lbs, Rear GAWR is 3850lbs.
RV dealer installed the e2 WDH system and trailer brake system.

We've pulled the camper four times. Once from the dealership to our home (about 45 miles), then an overnight trip that was around 60 miles one way, then pulled it to our storage area, about 11 miles from the house. When on the interstate and with the truck in tow/haul mode, the front of the truck felt light while steering. I was terribly nervous when we pulled it home (was dark, raining) and tractor trailer rigs pushed me around a bit but kept it on the road pretty well with a white knuckle death grip on the steering wheel.

Our overnight trip was for a gospel music event, about 50 miles on interstate, and about 10 miles on a two lane state highway. Again it was raining but daylight up there, and dark and clear the next night on the way home. I still felt the front of the truck was light, but with drier roads I wasn't as nervous getting back home.

I've talked with my RV dealer and they want to adjust the WDH to help get more weight on the front end?

My question being; have we possibly bitten off too much camper than we can safely tow? It was a great deal, but I want to feel more comfortable when pulling the camper on trips. I'm trying to learn weights and distribution stuff, but it's quite a bit to tackle...so need some thoughts from some of you more experienced with this?

On the chance that I can't get comfortable with this, will it be a hassle with our RV dealer to trade it in for a smaller camper?

[JRTJH]

First, All F150's aren't created equal. There are some 2013 F150 XLT 5.0L trucks with a GVW of 6700 pounds and some with a GVW of 7600 pounds. There are some with 3.21 gear ratios and some with 3.73 gear ratios, some with towing packages and some without towing packages.....

That said, it's difficult to know how your truck is equipped and whether you're over your towing capacity or just under your towing capacity. I'd suspect that with a 30' trailer weighing nearly 5000 pounds "dry" that you're pushing the limit, possibly over the limit....

Here is a link to a recent thread that has a link to a "towing calculator" that you can use to input your specific numbers and get an OBJECTIVE, no frills answer to where you stand "by the numbers". Remember, towing experience, equipment condition (your truck is 6 years old and parts are worn with use), your hitch, how it's set up, the cargo you carry, the roads you tow on, the conditions when you tow (cross winds, rain, etc) all play into how safe your rig will tow. As an example, if you and your DW weigh 300 pounds (150 each) and you carry 500 pounds of gear in the bed of your truck, that's 800 pounds before you hitch the trailer. On the other hand, if each of you weigh 300 pounds and your grandchildren are 75 pounds each, then you're at 900 pounds before you put one brick or piece of firewood in the bed....

Go here to get an idea of what weights you're dealing with: http://www.keystoneforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=36906

So, run the numbers at the link in the above thread, see how you stack up and if you have any questions, many of the members of our forum will give you their "sage advice" on what you're facing....

As an end note, be very cautious of listening to those who say, "You'll be OK, I do it all the time" especially if they don't have all the information on your truck, your cargo, your trailer weight and your experience level.....

[cookinwitdiesel]

A couple things you can do to confirm your situation.

Get the truck and trailer weighed at a CAT scales. Weigh twice, with the trailer attached same as you would drive, then park the trailer somewhere and weigh just the truck by itself. Compare the weights on the front and rear axles of the truck in both scenarios. Don't unhitch on the weight pad, that is poor etiquette for others who need to weigh and get back on the road.

Second thing, and much easier, just take a picture of your total rig from the side with and without the trailer hitched up. If the truck is squatting too much it should be pretty clear.

Both of these "checks" will tell you that you either need your WDH adjusted (if possible - I guess stiffer spring bars?) and or to change the balance between truck and trailer (either more truck or less trailer).

At the end of the day, regardless of what others on here say, if you are not comfortable driving the rig and feel safe, then a change should be made so that you are. No reason to make a vacation stressful.

[Retired Copper]

I am just going to lay it out there. The trailer in my in my picture is a PassPort 2670 30.6 feet long dry weight 5360. Pulled it with a 2013 F150 5.0 3:55 gears with the heavy tow package not the max tow. The tires on the truck had to be upgraded to Lt tires the shocks had to be up graded and the e2 just did not handle the 30 foot length. On anything that long you need a better hitch something with more sway control. After the upgrades the truck done fine as long as you stayed under a certain speed the faster you pulled it the more the wind effected it. On two lane roads at speeds 50 to 55 it was a dream. Once on the interstate you could tell it was back there in certain situations but livable with the upgrades. The tow guide had my F150 rated at 7600 lbs but pulling a camper I would never want to pull a trailer that length over about 6500lbs. This is just my 2 cents worth of advise. I knew from pulling a camper what I wanted and wasn`t total happy with the set up, doable and felt safe but just wasn`t what I was looking for. Good luck but towing doesn`t have to be a stressful experience. I think I have read somewhere where fastway recommends anything over 26 feet they recommend four points of sway control. I sent you a pm on what I did.

[sourdough]

I'll have to chime in with the others about the truck. First and foremost we need more information on the configuration, secondly a trip to the scales would be most beneficial. Aside from that....

The gvw of that trailer is 7545. It is 29' 3" long. Here are the specs (scroll down from the floorplan):

https://www.keystonerv.com/travel-trailers/hideout/floorplans/262lhs-travel-trailer/

I agree that the e2 is probably not enough wdh/sway control for that truck/trailer combo as well as the tires and other things.

Did you overload the truck? Without scaled weights it would only be a guess but very possibly. If the numbers work on the worksheet provided and you keep the truck I would make the suggested upgrades asap - towing a trailer doesn't have to be, nor is it, a "white knuckle" affair if the truck and trailer are matched and set up correctly. Good luck.

[linux3]

In 207 when I was looking to trade in my Ford Explorer Sport on a truck I looked hard at F150's with the V8. The Explorer had the Ecoboost 3.5 and fuel millage was poor. The Max tow package comes with the Ecoboost, no choice.
So, having the 5L V8 means you do NOT have the max tow package. You do NOT have the 3.73 gears although you might have the 3.55.
Son, you just flat out don't have enough truck if you are planning long trips.
There is a lot of marketing and sales BS out there but real world if you are planning on towing anything over 25 feet and if the TT weighs MORE than the truck you need a 2500 or F250.
As someone who pulls 8 ~ 9,000 miles a year I am seriously under rated for my truck and can relax during the ride.
Sure, you can do it and there will be folks who say they do but....

[notanlines]

I don’t know how long since you’ve had a bath, but if you take that RV in to trade for a smaller unit then today is your day for a bath. Avoid that at all costs. Please follow the advice given many times earlier and weigh it as suggested and then post all the info back here. Everybody gave good advice, and we’ll do everything we can to keep you in this RV and truck and do it safely.

[Gegrad]

I am guessing your E2 doesn't offer enough sway control. Which model do you have? Getting a 4pt sway control hitch if you don't have one may help a lot. I have a husky 4 pt sway hitch and I have ZERO sway towing a trailer roughly the same size as the OP. Conversely, my Passport was less stable than my current trailer (Passport was about 4.5 ft shorter); I was running an Equalizer 2 pt sway on that unit.

[crk112]

Just wanted to jump in and point out that, referencing the towing guide, in 2013 the F150 V8 5.0L was offered with the 3.73 axle. That gave a max tow of 9200-10000, depending on cab configuration. It requires the heavy duty payload package to achieve that.

I’m curious to know OPs wheelbase, axle ratio, and cab configuration. I have same year, make,model,trim, and engine of tow vehicle. I have same hitch, I have same TT just a couple or few feet shorter (242lhs). I have 157” wheelbase, 3.55 axles, super crew cab. Not many half tons would handle even my TT.. my tow vehicle weight (6200lbs with me in it) and wheelbase are in my favor, but I wouldn’t tow anything longer even with mine. My next truck will surely not be a half ton.

[Snoking]

Sounds like along with being marginal TV for the trailer, the hitch is not set up correctly if the front feels light. Here is the manual, there is a section on setup the hitch. Chris

https://www.fastwaytrailer.com/pdf/e2-round-bar-hitch-instructions.pdf

[Michaeldt]

Afternoon all,

Thanks for the posts and questions. It's been a busy last part of the week and Saturday but I do have some more answers for some of the questions. I have not taken the camper to a scale yet, but considering it possibly next week, or more optimal the week after (if we don't return the camper to the RV dealer first).

The Mrs. and I went to our Ford dealer today to look at trucks that would handle our camper, and let's just say we struck out. Found a great truck, but way out of our price range for now.

I did get our sales rep to print off the window sticker to our truck, and here are some of the details that has been asked;

2013 F150 Super Crew XLT
3.31 gear ratio
145" wheel base
5.0L V8

The GVWR listed on the truck sticker is 7100lbs.

I'm not making excuses, I should have done my homework better. My goal when researching and discussing campers was to start out with something like the Forest River R Pod, small, lightweight, and after a few years look at upgrading our camper and truck package.

It is our future goal to be full time RV'ers when I retire (another 10-15 years).

When we saw this model at the RV show, our sales guy assured us our truck would pull it. The tech who walked us through the inspection assured us our truck could pull it. I should have listened to my gut more but when they gave us the price they did on the Hideout, and it had many things that the Mrs. really loved (oven, bunks for the grands, a door for the master area), I neglected my gut and went stupid I guess.

Anyway, we're going to talk with our sales guy again next week. He has told me that we're not the first customer to purchase more camper than they need, and they've worked with customers before in this situation so if they are true to his word, we'll talk about working back into something smaller, 20ft max length, under 5,000lbs, and hopefully come out of this with minimal bruising. I have seen some Hideout models that are under 20ft, and they have most of the things the Mrs. will need, so prayers would be appreciated that we can work something out with our RV dealer.

Thanks for all the posts, suggestions, advice...if I hadn't found this forum I would have been headstrong and forced myself to buck up and fight this monster all over the place.

I did find out from a "car guy" who is a good friend of mine (co-worker), and he said that we can purchase a 3.55 or 2.73 axle and have it installed on the truck, but it would be a $1,200 - $1,600 investment with parts and labor. I'm not sure we want to go that avenue at this time.

I'll try and keep updates on what we find out.

[wiredgeorge]

Most folks feel that when speaking to an RV salesman, that there is some expertise happening. Many RV sale persons are not RVers, don't understand towing or trucks and bingo, you guessed it, are paid on commission. Before getting despondent over new truck prices (I have a 96 F250 7.5L with beefed up tires and suspension pulling our sub 7K lbs dry weight 5th wheel) take a deep breath. Your problem is the pulling isn't comfortable. Do some research on a better stabilizer hitch and at the same time run your VIN and look at the plate on the door of your truck and get ALL the numbers. Weigh station, if it makes you feel better but I for one don't haul enough stuff for real concern. I do travel with full propane tanks but never any water or fluids in any of the other tanks. We are weekend campers so normal stuff, like hoses, kitchen, some food for the weekend and clothes along a TV set and such... doubt there is much over 500-700 lbs of stuff added to the dry weight of the trailer. Your truck just may be OK if you find the right hitch and are careful not to overload the truck or camper. You MAY be overweight in some area but I am guessing the hitch may be the cause of the unstable tow feelings... Good luck!

[maccam1]

I'm really suprised with the ever dealership.im on my fourth tt,and each time I traded up,the first thing the salesperson asked,was info on my truck.before they would go any further
With the sale of the tt.

[sourdough]

Michael you've fallen into a trap/mistake so many of us have made and fell victim of asking the wrong people questions who will tell you anything to make a sale. In my case on this trailer, I went in looking for something a little smaller and lighter knowing full well what my truck capabilities were. I "thought" we would be happy with something that fit....when we found this one we knew it was "it" but then there was the truck. I am a truck/car guy so after crunching the numbers knew I would be really close and "fix" the truck to cover any problems. I did....try to "fix" it with bags, shocks, springs, etc. I was only 200 lbs. over gvw on the truck but it drove me crazy plus the towing experience was just not fun. New 3/4 HD fixed that completely. I tell you all that just so you know that you aren't nearly the first to have this happen and won't nearly be the last so don't beat yourself up too bad. I would recommend you listen to the advice you get from the members because these folks are extremely helpful and knowledgeable.

Now, before you go take a big soaking, which is what is going to happen; the guy telling you "we do this all the time" (or whatever) will be glad to take a new trailer back in....minus a hefty sum, resell it at near what you gave for it and sell you another trailer at retail....good for him, not so much for you - let's dig a little deeper into the situation.....

You've provided some basic info from the dealer pulling up the numbers he did. Get the numbers off the stickers inside the driver door of the truck - gawr (front/rear) and payload. Let's look at those. If you can get the vin from the truck I think there is a site that can use that to tell you the options you have - I'm thinking what kind of tow package if any, what type of receiver etc. (I don't know it). You can probably read the weight ratings and class on the receiver (maybe), or, if you can get the options a Ford website might show you what came on that truck receiver wise.

The 3.31 ratio is not a towing ratio IMO. On the other hand, it might work. It will show up in what the truck is rated to "pull", not "carry". I have replaced ring and pinions in my play trucks and had them replaced. They can make a huge difference in performance. The pricing given sounds about right (single axle) for someone to do it and I would opt for the 3.73 for sure.

Just trying to think and see if there are ways that you might be able to salvage the deal, keep the trailer DW really likes and avoid the "soaking" you're going to take if you try to return the trailer. But, it is a 7545 lb. trailer on a 1/2 ton which is about as much as one should pull when properly equipped IMO. See what the numbers say, the ultimate goal is to be safe.

[MarkEHansen]

I just wanted to add two points for the OP.

1. One of the members (Soaking?) posted a link to the instruction manual for the E2 hitch. I just wanted to add to this that the instructions for set up are really easy. Best of all, you can go through the motions even with the setup already done - and just see how it comes out. You do some measuring, hitch up the trailer without the spring bars, measure again, then add in the spring bars and measure again. I suggest you do this and see how close you are to what Fastway recommends.

2. There are many considerations when matching a tow vehicle to a trailer. Some will simply talk about "pulling", but that's only part of it. You need to have the power to pull the rig (truck, trailer, cargo, etc.) without causing any undue stress on the engine. You also need to be able to stop the rig without undue stress on the brakes. You also need to be able to control the rig in *all* conditions. Just pulling down a concrete highway in calm winds isn't the same as towing on a curved road, in high winds with 18-wheel trucks spinning by you.

Also consider what will happen in the event of an "emergency maneuver", like a deer jumps into the road in front of you and you have to swerve to miss it, etc. If you're at or over your limit, that's not going to end well.

Have you done the towing calculator yet (the link was posted by John)? Do that and provide back what you find.

I would definitely consider trading in the trailer as a last resort. If you find your truck is not up to the task, then start looking for a different truck. It doesn't have to be new. Consider getting an older, used truck as a temporary step toward your final.

Good luck.

[notanlines]

Michael, "so if they are true to his word," just what action by this company as a whole would lead you to believe what they are saying? Knowledgeable people on this site are leading you in the correct direction. Give them a chance to pull your proverbial butt out of the fire.

[Vet4jdc]

Don't take a bath on a new trailer (and you will). Buy a new truck that will handle the additional weight. You will thank us later.

[SummitPond]

Let me throw this out to the crowd; it's what I used to determine what I was comfortable with towing when we got our new rig. The spreadsheet had to be zipped up to be attached as the forum tool didn't accept xlsx files. Maybe it will be useful to someone, and if there's an error I made in calculation or assumption, please let me know.

To explain: yellow columns/rows are user input. Columns A & B contains the manufacturer line and the model. Columns C & D contain the dry weight of the TT and the CCC, both in pounds. Columns S & T are the length and width of the TT, both in feet. This is just for a comparison to the unit we currently had, which shows up in column U.

Column X contains TV information off the door column sticker, the owner's manual and the tow guide. TV cargo information (passenger weights, hitch weights, other miscellaneous stuff that would be in the cab or the bed) is also listed.

Column E lists the TT GVWR, F is the hitch weight (I assumed 12.5% for TT, 14% for 5er), H lists the TV curb weight (from X), J lists the TV max cargo weight (from X), L is the CVW of the TV and TT, M lists the GCWR (from X), N is the percent margin to the GCWR, P is the GCVW (TT GCWR+hitch weight+TV GVWR, a limiting case) and Q is the margin of this limiting case to the true GCVWR.

Any column N value with greater than 15% margin shows up bright green; greater than 10% shows up a dull green; less than 10% margin is a bold red number. I wanted at least 10% cushion for my normal travel configuration, thus the "flag". Anything that showed up red in column Q is a no-go from the start; I wanted at least 5% margin in that configuration.

As can be seen, I meet that requirement for our new unit (Winnie). There were lots of other entries that I cleared out to minimize the busy-ness of the spreadsheet.

EDIT: I forgot to mention that 5th wheel info is way at the "bottom" of the sheet.

[travelin texans]

I agree with everyone else, you're going to get stung VERY badly trying to trade down the rv. Of course they said they'd work with you, but it's a given it will be more to their advantage than yours. Sounds like they sold you a rv knowing what tv you had without ever a mention about it not being enough, did you hear "sure you can pull that, no problem" & you'd believe "they will work with you" now. If it were me I'd be looking at trading for a used truck to handle the rv you & the DW really like rather than giving more money away to the rv dealer, it'll be cheaper, you'll get more truck & still have the rv you like. You could possibly upgrade 2 to 4 years newer truck for much less $$ than trading down to a smaller rv.

[JRTJH]

NADA lists the value of used 2012-2015 Ford F250 crew cab 4x2 gas pickups with 45,000 miles at $16,000-24,000 in the central Arkansas area.

NADA lists the value of a 2013 F150 crew cab 4x2 5.0L gas pickup with 45,000 miles at $16,500-22,000.

So, the OP may be able to trade in his F150 for a comparable F250 for not much more than the price of "dealer profit" which usually runs around 10% of the trade value which in this case is around $2000. That would be much less than the cost to "trade down" to a smaller trailer.

While not the "answer for everyone", it's certainly wise to explore the "real costs" to trade up the tow vehicle as well as the "real costs" to trade down the trailer....

[Ken / Claudia]

Your getting good advice so far. My points are from personal and work experience. You said you felt that the front end was a little light. If you felt that, I say it likely is and that is real unsafe. Do what ever it takes to get the proper weight back on the front axle so you can maintain correct steering and braking.
Having the front axle too light is about as dangerous as driving in/on snow and ice. Not what you want with you, your family and grand kids.
Once the truck/hitch trailer all match up right you will have many great memories with the family and the trip will be easy.

[5J's]

White knuckle driving is no fun. I get it, your strapped for cash and can't make another payment. You've got some good advice here and it seems that if you can't make your current set up work, and it's sounding like you can't, then you may be able to trade up TV for little cost. Going the other route, trading down the TT, you'd likely be making the same payment and maybe a little more for a trailer that neither of you is completely satisfied with. Good luck and keep us posted.

[CaptnJohn]

Before you trade trailers ~~ please don't as you will get hammered! 1st your truck is light for that length and weight. The E2 hitch is fine for smaller TTs but I'd tell the dealer to trade that for the Equalizer 4 point with sway. In a heave wind you will appreciate the extra sway control. Check your tires, if P dump them for LT and make sure the LTs will carry the weight. Those 2 rather inexpensive changes may make pulling more relaxed. Your next truck ~~ make it a 1 ton as the price diff over a 3/4 is minor and when you nect upsize you will not be in the same situation.

[skmct]

I know from past experience the hitch can't be set up right. The trailer and tow vehicle must be loaded the same each time it is adjusted.If you add or relocate weight to either unit the hitch must be readjusted. It is possible to remove too much weight from the tow vehicles front or rear wheels with improper adjustment. Be sure both units are loaded with everything and everyone including the dog before adjusting the hitch.

[FlyingAroundRV]

Michael, if you're still watching this thread, I'll weigh in with my Two cents worth.

I would defintely go with a bigger truck as others have advised. Most people on these forums report graduating to bigger trailers after their first one. So in the long run you'll probably want that bigger truck anyway.
Now that you've bought the trailer you like, to trade down and take the hammering that you WILL take on the trade, then to later decide that you really did prefer the bigger trailer and trade up again, and then have to upgrade the truck anyway ... That is going to be a lot of wasted money.
WRT buying a truck. There are a lot of good used trucks out there and if you take the time to search, you can find some rare gems. We managed to find a 2015 F250 2WD with only 13,000 miles on it, last year. Even though it was 3 years old, it was still under manufacturer's warranty. I would suggest also to look for trucks in the southern states (away from the salted roads up north). We bought our truck out of Dallas. The biggest selection of trucks is there and they don't use salt on the roads as far as I know. Another good place to look is Atlanta. Depending on where you live, you might have to take a couple of days to go down and look at trucks, but it will be worth it in the long run.
We live in Australia, so I had to do my truck shopping real long distance. I went to Dallas with a list of 16 trucks I was interested in, from the online car ads site. We rented a car and hit the road. In the end, our truck was located 165 miles out of Dallas. We did a LOT of driving looking at trucks, but it was really worth it.
JMO! But I would suggest, don't downgrade the trailer, upgrade the truck. Move forward, not back.

[BulletOwner1]

In my humble opinion, there has been a lot of good info and advice given so far. But so far I don't think anybody has touched on this point. (I could be wrong, I skimmed some of them)

You mentioned that this is your FIRST RV. And you've been out TWICE. Granted, some of the things you are experiencing are red flags like the light front end. But I think I would be white knuckled if I was towing a 30' trailer for the first time also. As time goes by you will learn that if you're towing something, its going to feel different than not. I've towed for years, from 15' to 30' TT;s and one 30' fiver. I've never forgotten that there's a trailer behind me. So my advice is to see if you can get your weight numbers squared away first, then your hitch issue if the weights are doable. If the numbers are not good then you probably need to change the tow vehicle. But understand that the more experience you have towing the better you will become in knowing what you should feel and what you should not.

Respectfully submitted.

[FlyingAroundRV]

... But I think I would be white knuckled if I was towing a 30' trailer for the first time also.
That is a very good point and raises another point.
If you haven't towed something like a TT before, you might have a tendency to over control the rig, particularly when being passed by semi-trailers out on in the interstate where you'll be going at a reasonable clip yourself.
When the truck passing you comes up from behind, you'll feel his bow wake push you to the side. a slow steady resistance to that is all you need. Your rig should move as a unit if your TV is evenly matched to the TT and you have a good anti-sway hitch set up. There should be very little wagging back and forth of the trailer. If you do get that kind of wagging, you need to address that pronto! If you make rapid corrections against it, you will just make matters worse.
When I'm towing, I can feel the semi passing me before I'm aware that it is approaching (I'm usually focussed out the front more than the mirrors). I feel the rig push to the side of the road and I start a gentle pressure to keep it from going too far, but I let it move a little. When the semi passes, the suction from behind, pulls me back into the center of my lane where I want to be and all is usually well.
Just as an aside, I find that the wake from most semis is pretty even and predictable. However, the car carriers seem to generate a lot of turbulence in their wake. When one of those pulls back into the lane in front of me (and they always see to pull back in very closely) we get tossed around a fair bit until he's a couple hundred yards in front of me.

[DonnieBlitz]

Michaeldt hope your still reading this. We towed our toy hauler out to Sturgis last year and wondered why the front end was "Light" . Set up camp and proceeded to find out. Started talking with 2 people that had similar coaches....BOTH said this the same time..." got air Bags? ". Needless to say we are "Bagged" now and what a difference! Don't know your finances and don't really want to know but we bought a 2012 Dodge Dually Diesel fully loaded very reasonable, it was a Texas truck...no rust whatsoever! THEN we bought our Fuzion X toy hauler.

[Michaeldt]

Good morning everyone,

Well, I have thoroughly appreciated all the comments, remarks, suggestions and the PM's that have been sent. I apologize for not responding sooner but between work and church it's been a busy couple of weeks.

For those of you who mentioned the RV dealer would rake us through the coals...you were spot on. I talked with our sales guy who told me he would do his best to "make this right" and his best was us coming up with $3,000 down payment on another camper...not gonna happen.

So we are probably not going to do any further business with that dealer except any warranty or service needs that come up. I understand this wasn't totally their fault, I was at fault in many areas (not enough research, let them talk me into a larger camper than I planned for) and I've accepted that, but I just don't think they helped us as much as they could have...and I understand their bottom line is to make money, so lesson learned.

We are doing some research and talking with a few truck dealers service departments to see if upgrading our gear ratio on our current truck (3.31 to 3.55) is an option we want to look at. We're really not in a position right now to purchase a larger TV, but we'll look at it different times through the year and see if anything pops up that we can work with.

One question about the e2 WDH, and the four point system that some have posted about? Is that something we might can talk to our RV dealer about trading in, or would we have to purchase a 4 point system and try and sell the e2?

I haven't caught up with every post in this, but have read most of them and again, thank you and we appreciate the suggestions and teachings that many of you have offered. I do want to go through the e2 setup in their manual to see if that changes anything. If we can get a little more weight on the front end I think I'll feel better while we're on the road.

Will post as we learn more.

[MarkEHansen]

You'll have to ask the dealer about the trade-in on the E2, but I would expect he will not want it back.

It may not be as costly as you imagine to trade up to a better tow vehicle, so try to keep an open mind on that. You can get an older vehicle as a temporary truck for now, while you save up for a newer one. This was our plan (we were in the exact same position with a trailer that was too large for our TV) - but then I found a deal on a new truck that worked with our budget so we went that way instead.

Had that new truck option not worked for us, our plan was to purchase the a truck that would do the job, but be older and less feature rich, etc. because we figured it would be temporary. There were a lot out there that weren't that expensive.

Good luck with your search.

[Michaeldt]

First order of business is to get the hitch adjusted. Tomorrow is supposed to be nice, so I think we'll go to the storage lot and go through the hitch manual and measurements and see if we can make any adjustments that might be needed.

We have some friends in our church who are more experienced with campers, so will see if they can join us and help walk us through this with the manual.

[Number 4]

It may not be as costly as you imagine to trade up to a better tow vehicle, so try to keep an open mind on that. You can get an older vehicle as a temporary truck for now, while you save up for a newer one. This was our plan (we were in the exact same position with a trailer that was too large for our TV) - but then I found a deal on a new truck that worked with our budget so we went that way instead.

Had that new truck option not worked for us, our plan was to purchase the a truck that would do the job, but be older and less feature rich, etc. because we figured it would be temporary. There were a lot out there that weren't that expensive.

I'll second this since we have truly enjoyed our significant upgrade to a used 2015 F-250. We test drove a few at CarMax but I continued searching web sites and found one on craigslist.com. Thankfully the owner was a lousy photographer (hadn't gotten much ad response) because the DW and I exclaimed, "WOW, that's a nice truck!" when we drove up. He was motivated to sell and after getting a clean CarFax report we closed that private party deal on a Lariat trim package with extras for the price that CarMax had offered him as a trade-in. There are deals out there, you just have to be patient and keep looking.

[GMcKenzie]

We are doing some research and talking with a few truck dealers service departments to see if upgrading our gear ratio on our current truck (3.31 to 3.55) is an option we want to look at. We're really not in a position right now to purchase a larger TV, but we'll look at it different times through the year and see if anything pops up that we can work with.

Understand that while the gear swap will make your truck work better, you can't change the rating on the truck and you could still be stopped for being overweight.

[skmct]

From 2013 ford specifications CVGW 12,900 lbs max trailer weight 8100 lbs. I personally think he won't be happy with the pulling abilities of the 5.o motor . There will be a lot of down shifts on the hills which is nerve wracking. The biggest gain if he went to the 2500 would be the motor upgrade to the 6.2

[66joej]

Michaeldt If you go the diff upgrade I would suggest have the 3.73:1 gear set put in. Also don't know where you are but your estimate of $1200 seems quite low.
At the end of the day I agree with the consensus to get a bigger truck. Lots of good older ones out there that won't break the bank. JMHO

[ctbruce]

Theres a equalizer on sale in the classifieds for $350.

[LFord]

If you call Ford Customer Service, and give them the VIN on your truck, they can tell you how it came equipped from the factory as to "tow packages," rear-end ratios, wheelbase, bed length, etc., all of which go into the calculation as to max tow capacity for the truck. They can also tell you what the tow capacity is, as equipped from the factory, or you can download Ford's Towing guide and look it up yourself based on the engine installed, rear-end ratio, and type of tow package installed.


For example, my 2013 Ford F-150 XLT with a 3.5L ecoBoost engine, 6-speed auto, factory "trailer tow package," with a factory payload of 1744 lbs., extended cab (not "crew cab"), 6.5 bed, with only a 3.15 (I bought it used, didn't order it that way) rear-end is rated (with WDH) to tow 8,600 lbs. With an Equalizer hitch (1k/10k) with 4-way sway control, that truck pulls my 2016 Keystone Passport UL Express 199ML (3,600 EW; 5,000 max gross) quite well, and even semis blasting by on the Interstate barely cause the trailer to "wiggle" a bit.



However, for the length of the trailer you're towing, you may need "more truck" (e.g., F250) and/or a WDH with more sway control.

[CaptnJohn]

Dealers unload the e2 and other marginal hitches because they cost less and the bottom line for customers is more easy to swallow. I'd look on Craigslist for a used e4. Otherwise eTrailer generally has the best price. Then dump the e2 on Craigslist.

[FlyingAroundRV]

Another thing to consider when modifying a vehicle is what you'll do to the trade in value. When I went looking for a truck, I ran a mile from anything that was "modified" no matter what it was, whether lift kits, air bags, internal stereo mods, whatever.
IMO! You never know how well or otherwise those mods have benn done and what they do to the performance and handling of the truck. I particularly stayed away from lift kits. Suspension mods like airbags suggested that the truck had been worked very hard.

[Michaeldt]

Good morning everyone,

Ok the Mrs. and I were able to go to the storage space yesterday and measured our truck and hitch info. Here are the measurements that we came up with.

Truck uncoupled - 35 1/16"
Truck coupled (no sway bars attached) - 35 9/16"

If I read the manual correctly, when I add the sway bars it should have come back about 1/2 between the two, so was looking for 35 5/16?

When I added the sway bars to the truck coupled, measurement is - 35 1/2"

so, if I'm reading the manual correctly I'm under adjusted about 3/16?

Does that sound about right?

[buvens]

I think you are correct. See if you can adjust closer.
On the Equalizer you add washers normally or raise the "L" brackets. Manual on Equalizer indicated raising the "L" brackets one bolt was the same as adding one washer is I remember right.
I sold my E2 hitch and bought the Equalizer from PPL when they were running a special and it seems to feel a good bit better.
It does take a while to get used to pulling trailers. We have pulled in a lot of cross winds and through the northeast in the ice and snow till we could find a place to get off the highway, Just try to be safe.
Good Luck...Sonny