Greenball Mirage ST tires

[CWtheMan]

Not too long ago I posted the information about RVIA recommending all trailer tires be of radial construction starting with 14” OD.

Greenball has introduced a new brand name ST tire line-up, Mirage. All of them from 12” OD to 16” OD are radial designed.

https://www.greenball.com/brands/mirage/special-trailer-radial

I don't do promotions. This, IMO, is just useful information. The ST tire builders are very tuned into what the RV trailer industry is doing with trailer tires.

[ADQ K9]

Would these be the ones that Costco is selling? No specs from the web site Just Greenball ST and the size you want. Has and average review of 4.6 out of 5 stars

[Snoking]

Would these be the ones that Costco is selling? No specs from the web site Just Greenball ST and the size you want. Has and average review of 4.6 out of 5 stars

Greenball already had 3 or 4 radial trailer tires along with a raft of bias ply tires. Chris

[ADQ K9]

I just happened to be looking at the Costco web site and saw that they had the Green Ball tires for trailers but no real specs. Punch in the size pick your load rating and get the price. I guess they ship to your residence/work and you have to take them down to the store for mount and balance.

[Snoking]

I could not get Costco's web site to return ST tires inputting several common sizes. Chris

[JRTJH]

If brand names mean anything (Amazon, Sam's and Costco are notorious for mixing things up) the Greenball tires referenced by CW in his link are "MIRAGE" and the Greenball tires referenced in the Costco pages are "ST Towmaster" there is only one radial style and two bias ply styles listed on the Costco website. With the information available from Costco, I wouldn't order them expecting delivery of the "MIRAGE" trade name tires.

[ADQ K9]

Yup just looking at options not gonna do anything till I get the Tumbleweed out in April. Still pretty much sold on the Good Year Endurance unless I can find Maxxis or Carlisle locally. Haven't found them yet.

[Snoking]

Yup just looking at options not gonna do anything till I get the Tumbleweed out in April. Still pretty much sold on the Good Year Endurance unless I can find Maxxis or Carlisle locally. Haven't found them yet.

You might check to see if anyone has Provider ST's local.

http://taskmasterproducts.com/products/provider-st-radial/

[ADQ K9]

Thanks Chris haven't heard of them but I will check out the link.

[RobertS]

I would not use Greenball or Carlisle labeled tires as are produced in China and most likely made at the same company. Nor would I go back to using Marathon. I am now using Endurance so stay tuned
Robert

[Snoking]

I would not use Greenball or Carlisle labeled tires as are produced in China and most likely made at the same company. Nor would I go back to using Marathon. I am now using Endurance so stay tuned
Robert

The Marathon has been discontinued. Greenball has been building US plants I believe. Chris

[notanlines]

I would not use Greenball or Carlisle labeled tires as are produced in China and most likely made at the same company. Nor would I go back to using Marathon. I am now using Endurance so stay tuned
Robert
RobertS, playing devil's advocate here, tell me why you would go to another Goodyear tire after being burned by a Goodyear tire? It has less than a two year history, yet the Endurance has a reputation being built simply because it is built in America. Did Goodyear fire all the Marathon engineers? Did they fire all the quality control VP's that were in charge of Marathon? See where I'm going with this? You made your decision based on solely 'made in America' labeling. There are a number of excellent RV tires made in China. We might not want to admit this, but Goodyear put an entire generation of RV'ers at risk with their POS Marathons. They are not to be rewarded.

[JRTJH]

RobertS, playing devil's advocate here, tell me why you would go to another Goodyear tire after being burned by a Goodyear tire? It has less than a two year history, yet the Endurance has a reputation being built simply because it is built in America. Did Goodyear fire all the Marathon engineers? Did they fire all the quality control VP's that were in charge of Marathon? See where I'm going with this? You made your decision based on solely 'made in America' labeling. There are a number of excellent RV tires made in China. We might not want to admit this, but Goodyear put an entire generation of RV'ers at risk with their POS Marathons. They are not to be rewarded.

Goodyear also has a "reputation" in the motorhome industry with their G159 tire. Built from about 1996-2003, it is reported to have caused around 95 deaths in motorhome accidents caused by tire failure. If the reports are correct, Goodyear actually hid the test results and has refused to release findings in crash studies to prevent courts from being able to compare one incident to another. So, Goodyear might be an American made tire, but it's company reputation is far from "unblemished".... YMMV

[Snoking]

RobertS, playing devil's advocate here, tell me why you would go to another Goodyear tire after being burned by a Goodyear tire? It has less than a two year history, yet the Endurance has a reputation being built simply because it is built in America. Did Goodyear fire all the Marathon engineers? Did they fire all the quality control VP's that were in charge of Marathon? See where I'm going with this? You made your decision based on solely 'made in America' labeling. There are a number of excellent RV tires made in China. We might not want to admit this, but Goodyear put an entire generation of RV'ers at risk with their POS Marathons. They are not to be rewarded.

Please tell us what chinse made ST225/75R15E or ST235/80R16E that you endorse.

[JRTJH]

Please tell us what chinse made ST225/75R15E or ST235/80R16E that you endorse.

I'll step in and answer about the 225 75R15 LRE (since they're on my Cougar): Carlisle, Radial Trail RH or HD. The RH is the previous version, the HD is the current designation. Both are in use by a large number of members here and as far as I know, none (nobody) has reported any problems with failed tires, blowouts or even with leaking valve stems (not the tire but still) in the past 48 months. Made in China at a Carlisle owned, operated and supervised plant. Unlike many "Chinese tires" that are manufactured in china, sold to the highest bidder and shipped with any name the bidder wants to put on it... Probably the reason so many "oddball ST tires" are being sold in the US. I've seen tire brands come and go frequently and current offerings from "obscure tire brands" are no exception....

Anyway, back to your question. I'd recommend Carlisle first, Maxxis second and even though there is limited long term history, Endurance third.

[KCSA75]

I'll step in and answer about the 225 75R15 LRE (since they're on my Cougar): Carlisle, Radial Trail RH or HD. The RH is the previous version, the HD is the current designation. Both are in use by a large number of members here and as far as I know, none (nobody) has reported any problems with failed tires, blowouts or even with leaking valve stems (not the tire but still) in the past 48 months. Made in China at a Carlisle owned, operated and supervised plant. Unlike many "Chinese tires" that are manufactured in china, sold to the highest bidder and shipped with any name the bidder wants to put on it... Probably the reason so many "oddball ST tires" are being sold in the US. I've seen tire brands come and go frequently and current offerings from "obscure tire brands" are no exception....

Anyway, back to your question. I'd recommend Carlisle first, Maxxis second and even though there is limited long term history, Endurance third.

I have the same Carlisle's on my Cougar. I replaced my six-year-old "china bombs" last summer. They only have a couple thousand miles, but so far, so good.

I've been reading all these tire threads on this and some other forums and have wondered if a lot of the problems with the "china bombs" is attributable to lack of maintenance, improper inflation, abuse, etc. vs "they're made in China so they're automatically junk."

[sourdough]

I would not use Greenball or Carlisle labeled tires as are produced in China and most likely made at the same company. Nor would I go back to using Marathon. I am now using Endurance so stay tuned
Robert

You really have to look further than "China" as a broad reference for "china bombs". The ones I am aware of come from specific plants in specific provinces of China and from, from what I suspect, are companies lacking proper oversight of their production allowing them to produce "defective" units without any quality control. Remember, there are over 900 tire plants in China if my memory serves correctly. Only some of them consistently produce inferior products as best I can tell but you have to dig "a little deeper" to find out....not just "China".

And yes, I believe we are aware by now of the comments that all ST tire failures are due to defective owners running underinflated, overloaded, overstressed tires or "interply shear" and there are no "defective" tires. We do not need to rehash that.

Edit: To piggyback on John's response to Snoking; I agree. I've had my Carlisle tires since April 2015. 5 round trips to FL, many shorter trips of 3-500 miles; total approx. 18-20k miles. So far these are "superior" tires and I'm about to leave FL for TX on April 1.....with ZERO worries....but they aren't built in the same plant as Trailer Kings....:)

[Snoking]

Smaller trailers are noted to do better than larger ones that push the limits of ST235/80R16E tires.

The recent bolt that I picked up in a new Endurance ST225/75R15E occurred within a mile or so at the end of out Tucson trip last week. If I had picked it up 10, 20, 30 miles down the road the tire would have been trashed before I noticed it. The bolt would have been long gone and the fault most likely unknown. Chris

[JRTJH]

I have the same Carlisle's on my Cougar. I replaced my six-year-old "china bombs" last summer. They only have a couple thousand miles, but so far, so good.

I've been reading all these tire threads on this and some other forums and have wondered if a lot of the problems with the "china bombs" is attributable to lack of maintenance, improper inflation, abuse, etc. vs "they're made in China so they're automatically junk."

I believe that to a certain extent, you're conclusion is probably a significant factor in tire failure. I don't know how much is "owners not taking care of their tires with proper inflation and protecting them from UV as well as not running them above the speed rating, bumping into curbs and running over potholes, but also, a significant contributing factor until this past year is the installation of "barely adequate" tires by the RV manufacturers. Putting tires rated at 1920 on each end of an axle required to carry 3800 pounds is going to end with bad results, but there are many trailers that were delivered with that kind of "reserve capacity" in the past 10 or 15 years. I'm sure that contributes significantly to the failure rate of ST tires whether they were manufactured in China or in the US.

There's been a lot of "blame game" and probably enough "blame" to go around so everyone, owners, RV manufacturers and tire manufacturers can all have more than their share....

[sourdough]

I believe that to a certain extent, you're conclusion is probably a significant factor in tire failure. I don't know how much is "owners not taking care of their tires with proper inflation and protecting them from UV as well as not running them above the speed rating, bumping into curbs and running over potholes, but also, a significant contributing factor until this past year is the installation of "barely adequate" tires by the RV manufacturers. Putting tires rated at 1920 on each end of an axle required to carry 3800 pounds is going to end with bad results, but there are many trailers that were delivered with that kind of "reserve capacity" in the past 10 or 15 years. I'm sure that contributes significantly to the failure rate of ST tires whether they were manufactured in China or in the US.

There's been a lot of "blame game" and probably enough "blame" to go around so everyone, owners, RV manufacturers and tire manufacturers can all have more than their share....


THIS ^^^^^, this, is on point. We all buy a trailer thinking it is "well equipped" and safe never thinking that the manufacturer would put tires so marginal on it that it would endanger your family....they did for years until recently...I hope.

The old ways of building a trailer, deduct the trailer/pin weight, equip with axles that barely carry that then tires that could barely support that has caused untold damage. Hopefully that has changed, but, those ongoing failures, "stories", for years have developed the "china bomb" syndrome.

I have zero doubt that many, many failures are due to the one situation above PLUS the unending number of folks that just don't pay attention and contribute to their own failures. That does not mean, at all, that there are not inferior plants in China building inferior tires. It does not mean that trailers are not built so that much more weight is on one side vs the other. There are SO many variables, and so much blame to go around - we just have to do the best we can to understand what's going on and navigate the minefield the best we can.

[CWtheMan]

To research a tire’s origin you first must get the plant code off the tire sidewall. In this case “AQ” is the plant code for; CARLISLE TIRE & WHEEL CO. LTD. MEIXIAN, GUANGDONG China.

When you start researching that name and address you soon become aware of just how hard it is to track down any particular “lot”.

https://panjiva.com/Carlisle-Meizhou-Rubber-Manufacturing-Co-Ltd/1038647


But, in the end, what good does it do to find where a tire is made if you don't know the blends of materials that make-up the composition of the end product? The basic build materials are on the tire sidewall. However, the size of those materials are not there. Nor are the compounds. All that information is confidential and you'd need insider information to gain access to them.

Feedback without facts is just someone's lip service.

The best way to work at preventing RV trailer tire failures is to operate them within their designed operational parameters as recommended by vehicle manufacturers.

We have experts telling us all about such things as interplay sheer. Tire manufacturers aren't going to say much about that particular fatiguing action because it can't be prevented. I've got more than 200,000 miles on my trailer and I don't think I could estimate with in a couple hundred times where I've exceeded 60 degree turns getting into tight parking sites. Just pulling into a service station for fuel will often get your trailer into a 45 degree turn.

The experts tell us to use maximum permissible sidewall inflation pressures. Probably more than 90% of all Original Equipment trailer tires are already recommended by their manufacturer for full sidewall pressures. Those of you that have new trailers with the RVIA 10% reserve load capacity should check, I'll bet the trailer manufacturer did it by using the tires 100% load capacity inflation.


There are no hard figures to use with RV trailer tires. They are going to wear out or age out. The wear out is easy, you can see it. The age out is an owner's call. I traveled for more than three years with friends that have a Montana that has a GVWR 100# less than my Everest. Their trailer was a 2005 model with factory installed Uniroyal LT tires. They aged out almost as fast as our ST tires. The difference was their sidewalls would start growing bubbles whereas the ST tires would start to grow taller with initial tread separations.


Who started this up again? I found it late and now I'm going to bed late, again.


CW

[notanlines]

Chris, I can't expound any further than has already been done. For my money stay with Maxxis, Carlisle, Sailun (if you can make them work) or the Goodyear Endurance. Stay away from Trailer King at all costs.