Leak or Condensation?

[Windwill]

Hi All,
I just bought a new 2019 Keystone Passport 2920BH last Thursday (10/4/18). I upgraded from an 2006 Outback 26RS. I love it so far, but on our first trip this past weekend, I saw some leaking (I think) in the back bunk room where the walls meet the ceiling and in the corners. I only found it in this room. We got a lot of rain that weekend, however at the time that I noticed the leaks, it wasn't really raining, only misting a bit. This was on the third night. The first two nights I didn't notice anything and it rained a lot. It was definitely cool at night, probably mid to high 40's in Wisconsin, south of Milwaukee. My first thought was that it was condensation, since the windows were covered with condensation and the metal trim around the windows were wet. I could see that the water was forming (or coming in) at the seams where the walls meet the ceiling. There is silicon caulk along all of these seams. It was definitely warmer inside the camper and we had just given our 3 kids baths in hot water. I don't think we had any of the vents cracked open or windows open. We ended up putting the kids to bed and checking later and found lots of streams of water dripping down the walls in the upper bunks. It rained that night a good amount and in the morning the "leaking" was gone.
Now that I'm thinking this through and typing this out, it sounds more like condensation. The only thing that is making me think it isn't, is that the ceiling was wet also near where it meets the wall. So wet that the paint was coming of when I touched it. So I'm worried that it's wet on the inside, which would be caused by a leak. I've already spoken to the dealer and they are happy to take a look at it. The only issue is that I'm 2 hours away. I'm thinking I should just take it there for peace of mind. I've sent them pictures of the roof and pictures I took of the leaking and they didn't think the roof had anything to do with the leak. They did acknowledge that they toched up a spot on the roof, but didn't think it was an issue.
This never happened in my previous camper, but maybe there was never enough humidity in the air inside to cause it. Anyone have a similar issue or advice?

[FlyingAroundRV]

This summer I noticed that our trailer seemed warmer near the junctions of the roof and walls. I'm thinking that the insulation isn't so effective in those areas. That might mean that what you're seeing is condensation, but still worth a very thorough check.
Any easy way to check would be to turn a hose on the outside for a while and see what turns up. That's how I tracked down a leaky shore power connector.

[Ken / Claudia]

Your description is the perfect way to have condensation and a lot of it. Using unit multiple days, a family, no windows open, no vents open, 3 baths. You likely cooked a meal or more also. Seeing water on inside of window glass means vent the moisture out.

[Steveo57]

I've noticed condensation on the walls inside where there's an aluminum frame in the wall when it's cooler outside. Last time I noticed this it was cool outside and all along the bottom of the walls it was damp from condensation because of the frame in the wall.

[Windwill]

Thanks for the replies. I think we had our door open while giving baths that night, but I’m not sure. It did rain pretty hard today while it’s here in my driveway and I found no moisture anywhere in it. I’m most likely bringing to a dealer just to be sure. There’s also some leaks in the plumbing under the kitchen sink that need to be looked at anyway. I’m sure I could fix it but I shouldn’t have to with a brand new camper.

But I thought I’d share some of the pictures I took. You can see the moisture dripping down the walls and somehow the camera picked up the structure in the ceiling, I think because they were also creating moisture. The ceiling is dry now but paint comes off on my finger if I rub the spots that were wet. So that still worries me a bit.

[Steveo57]

Definitely looks like condensation. You can see where the frame is and if it was a leak it wouldn't be running down the walls and on the ceilings like that.

Just picture your bathroom at home with very little insulation and having a rainy day and giving three kids showers. The walls would be dripping!

[Windwill]

Also here’s some of the pictures I took of the roof. The caulking looks a little sloppy to me for it being brand new. I sent these pictures to the dealer and they did say they touched up the one lighter colored spot but the fingerprints on the black sealant are from the manufacturer. They didn’t think the seals in the pictures had anything to do with the leaking. Not sure if this has anything to do with the leaks either, but it was worth checking out. The caulking in the pictures is in the corner and most of the leaking was more on the sides. So, not sure.

[flybouy]

You cannot spend several days in a small sealed box without a vent or window opened. With a s& b house you have enough air exchange with the large attic space that's ventilated, door, window, outlets, stove hood, and other air leaks. Let's think of it this way. When you were young did you ever "steam up the windows" on a date in your car? Now take that sweat, breath, and add 3 more bodies, hot baths, cooking, well this is on you partner. As far as caulk it's difficult to see from your picks but usually it's not neatness that they are focused on. The good news is it sounds like your dealer is being very cooperative initially.

[travelin texans]

Also here’s some of the pictures I took of the roof. The caulking looks a little sloppy to me for it being brand new. I sent these pictures to the dealer and they did say they touched up the one lighter colored spot but the fingerprints on the black sealant are from the manufacturer. They didn’t think the seals in the pictures had anything to do with the leaking. Not sure if this has anything to do with the leaks either, but it was worth checking out. The caulking in the pictures is in the corner and most of the leaking was more on the sides. So, not sure.ar

As I've said before, I think they get paid by the tube for caulking, by the foot for wiring & cable & are issued 1 - 3" hole saw to run said wires.

[Windwill]

You cannot spend several days in a small sealed box without a vent or window opened. With a s& b house you have enough air exchange with the large attic space that's ventilated, door, window, outlets, stove hood, and other air leaks. Let's think of it this way. When you were young did you ever "steam up the windows" on a date in your car? Now take that sweat, breath, and add 3 more bodies, hot baths, cooking, well this is on you partner. As far as caulk it's difficult to see from your picks but usually it's not neatness that they are focused on. The good news is it sounds like your dealer is being very cooperative initially.
We definitely had windows, doors and vents open over the course of the 3 days. But at the time we noticed the moisture, I’m pretty sure we had nothing open for a while, except for maybe the door, but I can’t remember for sure.

[Ken / Claudia]

Keep vents and windows open always. Not just day or night. By open; cracked ; open some, or all depends how much moisture your putting into the air. Run fans, get damp rid etc.

[flybouy]

We definitely had windows, doors and vents open over the course of the 3 days. But at the time we noticed the moisture, I’m pretty sure we had nothing open for a while, except for maybe the door, but I can’t remember for sure.

That's twice you have referenced a door open. Are you referencing an outside entry door or the bathroom door? Even if you have the door open to the outside you still need a second opening, a window or roof vent to create an exchange of air. Does your bathroom have a vent with a fan? That should be used to remove the moisture at the biggest source, bathing/showering.

[Windwill]

I dropped it off at the dealer last night to get it checked out. We’ll see what happens. I’ll update once I know the verdict.

[Windwill]

That's twice you have referenced a door open. Are you referencing an outside entry door or the bathroom door? Even if you have the door open to the outside you still need a second opening, a window or roof vent to create an exchange of air. Does your bathroom have a vent with a fan? That should be used to remove the moisture at the biggest source, bathing/showering.

Yes, I was referring to the outside door. That's the only thing that was opened (maybe) at the time. I guess with all the on-and-off rain we were getting and the mist at the time, I kept the windows and vents closed and didn't think about the possiblity of condensation. Yes, the bathroom has a vent and a fan. I'll be sure to have it open and on from now on.
**UPDATE FROM THE DEALER** They dropped the ceiling in the bunkroom where we noticed the moisture dripping from the walls and they found no moisture in the insulation in the ceiling. So they are pretty much confirming that it was condensation. They said they had another Passport in there with the same complaint the day I brought it in. At least I'm not the only one freaking out.
So lesson learned I guess. But I'm glad I had it checked out. Thanks for all the advice and opinions!

[Dave Gamble]

We had quite a bit of condensation first night out on our 2019 26RBS, primarily on the front windshield but also on the windows in the slide. Much more than I’m confident. We went out and bought a 30 pint dehumidifier and the 2nd night was much, much better. The outside temps at night were low 30’s.

[BamaRam]

If you have an outdoor kitchen next to the bunkhouse, the wall between the the room and kitchen is probably not insulated. My kitchen boarders the bath and bunkhouse. No insulation anywhere.

[duh1]

So, did you sort out the leak vs condensation issue. And, are you still happy with the trailer after a year?

[Windwill]

Duh1, yes all sorted out. No condensation or leak issues after about 6 more trips this summer. We love the trailer. We just came back from the same trip that we went on a year ago 2 weeks ago. It was about 33 degrees at night and we were warm and dry. I learned the hard way about condensation I guess. But all good now.

[johnsoa2]

Good evening Windwill,
We were just at the dealer today doing a walk-thru of our to-be 2020 25Res. We noticed very similar condensation buildup on the wall behind cabinets in the LR. We have never stayed in, nor used this unit, so it cannot be condensation from use. It was a chilly 35 degrees in PA today. But I am nervous about condensation occurring in a brand new unit. Hmmmm.

[sourdough]

Good evening Windwill,
We were just at the dealer today doing a walk-thru of our to-be 2020 25Res. We noticed very similar condensation buildup on the wall behind cabinets in the LR. We have never stayed in, nor used this unit, so it cannot be condensation from use. It was a chilly 35 degrees in PA today. But I am nervous about condensation occurring in a brand new unit. Hmmmm.


Condensation occurs in ALL units if you do not take steps to mitigate it. Hot/cold outside with minimal insulation means hot/cold inside will cause condensation. It happens on every unit, of every kind in cold/hot weather all the time. The owner must understand the process and use the well known methods to eliminate or reduce it to a non issue.