Winterizing newbie questions

[KennyDean]

Hello to all,
I have a 2015 cougar 25 rks fifth wheel. Last year I moved it from storage in northern MD to Nashville TN. Was told no need to winterize as the winters aren’t cold enough. Well they were. Took my trailer out for the second time this summer for six weeks and boy did I have problems. Had to replace my kitchen sink fauset, bathroom sink and shower fauset and a part in back of toilet plus the inlet panel where I connect the water hose into my trailer. With that all said I need to winterize my fifth wheel this year correctly. Have watched many u tube videos on how too.
My questions are:
1) where is my water pump located?
2) I took the panel off the inside bottom cabinet of my water heater. But do not see any hoses with valves? My user manual say I have the by pass kit on it?
3) watching the video once they connect the hose on the water pump into the anti freeze bottle and turn on the fauset it looks like a lot of water comes out before it turns pink. Where is that water coming from?
4) is it easy enough for me to attemp this task myself or should I pay to have it done?
After replacing all the parts I said I did I see no more leaks but can’t find the pump?
Anything else I should know before attempting this task.
Thank you

[RagingRobert]

Sometimes we need to learn the hard way...I've decided to winterize myself as a newbie?...I'm going for the air compressor method blowing the water lines dry. Pretty straight forward according to Keystone/Goggle/U-tube...I hope I don't learn a lesson the hard way...

[Bisjoe]

Hopefully someone with your model knows where things are. In my TT the bypass valve is on the inside, on the other side of the water heater, after I remove a panel under the entertainment system. When you turn on the faucet there is water in the lines that has to clear before the pink stuff comes out. You avoid this by blowing air through the system. I prefer to add the antifreeze to the fresh water tank, and run all the faucets until the come out pink. Then drain the gray water tank, and pour down the sink and tub drains, and in the toilet to cover the closed drain. The first time it took me an hour, most tricky part was draining the water heater with the plastic plug at a funny angle. I bought a new plug and special wrench for that on Amazon which made it much easier. Considering what it cost you to repair it, you might want to pay someone if not comfortable with the process. My pump is under the bathtub/shower with an access door on the side.

[KennyDean]

Thank u Bishop, yes I hope someone with my same unit can help.
I did not like having to pay for all the fixtures but after replacing I felt good that I could do it. Thought I could save$100 but do understand. Thank you again

[KennyDean]

RR yes sir after getting a TBI brain injury overseas I seem to learn the hard way.
But want to learn as much as I can. The area RV store said for that area they recommende the anti freeze method but $100 thought I could do it and put the money saved towards the money I spent.

[flybouy]

Don't have your model but if you run the pump you can usually find it by following the noise when it's running.. Typically you will have to remove a panel to get access. I drain all the low point drains, drain the hot water heater, blow out the lines with compressed air, then use the antifreeze thru the water pump. Don't forget any outside showers/fixtures. The water heater bypass is typically on the cold water inlet, it's a valve with a pipe connecting the inlet and outlet water lines. Search this forum, I've seen numerous posts on this subject. Hope this helps.

[KennyDean]

Flybouy
Thank you for your valuable input ! Hoping to learn as much as I can about my trailer. Write down notes in my log book. Want to take it out next year for a three month adventure. I will look at past posts. Safe travels!

[flybouy]

Have fun planning your 3 month excursion and take lots of pictures!

[KennyDean]

Sure will buddy. Will put the pictures on an album. Raving a lone gets lonely at times but I have noticed rivers are friendly people.

[sourdough]

I agree with flybouy. Just turn it on. I've not had an RV that I couldn't hear the water pump. It will be behind a panel, or in a box....somewhere. Some folks have posted pictures on the forum of them being in some pretty weird places. Mine is under the bathroom sink thankfully....but a tight fit for sure.

[KennyDean]

Sourdough
Thank you, that’s what I will do. I have all the information I need . Watch I think every video on u tube wrote down step by step. Checked it twice and also ordered the kit for the water pump. It will be there when I get there. My kids will buy four gal of rv anti freeze. When the kids go to school I will start will have all day to complete. Excited to do this task. Will let you all know when I have completed the task. Thank you.

[Carvendive]

Not the same but maybe... 28RKS XL 2017 5th wheel.
I remove the wood trim panel in my storage Bay to get at the back of the water heater and the water pump.
The water heater bypass is on the back of the heater. Pretty easy to see with a flashlight.
When I installed the water pump bypass (I use antifreeze) I ran extra lengths of hose and mounted the bypass near the hot water heater so that I now only need to remove one panel in order to winterize.

I'm an overkill kind of guy. I blow out the system first and then add the antifreeze.
*** Only use 35-40 psi of air ***
The 100+psi from the compressor will cause damage.

Also... You will still need some antifreeze. P-traps for sinks and possibly built in ice makers and the toilet. I leave some in the toilet to keep the flush seal lubricated and to prevent shrinkage, from drying out.

[Carvendive]

One other thing.
I can't tell you how many times I've listened to or helped fix winter freeze problems where the owner tells me it was winterized at the shop.

Do it yourself. The more you do your own maintenance the more pride and joy you will have with camping.

... same thing with wheel bearings. Easy to do and you know they are re loaded with quality grease.

[Local150]

I won't put the pink stuff in the holding tank as the taste and smell linger all season. With hot water bypass no need for that, plus it takes more anti freeze,, I can do my 34 footer with about a gallon and a half

[sugarhillctd]

I have a 2016 25RKS. I can post some pictures of where you need to look to get the job done if you want.

Let me know.

John

[imapackerback]

That's what I did last year (wintering in north Dallas area). Blowing it out worked just fine, but added antifreeze to the p-traps and a touch in the toilet to keep the seal from drying out.

2015 Bullet 248 RKS

[imenzies76]

I used antifreeze last year and it was cold enough to freeze it. Lucky that the lines didn't burst. I will be doing compressed air to blow out the lines from the pump back with all faucets open. I was told by a seasoned camper to adjust your psi to about 30lbs to prevent lines from splitting. It was my first winterizing last year and found a bunch of info from this forum and youtube videos. Good luck.

[RagingRobert]

I'll be first time winterizing myself after the Thanksgiving long weekend up here in cold Canada. I'm going to do as #12....blow out everything first then add the antifreeze via the water pump. @#17...you must of diluted the antifreeze with some water still in the lines for it to freeze. I heard straight antifreeze will go slushy but not freeze solid. The stuff I bought is good until -50 Celsius apparently...we get cold up here in Toronto but not that cold :)

[Jmill8]

Here in Pacific NW it doesn't get very cold usually. I blow out lines, drain low points, pour AF in drains and toilet. Been doing this for many years and no freeze problems.

[RagingRobert]

It makes sense to just blow out the lines in certain climates. Antifreeze in colder areas will help keep the pump, valves, and faucets lubricated.

[JRTJH]

I used antifreeze last year and it was cold enough to freeze it. Lucky that the lines didn't burst. ....

The "claim to fame" for RV antifreeze is that it doesn't typically freeze solid, but turns to an icy slush. Even if it does freeze completely, it doesn't expand as it freezes. It's the expansion that causes the damage by splitting tubing, valves, etc.

Many people simply "run some pink stuff through the pipes, when it's pink at the faucet, they're good"... It doesn't work that way. The plumbing is filled with water, when you introduce RV antifreeze into the system, it mixes with the water and, until all of that mixture is pushed out of the plumbing, you don't have "full protection" to the advertised rating on the antifreeze container. What you do have is diluted antifreeze that can still cause damage if it gets cold enough, and yes, that dilution will freeze, expand and can damage or destroy your plumbing system. That's the reason to either "run until the faucets flow dark pink" or "blow the lines to remove as much water as possible before using antifreeze". It's "cheaper to remove the water with air" than it is to "remove the water with antifreeze" so most people in cold climates use a compressor before they add the antifreeze to their system. YMMV.

[KennyDean]

Thank you sugarhillltd . Please do send pictures if you can. Would be helpful as I would think there in the same place. Thank you

[KennyDean]

Pictures would be very helpful as I am sure they would be in the same place. Will be in TN next Wednesday to winterize them grandsons 7 th Birthday then fly home to MD. Can’t wait to get the pictures and put all the advice to good use. I am sure I can do it. Just take my time got all day. Have to do it right as I do not want a repeat of this year replacing so many faucets. Will let you know how it went when I get finished.

[KennyDean]

To JRTJH
Thank you makes a lot of sense. One I replaced all my faucets and pipe that water hose connects too. I am hope I have no tubing that is bad. Guess the only way to find out turn on the water and see if you have good water pressure coming out. Fingers crossed! Will let everyone know how it goes.

[JWS]

Ok I will ask the obvious stupid question. Where do you insert the air blower to blow out the lines? I live in NE Texas and have always drained low points and water heater and put antifreeze in p traps. But with our new Cougar I want to go the extra step to be sure. Also we are due for colder than normal freezes. Normal for us is 20 F and colder than normal single digits. I usually don't have to worry much as we don't stay below freezing more than a few hours. BUT this may be the year.

[DocP]

Ok I will ask the obvious stupid question. Where do you insert the air blower to blow out the lines? I live in NE Texas and have always drained low points and water heater and put antifreeze in p traps. But with our new Cougar I want to go the extra step to be sure. Also we are due for colder than normal freezes. Normal for us is 20 F and colder than normal single digits. I usually don't have to worry much as we don't stay below freezing more than a few hours. BUT this may be the year.

The fitting screws into the city water inlet: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B002XL2IEA/ref=sxts_kp_bs_lp_1?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=8778bc68-27e7-403f-8460-de48b6e788fb&pd_rd_wg=NjUnk&pf_rd_r=GGR4H66T7C8D2BPME55C&pf_rd_s=desktop-sx-top-slot&pf_rd_t=301&pd_rd_i=B002XL2IEA&pd_rd_w=q6482&pf_rd_i=rv+water+line+blowout+adapter&pd_rd_r=eb4d312d-4a78-495d-85f7-db2e6d692404&ie=UTF8&qid=1537021797&sr=1

[ChuckS]

I prefer to use low pressure air to blow out water system first. This is done after draining water heater and low point drains ...

A RV air hose adapter is available at just about any place selling RV stuff. Wally World carries it as well

Make sure to also blow out outside shower drains and washer line.

I then pump RV anti freeze thru all fixtures and toilet.

And don’t forget to blow out the black tank flush as water will sit in the line and anti siphon valve and crack if it freezes.

[JWS]

Thanks for reminding about the black tank flush. It wasn't even on my radar!

[RagingRobert]

Another one people forget is the city fill line. After you fill the lines with antifreeze open a faucet for a second to relieve a little pressure then remove the screen/washer from the city connection and push the valve button to let some antifreeze run out. I think its also a good idea to hand pump a little antifreeze into the fresh water tank and open the valve to drain some pink then close.

[JRTJH]

To JRTJH
Thank you makes a lot of sense. One I replaced all my faucets and pipe that water hose connects too. I am hope I have no tubing that is bad. Guess the only way to find out turn on the water and see if you have good water pressure coming out. Fingers crossed! Will let everyone know how it goes.

One of the easiest "shortcuts to check plumbing leaks" is to just turn on the 12 VDC pump and let the system pressurize, then close all the faucets and listen for the pump to cycle. If there are leaks, it will run momentarily to repressurize as the leak reduces the standing pressure. If the pump doesn't turn on through the night, you don't have any leaks. If it does, something's either dripping out a faucet, a fitting or a broken pipe.

[JRTJH]

Another one people forget is the city fill line. After you fill the lines with antifreeze open a faucet for a second to relieve a little pressure then remove the screen/washer from the city connection and push the valve button to let some antifreeze run out. I think its also a good idea to hand pump a little antifreeze into the fresh water tank and open the valve to drain some pink then close.

That's a good way to dislodge the O-ring in the backflow valve located on that "stem" that you're pushing. If you dislodge the valve, it will leak when using the 12 VDC pump to flow water through the system.

Consider this: If you use compressed air, you'll push the water out of that part of the line, and when you add the anti-freeze, it'll backflow into that section of the plumbing to "fill the void" created by using the air to displace the water. There's no need to "push the stem" and risk destroying the backflow valve on conventional fill systems. If you have a "convenience center" with all the connections/fittings in one location, you "could have" a different setup, so check to be sure. However, on separate city water fill ports, blowing them with air will displace the water sufficiently to protect it from freezing.

As for putting antifreeze in the fresh water tank. Many find the taste/odor of RV antifreeze to be offensive. It takes hours and hours of flushing the fresh water tank to clear the antifreeze. If the tank is empty, the small amount of water remaining on the floor won't be able to expand and stress the tank, so there's no danger of damage from freezing. YMMV

[flybouy]

Another one people forget is the city fill line. After you fill the lines with antifreeze open a faucet for a second to relieve a little pressure then remove the screen/washer from the city connection and push the valve button to let some antifreeze run out. I think its also a good idea to hand pump a little antifreeze into the fresh water tank and open the valve to drain some pink then close.

I don't think most people mess with the city water inlet check valve. I've never heard of one freezing. Putting antifreeze in the fresh water tank will make for at lot of flushing to that tank to remove it. As was already stated some water left in the tank freezing won't hurt it, as long as it's not in the drain valve. When I de-winterize the system I'll mix a little bleach with the water and use the fw system to flush the lines instead of city water. My thinking is is that after setting over winter season here in MD where temps can swing from 80 to near zero why not cleanse the fw tank and kill any possible contaminants. Then flushing the camper with it will serve another use for it and use less water. YMMV

[KennyDean]

Thank you. With all your help and great advice I was able to save $250 and feel good about myself being able to do it myself. Everything went well following step by step procedures. One item I forgot to buy and don’t need it till I go out in May is a new shower head and hose. Did look over my water heater for about 1/2 hour followed the hoses and my unit does not have a cold and hot water shut off valve. Jut one that shuts both off and by passes at the same time. Now I have a permanent pump winterizing kit on the pump.
One happy camper!

[KennyDean]

Scratch on the side of my 2015 cougar extra light fifth wheel.. it’s about 12 inches don’t know how it got there. Under my window. It is noticeable. Most of the scratch doesn’t go all the way through the decals or the paint not sure if it’s paint or not but about 3 inches in the black detail it does go through the decal and is rough. Any suggestions To fix this issue as it is my home away from home and I take pride in it like everyone else takes pride in their’s. Thank you

[DocP]

Thank you. With all your help and great advice I was able to save $250 and feel good about myself being able to do it myself. Everything went well following step by step procedures. One item I forgot to buy and don’t need it till I go out in May is a new shower head and hose. Did look over my water heater for about 1/2 hour followed the hoses and my unit does not have a cold and hot water shut off valve. Jut one that shuts both off and by passes at the same time. Now I have a permanent pump winterizing kit on the pump.
One happy camper!

Good for you. Nobody is going to care more about doing it right than you. My wife thinks I'm crazy (she's a "just pay the guy" sort of person), but I really enjoy working on my camper and learning everything about it that I can.

[Local150]

I messed with that valve and it never quit leaking,, ending up replacing it,, wasn't much room to replace, but eventually got it with nearly every knuckle bleeding lol

[RagingRobert]

I've seen a few videos now about pushing that button in on the city fill to let some antifreeze out? Apparently that valve can be damaged in freezing temps. It made sense to me letting any air or water out and having antifreeze at that valve also. How does that valve work when you hook up the city water? Doesn't that button/button get pushed in when there's pressure?

[KennyDean]

DocP
Yes in deed. Need to learn everything there is to know on the camper. It will save$$$$$ and it’s fun too. Before I take off in May I will be sure to pick up the correct tools and put them u set into the storage

[flybouy]

I've seen a few videos now about pushing that button in on the city fill to let some antifreeze out? Apparently that valve can be damaged in freezing temps. It made sense to me letting any air or water out and having antifreeze at that valve also. How does that valve work when you hook up the city water? Doesn't that button/button get pushed in when there's pressure?

One more advantage to blow out the lines with low pressure air.

[KennyDean]

Just completed my winterizing and all I needed was to push the valve in air and pink cane out. So should be ready for winter. Fingers crossed. When May comes I hope all I have to do is drain and go camping. My lesson was costly but sent most of them.

[KennyDean]

Yeah was easy the valve released air and pink stuff. Fell darn good about completing the task.

[shermris]

There are a lot of youtube videos that will help you with the winterizing process. There is always residual water left in the water lines after use, which is why it isn't pink right away. Your water heater shut off valve may be hidden from view, (like the electric water pump). It will be found somewhere behind the water heater. Mine requires removing some screws on a panel and reaching through a 5" hole to the valve. I needed a flashlight to find it the first time, but access is not that hard once you know where it is. The most common location for the water pump is under the bathroom shower but the location may be different. Make sure to pull the drain plugs on the freshwater storage tank and the water heater. It's not hard but can be expensive if you don't get all of the water out of your trailer tanks, lines, and drains.

[Local150]

Hello to all,
I have a 2015 cougar 25 rks fifth wheel. Last year I moved it from storage in northern MD to Nashville TN. Was told no need to winterize as the winters aren’t cold enough. Well they were. Took my trailer out for the second time this summer for six weeks and boy did I have problems. Had to replace my kitchen sink fauset, bathroom sink and shower fauset and a part in back of toilet plus the inlet panel where I connect the water hose into my trailer. With that all said I need to winterize my fifth wheel this year correctly. Have watched many u tube videos on how too.
My questions are:
1) where is my water pump located?
2) I took the panel off the inside bottom cabinet of my water heater. But do not see any hoses with valves? My user manual say I have the by pass kit on it?
3) watching the video once they connect the hose on the water pump into the anti freeze bottle and turn on the fauset it looks like a lot of water comes out before it turns pink. Where is that water coming from?
4) is it easy enough for me to attemp this task myself or should I pay to have it done?
After replacing all the parts I said I did I see no more leaks but can’t find the pump?
Anything else I should know before attempting this task.
Thank you
Make sure your water tank is drained. Then water will come out for a bit then pink,, my water pump is under a drawer in kitchen,, just got done winterizing mine a few minutes ago. Only thing I forgot is to leave frig doors open a bit so no mold grows in there

[RagingRobert]

You tube is an excellent source of info...again don't forget the city water fill valve when winterizing and make sure you release some pressure by opening a faucet before you push the valve button to let some antifreeze out or you can damage that o-ring. Blowing out the lines first will ensure you get rid of all the water and you don't dilute the antifreeze.

[Local150]

You tube is an excellent source of info...again don't forget the city water fill valve when winterizing and make sure you release some pressure by opening a faucet before you push the valve button to let some antifreeze out or you can damage that o-ring. Blowing out the lines first will ensure you get rid of all the water and you don't dilute the antifreeze.
When in doubt about dilution I just use another gallon of anti freeze it's cheap compared to repairs