2 grey check buttons but one grey release valve

[waltheraustin]

First trip and or 5 new to us hideout 27dbs. One grey is showing full but the other is empty. Are there 2 tanks connected? With one release valve? Wondering if I need to go dump or wait for you other to fill up. 2015 hideout 27dbs

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[rhagfo]

You have two tanks with separate dump valves, look towards the rear of the trailer or between the tires.

[waltheraustin]

This? I thought it was a relief for the water in the system. I don't see another valvehttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180317/0c879a8988b2cf4bbd1debee38308909.jpg

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[rhagfo]

This? I thought it was a relief for the water in the system. I don't see another valvehttps://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180317/0c879a8988b2cf4bbd1debee38308909.jpg

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No,’that is a fresh water drain, look on the same side as the rest of the drains.

[waltheraustin]

I know the previous did some drain stuff but I don't see any other drain besides the cold and hot drain. I drained it and that was the one that was full. Ill do some research to see how the other tank gets water in out

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[RETAFCHIEF]

If KEYSTONE READS THESE FORUMS they should clarify the gray tank issues. I have the same thing as others do with two tanks and one valve. The dealers don't know, as I had them scratching their heads. I emailed Keystone and was told there are two tanks and one valve. I went under my 32RLI from one end to the other and there are no other valves. The tanks must be connected together. As far as the panel indication, it could be the empty tank light will always be lit on one tank. I'll test mine on an upcoming trip and post the results.

[travelin texans]

I wouldn't rely on the sensor lights, they usually are so inaccurate that they are totally useless. I have 4 indicator lights, 2 grey, 1 black, fresh water, the fresh water may be close, but the others have read 1/3 on 1 of the greys & 2/3 on the other grey & black since it was towed off the lot brand new, I don't even look at them anymore.

[RETAFCHIEF]

My last trailer, a Flagstaff had two gray and one black tank, all with valves. The panel was always good for fresh and gray tanks, but 1/3 high for the black tank. I ran the tank flusher and added various cleaners, but learned to live with it for four years. A 42 gallon Blue Barker helped as a back up.

[waltheraustin]

If KEYSTONE READS THESE FORUMS they should clarify the gray tank issues. I have the same thing as others do with two tanks and one valve. The dealers don't know, as I had them scratching their heads. I emailed Keystone and was told there are two tanks and one valve. I went under my 32RLI from one end to the other and there are no other valves. The tanks must be connected together. As far as the panel indication, it could be the empty tank light will always be lit on one tank. I'll test mine on an upcoming trip and post the results.I felt think a fool not being able to find it

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[rogeru]

Our 2015 302RLS Sprinter also has two sensors but only one drain.... I have no idea why they created something like this, but we haven't ever had a problem in the 3 yrs. we've used it.

[BobbyB]

27DBS only has one grey tank. The panel is generic, so the #2 grey button is not actually connected to a tank.


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[notanlines]

Exactly what Bobby said. You only have one grey tank, 39 gallons.

[DocP]

If KEYSTONE READS THESE FORUMS they should clarify the gray tank issues. I have the same thing as others do with two tanks and one valve. The dealers don't know, as I had them scratching their heads. I emailed Keystone and was told there are two tanks and one valve. I went under my 32RLI from one end to the other and there are no other valves. The tanks must be connected together. As far as the panel indication, it could be the empty tank light will always be lit on one tank. I'll test mine on an upcoming trip and post the results.

I just picked up my 2018 Cougar 32RLI 2 days ago, and there are 2 gray tanks and 2 valves. During the walk-through, I made the dealer hunt around with me under the trailer until we located both of the gray water valves. One of the valves was really tucked up there and would be easy to miss if you didn't know to look for it.

With my previous class A motorhome, Thor was good about sending out the plumbing and electrical schematics for their units. Since Keystone is a Thor subsidiary, I thought that they would do the same. Unfortunately, when I requested the schematics from Keystone, they told me that they don't provide that information to the end-user.

[ctbruce]

Just a note for others: to our knowledge, there are NO KEYSTONE employees on this forum. If there are, they are silent. Posting messages to get THEIR attention ain't gonna work. This forum, as stated on the bottom of each web page has no connection to or with Keystone.

That said, doing a search for single waste valve, how many tanks, etc. will yield a lot of reading.

Also, the waste tank valves amd discharge are on the drivers side of the trailer.

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[RETAFCHIEF]

Keystone is talking out of both sides of their mouth. Here is the complete email about valves and trim strips they sent me. "Good Afternoon Mr. Carter,

Thank you for contacting Keystone RV. Your Cougar has one valve to pull to empty both gray tanks. For wall trim or any other replacement part, you will need to contact your dealer to check on availability and pricing. Let me know if you have additional questions. Have a great day!

Thank you,

Jeannene Jenks
Retail Advisor
Keystone, Dutchmen and Crossroads RV

[RETAFCHIEF]

Additional note. The gray valve stickers are next to the black water sticker, but are stacked one above the other. This implies there is no other location.

[notanlines]

These are the spec's for a "27DBS"

Ext Width 8 ft
Ext Height 11 ft
Int Height 7 ft
Interior Color Maplecrest
Hitch Weight 865 lbs
Dry Weight 6505 lbs
Cargo Weight 1360 lbs
Fresh Water Capacity 45 gals
Grey Water Capacity 38 gals
Black Water Capacity 32 gals
Tire Size ST205/75R14C
Furnace BTU 30000 btu
There is only one grey tank and only one grey tank drain handle.

[RETAFCHIEF]

Keystone should furnish an X-Ray of each unit to eliminate any doubt. Some have one tank, some have two with one valve, and who knows what else.

[JRTJH]

This thread is turning into a "trash someone (Keystone) who isn't listening, hasn't listened and likely won't listen in the future.....

Keystone does not monitor this forum (in any official capacity) and if (NOTE THE EMPHASIS ON IF) anyone from Keystone does monitor this forum unofficially, they have NEVER (again, not the emphasis on NEVER) posted any response to any complaint, suggestion or praise offered in any post.

If there is a need to contact Keystone or to communicate suggestions, ideas, criticism of their business, please contact them directly, this forum is not a "third party communication system to the company" and every member's attempt to contact Keystone via this forum has failed......

That said, I've found in my limited time on this forum that most "extremely frustrated new owners" have found through familiarization with their RV that it isn't an aberrant build, but just that they simply didn't see the other valve handle when they looked under their trailer while being emotionally "Pi**ed" at Keystone for screwing them out of a valve.....

I'd urge everyone to take a deep breath, try to smile, stop blaming everyone but ourselves and realize that this forum is not a direct link to Keystone RV Manufacturing Company.

As for blame, if you can't find your dump valve, it's not the factory's fault, that is between you, your dealer and the guy that showed you where the other two dump valves were located. He (not Keystone) let you down by not pointing to #3 as he did with #1 and #2 valve handles...... As for one valve with two tanks, if that is how your RV was built (I haven't seen one built that way yet) you'll know for sure as soon as both tanks are full and you pull the valve. If only one empties, you'll know that the response from Keystone isn't correct, if both tanks empty, then you'll know that the response was "spot on"....

[jsmith948]

Let's try to think this through.
Why would two grey tanks be plumbed into one discharge valve?
This would mean the plumbing that connects the tanks upstream of the valve would have the potential to leak. That is why you will always find the discharge valve mounted onto the tank. If you have one valve, you have one tank.
Another clue is your listed grey water capacity. If you have two grey tanks, your grey water capacity would be up around 60 or more gallons.

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[RETAFCHIEF]

JRTJH: Why would the factory say there is one valve? The dealer had two people all over the bottom searching and I searched as well.To say there are reasons not to use one valve doesn't make another magically appear. I had a Flagstaff for 4 years and the factory did input through the forum. I did contact them directly and was passing on their response. Is that wrong? Insisting the members are incorrect is not consistent with a forum. "Newbies" ask questions and from what I've seen, the valve issue is a long-term problem. I guess we just ignore the problem instead of comparing notes. If the dealers can't find the valves and the factory rep says one valve, what is a "Newbie" to do?

[JRTJH]

JRTJH: Why would the factory say there is one valve? The dealer had two people all over the bottom searching and I searched as well.To say there are reasons not to use one valve doesn't make another magically appear. I had a Flagstaff for 4 years and the factory did input through the forum. I did contact them directly and was passing on their response. Is that wrong? Insisting the members are incorrect is not consistent with a forum. "Newbies" ask questions and from what I've seen, the valve issue is a long-term problem. I guess we just ignore the problem instead of comparing notes. If the dealers can't find the valves and the factory rep says one valve, what is a "Newbie" to do?

I'd urge you (or any other newbie) to work it out with the dealer, ask the question here, and accept the input from other members. It does no good to "yell and scream about Keystone" or to call the factory "incompetent" because you don't understand why they did something a particular way. Being frustrated is fine, just don't do it on this forum with the expectation that somehow, Keystone will "rush to your rescue"... It ain't gonna happen....

What's a newbie to do? Ask, listen, learn, talk to the dealer, contact Keystone, read the manual, compare other trailers to yours, an a host of other things. But expecting a response from Keystone on this forum isn't one of them....

To add to Jack's comments, to date (I haven't seen everything Keystone changes) all of their entry level and mid level trailers use "waste fluid tanks" that are the same size. So, if you have a 28 gallon black tank, you can expect to either have 28 gallons (one tank) or 56 gallons (2 tanks) for gray water. The same with a 34 gallon black tank, you'll find either 34 gallons or 68 gallons of gray capacity. Until now (2018 model year) those two gray tanks have had two valves, one for each tank. Until now, the problem has been whether they are tied to one outlet or whether one gray tank had a separate sewer hose connection (requiring a "Y" connector) on the sewer hose. To date, they have ALL had a valve on each tank outlet.

IF there is a change at Keystone and they are now installing a single gray tank valve (inside the coroplast covered basement) it is a new concept and one that I have not yet seen. Is it possible that they changed the plumbing layout? Yup, it is possible. Is it an "across the board on all brands" kind of change? Not that I can see. Several people with 2018 trailers built by Keystone have commented that they have two gray tank valves, so it's not uniform (if it is happening at all).

My "distant guess" (if I were to make one) would be that the extension rod and valve handle came loose on your trailer and fell off during transport from the factory to the dealer and the dealer "missed the handle replacement" on your trailer. I say this because you stated that there are two "gray valve" stickers on the side of your trailer, one on top of the other. That would not be the situation "IF" there was one handle, at least from this distance away from the trailer and making a guess. I'd think that somewhere on your coroplast is a "tiny slit" where the other valve handle was attached or on the frame rail up near the existing valve handle is a small hole where the other valve handle "used to be".

You can determine if there is one valve by simply running water in the bathroom sink and in the kitchen sink until both tanks are full. If no water is flowing out of the sewer hose, then you know both tanks are "closed by a valve or valves". Pull that "ONE HANDLE" and see if both tanks empty. If they do, then apparently Keystone changed their plumbing design. If, however, when you pull that single handle, only one tank empties, you'll know there's something "missing".

I sense your frustration, but directing that frustration toward Keystone by posting it on this forum won't resolve anything. It's like looking at the TV and yelling at your favorite team for making a mistake on the field. You might feel better, but you know that the players didn't hear you, no matter how loudly you yelled..... Same with Keystone and this forum.......

[ctbruce]

See post #13 From DocP Same year, same trailer. Your specs say 60 gallons grey water and that would indicate 2 grey tanks. DocP also states there were 2 grey handles. Since he holds the answer to this 32RLI mystery, maybe he would share where the 2 grey handles are located?

DocP, save us please!

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[RETAFCHIEF]

What did I do to upset anyone? I must have missed this part. "yell and scream about Keystone" or to call the factory "incompetent" because you don't understand why they did something a particular way." I am a reasonable person using facts to try and get an answer, nothing else. I find it sad that if you are not in-step with the Site Team you are criticized. I guess it is how things are in this forum. If you scold, so be it.

[notanlines]

"See post #13 From DocP Same year, same trailer. Your specs say 60 gallons grey water and that would indicate 2 grey tanks. DocP also states there were 2 grey handles. Since he holds the answer to this 32RLI mystery, maybe he would share where the 2 grey handles are located?"

Chip, Doc has the same RV as which other member? The OP has a 2015 Hideout 27DBS. I believe the others have Cougars.

[ctbruce]

Sorry for confusion. RETACHIEF, DocP has the same trailer as you, a 2018 Cougar 32RLI. See post 13 above in this thread.

Thanks, Jim.

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[DocP]

My Cougar 32RLI is currently at the dealer's having slide toppers installed. When I get it back I will post pictures of the 2 valve handles. They were about 2 feet in from the gray water main discharge. The one handle on the left of this pipe was very visible, and supposedly drains the kitchen sink. The other handle on the right was right up against the coroplast underbelly (easy to miss), and I'm told that it drains the bathroom sink and shower.

The specs say that the total gray water capacity is 60 gallons; implying 2 30-gallon tanks, each with their own valve. Again, I'll post pictures when I get the camper back.

- Mike

[RETAFCHIEF]

DocP, Are your gray water stickers both at the same place? Mine are applied together with one about 1/2 inch directly above the other. The unit is in a Toy Storage facility, inside, so I can't just go look at it.

[DocP]

DocP, Are your gray water stickers both at the same place? Mine are applied together with one about 1/2 inch directly above the other. The unit is in a Toy Storage facility, inside, so I can't just go look at it.

There are only 2 stickers as I am standing facing the side of the camper - the left one is "Black" and the right sticker is "Gray". I have seen other pictures of the 32RLI that had 2 Gray stickers (as you describe yours), one above the other, but mine only has one "Gray" sticker. That being said, there are 2 valves for the 2 gray tanks. That's all I know at this point, and I physically opened and closed both of them when I did my walk-through this past Friday. As mentioned, mine is at the dealer right now, and I will post a picture when I get it back.

[RETAFCHIEF]

Thanks. We are planning a short local trip in April as a shakedown. I'm just trying to get the basics answered before then. Our last trailer had a 12 day first trip and besides minor stuff, it was trouble-free for 4 years.

[Tinner12002]

These are the spec's for a "27DBS"

Ext Width 8 ft
Ext Height 11 ft
Int Height 7 ft
Interior Color Maplecrest
Hitch Weight 865 lbs
Dry Weight 6505 lbs
Cargo Weight 1360 lbs
Fresh Water Capacity 45 gals
Grey Water Capacity 38 gals
Black Water Capacity 32 gals
Tire Size ST205/75R14C
Furnace BTU 30000 btu
There is only one grey tank and only one grey tank drain handle.

That's what I found also, so with that being said, in my opinion there would only be one grey and one black tank based on the size of the fresh water capacity. I believe they, the manufacturers, try to use black and grey tanks that will at least hold the capacity of fresh water...not saying that's always the case but I believe that's the norm.
Toy haulers may be an exception to that.

[RETAFCHIEF]

Here is the latest from my dealer: "Just an FYI, we have been building the 32RLI since the middle of last year. When we converted to that floorplan from the old 30RLI we were using a 2 valve gray tank system. I’m sure many of the original 32RLI models had the same tank architecture and plumbing as the trailer that it replaced on the initial production. There are many dealers who are low-volume sellers and it takes them a long time to sell their inventory. You could definitely have a buyer on a forum who may have just picked one up but it was built a long time ago."

[JRTJH]

RETAFCHIEF,

Have you filled both gray water tanks and pulled the handle to see what happens ??? Inquiring minds want to know.....

[RETAFCHIEF]

My trailer is in an indoor storage facility until the end of the month. I know that would have been the way to tell, but I didn't get the chance as we are still winterized. I wouldn't fill them just add enough one at a time to verify flow. Thanks.

[notanlines]

For some reason or other I can't seem to get across that Waltheraustin is the OP, not RETAFCHIEF. I realize the problem is close, but not the same RV and not equipped the same. RETAFCHIEF should have his own thread and we should solve the problem of Waltheraustin first. No disrespect towards any posters, I'm just sayin'.....:D

[RETAFCHIEF]

No need for anybody to do anything for me. I just asked a question and unless I'm at my trailer there is no answer. The manufacturer, dealer, and countless others all have differing opinions. I'm just glad I was here when my house was built.

[maccam1]

I just purchased a 2018 cougar ht 32rli in october,on my unit there is another grey tank release near the tires under the unit,it does not stick out so you can see it,you need to look up under for it

[DocP]

macaam1: That's consistent with my 32RLI, which just came off the production line on 2/28/18.

[RETAFCHIEF]

So much for my dealer's explanation. If they say there is one valve and you can't find another one, what do you do? The PDI is for a new unit and the buyer doesn't have the answers or there would be no need for the PDI. I guess you buy a trailer and then tear it apart to see where things are.

[JRTJH]

Or: Take advantage of the "been there/done that/got the Tee shirt and the poster kind of experience and advice" from others on a "forum on the internet"

and ....... There's something to be said from someone who actually knows what they're telling someone versus the "candid advice" of a dealer's representative who has never actually seen the product but since you need an answer, here it is.......

[RETAFCHIEF]

JRTJH: I will no longer post about the valves. I am not thrilled about the response and have only pointed out the journey. I'm sorry if you take personal offense. Thanks for your input.

[JRTJH]

No "personal offense" taken. Actually I find it amusing that someone would "yell at Keystone" (post #6) on a forum where they aren't present, suggest that "Keystone should furnish an X-Ray of each unit to eliminate any doubt." (post #18) and insist that their RV doesn't have a specific valve arrangement, then state that they "actually haven't looked because the RV is in storage until the end of the month (post #34). That lends a "chuckle" and a nod of the head, realizing that there may not even be a problem and the concern may well be a bit of "the sky is falling".

Please do post once more about your valves, but hopefully that'll be AFTER you've had the opportunity to look under your trailer and verify that it's different from the other similar models that have two valves as verified by multiple members.

Again, no "offense taken" it's really quite a joy to watch people learn about their RV and realize things aren't as complicated and/or outrageous as they first suspected.

Looking forward to learning how your gray tank valve arrangement is plumbed and whether Keystone really did change the valving on the 2018 32RLI. Who knows, you may be the one that teaches the "old dogs" a new trick.....

[sealyin]

Just posted this in a different thread. It is for our 2017 Cougar RBIWE. Two gray tanks and one valve

[RETAFCHIEF]

Please send a private message if you are only trying to belittle a member. Try a little class.

[JRTJH]

Please send a private message if you are only trying to belittle a member. Try a little class.

Take your own advice, PLEASE !!! :)

[JRTJH]

Just posted this in a different thread. It is for our 2017 Cougar RBIWE. Two gray tanks and one valve

I saw your post and the diagram in the different thread. That's a "novel approach" to eliminating the second gray tank valve. Your diagram is the first time I've seen that system. It looks like it may simplify dumping and possibly could make maintenance easier since there are fewer moving parts. I don't see a down-side so long as the two tanks are co-located. In our 27RKS, the galley tank is in the rear and the bath tank is in the front, so there's about 12-15 feet of separation between the tanks. Maintaining a drain slope would be impossible with all the drain lines above the coroplast and if they are below it, freeze damage would occur in cold weather use.

So, it's not an ideal situation for all uses, but may be the "wave of the future" for some floorplans.

Thanks for posting. Did you draw the diagram or is it from a website?

[sealyin]

Drawing came from technical support through Keystone.

[Tinner12002]

Just posted this in a different thread. It is for our 2017 Cougar RBIWE. Two gray tanks and one valve

Going to ask a silly question here, but wouldn't both tanks fill up at the same level with that drain/plumbing configuration?? You wouldn't be really gaining a tank for the kit sink and one for the bathroom but just gaining double the volume of a single tank.

[ctbruce]

I'm convinced that Keystone and all the others have an office group entitled Let's Keep Them Hoppin'. Their purpose is to find new and novel ways to keep people saying WTH under their breath and shave a dollar off the cost at the same time. It's kind of like the US version of the Ministry of Silly Walks.

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[JRTJH]

Going to ask a silly question here, but wouldn't both tanks fill up at the same level with that drain/plumbing configuration?? You wouldn't be really gaining a tank for the kit sink and one for the bathroom but just gaining double the volume of a single tank.

That's my "unreasoned reasoning" as well. About the only accomplishment (other than eliminating one valve) is to equalize the weight distribution between the two gray water tanks. No matter the source of waste water (galley or bath) both tanks will essentially maintain the same weight as they fill. As I said in an earlier post, if the tanks are co-located, it may be a cheaper alternative, but it does limit the placement of tanks and wouldn't work on floorplans with the kitchen on one end of the trailer and the bath on the other end. There's no way to maintain a drain slope from the distant tank "inside the coroplast" and anything full of waste water that's run below the coroplast will freeze in a winter environment.

It looks like a good idea for some floorplans but not for all/most of what Keystone builds.

[waltheraustin]

Hello all, just came back to the thread after being out for a few days. Disappointing to see 2 led read outs for 1 tank but no worries. I'm just glad there isn't another valve I can't find to release water that may be in there.

Appreciate the help!

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