States that weigh "payload"?

[kfxgreenie]

I'm wondering if there is a list of states that weigh vehicles off the yellow sticker payload? I'm well aware that states weigh commercial vehicles, all that I know of weigh said vehicles off from GAWR's, and or the lesser plate if registered less than scaled weight. There was recently a post on this forum that asserted that the DOT in some states will cite you if you are over ANY stickered number. I would like to know what states these are?

[Ductape]

In all my 25 years of driving commercially, I have never seen, nor heard of law enforcement bothering a single RV owner. FWIW, out on the streets California was always said to have the most over zealous vehicle enforcement, with Conneticut a close second.

[Ken / Claudia]

In Oregon the state police does, I did. Even most dept.s that have traffic units can and are trained how to spot and weight vehicles. Do they? I know some do not care until they investigate a crash. Others try to be more proactive. But, we had a yearly number of vehicles all patrol had to check. That number included all trucks, comm or not, pickups with rvs or work trailer, Dec is when the guys get pushed to catch up there numbers. Up until the 1990s we put up road checks during the fall hunting season and mainly were there to check game but, overloaded vehicles was another.

[Javi]

Texas will if the officer has reason to believe you are over weight or have other safety violations... Get stopped for a traffic violation and get checked for license class, weight and safety... For instance any officer with 1/2 a brain knows an F250 ain't legal carrying a 13K plus trailer...

I suspect most if not all states have the laws on the books, enforcement is the choice of the officer or their superiors...

[xrated]

I'm not as worried about the law.....as I am the "lawyers". A civil suit against me for knowingly towing overloaded, if I was involved in a serious accident or a fatality accident, worries me a lot more. Fortunately, with my present TV/trailer combo, I don't have to worry about it.

[MattE303]

I have read a ton of threads about this kinda stuff on the Glamis Dunes (SoCal) discussion groups. The conventional wisdom there is that the main thing LEO's care about is being over axle and tire ratings (GAWR), not payload or gross combined. I don't go to Glamis personally, but it sounds like that area is pretty aggressively patrolled, and I didn't find a single account of anyone being cited for GVWR/GCWR.

[Bolo4u]

I have read a ton of threads about this kinda stuff on the Glamis Dunes (SoCal) discussion groups. The conventional wisdom there is that the main thing LEO's care about is being over axle and tire ratings (GAWR), not payload or gross combined. I don't go to Glamis personally, but it sounds like that area is pretty aggressively patrolled, and I didn't find a single account of anyone being cited for GVWR/GCWR.

Yes. In California, generally the enforcement for non-commercial would focus on axle and/or tire ratings, but it doesn't mean if a setup is grossly overloaded, they won't use GVWR/GCWR. For commercial, it can be anything.

[Racebug]

most states allow you to abide by the law of the state your drivers license is issued. if your not being paid to pull your trailer, then your not commercial and do not have to follow any of the commercial rules. With a basic drivers license (class D in KY) I am allowed to haul 80,000 lbs and be 65' long and haul double trailers. I am not sure if they even care about what I am hauling with either.... On the other hand when I am driving my 3500 ram service truck (commercial work truck), they will nail me to the cross for having a 1000 pound trailer behind me even though I have a log book filled out and a medical card.
Basically, if your not making money, that wont screw with you.

[chuckster57]

Pismo beach is a popular place for getting your axle weighed. BIL has witnessed CHP impounding trailer for being over.

[gearhead]

Probably 15 years ago a co-worker was on vacation in California pulling a heavy 5th wheel with a Dodge 2500. Highway patrol pulled him over and weighed him. They let him go but told him if he had been a "local" they would have him unhitch and come back for the 5th with a suitable truck.
I have read on a local fishing forum that Texas highway patrol has pulled heavy 5th's over but I haven't heard or seen it first hand.
I've seen more than a few that needed to be pulled over.

[CWSWine]

Yep, to many lawyers advertising on the internet that if you been a accident with RV contact us. Now I have seen two bill boards that said "If you have been in accident with commercial vehicle or RV contact" some lawyers name. Get caught over weight would be inconvenience but a civil lawsuit could be life changing.

Just a note the setup in my signature is no longer current since I was over weight. I recently purchase a diesel pusher Class A with 5740 pound cargo capacity with 10,000 towing capacity.

[CWSWine]

Some people want see the law that says a personnel truck can't be over GVWR and that it is illegal. For civil court atleast it dosen't have to be illegal to become a factor in the case. The jury I sat on 40 percent of the cause of the accident was the truck was lifted and had oversized tires on it (over all he was found 80 percent his fault). We the jury determined that was part of cause since is raining and the larger tires increase stopping distance and was confirmed by a expert witness. I ask a retired judge about if legal to go over GVWR and he said there is state and federal law that you must operate a vehicle on public streets within manufacture specs.

[sourdough]

I know they enforce it in NM. I don't know what criteria they use but I did watch a trooper carry a portable scale around a 5th wheel and truck weighing it. When I came back by out of curiosity the trailer was there and the towing truck wasn't. This was outside of Loco Hills NM if I recall.

[CWtheMan]

Here in SC you pay for what you haul - so to speak. My dully has a GCWR of 23,500# when equipped with a 4.10. The SC DOT patrol cars all carry single wheel position scales. Should I be stopped and checked for total weight and found to be over the GCWR listed on my vehicle registration my day would end and I might get a stiff fine.

[JRTJH]

I have not been stopped for weight, but 2 weeks ago we were travelling north on I-75 and crossed the Mackinac Bridge into the upper peninsula. When we were in line at the toll booth (at the north end of the bridge) a state policeman motioned me to get out of line and pointed to the shoulder of the road. Of course I complied, and he asked me how long my rig was. We were towing the fifth wheel with the boat behind it. I told him it was 73'6". He asked for my driver's license, checked for the "double towing endorsement" and dragged out a tape measure, hooked it on the front bumper and walked to the back of the boat. Sure enough, I had measured the same as his results. He handed me back my driver's license, told us to have a good day and we got back in line to pay the toll. That's the first time I've been stopped for a "compliance check" in Michigan, he didn't check weights, but he did check length of the rig and insurance/driver's license for appropriate endorsements.

[sourdough]

I think John's experience is going to expand...including weights. I've been running back and forth across TX the last few days and I can see, especially in the metro areas, as they take your tax dollars, build new highways and then give them to toll entities (NTTA) to then tax you, toll you and have their own enforcement folks, that RV folks (towing vehicles) are going to be on their short list of "victims". Those that pay no attention, or refuse to abide by, the dictated weights of their vehicles/rvs are going to be in for a very rude surprise when they "flip the switch".

[chuckster57]

I have said it before: RV's are the untapped gold mine.

[rhagfo]

I'm not as worried about the law.....as I am the "lawyers". A civil suit against me for knowingly towing overloaded, if I was involved in a serious accident or a fatality accident, worries me a lot more. Fortunately, with my present TV/trailer combo, I don't have to worry about it.

Glad you feel that way, as there are many lawers out there willing to prove you wrong.

Being within limits is only part of of the defense, how the rig was operated is likely be abigger part of the case.

[flybouy]

I have said it before: RV's are the untapped gold mine.

Agreed. If there is a way to make/collect money from it someone (or group, i.e. government) will.

[JRTJH]

There's another thread on the forum right now about the condition of the roads and a state by state comparison. What better way for states to collect money than from "tourists/travelers" crossing the border into their state? Just open an RV lane at the "entry point weigh stations" and check for compliance. Those that are "overweight" get a ticket (upcharge) and those that are "more than the average vehicle weight" (set by the state government) get to buy a permit..... Some say it will "kill tourism" but when every state does it, it's either stay home or buy the permit.

We are on the brink of needing a new transportation system (roads and bridges) and there's no money to pay for it. It's only a matter of time before RV'ers are included in that "bountiful income source" that's typically reserved for commercial truckers. (Ever see that decal on the back of a truck that reads, "This vehicle pays $5000 in road taxes per year" ???) Soon to apply to RV's too ??????

[mfifield01]

The topic had me thinking about checkpoints. Do border patrol checkpoints weigh as you go through?

[Desert185]

There's another thread on the forum right now about the condition of the roads and a state by state comparison. What better way for states to collect money than from "tourists/travelers" crossing the border into their state? Just open an RV lane at the "entry point weigh stations" and check for compliance. Those that are "overweight" get a ticket (upcharge) and those that are "more than the average vehicle weight" (set by the state government) get to buy a permit..... Some say it will "kill tourism" but when every state does it, it's either stay home or buy the permit.

We are on the brink of needing a new transportation system (roads and bridges) and there's no money to pay for it. It's only a matter of time before RV'ers are included in that "bountiful income source" that's typically reserved for commercial truckers. (Ever see that decal on the back of a truck that reads, "This vehicle pays $5000 in road taxes per year" ???) Soon to apply to RV's too ??????

And that would generate a "trailer for sale sign" for me. The problem is the government, not the tax payers.

If the states would actually spend the fuel tax money on road maintenance instead of other progressive issues that I won't go into, we might not have the current state of roadway disrepair.

[sourdough]

The topic had me thinking about checkpoints. Do border patrol checkpoints weigh as you go through?

Not that I've ever witnessed. But, I will say that they have enough hi tech snooping equipment on the highway and through the checkpoint that I wouldn't be surprised if they couldn't, or don't start in the future.

[mfifield01]

I was thinking about the in state checkpoints. I've gone through the one north of Big Bend and north of Del Rio.

[Outback 325BH]

And that would generate a "trailer for sale sign" for me. The problem is the government, not the tax payers.



If the states would actually spend the fuel tax money on road maintenance instead of other progressive issues that I won't go into, we might not have the current state of roadway disrepair.


^^^This!

The idea of no money for infrastructure is amusing. The money is already there, it is just spent on the wrong things.

Just quit with the "new" taxes idea. Cut spending!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Javi]

If y'all would research your state weight laws I think most of you would find that the limits do not exclude personal vehicles nor exempt RV's.. I know for a fact that Texas does not exempt privately owned vehicles from their weight laws... Enforcement is not pushed like it is for commercial... But it does happen....

When I ran the Fertilizer company, we allowed the DPS and local LEO's to use our scales and parking lot at all our terminals for inspections and holding..

I've seen everything from 16' tandem axle car trailers to big 5th wheels weighed and more than a few parked until someone with a proper vehicle or license showed up...

just because you don't see a trailer stopped every 100 yards don't mean they don't get stopped...

[mfifield01]

If y'all would research your state weight laws I think most of you would find that the limits do not exclude personal vehicles nor exempt RV's.. I know for a fact that Texas does not exempt privately owned vehicles from their weight laws... Enforcement is not pushed like it is for commercial... But it does happen....

When I ran the Fertilizer company, we allowed the DPS and local LEO's to use our scales and parking lot at all our terminals for inspections and holding..

I've seen everything from 16' tandem axle car trailers to big 5th wheels weighed and more than a few parked until someone with a proper vehicle or license showed up...

just because you don't see a trailer stopped every 100 yards don't mean they don't get stopped...Is it enforced on GAWR, GVWR, or both (in Texas)?

[Javi]

Is it enforced on GAWR, GVWR, or both (in Texas)?
Both.. 10K better be below 10K... although individually the Leo might give a fudge factor of a couple of hundred, it ain't guaranteed by any means...

Over on the axle is one ticket...

over on the gross is another...

[sourdough]

I was thinking about the in state checkpoints. I've gone through the one north of Big Bend and north of Del Rio.



Yes, I was talking about in state checkpoints; primarily TX and NM.

[JRTJH]

Checkpoints at state lines is nothing new. Maybe "what they check for" might change, but years ago (July 1971 to be exact), California had checkpoints at the state line checking for produce, plants, flowers, etc. If you had them, dispose of them, eat them or donate them to the dumpster sitting by the checkpoint. We went through about 2AM, back then without A/C, we travelled at night. After a year at Edwards AFB, it was 116 at 4AM as we climbed the hills just west of Blythe. There was no checkpoint leaving, but the "westbound lanes" were backed up waiting to make their "declaration and enter the state"....

[CaptnJohn]

If we continue to see some crazy things on the roads and accidents checkpoints and being pulled over will become normal. I recently saw an Escalade pulling at TT at about 80 mph. The hitch area was looking like a 'V', headlights had to reach the moon. Saw a 1/2 ton pulling a 5er that no amount of air bags could level. This one doing about 20 mph on a slight grade. Then the recent video of the mid-size SUV sliding a long TT down the highway. If LEO were more pro-active on the idiots the foolish ones would get away longer and the rest would not become inconvenienced.

[B-O-B'03]

I was thinking about the in state checkpoints. I've gone through the one north of Big Bend and north of Del Rio.

I believe those are customs and border patrol check points, they ask citizenship and what are you bringing in type questions ("is there anyone riding in the camper?").

You do not what to be in line for the one between Study Butte and Alpine, after the Chili Cook off :eek:

One of my favorite places to go.

-Brian

[busterbrown]

RV check points will never happen in my life time nor during my young children's life time. Too much bureaucracy and government control that middle america would never create interstate regulations for recreational vehicles.

Everyone talks about how they (me included) see the occasional 'albeit dangerous' overweight TV. But what boggles my mind is the much larger problem of smart phone use by everyday drivers. Never seen one RV involved fatality (or injury) in all the hospitals I've worked in during my 20 year career. On the other hand, can't even count the number of trauma victims I've managed care for when involved with someone texting.

There's your revenue stream for the 'new and improved' national highway system: enforcement of strict "eyes-on-the-road" laws.

[chuckster57]

California has some very tough laws regarding texting while driving. Can't say I've seen many pulled over, but I can't count the number I see texting. While I agree with you, and the intention of the law, enforcement is near impossible because people just set the phone down for a minute. You can't "lose weight" for a few minutes.

[Desert185]

When the roads are littered with overweight RV's that caused death and destruction, maybe gov will do something about it. I just don't see the body count to justify the increased workload for DOT and LE.

There are bigger fish to fry than hitting on the RV family trying to have a good time. I vote for industry education rather than enforcement.

[CaptnJohn]

When the roads are littered with overweight RV's that caused death and destruction, maybe gov will do something about it. I just don't see the body count to justify the increased workload for DOT and LE.

There are bigger fish to fry than hitting on the RV family trying to have a good time. I vote for industry education rather than enforcement.

If you read many of the posts here quite a few see the numbers as a goal to pass so the education is there ~~ just ignored.

[busterbrown]

enforcement is near impossible because people just set the phone down for a minute.

When I lived in Phoenix about 10 years ago, there were more traffic enforcement cameras in the suburbs than drivers. Most were for speeders. Change the focus and target "texters" by adding additional video equipment that would more affordable and advanced since I was there. The first month of issued citations alone would pay the upfront infrastructure costs.

Look into the eyes of a victim's surviving spouse a few times and you realize that enforcement needs to be more than just 'officers on patrol'.

Although, now that I think about it, weekend enforcement 'ground' blitzes have proved successful in my area in the past. They are just few and far between.

[sourdough]

Some thoughts on towing

Do overloaded RVs/ towing kill lots of people? Who knows? Do those same folks pose a risk to normal/regular driving folks? Absolutely. Are government entities trying to (at this time) trying to target RV folks? No. Could they at any minute? Yes. Would it be super simple? Yes. So, from a person that has driven 100.000 miles per year in the past and tried to negotiate all the dimwits on the road:

ANY RV/towing vehicle cited for exceeding the speed limit more than 5 mph should have the vehicle/RV impounded for 3 days and a $500 fine. All RV/tow vehicle combinations should be checked by state troopers....just as they do the commercial vehicles. If you are out of compliance you are stopped and impounded - if you exceed ANY legal limitation on your truck/trailer combo minimum fine $1000, exceed limitations by 10%, fine $5000, loss of license, . As far as driving while occupied by your phone or ? for texting etc.; first offense for texting and driving...$500, 3 days in jail and loss of device. 2nd offense; $1000 fine, 10 days in jail, loss of device. 3rd offence would be $5000, 1 year in prison, loss of device and loss of vehicle.

Those are my thoughts on how I feel about people that would put you, and others lives, in peril for really stupid things. JMHO Let the fun begin....

[Desert185]

Some thoughts on towing

Do overloaded RVs/ towing kill lots of people? Who knows? Do those same folks pose a risk to normal/regular driving folks? Absolutely. Are government entities trying to (at this time) trying to target RV folks? No. Could they at any minute? Yes. Would it be super simple? Yes. So, from a person that has driven 100.000 miles per year in the past and tried to negotiate all the dimwits on the road:

ANY RV/towing vehicle cited for exceeding the speed limit more than 5 mph should have the vehicle/RV impounded for 3 days and a $500 fine. All RV/tow vehicle combinations should be checked by state troopers....just as they do the commercial vehicles. If you are out of compliance you are stopped and impounded - if you exceed ANY legal limitation on your truck/trailer combo minimum fine $1000, exceed limitations by 10%, fine $5000, loss of license, . As far as driving while occupied by your phone or ? for texting etc.; first offense for texting and driving...$500, 3 days in jail and loss of device. 2nd offense; $1000 fine, 10 days in jail, loss of device. 3rd offence would be $5000, 1 year in prison, loss of device and loss of vehicle.

Those are my thoughts on how I feel about people that would put you, and others lives, in peril for really stupid things. JMHO Let the fun begin....

:facepalm:

You don't get my vote.

[JRTJH]

The way I see it (Could be wrong) it's all about "ATTITUDE" and "PAYING THE PRICE OF ADMISSION".....

Let me explain: It seems to me that as our society becomes more affluent, people have more "disposable income" to spend on the things they want. Some people want "things" some people want "privilege".

Not too many years ago, Texas (if I remember correctly) started a program of building "high speed roads" with no speed limit. You pay a toll to use that road and "go as fast as you want" or you "live with the slow road" and if you speed and get caught, you pay a fine. The fine is "money only, no points" so essentially it boiled down to "pay to go as fast as you want or pay if you get caught without any other penalty".... What that did is create a "mindset" of "I can ignore the law, pay if they catch me and there's no consequence"......

Now we have people who believe that speeding is OK, you just have to pay if you get caught, and you get to speed again tomorrow and, well, if they catch me, I'll be unlucky and have to pay again.... <sigh>

So, from that "mindset" we've "taught a generation" of drivers not to be responsible for their actions (beyond their wallet). It's the "price of admission for the privilege of ignoring the law"..... And, unfortunately, they simply don't see any impact on anyone other than themselves. There's no risk to the others on the road, no risk to anybody but them and when they "pay the fine" they're no longer "in trouble".... That mindset is "guilty only if I can't pay the fine"...

Simple, instant gratification and it only cost me $110. Hell, I can afford it....

Now, apply that to RV weights, seat belts, texting, watching movies on the navigation screen (with that unlock brick) or most anything that "people do for their instant gratification"......

Once we make the punishment "harsh enough to affect more than a couple hours of pay" things will change, or at least offenders will have some "skin in the game" when it comes to their choices... Right now, it's just "paying the ticket and doing it again as soon as the cop is out of sight".....

[Javi]

The way I see it (Could be wrong) it's all about "ATTITUDE" and "PAYING THE PRICE OF ADMISSION".....

Let me explain: It seems to me that as our society becomes more affluent, people have more "disposable income" to spend on the things they want. Some people want "things" some people want "privilege".

Not too many years ago, Texas (if I remember correctly) started a program of building "high speed roads" with no speed limit. You pay a toll to use that road and "go as fast as you want" or you "live with the slow road" and if you speed and get caught, you pay a fine. The fine is "money only, no points" so essentially it boiled down to "pay to go as fast as you want or pay if you get caught without any other penalty".... What that did is create a "mindset" of "I can ignore the law, pay if they catch me and there's no consequence"......

Now we have people who believe that speeding is OK, you just have to pay if you get caught, and you get to speed again tomorrow and, well, if they catch me, I'll be unlucky and have to pay again.... <sigh>

So, from that "mindset" we've "taught a generation" of drivers not to be responsible for their actions (beyond their wallet). It's the "price of admission for the privilege of ignoring the law"..... And, unfortunately, they simply don't see any impact on anyone other than themselves. There's no risk to the others on the road, no risk to anybody but them and when they "pay the fine" they're no longer "in trouble".... That mindset is "guilty only if I can't pay the fine"...

Simple, instant gratification and it only cost me $110. Hell, I can afford it....

Now, apply that to RV weights, seat belts, texting, watching movies on the navigation screen (with that unlock brick) or most anything that "people do for their instant gratification"......

Once we make the punishment "harsh enough to affect more than a couple hours of pay" things will change, or at least offenders will have some "skin in the game" when it comes to their choices... Right now, it's just "paying the ticket and doing it again as soon as the cop is out of sight".....

Speed limit on those roads is 75 to 85 depending on which road... But you are correct that Texas has never had a points system (at least not in the 54 years I've had a license). A point system would never fly politically, but I wouldn't mind seeing it...

When we moved to Colorado in the early 70's we lived up in Little Deer Creek Canyon at the Hog Back... and I worked down in Arvada... people I worked with thought it was unreal that I lived that far from work... I told them that back home we often drove a hundred miles for a cup of coffee.... They always thought I was joking... Nope..

[hankpage]

Some thoughts on towing



ANY RV/towing vehicle cited for exceeding the speed limit more than 5 mph should have the vehicle/RV impounded for 3 days and a $500 fine. All RV/tow vehicle combinations should be checked by state troopers....just as they do the commercial vehicles. If you are out of compliance you are stopped and impounded - if you exceed ANY legal limitation on your truck/trailer combo minimum fine $1000, exceed limitations by 10%, fine $5000, loss of license, . As far as driving while occupied by your phone or ? for texting etc.; first offense for texting and driving...$500, 3 days in jail and loss of device. 2nd offense; $1000 fine, 10 days in jail, loss of device. 3rd offence would be $5000, 1 year in prison, loss of device and loss of vehicle.

Those are my thoughts on how I feel about people that would put you, and others lives, in peril for really stupid things. JMHO Let the fun begin....

WOW!!!! If you really feel that way, why not the same rules for all drivers??? If I'm 100 lbs. over payload my rig is impounded???? The rules and penalties are already there. We don't need more specific laws, just enforce the ones we have whether a RV or a VW. JM2¢, Hank

[Desert185]

I believe in accountability, but not to the degree that the regulations and penalties should be onerous compared to the level of the violation. I lived with special emphasis throughout my career to resolve safety issues through focused training and awareness education.

I think focused resources would be better served in other areas with more frequently demonstrated issues rather than RV's. The RVIA and the industry in general, for example, should embark on a more active education program to point out the issues one may encounter when towing heavy trailers. This would include manufacturers, sales, clubs, seminars, public service announcements, etc. A lot of folks just aren't aware of the realities and most industry sources (like sales dealers) continue to contribute to the misleading or lack of information related to towing heavy trailers.

Slapping a kid for holding a knife and fork the wrong way is the wrong approach. The punishment needs to fit the crime...after an attempt at education and awareness takes place. The brown shirt and armband approach is currently overkill for the general RV crowd.

[JRTJH]

Desert185,

The only "problem" with your approach is the "motivational factor" of where you're suggesting the behavioral change" should begin. If you consider that the RVIA and industry are motivated by profit (RVIA is an industry supported organization not a consumer organization) and the dealership, which you correctly point out is a part of the problem (because they are also motivated by profits). Essentially, your solution points to those who would "suffer loss" if they do what you suggest. The chances of that kind of "blood letting" likely won't happen.

So, if it's to be effective, there has to be a "gain" for whomever starts the change. That wouldn't be (in my opinion) RVIA, the industry or the dealerships. All of them benefit from selling "overweight rigs" to "unsuspecting victims".....

It's going to be the public that has to take the initiative of knowing what they're buying or the government (none of us want increased governmental control) to intervene. General public "restraint" when buying "luxury items" isn't likely to happen, so unless "Uncle Sam" steps in, either with increased enforcement of existing laws or by regulating the sales to "compliance with weight restrictions", I don't think we'll see much change. People are going to push the envelope and if there's no consequence for their "wrongdoing" consumers aren't going to stop buying 35' trailers to tow behind their Grand Cherokee.....

[sourdough]

WOW!!!! If you really feel that way, why not the same rules for all drivers??? If I'm 100 lbs. over payload my rig is impounded???? The rules and penalties are already there. We don't need more specific laws, just enforce the ones we have whether a RV or a VW. JM2¢, Hank


There are very few "specific" laws directed at RV's only that I'm aware of, and there should be. Having just made an almost 1000 mile round trip in the last 3 days (no RV) I can assure you that there are many, many, many folks on the highway towing things they shouldn't, towing with things they shouldn't or towing in a manner they shouldn't. They are obvious. Folks won't change unless there is some sort of repercussion for wrongdoing. Currently there is none to speak of for RV owners and the consequences of that are reflected in some of the attitudes we see on the forum.

My examples of penalties seem stringent, but, in TX with a speed limit of 75, you would be towing a rig at 80 mph + before they held the rig for 3 days and fined you. Pulling a trailer at 80+ mph? Can you imagine the devastation that could cause if the driver lost control? I was passed by a 5th wheel behind a 3/4 ton Ford doing well over that on this trip; crazy. I feel the same way about semi drivers. When you have that much behind you, YOU, the driver, should be held to a higher standard simply because a mistake on your part could be catastrophic for someone else...more so than just a Toyota Corolla driving down the highway.

Impounding may be a little harsh in some instances; maybe just holding the trailer/TV until the problem is rectified with a substantial fine. SOMETHING of consequence to get the attention of the offender and make them say; "I don't want to do that again - it's not worth it". Right now we have lots of folks that don't have any idea of the responsibilities involved when they hook that 35' trailer on the back of their vehicle. It's just "I've waited so long for this vacation I can't wait to hit the road and get to the lake". There's nothing wrong with that, in fact it's great to be able to do it, but a person towing an RV HAS to always keep in mind that there's more to it than just jumping in and doing what they want - to heck with the rules - they are carrying a lot of responsibility behind them.


I tow across the country so I certainly don't want a bunch of onerous new laws that could ensnare me by accident. In a perfect world folks could just attend an educational seminar held by ???, learn all the right things to do then go out and do them. Ain't gonna happen - the seminars nor folks just going out and doing the right thing.....because. We all know that. Then we're back to trying to "force" compliance by laws and penalties.

I suppose my original post was driven more by my agitation at folks that text and drive (seemingly everyone I see on the road any more) and isn't really something we can solve here, but......yesterday, driving back to our mountain home here, we were in the hills. I could see a car coming in the distance and I kept my eye on it as we went up and down the hills. I knew it was close so I just kept my eyes on the crests of the hills. I saw the top of a vehicle coming up the rise and it continued straight at me...in my lane! I pulled clear off the edge of the road and waited to see if I had to drive off the hill. There she came at about 65 mph, oblivious, staring at her smartphone texting. She passed so close to me, in my lane, that I could see her perfectly. She saw me just as she went by and she had a look of pure terror - which she should have then jerked her car so hard I was afraid she was going to roll it - she didn't. On the other hand, my wife was shook up and I was POd. Anyway, when you are behind the wheel it is a full time job and you have lots of responsibility. You need to be aware of it and act accordingly. If we can't police ourselves then our only recourse is to have ourselves policed. Not the ideal situation but.....JMO

[Desert185]

Desert185,

The only "problem" with your approach is the "motivational factor" of where you're suggesting the behavioral change" should begin. If you consider that the RVIA and industry are motivated by profit (RVIA is an industry supported organization not a consumer organization) and the dealership, which you correctly point out is a part of the problem (because they are also motivated by profits). Essentially, your solution points to those who would "suffer loss" if they do what you suggest. The chances of that kind of "blood letting" likely won't happen.

So, if it's to be effective, there has to be a "gain" for whomever starts the change. That wouldn't be (in my opinion) RVIA, the industry or the dealerships. All of them benefit from selling "overweight rigs" to "unsuspecting victims".....

It's going to be the public that has to take the initiative of knowing what they're buying or the government (none of us want increased governmental control) to intervene. General public "restraint" when buying "luxury items" isn't likely to happen, so unless "Uncle Sam" steps in, either with increased enforcement of existing laws or by regulating the sales to "compliance with weight restrictions", I don't think we'll see much change. People are going to push the envelope and if there's no consequence for their "wrongdoing" consumers aren't going to stop buying 35' trailers to tow behind their Grand Cherokee.....

If 35' trailers are being sold to unsuspecting Grand Cherokee owners, then those dealers are enabling the problems and should be held accountable to a degree if a disclaimer signed by the buyer is not provided. If the buyer insists, then its his baby and time for existing laws and statutes to be enforced.

You and others seem to be pushing enforcement, which is a reasonable solution if done reasonably. Enforcement and educated compliance go hand in hand for success. The RV industry, whether govt instigated or not, posts stickers galore reminding the buying public of limitations when operating the product (go to an ATV dealer and check them out). Both the industry and the end users need to take responsibility for the operation of the vehicle, and I think more folks would comply if they knew the facts and consequences. We see that on this forum after a dose of reality from the WP contingent.

Once again, limits may be pushed and no one has a death wish, but heavy-handed, onerous punishment without frontend education and awareness is not the answer. There has to be a balance in the process without draconian consequences.

Is everyone going to comply? No. Criminals will always have guns, regardless of the laws that primarily affect law abiding citizens. Let's just enforce the laws already on the books and try to further educate those who will generally comply.

[JRTJH]

If we rely on the manufacturers to "educate the public" we'll get products with names like "Cougar Half Ton" and "Jayco Eagle Half Ton" which come with a disclaimer in very small print on the bottom of the back page of the brochure that says, "Towable with a properly equipped half ton truck"... What it doesn't say is that 97% of all manufactured half ton trucks are NOT properly equipped... Oh wait, that's what's happening right now....

So, they are marketing to an uneducated public and creating the situation that we're talking about. I wouldn't look to them for much support at reducing the problem at the expense of their profits.

As for all the "government stickers" that are already being put on things. We've had several examples on the forum in the past week where people damaged their trailers by "ignoring the caution" that was clearly placed directly over the connection they were using. I'd wager that half the members of this forum don't know what information is on the two weight stickers on their trailer, and probably 25% of them didn't realize there are TWO stickers (until they just read it in this response) so "educating the public with stickers" is about as effective as asking a "real man" to read the assembly instructions before trying to build his kid's new bicycle...

I agree, "draconian measures" shouldn't be the first step, educating the public should be, followed by enforcement, followed by stricter enforcement for those who refuse to comply...

The way I see it, every special interest group points fingers at others who "are a bigger problem" The RV community is pointing fingers at people who text, texters are pointing fingers at people who speed, speeders are pointing fingers at drunk drivers, saying they cause more accidents than the RV community.... They probably do, from a statistical point of view, but if we "do nothing because there's always a bigger problem that should be fixed first".... Where do we end up? Doing nothing ??? That's where we've been and where we're going, in that "circle of pointing fingers" with no results.....

It's a certain fact that RV'ers aren't the biggest offender of traffic laws, but then neither are drunk drivers (currently) and yet we're about to require an alarm be installed in all new cars to warn parents to check the back seat to be sure they don't leave a child behind..... From what I'm reading, we are "reacting to around 25 child deaths annually" with that measure. I'll admit, the death of a child is tragic and should NEVER happen, but focusing on that problem while ignoring the 3,000 deaths from texting??? In my state, we still don't enforce an existing law that prohibits cell phone use and we don't enforce the one that requires towing under the maximum vehicle weight. Heck, in many places we don't even enforce speed limits, yet all the news stations give us statistics on the "growing death toll on our nation's highways"....

We're going in circles trying to find a place to start ????? Seems to me the faster we go in that circle, the smaller the circle gets and we're getting nowhere faster than before..... :facepalm:

[chuckster57]

Don't remember where, but I thought I saw someone trying to introduce legislation that would require cell phones to be disabled while a vehicle was in motion. I agree we seem to be playing musical chairs, and I often wonder who the "winner" will be.

[sourdough]

If 35' trailers are being sold to unsuspecting Grand Cherokee owners, then those dealers are enabling the problems and should be held accountable to a degree if a disclaimer signed by the buyer is not provided. If the buyer insists, then its his baby and time for existing laws and statutes to be enforced.

You and others seem to be pushing enforcement, which is a reasonable solution if done reasonably. Enforcement and educated compliance go hand in hand for success. The RV industry, whether govt instigated or not, posts stickers galore reminding the buying public of limitations when operating the product (go to an ATV dealer and check them out). Both the industry and the end users need to take responsibility for the operation of the vehicle, and I think more folks would comply if they knew the facts and consequences. We see that on this forum after a dose of reality from the WP contingent.

Once again, limits may be pushed and no one has a death wish, but heavy-handed, onerous punishment without frontend education and awareness is not the answer. There has to be a balance in the process without draconian consequences.

Is everyone going to comply? No. Criminals will always have guns, regardless of the laws that primarily affect law abiding citizens. Let's just enforce the laws already on the books and try to further educate those who will generally comply.


I agree that draconian measures shouldn't be the first step. But, where is the education supposed to come from? Manufacturers aren't going to do it and neither are dealers. Dealers wouldn't do it even if you paid them and if it costs, buyers aren't going to go. So, where does it come from? Any motivated buyer/owner can go online and learn a lot - probably enough to be safe if they would abide by what they read.....but then again, what kind of information are they actually going to get? Real, honest information or some guy's off the wall interpretation of how it should be done?

Now, we're back to enforcement since education didn't work. Enforcement for RVs is going to be difficult from a law enforcement perspective. All trucks and RVs have different specs so it would have to be a very people intensive effort. People cost money; most LEO organizations run short of money. Now what? Back to the draconian measures - slaps on the wrist don't work. Example: I think this was brought up in a previous post. In NM they changed the laws for speeding. Used to be you got the ticket, chose guilty, not guilty or no contest. You went on your way and contacted the judge to determine your fine etc. You were assessed points against your license. Now, when you get stopped for speeding you have 2 choices; return to the local judge at a date the judge determines so he can hear your case (no phone call - actual appearance) OR plead guilty on the spot, sign the dotted line, the tell you the amount of the fine on the spot and give you an envelope so you can mail it in. No points. Poof! It's done gone and over. Last time I was stopped I just said "guilty" - I'm not driving all the way back here to do this. $140 if I recall. I can do that all day long. Am I learning anything? Yes. They want the money, not safety. I'm not hurt at all except a small fine and I'm good with that. Small, meaningless law enforcement measures don't accomplish anything. Now the draconian makes sense. How draconian? That would be up for discussion, but, the object would be to get the response I alluded to earlier "Wow, that hurt! I'm never doing that again"! How do we do that? I doubt we ever will since RV safety is a pretty low priority, but it seems we could start by having everyone drive through an RV weight line to get compliance.......:facepalm::whistling::popcorn:

I don't want to do that anymore than anyone else. I do want to do something to get RVers to adhere to established weight limits. The RV world is exploding and the number of overloaded, unsafe rigs on the highways is growing exponentially. I figure something will happen sooner or later. I am not the WP. I am an older, thoughtful, conservative, safety conscious individual that tries to follow the law - especially when towing; I expect everyone else to do the same. It's not asking anything special of anyone - it's the law and as we have witnessed, if you don't follow the existing laws, they just keep making more to try to address the same thing.

[Desert185]

If we rely on the manufacturers to "educate the public" we'll get products with names like "Cougar Half Ton" and "Jayco Eagle Half Ton" which come with a disclaimer in very small print on the bottom of the back page of the brochure that says, "Towable with a properly equipped half ton truck"... What it doesn't say is that 97% of all manufactured half ton trucks are NOT properly equipped... Oh wait, that's what's happening right now....

So, they are marketing to an uneducated public and creating the situation that we're talking about. I wouldn't look to them for much support at reducing the problem at the expense of their profits.

As for all the "government stickers" that are already being put on things. We've had several examples on the forum in the past week where people damaged their trailers by "ignoring the caution" that was clearly placed directly over the connection they were using. I'd wager that half the members of this forum don't know what information is on the two weight stickers on their trailer, and probably 25% of them didn't realize there are TWO stickers (until they just read it in this response) so "educating the public with stickers" is about as effective as asking a "real man" to read the assembly instructions before trying to build his kid's new bicycle...

I agree, "draconian measures" shouldn't be the first step, educating the public should be, followed by enforcement, followed by stricter enforcement for those who refuse to comply...

The way I see it, every special interest group points fingers at others who "are a bigger problem" The RV community is pointing fingers at people who text, texters are pointing fingers at people who speed, speeders are pointing fingers at drunk drivers, saying they cause more accidents than the RV community.... They probably do, from a statistical point of view, but if we "do nothing because there's always a bigger problem that should be fixed first".... Where do we end up? Doing nothing ??? That's where we've been and where we're going, in that "circle of pointing fingers" with no results.....

It's a certain fact that RV'ers aren't the biggest offender of traffic laws, but then neither are drunk drivers (currently) and yet we're about to require an alarm be installed in all new cars to warn parents to check the back seat to be sure they don't leave a child behind..... From what I'm reading, we are "reacting to around 25 child deaths annually" with that measure. I'll admit, the death of a child is tragic and should NEVER happen, but focusing on that problem while ignoring the 3,000 deaths from texting??? In my state, we still don't enforce an existing law that prohibits cell phone use and we don't enforce the one that requires towing under the maximum vehicle weight. Heck, in many places we don't even enforce speed limits, yet all the news stations give us statistics on the "growing death toll on our nation's highways"....

We're going in circles trying to find a place to start ????? Seems to me the faster we go in that circle, the smaller the circle gets and we're getting nowhere faster than before..... :facepalm:

Thanks for helping to make my point on people. I didn't want to go where you went and you're so much better at it than I am (compliment:bow:)..and I really don't read the stickers, either. I just read the owner's manual and forum myself with the details of the new endeavor.

So I guess we're back to the status quo. If we aren't enforcing the existing laws and people can't be educated to do the right thing, then there is no point in opening a big can of gestapo on the nice retired couple from Mayberry, KS who is just trying to have good time.

I'm good with it.

[notanlines]

We just left a campground in Wisconsin where we saw (among other things) a 2016 425ts Raptor being towed every week-end with an F250 Crew Cab Diesel. I believe this is the worst we saw most of the summer, but as all of you know this isn't unusual. I only talked to him about his side by side he had in the garage, not the load he was towing.
In looking at the side of the argument concerning heavily overloaded pickups it might be easier to win on occasion if the statistics were stronger in our favor. The truth of the matter is that there are very, very few RV accidents/mishaps due to the pickup being overloaded.

[xrated]

We just left a campground in Wisconsin where we saw (among other things) a 2016 425ts Raptor being towed every week-end with an F250 Crew Cab Diesel. I believe this is the worst we saw most of the summer, but as all of you know this isn't unusual. I only talked to him about his side by side he had in the garage, not the load he was towing.
In looking at the side of the argument concerning heavily overloaded pickups it might be easier to win on occasion if the statistics were stronger in our favor. The truth of the matter is that there are very, very few RV accidents/mishaps due to the pickup being overloaded.

I'm not so sure about that....very few accidents due to overloading. I honestly don't know if that info is tracked by anyone, and the accidents that do happen may just be reported as tire failures....which may have resulted from overloading; I just don't know.

[cpt_majestic]

I'm not as worried about the law.....as I am the "lawyers". A civil suit against me for knowingly towing overloaded, if I was involved in a serious accident or a fatality accident, worries me a lot more. Fortunately, with my present TV/trailer combo, I don't have to worry about it.

I agree 100%, the whole thing is just not worth it for me. Larry H Parker will foam at the mouth for a case like this and it could be financially devastating for most...

[xrated]

I agree 100%, the whole thing is just not worth it for me. Larry H Parker will foam at the mouth for a case like this and it could be financially devastating for most...

Yea, I've worked way too long and hard for what I have to allow someone to take it from me....all because of my stupidity or indifference.

[JRTJH]

I agree 100%, the whole thing is just not worth it for me. Larry H Parker will foam at the mouth for a case like this and it could be financially devastating for most...

Yea, I've worked way too long and hard for what I have to allow someone to take it from me....all because of my stupidity or indifference.

And this is why I have a 31' XLite fifth wheel (not a 37' one) for my F250 and why I have an F250 (not an F150) for my XLite.....

Even some of the Cougar XLite models would "overload" my F250 diesel based on the available payload sticker "prominently displayed on the door pillar in YELLOW".....

[jsmith948]

Don't forget public perception. Have you ever been sitting at a light minding your own business only to have someone driving a Prius come up alongside and offer their 'opinion' as to how you and 'your kind' are polluting the atmosphere and ruining the world with our diesel trucks and vile, unnecessary RV? I have - of course I reside in Kalifornia. There WILL come a day when we (folks with RVs) are required to stop at the truck scales and go through the same hassles as the big rigs - safety inspections - including tires, suspension, road flares, proper license, registration, etc., etc., etc.!
The "public" will demand it through their legislators - after all, why should 'we' be allowed to do something 'they' can't? (never mind that we worked all of our lives so that we could one day retire and enjoy the RV lifestyle. The policing entities will increase enforcement in order to satidfy the 'public' - then, once the realization dawns that this is a pretty good way to increase state revenue, the states will begin adding RV lanes at the scales. As an example, here in good ole' Kalifornia, even though there are numerous state of the art weigh stations throughout the state, the CHP/Caltrans folks will set up an inspection station in a highway rest area in order to impress the 'public' with their efforts at cracking down od these 'outlaw' truckers - aka menaces to the motoring public. It is always plitical - just follow the money. Sorry for my cynicism - it's the result of 2.5 million miles as a trucker. Rant off.

[Desert185]

I'm not so sure about that....very few accidents due to overloading. I honestly don't know if that info is tracked by anyone, and the accidents that do happen may just be reported as tire failures....which may have resulted from overloading; I just don't know.

A lot of people don't know.

[Desert185]

Don't forget public perception. Have you ever been sitting at a light minding your own business only to have someone driving a Prius come up alongside and offer their 'opinion' as to how you and 'your kind' are polluting the atmosphere and ruining the world with our diesel trucks and vile, unnecessary RV? I have - of course I reside in Kalifornia. There WILL come a day when we (folks with RVs) are required to stop at the truck scales and go through the same hassles as the big rigs - safety inspections - including tires, suspension, road flares, proper license, registration, etc., etc., etc.!
The "public" will demand it through their legislators - after all, why should 'we' be allowed to do something 'they' can't? (never mind that we worked all of our lives so that we could one day retire and enjoy the RV lifestyle. The policing entities will increase enforcement in order to satidfy the 'public' - then, once the realization dawns that this is a pretty good way to increase state revenue, the states will begin adding RV lanes at the scales. As an example, here in good ole' Kalifornia, even though there are numerous state of the art weigh stations throughout the state, the CHP/Caltrans folks will set up an inspection station in a highway rest area in order to impress the 'public' with their efforts at cracking down od these 'outlaw' truckers - aka menaces to the motoring public. It is always plitical - just follow the money. Sorry for my cynicism - it's the result of 2.5 million miles as a trucker. Rant off.

Besides learning to fly, one of the smartest, self-satisfying, financially positive things I've done in my life was to move out of that state in 1992. :thumbsup:

[Javi]

http://fifthwheelst.com/rv-accidents-statistics.html

Not a lot of statistics on RV accidents... but it appears most of what is available is from Lawyers... go figure... :D

[xrated]

And this is why I have a 31' XLite fifth wheel (not a 37' one) for my F250 and why I have an F250 (not an F150) for my XLite.....

Even some of the Cougar XLite models would "overload" my F250 diesel based on the available payload sticker "prominently displayed on the door pillar in YELLOW".....

So, a payload sticker has some yellow on it.....who knew? :D

[xrated]

jsmith948......people that drive a Prius, generally do not exist in my mind....mostly like a little annoying gnat that you should just swat! People like that actually make me wish I had a tuner on the truck for those special occasions..............













Not really ^^^^^^, but it would be kind of funny/ironic.

[mfifield01]

Based on the original question/topic, I called the DMV in Texas. I basically asked about my registered weight on my truck. The dealer registered it below the GVWR. I said what if I get pulled over and I'm over the registered weight. They said to not worry about it unless it's commercial. Also, she stated that the registered weights only apply to larger trucks.

[Desert185]

http://fifthwheelst.com/rv-accidents-statistics.html

Not a lot of statistics on RV accidents... but it appears most of what is available is from Lawyers... go figure... :D

"At 26 deaths per year, the rate of RV deaths has an average fatality rate of 1/3 of the average rate of all vehicles or 0.44per 100 million vehicles miles versus 1.48 for all vehicles in the US."

Pretty low RV body count to justify special emphasis...and then how many were due to being overloaded? Pretty low stats to cause an increase in blood pressure. Law enforcement has bigger fish to fry.

Ever since Adam and Eve first met, there has been an effort to attain zero accidents, but like the very lengthy American war on poverty, try as we might, attaining zero accident success ain't gonna happen.

Personally, I can live with those stats and comfortably maintain 120/80 during these retirement years.

[sourdough]

"At 26 deaths per year, the rate of RV deaths has an average fatality rate of 1/3 of the average rate of all vehicles or 0.44per 100 million vehicles miles versus 1.48 for all vehicles in the US."

Pretty low RV body count to justify special emphasis...and then how many were due to being overloaded? Pretty low stats to cause an increase in blood pressure. Law enforcement has bigger fish to fry.

Ever since Adam and Eve first met, there has been an effort to attain zero accidents, but like the very lengthy American war on poverty, try as we might, attaining zero accident success ain't gonna happen.

Personally, I can live with those stats and comfortably maintain 120/80 during these retirement years.


I think you're right. I travel all the time - by vehicle. I see stuff (of all kinds, not just towing) most every day that makes you just shake your head, but, in the end most of the idiotic stuff I see never has a bad ending therefore it didn't happen.

I think that RVs will come under the microscope, not because of accidents, but because we are an untapped revenue stream. At that point who knows if they are going to try to get the extra $$ when you register or at a checkpoint.

I think weight enforcement will be far down the line if at all in my lifetime. I suspect the only ones affected are those that might have an accident, have their weights checked and end up on the wrong end of a wrongful death suit or some such. And no, it's not something that's going to raise by blood pressure above the 162/96 it was this morning.....:facepalm::)

[MattE303]

...
My examples of penalties seem stringent, but, in TX with a speed limit of 75, you would be towing a rig at 80 mph + before they held the rig for 3 days and fined you.

...and in California, your law would get my rig impounded for 3 days for going 61 MPH... sound reasonable?

[hankpage]

So, a payload sticker has some yellow on it.....who knew? :D

I never saw a yellow sticker on my truck so I was forced to go out in the rain and look for one. Nope, no yellow just plain old boring white. Maybe yellow is a Ford thing. :whistling:

In this crazy state most dealers will register 3/4 and 1T non-commercial SRW trucks at 7000 lbs even though they weigh more than that empty. This is because many parks and communities ban vehicles registered over 4 tons instead of commercial vehicles which would make sense since the bans have nothing to do with weight just commercial truck traffic. :nonono: Maybe we should get some of our forum members to run for political offices to straighten some of these rules out. :rofl:

[sourdough]

...and in California, your law would get my rig impounded for 3 days for going 61 MPH... sound reasonable?


No it doesn't.....but it is Kalifornia. It would just be another reason for me to leave.....or not go there.:)

In all seriousness, I did say in a later post that those "proposed" guidelines would need to be discussed because they are pretty stiff and you bring up a valid point.

[Desert185]

...and in California, your law would get my rig impounded for 3 days for going 61 MPH... sound reasonable?

I thought the same thing. I tow at 60 on the freeways, whether the towing speed limit is 55 or much higher. The HP leaves me alone, even in a 55 state.

[Desert185]

Sourdough:

"And no, it's not something that's going to raise by blood pressure above the 162/96 it was this morning."

I'm not a doctor, my friend, but no salt, no booze, one cup of coffee, drink more water and walk an hour a day. Its a start. :thumbsup:

[xrated]

I never saw a yellow sticker on my truck so I was forced to go out in the rain and look for one. Nope, no yellow just plain old boring white. Maybe yellow is a Ford thing. :whistling:

In this crazy state most dealers will register 3/4 and 1T non-commercial SRW trucks at 7000 lbs even though they weigh more than that empty. This is because many parks and communities ban vehicles registered over 4 tons instead of commercial vehicles which would make sense since the bans have nothing to do with weight just commercial truck traffic. :nonono: Maybe we should get some of our forum members to run for political offices to straighten some of these rules out. :rofl:

Well, I guess it COULD be, except that my Honda Civic (work car) has the same kind of sticker for tire size, rim size, and payload capacity. It's actually a mostly white sticker on both my truck (Ford) and my Honda, with some yellow coloring.....almost looks like it was done with a yellow highlighter market

[sourdough]

Sourdough:

"And no, it's not something that's going to raise by blood pressure above the 162/96 it was this morning."

I'm not a doctor, my friend, but no salt, no booze, one cup of coffee, drink more water and walk an hour a day. Its a start. :thumbsup:

Thanks Desert; it is something we are working on now.

This is off topic but want to mention this since someone may encounter it one day;

In 1977 I had a near fatal motorcycle accident. 19 skull fractures, broken nose, jaw, ribs etc. 3 weeks after I was released from the hospital I had an acute attack of gout - had never had it or heard of it. At that time I also found I had hypertension....which I had never had either. In fact, prior to the accident I was a picture of perfect health. We had to work long and hard to get the gout and hypertension under control...but we did and it had been that way for decades. They told me that the onset of these things were due to the trama/shock and somehow the way my body regulated those things had went amiss. At the end of last year I went in for a routine gall bladder removal. 8-9 days later I was soaking the bed in sweats and couldn't eat.
Found that the gall bladder removal had become infected and I had a very serious infection in/on the liver requiring them to run a tube through my ribs and liver to drain the infection for 10 days. Pretty intense. This was on the heels of having my knee removed for 3 months then replaced after removing a large portion of the leg bone due to infection.

After we had finished the antibiotic regimen to clear the infection I went in for another blood test. What did we find? I now had diabetes, a low thyroid condition and my hypertension was back! (everything had been fine prior to these events - I have a blood test every 3 months to monitor "stuff"). All just because of the trama/shock to the system of the prior surgeries/infections. It was unbelievable. The doctors again said it was due to the shock and was not uncommon. I had never heard of it and just wanted to throw that out there in the event someone ever has a situation where this could come into play and become an issue for them. At least you might be aware of some of the potential hazards.

Now, back to weighing our RVs.....:)

[Ken / Claudia]

After reading thru these posts. I must reply to post #33. Yes there are people hurt and killed while in or operating or struck by RVs or people towing RVs. I suggest you contact a highway patrol or state police. I am not even sure how a person in the ER learns of those details. Do you know how people where in a ford, chev, dodge when crashed? Was the person towing a boat? The police know. Hospital personal?
And the cause of any major crash will not be known until days or weeks after. Only police and insurance co.s and few people involved get that information unless a press release is done. Many major crashes have more than 1 factor that caused it.
Rvs might make up 1 to 2 % percent of all vehicles out there on the roads, so I agree there are not on the nightly news anyway. Heck the last one I watched shown a SUV pulling a TT. They showed it and never even mentioned the TT. just that 2 vehicles hit head on. Good data is hard to find because what is a RV as listed on the crash report. And if towed how did it contribute to the crash? Easy to say a tire blew out. But, why? Easy to say vehicle did not stop before striking the other vehicle but, why? The best data I have is now old but, I will repeat it. In Oregon most RV crashes are said to be caused by driver sleepy or fell asleep.

[rhagfo]

I never saw a yellow sticker on my truck so I was forced to go out in the rain and look for one. Nope, no yellow just plain old boring white. Maybe yellow is a Ford thing. :whistling:

In this crazy state most dealers will register 3/4 and 1T non-commercial SRW trucks at 7000 lbs even though they weigh more than that empty. This is because many parks and communities ban vehicles registered over 4 tons instead of commercial vehicles which would make sense since the bans have nothing to do with weight just commercial truck traffic. :nonono: Maybe we should get some of our forum members to run for political offices to straighten some of these rules out. :rofl:
2004.5 will not likely have the payload/tire load and psi sticker, they were not required until 2006.
That said if one was to get scaled would it be off the the VIN sticker or the would the registered weight if above the VIN GVWR. Then again would they weigh onn the GAWR?

[CaptnJohn]

jsmith948......people that drive a Prius, generally do not exist in my mind....mostly like a little annoying gnat that you should just swat! People like that actually make me wish I had a tuner on the truck for those special occasions..............













Not really ^^^^^^, but it would be kind of funny/ironic.



This is when I wish for a button to change the exhaust and be able to bury them in a cloud of black smoke.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[flybouy]

http://fifthwheelst.com/rv-accidents-statistics.html

Not a lot of statistics on RV accidents... but it appears most of what is available is from Lawyers... go figure... :D

So true. Many years ago when I was learning how to fly the manual for a Cessna 172 was about 15 pages of essentially weight and balance and performance tables. In the 1970's that manual bloated to approximately 50+ pages. Why? A tennager broke into an airport, broke into a Cessna, hot wired it and speed down the runway until he ran off the runway ending in a fatal crash. The parents of said juvenile sued Cessna and won several million dollars because nowhere in the manual did it state that you had to be a pilot to operate the plane. This is but one of thousands of reports of how a personal tragedy due to a lack of good judgement/common sense results in Lawyer's profiting and the end user paying the price in many ways; remember the grandmother and the hot coffee at the McDonalds drive thru?.

I apologize for the long post but it seems to me like the major issue here is the lack of, or willing disregard to apply commonsense. Just my opinion. Sorry for the interruption, please proceed with the dead horse beating. :popcorn:

[rhagfo]

So true. Many years ago when I was learning how to fly the manual for a Cessna 172 was about 15 pages of essentially weight and balance and performance tables. In the 1970's that manual bloated to approximately 50+ pages. Why? A tennager broke into an airport, broke into a Cessna, hot wired it and speed down the runway until he ran off the runway ending in a fatal crash. The parents of said juvenile sued Cessna and won several million dollars because nowhere in the manual did it state that you had to be a pilot to operate the plane. This is but one of thousands of reports of how a personal tragedy due to a lack of good judgement/common sense results in Lawyer's profiting and the end user paying the price in many ways; remember the grandmother and the hot coffee at the McDonalds drive thru?.

I apologize for the long post but it seems to me like the major issue here is the lack of, or willing disregard to apply commonsense. Just my opinion. Sorry for the interruption, please proceed with the dead horse beating. :popcorn:

The Cessna is a great example of what is wrong with the justice system in this country! That case should have been thrown out as soon as it was filed!
This is also why most small hand tools come with user manuals with more information on what NOT to do with said tool than how to use it correctly!

[Desert185]

Computers have been a boon to society, making previously unheard of things possible. A byproduct of those possibilities is the dumbing down of society in so many areas, to include "a jury of your peers". I'll leave it at that.

[notanlines]

Solely for the benefit of those of you with the wise-guy Prius remarks:



And also thanks to the guy in Ontario without whose sense of humor this would not be possible!

[B-O-B'03]

Computers have been a boon to society, making previously unheard of things possible. A byproduct of those possibilities is the dumbing down of society in so many areas, to include "a jury of your peers". I'll leave it at that.

The same thing is happening with automobiles, among other things.

You don't have to pay attention anymore, the car does it for you :facepalm:

Personally, I am all for removing every safety label and letting Darwinism take its course.

We are coddling the stupid and they are out numbering us at a very high rate.

/soapbox

-Brian

[JRTJH]

Just look at a simple 6' extension cord that cost 39 cents when I was a kid. First they added a "silver UL label, then the mandated "twist to plug" covers on the three plug-in and a "flange" so you don't slip and touch the connector when plugging it in. Next came not one, two or three, but SIX warning/caution labels to warn against everything from not using it over its rating to not letting your toddler chew on the cord.

Pretty much, that 39 cent cord now costs $4.79 and you have to spend your first half hour of ownership removing the labels so you can find the plug to use the darn thing......

And, you don't want me to get started on the warnings that come with something as simple as a toaster or even the ice maker that many of us like to have for our camper. I bought mine at Sam's Club and the 108 page owner's manual has one page of "how to operate" the thing and the rest is warnings, California initiatives, potential carcinogens, and who to contact if there's a safety risk identified during use. All of that, not in one language, but in 7 languages from English to Japanese (or some other "squiggley" alphabet).

What happened to the one page, "fill with water, plug it in and turn it on, wait 10 minutes and open the door to get your ice".... That's all it really needs to say, all the rest is "discarded as gubmint junk" anyway....

and yes, it also had those same 6 warning labels on the power cord......:facepalm:

[hankpage]

Just look at a simple 6' extension cord that cost 39 cents when I was a kid. First they added a "silver UL label, then the mandated "twist to plug" covers on the three plug-in and a "flange" so you don't slip and touch the connector when plugging it in. Next came not one, two or three, but SIX warning/caution labels to warn against everything from not using it over its rating to not letting your toddler chew on the cord.

Pretty much, that 39 cent cord now costs $4.79 and you have to spend your first half hour of ownership removing the labels so you can find the plug to use the darn thing......

And, you don't want me to get started on the warnings that come with something as simple as a toaster or even the ice maker that many of us like to have for our camper. I bought mine at Sam's Club and the 108 page owner's manual has one page of "how to operate" the thing and the rest is warnings, California initiatives, potential carcinogens, and who to contact if there's a safety risk identified during use. All of that, not in one language, but in 7 languages from English to Japanese (or some other "squiggley" alphabet).

What happened to the one page, "fill with water, plug it in and turn it on, wait 10 minutes and open the door to get your ice".... That's all it really needs to say, all the rest is "discarded as gubmint junk" anyway....

and yes, it also had those same 6 warning labels on the power cord......:facepalm:

The new ones will be labeling each cube to warn of a possible choke hazard. :cool:

[JRTJH]

The new ones will be labeling each cube to warn of a possible choke hazard. :cool:

Come to think of it, maybe I should dig through the box in the camper to find the owner's manual, fill out the paperwork to identify the ice cubes as a "choke hazard" and submit it??? No, with my luck they'll send somebody to confiscate my ice maker and charge me for a retrofit so it only makes cubes that are too large to swallow..... :bm:

[CaptnJohn]

The same thing is happening with automobiles, among other things.



You don't have to pay attention anymore, the car does it for you :facepalm:



Personally, I am all for removing every safety label and letting Darwinism take its course.



We are coddling the stupid and they are out numbering us at a very high rate.



/soapbox



-Brian


I too believe Darwin should be much busier. Then wonder in some instances who is less brilliant, those that stand in the middle of a highway or those that stop because they are there.



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[chuckster57]

The problem with "Darwinism" when it comes to driving is the innocent person the idiot takes out in the process. I'm not in line to volunteer for that.

[B-O-B'03]

The problem with "Darwinism" when it comes to driving is the innocent person the idiot takes out in the process. I'm not in line to volunteer for that.

I am thinking more of the people that will take their new extension cord, curling iron, toaster, coffee maker, etc into the bath tub with them. Not sure what the answer is for all the idiots on the road... maybe a driving test, with a shock collar?

There was that girl, that shot her boyfriend, through a book, with a .50 desert eagle... unfortunately, she is already pregnant with their second child, maybe CPS will take them both away.

-Brian

[Outback 325BH]

Thing to remember too is, for any inspection/stop that would weigh, they don't weigh "payload"... they would just weigh the vehicle and compare that to GVWR. Possibly weigh axles and compare to GAWR.

The concept of "payload" is simply for us to have an idea how much room we have until reaching GVWR.




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[chuckster57]

Thing to remember too is, for any inspection/stop that would weigh, they don't weigh "payload"... they would just weigh the vehicle and compare that to GVWR. Possibly weigh axles and compare to GAWR.

The concept of "payload" is simply for us to have an idea how much room we have until reaching GVWR.




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My understanding is CHP weighs rear axle and impounds based on gawr. Common occurrence at some popular RV places like Pismo Beach.