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View Full Version : ST vs LT tires for 5th wheel trailers


TNT Miller
05-02-2017, 08:12 PM
Need to replace all 5 tires on my 2013 Laredo 266RL tire size is 235/80 16
I have a 28 foot race trailer that has it 235/85 R-16's E on it and have been there for a long time with 0 issues they were on it when I bought the trailer
Q- What is the main difference between the ST and the LT
Thank you .

busterbrown
05-02-2017, 10:53 PM
Members may chime in on the differences but this YouTube video (https://youtu.be/r6SwwRnmp1Q) does a great job illustrating the general application for each tire classification: passenger, light truck (LT) and trailer (ST). Some RV owners have swapped out ST tires for LT tires and will promote their decisions. Industry standards, however, only recommend an appropriate load capacity ST tire for coaches like fifth wheels and travel trailers due to side wall requirements.

notanlines
05-03-2017, 02:53 AM
We bought our Raptor in 2014 in Florida, a repo that the owner had for 5 months. The China bombs were built in March of 2013. When I talked to him he said it had been on four camping trips in Florida. We towed in home and then back to Florida, 1600 miles, at which time we blew two of those wonderful ST tires recommended by so many rule-followers and Geico parted with $9,200 to repair the damage. We left Camping World body shop in Fort Myers (people did a fantastic job) and towed directly to Tire King for new Sailun S-637's. 18,800 miles later not one spec of trouble. Towed over the desert, mountains, over hill, over dale.....you get my drift. Tell you what; rule followers can ride on Trailer Kings all day long. I'll stick with our LT Sailuns. I'm just about to get off my soapbox. Look for another member here who has had blowouts and trailer damage from an LT tire. I'm done!

ctbruce
05-03-2017, 03:23 AM
I'm pretty sure no one on here would recommend either keeping or replacing with Trailer Kings. They don't walk away, they RUN away from them. That said the biggest argument/discussion is on Carlisle vs Sailun vs Maxxis. If you're going to replace, replace better, not the same or worse.

Do a search on here, you'll find more tire threads than you can read in a day.

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BuxCamper
05-03-2017, 03:33 AM
Going off topic but when are the insurance companies going to say enough is enough with the Trailer Kings?

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xrated
05-03-2017, 03:36 AM
I'm not educated enough about the difference between LT vs. ST tires, but like many products, there are different levels of quality available in almost everything you buy....cars, trailers, tools, clothing, and the list goes on all the way to infinity, and beyond. Trailer Tires are no different, in my opinion. We've all heard about or experienced the "China Bomb" tires, definitely on the lower end of the quality scale of ST tires. I had them on the new trailer that I bought last fall and couldn't wait to get them off of the trailer, which I did earlier this spring. I didn't go with an LT tire though, a set of Maxxis ST tires went on the trailer, based on past experience with them, as well as lots of folks that use them commenting about the quality of the Tire. From what little I know about trailer tires, I'm going to stick with what type (not brand) of tires that the manufacturer puts on the trailer. It seems to me (again, certainly not an expert here), that if the LT type tires were a better choice, then at least some of the trailer manufacturers would be using them on new, from the factory applications.

bsmith0404
05-03-2017, 04:46 AM
Yes there is a lot of information on this forum and this has been discussed many times so a search will provide a lot of reading. A google search will also provide a lot of information on the difference between LT and ST tires. The main difference is the sidewall construction. ST tires are designed to carry more weight. If you look at load capacities of tires, many LT tires are not rated heavy enough to carry the bigger 5ers. There are some exceptions and Sailuns are one of them, but they are a commercial tire not an LT tire intended for light duty trucks.

I personally keep ST tires on my trailers, but I have upgraded. It came with E rated china bombs, I took them off and went with F rated Carlisles. After losing one of those to a nail and also upgrading my wheels to a 110 psi rated wheel, I have now changed to Hartland G rated all steel ST tires. The original tires were a 235/80R16 LRE, the new ones are 235/85R16 LRG.

Also, run a TMPS, worth every penny you pay for them. When I picked up a nail on the Carlisle, the TPMS alarm went off and I was able to stop before the tire went completely flat, which took less than 30 seconds. I would not have had to go very far on a flat tire before it separated and caused damage to the RV. It's hard to tell by looking in the mirror if a tire is going flat, you will notice it when you look on the mirror and see stuff flying off. I have the TST 507, but there are other systems that work well too. A search on this forum will give you reading on those as well.

Outback 325BH
05-03-2017, 06:11 AM
And yet higher-end trailers offer LT tires as an option. This topic is always funny to watch unfold.

ST tires are crap.


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xrated
05-03-2017, 06:27 AM
And yet higher-end trailers offer LT tires as an option. This topic is always funny to watch unfold.

ST tires are crap.


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Saying that ST tires are crap is certainly a blanket statement as well as a generalization that is simply not true. As I stated above, there are higher and lower quality tires of all sorts...LT, ST, motorcycle, passenger type, and probably even wheelbarrow tires.

CWtheMan
05-03-2017, 07:14 PM
And yet higher-end trailers offer LT tires as an option. This topic is always funny to watch unfold.

ST tires are crap.


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Because it has an LT prefix in it's size identification does not mean it's a 100% LT tire. Look closer and you will also find RST (Regional Service Trailer) somewhere on it's sidewall.

Almost all RV trailer's with 8000# axles have medium duty truck tires. However, a closer look will identify them as being designed for low platform trailer service.

It is the RV trailer builders responsibility to select and fit Original Equipment tires. They can use any DOT certified highway tire. Keystone did just that with all of their trailers equipped with 6000# axles in model years 2005 & 2006. One of their tires of choice was the Uniroyal LT235/85R16E. After two years, Keystone went back to the ST tires. The failure rate with the LT tires was very similar to the failure rate of an ST tire with nearly equal load capacity. I traveled with a friend that had a 2005 Montana. We found sidewall blisters in his General's. They were 2 & 1/2 years old.

Some of the smaller, sporty fivers, in the Dutchman Danali lineup had 20" passenger tires.

Rick Leary
05-21-2017, 05:49 PM
Amen! My experience mirrors yours! LT's provide reliability and peace of mind.

Barbell
05-23-2017, 06:31 AM
Even tho it has the LT designation on the sidewall, my Sailun tires also say FOR TRAILER SERVICE ONLY. A true truck tire is not suitable for multi-axle trailers due to the tire sliding sideways in tight turns. Truck tires just can't take such abuse while trailer tires can.

rhagfo
05-23-2017, 08:47 AM
Even tho it has the LT designation on the sidewall, my Sailun tires also say FOR TRAILER SERVICE ONLY. A true truck tire is not suitable for multi-axle trailers due to the tire sliding sideways in tight turns. Truck tires just can't take such abuse while trailer tires can.

???
Please explain then why semis use the same tire carcass on all positions, be it steer, driver, or trailer???

Javi
05-23-2017, 09:01 AM
???
Please explain then why semis use the same tire carcass on all positions, be it steer, driver, or trailer???

When I was responsible for buying tires for a fleet of 30+ trucks we bought steering, drive and trailer tires... they were each position dependent... That may have changed nowadays but I'd not bet on that...

rhagfo
05-23-2017, 09:35 AM
When I was responsible for buying tires for a fleet of 30+ trucks we bought steering, drive and trailer tires... they were each position dependent... That may have changed nowadays but I'd not bet on that...

Tread pattern, but when you had them capped, the old steer could not go back on a steer axle! so where did it go??

How many times did you cap a carcass, and did drivers always become drivers, 3rd cam move to trailer tire??

CWtheMan
05-26-2017, 09:25 AM
Even tho it has the LT designation on the sidewall, my Sailun tires also say FOR TRAILER SERVICE ONLY. A true truck tire is not suitable for multi-axle trailers due to the tire sliding sideways in tight turns. Truck tires just can't take such abuse while trailer tires can.

Most of us are not privy to a tire's complete design structure and the materials use for that design.

Therefore a tire is what it's manufacturer says it is. Normally a LT tire earmarked for trailer service may also have an RST on its sidewall, meaning, Regional Service Trailer. It is a single position tire.

CWtheMan
05-26-2017, 09:35 AM
When I was responsible for buying tires for a fleet of 30+ trucks we bought steering, drive and trailer tires... they were each position dependent... That may have changed nowadays but I'd not bet on that...

Tires for "fleet" trucks is out of the ballpark in this sort of forum. They are governed by completely different regulations. The Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration. Our trailers and almost all tow vehicles are governed by the Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Standards. One is not applicable with the other.

CWtheMan
05-26-2017, 10:05 AM
"Light truck (LT) tire means a tire designated by its manufacturer as primarily intended for use on lightweight trucks or multipurpose passenger vehicles."

That's a verbatim quote from NHTSA. Basically it's all that needs to be known about the design. The same can be said about a Special Trailer tire.

Some manufacturers will tell you a little bit more about their tires but not much. Why? They already told you it's a trailer tire. Why go into a comparison? They don't have anything to do with vehicle fitment selections. If anyone wants some feedback about why their trailer was fitted with ST tires and not LT tires they need to ask the trailer manufacturer. They know the why about the fitments they make. Good luck on that one. In the regulations that gives them the authority for their fitments it says for them to make an "appropriate fitment". They signed the trailer's certification papers. Therefore, their fitment is locked-in.

The only recourse an owner has with replacements that differ in design from the Original Equipment tires is to use vehicle manufacturer recommended options, or, go out on the limb and do it their way.

Desert185
05-27-2017, 05:54 AM
"Light truck (LT) tire means a tire designated by its manufacturer as primarily intended for use on lightweight trucks or multipurpose passenger vehicles."

That's a verbatim quote from NHTSA. Basically it's all that needs to be known about the design. The same can be said about a Special Trailer tire.

Some manufacturers will tell you a little bit more about their tires but not much. Why? They already told you it's a trailer tire. Why go into a comparison? They don't have anything to do with vehicle fitment selections. If anyone wants some feedback about why their trailer was fitted with ST tires and not LT tires they need to ask the trailer manufacturer. They know the why about the fitments they make. Good luck on that one. In the regulations that gives them the authority for their fitments it says for them to make an "appropriate fitment". They signed the trailer's certification papers. Therefore, their fitment is locked-in.

The only recourse an owner has with replacements that differ in design from the Original Equipment tires is to use vehicle manufacturer recommended options, or, go out on the limb and do it their way.

Yet, the government continues to essentially bless tires with a history of issues, i.e. china bomb branded tires. As an example, the Jaxxon brand ST's that came on my car hauler were dimensionally undersized compared to the same size in Carlisle's and wore out unevenly and prematurely.

I think there is more to the process than just blindly replacing trailer tires with any brand as long as it states "ST" on the sidewall. There are times when following the government regulations is "going out on a limb." There is such a thing as choosing to be safe rather than legal or recommended. :)

bsmith0404
05-27-2017, 06:48 AM
One thing that differs extensively between LT and ST tires is the load carrying capacity. Many people make the mistake of thinking an LRE is and LRE is an LRE. That's not true or accurate. The load range rating is based on a tires toughness. It used to be based on the number of plies, but today it's more the number of ply equivalent. For example, a 14 ply tire may not actually have 14 plies, but have fewer stronger plies equivalent to 14 standard plies.

The Load Index (LI) is the big difference between LT and ST. If you do a comparison of LT and ST tires you will notice this. For example, looking at a 235/80R16 you will notice that the max LI for an LT is 120 (3086 lbs). The lowest LI for an ST tire is 124 (3527 lbs). That's a different load carrying capacity of nearly 2,000 lbs.

The question to ask yourself here is how much LI do you need for your RV. For me with a 15,500 GVWR, a 120 LI is too close to the edge of the tires capability. BTW, I've stepped up to a 235/85R16 with a 129 LI and from what I can find are only available in an ST.

CWtheMan
05-27-2017, 06:50 AM
The Jaxxon brand ST's that came on my car hauler were dimensionally undersized compared to the same size in Carlisle's and wore out unevenly and prematurely.


Tires of the same design and size are supposed to have the same basic dimensions. The Tire & Rim association (TRA) sets those standards.

Were you comparing a tire that already had some miles on it to a new unused tire?

A tire already suffering from tread separation will be larger than a like sized tire.

In any event, you should have had the tires inspected or reported them to NHTSA.

CWtheMan
05-27-2017, 07:44 AM
There are times when following the government regulations is "going out on a limb." There is such a thing as choosing to be safe rather than legal or recommended.

I'm not singling out your post for ridicule. I post many things that are misunderstood and this may be one of them.

Lets say you live in a state that has active vehicle inspection laws and your trailer has to be inspected periodically. When such state inspections are enacted most of the inspection procedures are already established. One is about tire size and design. The bottom line is; If an owner has replaced original equipment ST tires with any other design the inspectors will reject the use of such replacements and the vehicle will not pass inspection until adequate replacements are installed.

Now lets look from another view. Your car, pick-up etc. needs new tires. So you take it to your favorite tire retailer. They look at your vehicle's VIN number, compare it to a list of suitable replacements and tell you what brand they have on hand or can get quickly. To go off that list with a "plus sized" tire not recommended by the vehicle manufacturer will normally require a call to them for approval. That type of service is not available with RV trailer tires. With RV trailer tires it's use like sized tires as replacements or optional tires that are recommended by the trailer builder.

ST tire manufacturers are building tires for almost any load capacity needed by the trailer builders. New sizes are often introduced with new brand names such as the Goodyear Endurance with it's ST255/85R16.

I post a lot of information about what is supposed to happen. It's not always well received. But, that does not make it incorrect. Hardly anyone ever asks me for references. I have them. For instance, I have used the inspection information from 49 CFR 570.62 while writing this post.

Desert185
05-27-2017, 07:38 PM
I'm not singling out your post for ridicule. I post many things that are misunderstood and this may be one of them.

Lets say you live in a state that has active vehicle inspection laws and your trailer has to be inspected periodically. When such state inspections are enacted most of the inspection procedures are already established. One is about tire size and design. The bottom line is; If an owner has replaced original equipment ST tires with any other design the inspectors will reject the use of such replacements and the vehicle will not pass inspection until adequate replacements are installed.

Now lets look from another view. Your car, pick-up etc. needs new tires. So you take it to your favorite tire retailer. They look at your vehicle's VIN number, compare it to a list of suitable replacements and tell you what brand they have on hand or can get quickly. To go off that list with a "plus sized" tire not recommended by the vehicle manufacturer will normally require a call to them for approval. That type of service is not available with RV trailer tires. With RV trailer tires it's use like sized tires as replacements or optional tires that are recommended by the trailer builder.

ST tire manufacturers are building tires for almost any load capacity needed by the trailer builders. New sizes are often introduced with new brand names such as the Goodyear Endurance with it's ST255/85R16.

I post a lot of information about what is supposed to happen. It's not always well received. But, that does not make it incorrect. Hardly anyone ever asks me for references. I have them. For instance, I have used the inspection information from 49 CFR 570.62 while writing this post.

Nothing personal taken.

I'm just trying to suggest that strictly adhering to a CFR may not be the entire story, as in china bombs vs Carlisles, Maxxis or Sailuns. Jaxxon ST tires are certainly at the bottom of the heap, in my experience. They came new on my car hauler BTW, and were dimensionally smaller. The manufacturer said I probably bent an axle or knocked it out of alignment. He gave me the specs, I measured, all was good, he could care less about the tires, so I bought Carlisle's (up one load range) and all was good.

The only CFR's I read are the FAR variety, and only because I have to. One can do one's due diligence and improve the situation without referencing guvmint, double-speak websites.