2nd air prep.

[papi]

My 2016 Cougar has 2nd Air conditioning prep. I know what it is but, what is it? What is included? What makes it prep? sorry for all the questions. I am going to have the dealer install a second air but I would like to know before I go. Thanks

[PARAPTOR]

Roof supported in that area and 110V Ac wiring provided and Possibly thermostat wire (usually not)

ADDED; IS IT going to be duct less????

[papi]

That is actually one of my questions. does the prep includes ducts, Or does it have to be ductless. :confused

[PARAPTOR]

Not sure about new ones, but most as you can see by our resent posts on adding a second AC they have been ductless. Just pop in that hole and connect the 110 VAC As you probably know by my posts on this subject I think it a bad solution adding a second AC to help cool the rig when all it does is blow in the bedroom. As you have read others add a fan to help get that cold air into the rest of the rig.

I sure hope they make available an add on ducted unit in the future so ducts would also be there when you add the second unit. Think I seen an ad for think it was keystone where it was like a race track with AC units on each curve. Looked like in that configuration adding a second would help entire rig.

My guess yours will be a duct less

[Frank G]

This thread has exposed some interesting thoughts about how the manufacture handles the second air conditioner. If you get a second air conditioner installed at the factory as an option is it ducted? Our Laredo came this way and it has it's own thermostat in the bedroom. When we get it back from the dealer it we will find out. This leads me to believe that whatever the factory does for the ducting on second unit it is the same no matter who installs the second air conditioner, factory or otherwise. To continue, I find it difficult to find construction practices on some models and great video's on others. Same goes for literature. I have seen detailed "Race Track" drawings for some models, and absolutely no information on the next. So... if you are more concerned with the engineering and build of your unit and not the eye appeal (like myself) good luck. Yes, the DW got her pick.:lol:

[JRTJH]

This discussion brings up some very good information about differences in trailers (and also some similarities). It's common to believe that everything from a manufacturer should include the same kind of construction, but that's not always what happens. Some of the features are "exclusive" to one brand within the Keystone family while many are included in every trailer they produce regardless of brand.

It's much like comparing a Lincoln Town Car to a Ford Crown Victoria, and if you are old enough, a Mercury Grand Marquis. They all are produced by Ford Motor Company, but each is an individual brand and "caters" to a specific type of buyer. All of them are "basically the same frame" but as the price grows, so does the list of "features"....

Within Keystone, it's the same. While a 38' Laredo, a 38' Cougar, a 38' Fuzion and a 38' Montana may all use the same chassis and many of the same components (pinbox, axles, windows, doors, appliances, etc) they can be constructed very differently. For instance, the cargo door on the Fuzion gives it a very different "rear end" and the "drop front chassis rails" give the Montana and Alpine a significantly larger front storage area and taller bedroom.

The "race-track" ducting system was (it may not even be available on current models, I haven't checked) a "key feature" on the Laredo, it wasn't available on Cougar models with the same or similar floorplans.

Just as rear seat A/C ducting was standard on the Town Car, optional on the Grand Marquis and not available on the Crown Victoria, features change, sometimes dramatically, on different brands within the Keystone product line.

So, if something is important enough to be a "deal breaker" or even a "significant disappointment", be certain to include that into the considerations when you look at different Keystone products. Ask specific questions of the dealer, make sure you verify the important details and don't take for granted that it'll be there on the model you choose. Just because "Keystone offers it in one brand" doesn't make it available or included in any other brand they produce. Sometimes, for marketing purposes, a feature may be "brand exclusive" on one trailer line and only available on select models. That's the way the Mor-Ryde system first started on Montana fifth wheels and the way "self adjusting brakes" are on only the Premium and Luxury trailers today. Those features may "creep" into the lower lines, but they aren't available on everything Keystone produces. Neither is the "A/C ducting for both air conditioners. Often it doesn't make any difference whether the front A/C is factory installed or dealer installed. If ducting isn't a part of the lineup, it won't be available no matter where the "optional A/C" is installed.

Do your homework on what's important before you sign on the dotted line.

[sourdough]

As you probably know by my posts on this subject I think it a bad solution adding a second AC to help cool the rig when all it does is blow in the bedroom. As you have read others add a fan to help get that cold air into the rest of the rig.

I think if the 2nd AC is to help cool the entire trailer then common ducting for both ACs would be beneficial. For us, a cool to cold bedroom is what we like so the 2nd 13.5 non-ducted AC in the bedroom works great. Far better than "sort of cool" throughout the trailer. When we're up and going a "sort of cool" trailer can be dealt with and if we want it cooler we just turn on the bedroom AC and put a fan (as you mentioned) in the door and problem solved.
We got the MorRyde suspension and self adjusting brakes:):), just no ducts for a 2nd AC:(

[NorskeBob]

My last RV was a Crossroads product (CF335SS) and it came with 2nd air prep - wiring and thermostat (Dometic Programmable Thermostat) for two zone settings - zone 2 was the bedroom. There was a temp sensor located in the bedroom for zone 2. We did not have the AC installed - had a fantastic fan installed - reversible with a thermostat. Use the fan to pull air through the RV when the AC was not needed. AC was ductless.

In the summer a single AC would not keep to RV cool when outside temp was over 80 degrees or if the RV was in the sun all day. But at least it kept the humidity down.

Our new rig has the 2nd air installed - separate thermostat in the bedroom. We had a fantastic fan installed in the bathroom (reversible with a thermostat). We will run it when the 2nd AC is not needed - which is allot of the time in Upstate NY.

[Outback 325BH]

My 2016 Cougar has 2nd Air conditioning prep. I know what it is but, what is it? What is included? What makes it prep? sorry for all the questions. I am going to have the dealer install a second air but I would like to know before I go. Thanks



2nd ac prep generally means the camper is pre-wired (120 vac) and has a hole with framing already in place... usually a vent or light is in the hole.

It could mean it is pre-wired for a thermostat, but often not.

Keystone Laredo's "race track" is the only ducting system I know of that would have a 2nd ac connected to a duct.

I have 3 air conditioners: one is connected to the ducting with wall thermostat and the other two are just straight-dump without wall thermostats (thermostat is on unit).

With the small ducts that are in these campers, I don't rely on them much. Of course with 3, I don't have to.


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[Javi]

I think if the 2nd AC is to help cool the entire trailer then common ducting for both ACs would be beneficial. For us, a cool to cold bedroom is what we like so the 2nd 13.5 non-ducted AC in the bedroom works great. Far better than "sort of cool" throughout the trailer. When we're up and going a "sort of cool" trailer can be dealt with and if we want it cooler we just turn on the bedroom AC and put a fan (as you mentioned) in the door and problem solved.
We got the MorRyde suspension and self adjusting brakes:):), just no ducts for a 2nd AC:(

Yeah.. My Cougar doesn't have the bedroom A/C ducted either... But like you said that ain't all bad... with two 15K units we usually just turn on the bedroom unit while we're watching TV or talking in the evening... Rarely will we turn on both units except in the heat of the day...

[papi]

I am going to my seosonal site to open the camper this weekend. Finally camping season is open here in IL. I will investigate what the prep is all about. We are going on a road trip in July and we will be spending a week in Destin FL. Last time we were there one AC was not enough. The question is, Is it worth it to get a second A/C unit? should I go with a 15 or a 13.5? Any input would be appreciated.

[336]

I just did it in my 2016 cougar 336. Had second ac prep. Prep is basically as stated before. Access to a power source and a supported ceiling box. No thermostat provisions. No ducting. So the second ac just blows in the bedroom. Which is fine on my unit. Other ac is in great back and it was having a hard time pushing cold air all the way to the front. I called my dealer he wanted $1500 to add the second ac. I got all the parts and did the job in about 5 hrs for $500. Nothing more complicated than wiring an outlet. Some heavy lifting. And lots of time pulling lap sealant off the roof.

[papi]

Did you get a 15 or. 13.5?

[336]

I got The Brisk Air II 13.5. That was what comes factory on the unit if you order double Ac

[Dave W]

Somewhere on this forum you will find my project adding the second a/c to our 5er.

You should see a plastic plate covered hole in the ceiling near the vent. It may or may not have a box - ours did not. I added an old work box, used a 20 amp plug receptacle as a terminal strip for the supplied wire nutted 110VAC service. It was not ducted nor was there any 'stat wiring. I then installed a Dometic 13.5 Btu Penguin, being the lowest profile unit available. Between the two a/c units, the 5er stayed cool on 100* plus days in Nevada.

Plan it well and the job goes quickly. You need the a/c roof unit, the inside control panel, possibly a box, a 2-3 foot length of 12awg wire and someone young and strong to help you get the 95 pound roof unit 13 feet up. The roof vent and DICOR removal are really what take the longest time. My cost for everything was about $650 as I added the heat strip as well which was a good choice for those chilly spring or fall mornings.

[papi]

I checked mine on the weekend and yes you all are right. Is not ducted. I am going have the dealer do it because the light, the tv and antena outlet, the ducted air vent, and one of the vent pipe on the roof are all to close to the vent where the second air will go. I am getting a Domestic brisk air 13.5 installed for 850. They can have the headache to figure this one out. Thanks for all of your advises.

[sourdough]

I checked mine on the weekend and yes you all are right. Is not ducted. I am going have the dealer do it because the light, the tv and antena outlet, the ducted air vent, and one of the vent pipe on the roof are all to close to the vent where the second air will go. I am getting a Domestic brisk air 13.5 installed for 850. They can have the headache to figure this one out. Thanks for all of your advises.


Your thoughts were exactly what mine were. Why fight trying to install the thing. I paid a little less than $900 (I may have even got the $39 install back then, but I don't think it was more than $99). Seems like a deal to me.

[Frank G]

Interesting thread, but I need to provide a update. This afternoon I turned on the second (optional) air conditioner in the bedroom and found that it is ducted. You never know how they build them. Was that done at the factory because they installed the 2nd AC, who knows.

2017 Lerado 325RL Built 11/6/2016

[Outback 325BH]

Interesting thread, but I need to provide a update. This afternoon I turned on the second (optional) air conditioner in the bedroom and found that it is ducted. You never know how they build them. Was that done at the factory because they installed the 2nd AC, who knows.



2017 Lerado 325RL Built 11/6/2016



Laredo campers have a "racetrack", which is an interesting implementation. It allows you to run either ac (main or 2nd) or both at the same time and route cool air throughout the camper. The racetrack design runs in a circle so the two ac units do not fight each other, they work together. I love the idea. Of course after seeing how crappy the ductwork is in campers, I wonder how good it works. I almost bought a Laredo because of the racetrack, however I bought an Outback instead (for other features, not because of anything bad of the Laredo).




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[NealBlue]

Here is something else to muddle it up. My 2016 Laredo has the factory installed 2nd a/c in the bedroom. It also has the "racetrack" ducting. But, my second unit is not ducted. The "racetrack" makes a u-turn just before the second unit.

[Frank G]

Here is something else to muddle it up. My 2016 Laredo has the factory installed 2nd a/c in the bedroom. It also has the "racetrack" ducting. But, my second unit is not ducted. The "racetrack" makes a u-turn just before the second unit.

This is also an update to Post #18 above. Since I made that post we took a factory tour of the Laredo assembly facility. The mid-profile or life size units are assembled on the same line as the Alpine and Avalanche units. If the second air conditioner is factory installed it is ducted. The ultra light fifth wheel and TT models share a assembly line with Cougar models. We also saw that facility. Again, the same tour guide and the same response on the AC install.

Who knows if the duct man allowed for the 2 AC.

[Jdg1172]

I have a 2017 cougar and have thought about adding a second ac. I took the bezel off around the vent to see for myself. It's not setup to be ducted but that could be changed if wanted. The duct work runs forward far enough. With some cutting through the side support you can access the duct. Running a wire for thermostat looks to be a piece of cake too.

[Dave W]

I have a 2017 cougar and have thought about adding a second ac. I took the bezel off around the vent to see for myself. It's not setup to be ducted but that could be changed if wanted. The duct work runs forward far enough. With some cutting through the side support you can access the duct. Running a wire for thermostat looks to be a piece of cake too.

Take another look in there - you will have ducting in sight but does it make a loop through the bedroom and back to the opposite side of tha 5er with several vents? If you add another a/c and add ducting to that partial loop you may just end up with a less efficient system since you really haven't added exhaust vents and will have 'packed' the ducting with air that doesn't move well. Yes, you will have the advantage of a single thermostat .... but do your research first on duct size and air flow. On our Montana HC, I went with the non ducted a/c and it does a good job especially since cool air 'falls' and helps considerably in the LR/kitchen area - even in 100* plus heat.

There are many 'net articles on air flow in a/c ducting though most are house, there are a few RV specific

[Jdg1172]

Take another look in there - you will have ducting in sight but does it make a loop through the bedroom and back to the opposite side of tha 5er with several vents? If you add another a/c and add ducting to that partial loop you may just end up with a less efficient system since you really haven't added exhaust vents and will have 'packed' the ducting with air that doesn't move well. Yes, you will have the advantage of a single thermostat .... but do your research first on duct size and air flow. On our Montana HC, I went with the non ducted a/c and it does a good job especially since cool air 'falls' and helps considerably in the LR/kitchen area - even in 100* plus heat.

There are many 'net articles on air flow in a/c ducting though most are house, there are a few RV specific

Thanks... I will do some research on this.

[DetnNet]

I just installed a Brisk Air 2 13.5 last weekend on a 2016 cougar. We were finding the rear ducted unit did not quite cool the front enough and wanted more cooling in the bedroom. I like the other recommendations taped and sealed off the rear unit air paths and vents to prevent air leakage. The 2nd ac opening was not ducted, had enough AC line wire to make it to the connection, and did not find a dangling thermostat control wire. In my case I think the 13.5 will be enough additional cooling for the area and will find out as we camp this summer.

I would be interested in what folks used to seal the box. The sides were sealed by the wood frame/supports. The back and front were open. I ended up using silver metallic HVAC tape and some cut pieces of sheet metal to seal the front and back of the box. I considered using the plastic chute from the vent but quickly discarded the idea when it did not hug the outside of the opening and felt it would restrict airflow and not work well with the provided divider of the control box.

[chuckster57]

I use the aluminum tape all the time. Works great, so I would say your good to go!!

[lesleyinky]

Not one moment of regret installing a second A/C. It did have to be ductless. We purchased a 13.5 that I️ ordered new off amazon for around $550. CW did the install for us around $125.

In our opinion we paid too much for the TT to not be completely satisfied and comfortable when using it. Adding fans didn’t cut it on the super hot days.

[DetnNet]

Thanks for the replies. Will be looking forward to the extra cooling!

[19Cougar28sgs]

The front of the trailer is the hottest and highest, so adding a ductless ac unit and blocking the front vents for the ducted ac should drastically improve on removing heat from the space.

Does anyone know if the new cougars pre wiring have the INCOMMAND wiring there? I have the sensor already installed in the space and the iN·Command dashboard has front ac controls.

[chuckster57]

We don't carry the Cougar line but if it has a thermistor in the bedroom and the option on the control panel then I would venture to say it does. Look at the bedroom vent, there should be a sticker on the vent garnish ring or the ceiling stating there is 110VAC. Or you can just remove that ring and look at whats up there

BTW...Welcome to the forum :wlcm:

[19Cougar28sgs]

We don't carry the Cougar line but if it has a thermistor in the bedroom and the option on the control panel then I would venture to say it does. Look at the bedroom vent, there should be a sticker on the vent garnish ring or the ceiling stating there is 110VAC. Or you can just remove that ring and look at whats up there

BTW...Welcome to the forum :wlcm:

Thanks!

I’ll have to do some digging up there and see. Currently my 15000btu dometic doesn’t make it a winter wonderland in these crazy heat waves. I don’t think I will need another 15k system to do it though.